Matthew Leblanc return?

Motofinne
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6/15/2023 12:23am
MXMattii wrote:
Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to...

Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to almost 80%. That would mean that less children would be home schooled and that the Roczen, Herlings, Gajser, Coenens, ... wouldn't stay amateur till they had all 2 cents medals and trophies. But would turn pro. A bit like the exception Deegan did. Matthew Leblanc did it too as exception because he was between a brick and a wall, but he doesn't get rewarded, no seat in factory team, no seat in satellite team (because money that could be used for projects like that are going to kids who need to win Loretta...). Hymas got two extra years from Honda to get up-to-speed in amateurs, something Leblanc could've used too, but because he had already six championships they could've gave him also at least two years without pressure in a good satellite team being pro, learning everything.

To show that Loretta is a nice event but nothing more than that: Jett Lawrence has zero championships on the ranch, he got beaten by Jalek Swoll and Hardy Munoz. Joe Shimoda didn't seem to click with the track at the LL Ranch because he had numerous attempts but only 1 championship, his story is a bit different because he needed to make it on his own dime and with support from Japan, because the talent scouts here had shit in their eyes, or his flag behind his name wasn't the right one (while 4 big bike manufacturers share the same flag). Who knows?! I saw the kid ride twice once on blue groove, once in mud he went very fast, rode clean and looked forward not like a lot of his age just down to their wheel. He made it into the pro ranks and is now keeping Pro Circuit into the pictures between all the LL champs. Maybe the system is broke... 

This is an unpopular opinion but way too many US based 250 riders get Factory rides too soon. Once you get your shot and fail to capitalize on it you're screwed.

Cut down on full Factory rides and increase well funded and supported satellite teams where these riders can thrive without the full Factory pressure.

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4DAIVIPAI2K5
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6/15/2023 4:20am

Is he going dark green?

 

DonM
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6/15/2023 8:18am
MXMattii wrote:
Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to...

Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to almost 80%. That would mean that less children would be home schooled and that the Roczen, Herlings, Gajser, Coenens, ... wouldn't stay amateur till they had all 2 cents medals and trophies. But would turn pro. A bit like the exception Deegan did. Matthew Leblanc did it too as exception because he was between a brick and a wall, but he doesn't get rewarded, no seat in factory team, no seat in satellite team (because money that could be used for projects like that are going to kids who need to win Loretta...). Hymas got two extra years from Honda to get up-to-speed in amateurs, something Leblanc could've used too, but because he had already six championships they could've gave him also at least two years without pressure in a good satellite team being pro, learning everything.

To show that Loretta is a nice event but nothing more than that: Jett Lawrence has zero championships on the ranch, he got beaten by Jalek Swoll and Hardy Munoz. Joe Shimoda didn't seem to click with the track at the LL Ranch because he had numerous attempts but only 1 championship, his story is a bit different because he needed to make it on his own dime and with support from Japan, because the talent scouts here had shit in their eyes, or his flag behind his name wasn't the right one (while 4 big bike manufacturers share the same flag). Who knows?! I saw the kid ride twice once on blue groove, once in mud he went very fast, rode clean and looked forward not like a lot of his age just down to their wheel. He made it into the pro ranks and is now keeping Pro Circuit into the pictures between all the LL champs. Maybe the system is broke... 

Motofinne wrote:
This is an unpopular opinion but way too many US based 250 riders get Factory rides too soon. Once you get your shot and fail to...

This is an unpopular opinion but way too many US based 250 riders get Factory rides too soon. Once you get your shot and fail to capitalize on it you're screwed.

Cut down on full Factory rides and increase well funded and supported satellite teams where these riders can thrive without the full Factory pressure.

So we should have fewer rides available because of the few that fail to live up to expectations or have injury issues....got it...

7
GrapeApe
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6/15/2023 8:37am
GrapeApe wrote:
People seem to forget Matt Leblanc got burnt out and quit. He wasn't banished by the industry, he would have picked up another ride if he...

People seem to forget Matt Leblanc got burnt out and quit. He wasn't banished by the industry, he would have picked up another ride if he had the drive and desire.

Regis wrote:
Quitting isn't the right word or action Matt took. When a family sacrifices everything to a sport you all fight through multiple major injuries to climb...

Quitting isn't the right word or action Matt took. When a family sacrifices everything to a sport you all fight through multiple major injuries to climb the ladder time and time again, it’s a mental challenge not many full grown adults can manage. Let alone a teenager.

The kid and family fought hard and sacrificed a lot to get where they were, when that wasn’t offered again it’s absolutely understandable to step back. 
 

Life goes on.  Doesn’t mean he quit. Would love to see him circle the wagons and go out healthy and show his speed.  Even if it’s not full time.

 

I didn't intend to use quit in a derogatory manner, I was just making the point he walked away on his own. He could have done what many others have done and ride for a smaller team to work on rebuilding speed and confidence.

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The Shop

GrapeApe
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6/15/2023 8:59am Edited Date/Time 6/15/2023 9:19am
MXMattii wrote:
Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to...

Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to almost 80%. That would mean that less children would be home schooled and that the Roczen, Herlings, Gajser, Coenens, ... wouldn't stay amateur till they had all 2 cents medals and trophies. But would turn pro. A bit like the exception Deegan did. Matthew Leblanc did it too as exception because he was between a brick and a wall, but he doesn't get rewarded, no seat in factory team, no seat in satellite team (because money that could be used for projects like that are going to kids who need to win Loretta...). Hymas got two extra years from Honda to get up-to-speed in amateurs, something Leblanc could've used too, but because he had already six championships they could've gave him also at least two years without pressure in a good satellite team being pro, learning everything.

To show that Loretta is a nice event but nothing more than that: Jett Lawrence has zero championships on the ranch, he got beaten by Jalek Swoll and Hardy Munoz. Joe Shimoda didn't seem to click with the track at the LL Ranch because he had numerous attempts but only 1 championship, his story is a bit different because he needed to make it on his own dime and with support from Japan, because the talent scouts here had shit in their eyes, or his flag behind his name wasn't the right one (while 4 big bike manufacturers share the same flag). Who knows?! I saw the kid ride twice once on blue groove, once in mud he went very fast, rode clean and looked forward not like a lot of his age just down to their wheel. He made it into the pro ranks and is now keeping Pro Circuit into the pictures between all the LL champs. Maybe the system is broke... 

Almost everything you have typed here is incorrect.

Leblanc had support from Star in the amateurs for not just 2 but 4 years, much longer than most get. One year in supermini, two years in B class, and one year in A class. He did get a seat on a the pro factory team, albeit for only 1 year.

Jo Shimoda rode a KTM in the mini classes (not Japan) until he was picked up by Amsoil Honda who supported him for three years in Schoolboy, B and A. That was the best amateur support you could possibly get at the time. Your comments about talent scouts having shit in their eyes and his nationality is kind of telling that you're just off on a rant and have no idea what you're saying.

The "system" gives these kids a platform to prove themselves, but at some point it's sink or swim. Not everyone is cut out to be the next Eli Tomac. That's not unique to the sport of motocross.

 

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dsc131
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6/15/2023 9:16am
MXMattii wrote:
Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to...

Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to almost 80%. That would mean that less children would be home schooled and that the Roczen, Herlings, Gajser, Coenens, ... wouldn't stay amateur till they had all 2 cents medals and trophies. But would turn pro. A bit like the exception Deegan did. Matthew Leblanc did it too as exception because he was between a brick and a wall, but he doesn't get rewarded, no seat in factory team, no seat in satellite team (because money that could be used for projects like that are going to kids who need to win Loretta...). Hymas got two extra years from Honda to get up-to-speed in amateurs, something Leblanc could've used too, but because he had already six championships they could've gave him also at least two years without pressure in a good satellite team being pro, learning everything.

To show that Loretta is a nice event but nothing more than that: Jett Lawrence has zero championships on the ranch, he got beaten by Jalek Swoll and Hardy Munoz. Joe Shimoda didn't seem to click with the track at the LL Ranch because he had numerous attempts but only 1 championship, his story is a bit different because he needed to make it on his own dime and with support from Japan, because the talent scouts here had shit in their eyes, or his flag behind his name wasn't the right one (while 4 big bike manufacturers share the same flag). Who knows?! I saw the kid ride twice once on blue groove, once in mud he went very fast, rode clean and looked forward not like a lot of his age just down to their wheel. He made it into the pro ranks and is now keeping Pro Circuit into the pictures between all the LL champs. Maybe the system is broke... 

I think manufacturers spend so much money on winning amateur titles because amateur racers and riders are their target customer base.

From a business perspective, why would you cut back on proving yourself to your target demographic in the very forum they live?

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MXMattii
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6/15/2023 12:19pm Edited Date/Time 6/15/2023 12:20pm
MXMattii wrote:
Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to...

Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to almost 80%. That would mean that less children would be home schooled and that the Roczen, Herlings, Gajser, Coenens, ... wouldn't stay amateur till they had all 2 cents medals and trophies. But would turn pro. A bit like the exception Deegan did. Matthew Leblanc did it too as exception because he was between a brick and a wall, but he doesn't get rewarded, no seat in factory team, no seat in satellite team (because money that could be used for projects like that are going to kids who need to win Loretta...). Hymas got two extra years from Honda to get up-to-speed in amateurs, something Leblanc could've used too, but because he had already six championships they could've gave him also at least two years without pressure in a good satellite team being pro, learning everything.

To show that Loretta is a nice event but nothing more than that: Jett Lawrence has zero championships on the ranch, he got beaten by Jalek Swoll and Hardy Munoz. Joe Shimoda didn't seem to click with the track at the LL Ranch because he had numerous attempts but only 1 championship, his story is a bit different because he needed to make it on his own dime and with support from Japan, because the talent scouts here had shit in their eyes, or his flag behind his name wasn't the right one (while 4 big bike manufacturers share the same flag). Who knows?! I saw the kid ride twice once on blue groove, once in mud he went very fast, rode clean and looked forward not like a lot of his age just down to their wheel. He made it into the pro ranks and is now keeping Pro Circuit into the pictures between all the LL champs. Maybe the system is broke... 

GrapeApe wrote:
Almost everything you have typed here is incorrect. Leblanc had support from Star in the amateurs for not just 2 but 4 years, much longer than...

Almost everything you have typed here is incorrect.

Leblanc had support from Star in the amateurs for not just 2 but 4 years, much longer than most get. One year in supermini, two years in B class, and one year in A class. He did get a seat on a the pro factory team, albeit for only 1 year.

Jo Shimoda rode a KTM in the mini classes (not Japan) until he was picked up by Amsoil Honda who supported him for three years in Schoolboy, B and A. That was the best amateur support you could possibly get at the time. Your comments about talent scouts having shit in their eyes and his nationality is kind of telling that you're just off on a rant and have no idea what you're saying.

The "system" gives these kids a platform to prove themselves, but at some point it's sink or swim. Not everyone is cut out to be the next Eli Tomac. That's not unique to the sport of motocross.

 

Re-read maybe you'll understand.

× Jo Shimoda raced for KTM Japan as long he raced with KTM in the USA. Jo scored great on 65cc, 85cc, Supermini and got finally support when he showed his damn grit! When he stayed trying! Honda picked him up.

× I didn't say they supported him only for two years, I said they should've kept him on for two extra years. If you put 5 years of money into a kid, you don't dump him to swim or sink. But put him in a decent satellite team for 2 team. Instead of dumping him into factory team, to swim or sink. Brands are ruining their own investments

2
GrapeApe
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6/15/2023 1:25pm
MXMattii wrote:
Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to...

Thought a little more about, and came to the conclusion that if manufacturers wouldn't chase those "Youth Amateur Events", they could cut back on support to almost 80%. That would mean that less children would be home schooled and that the Roczen, Herlings, Gajser, Coenens, ... wouldn't stay amateur till they had all 2 cents medals and trophies. But would turn pro. A bit like the exception Deegan did. Matthew Leblanc did it too as exception because he was between a brick and a wall, but he doesn't get rewarded, no seat in factory team, no seat in satellite team (because money that could be used for projects like that are going to kids who need to win Loretta...). Hymas got two extra years from Honda to get up-to-speed in amateurs, something Leblanc could've used too, but because he had already six championships they could've gave him also at least two years without pressure in a good satellite team being pro, learning everything.

To show that Loretta is a nice event but nothing more than that: Jett Lawrence has zero championships on the ranch, he got beaten by Jalek Swoll and Hardy Munoz. Joe Shimoda didn't seem to click with the track at the LL Ranch because he had numerous attempts but only 1 championship, his story is a bit different because he needed to make it on his own dime and with support from Japan, because the talent scouts here had shit in their eyes, or his flag behind his name wasn't the right one (while 4 big bike manufacturers share the same flag). Who knows?! I saw the kid ride twice once on blue groove, once in mud he went very fast, rode clean and looked forward not like a lot of his age just down to their wheel. He made it into the pro ranks and is now keeping Pro Circuit into the pictures between all the LL champs. Maybe the system is broke... 

GrapeApe wrote:
Almost everything you have typed here is incorrect. Leblanc had support from Star in the amateurs for not just 2 but 4 years, much longer than...

Almost everything you have typed here is incorrect.

Leblanc had support from Star in the amateurs for not just 2 but 4 years, much longer than most get. One year in supermini, two years in B class, and one year in A class. He did get a seat on a the pro factory team, albeit for only 1 year.

Jo Shimoda rode a KTM in the mini classes (not Japan) until he was picked up by Amsoil Honda who supported him for three years in Schoolboy, B and A. That was the best amateur support you could possibly get at the time. Your comments about talent scouts having shit in their eyes and his nationality is kind of telling that you're just off on a rant and have no idea what you're saying.

The "system" gives these kids a platform to prove themselves, but at some point it's sink or swim. Not everyone is cut out to be the next Eli Tomac. That's not unique to the sport of motocross.

 

MXMattii wrote:
Re-read maybe you'll understand. × Jo Shimoda raced for KTM Japan as long he raced with KTM in the USA. Jo scored great on 65cc, 85cc...

Re-read maybe you'll understand.

× Jo Shimoda raced for KTM Japan as long he raced with KTM in the USA. Jo scored great on 65cc, 85cc, Supermini and got finally support when he showed his damn grit! When he stayed trying! Honda picked him up.

× I didn't say they supported him only for two years, I said they should've kept him on for two extra years. If you put 5 years of money into a kid, you don't dump him to swim or sink. But put him in a decent satellite team for 2 team. Instead of dumping him into factory team, to swim or sink. Brands are ruining their own investments

So after working with him for 4 years as an amateur, you think they should have then loaned him to a "decent satellite team" to have him race amateur for 2 more years, then brought him back to Star for his pro debut to finish out his contract? lol Do you think Leblanc would be on board with that plan?

 

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MXMattii
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6/15/2023 4:35pm Edited Date/Time 6/15/2023 4:38pm
GrapeApe wrote:
So after working with him for 4 years as an amateur, you think they should have then loaned him to a "decent satellite team" to have...

So after working with him for 4 years as an amateur, you think they should have then loaned him to a "decent satellite team" to have him race amateur for 2 more years, then brought him back to Star for his pro debut to finish out his contract? lol Do you think Leblanc would be on board with that plan?

 

In other worlds than that in America, racers get developed and then before joining factory team, they get one or two adjustment years. Last year Liam Everts turned pro, but because KTM didn't want to smother him neither let him "swim or sink" they let hem adjust to weekly racing at Diga Pro Racing KTM. A decent satellite factory team. It worked because he grew week after week, found his feet, under an enourmous pressure and a year later he won his first Grand Prix. (If the owner of Diga didn't got sick both Coenen brothers would've been racing for him this year too. Now they got slotted in between the factory riders at the eleventh hour.)

For Yamaha you could create a good connection with ClubMX or some other team for example. But you seem ignorant to that kind of working. Bud Racing was the smaller team that first worked with Ferrandis, and when he was good enough he raced for CLS...

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romain524
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6/15/2023 5:10pm
MXMattii wrote:
Re-read maybe you'll understand. × Jo Shimoda raced for KTM Japan as long he raced with KTM in the USA. Jo scored great on 65cc, 85cc...

Re-read maybe you'll understand.

× Jo Shimoda raced for KTM Japan as long he raced with KTM in the USA. Jo scored great on 65cc, 85cc, Supermini and got finally support when he showed his damn grit! When he stayed trying! Honda picked him up.

× I didn't say they supported him only for two years, I said they should've kept him on for two extra years. If you put 5 years of money into a kid, you don't dump him to swim or sink. But put him in a decent satellite team for 2 team. Instead of dumping him into factory team, to swim or sink. Brands are ruining their own investments

Jo never raced for KTM Japan, his dad was buying the bikes. Just his last year in supermini he got a race motor from Orange Brigade for Mammoth and LL.

Cortami79
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6/16/2023 2:13am Edited Date/Time 6/16/2023 2:14am

I'm not against the amateur AMA scene at all, but I think they have to work on getting these guys on Nationals like the GP's do. So a 125cc class  (now schoolboy) and a 250cc class (maybe A and Cool . Two day AMA national events with those classes. Loretta Lynns is awesome ofcourse, but it would be better imo to have these talents all ride tracks that pro's are riding

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burn1986
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6/16/2023 2:27am Edited Date/Time 6/16/2023 2:28am
Magoofan wrote:
I thought he was funny in "Friends"   [img]https://media.tenor.com/JxoJ7inr68UAAAAC/joey-joey-tribbian.gif[/img]

I thought he was funny in "Friends"

 

Lol, I’m glad I’m not the only one that was thinking that 👍

I guess there’s no relation to each other?

1
GrapeApe
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6/16/2023 8:34am Edited Date/Time 6/16/2023 8:36am
GrapeApe wrote:
So after working with him for 4 years as an amateur, you think they should have then loaned him to a "decent satellite team" to have...

So after working with him for 4 years as an amateur, you think they should have then loaned him to a "decent satellite team" to have him race amateur for 2 more years, then brought him back to Star for his pro debut to finish out his contract? lol Do you think Leblanc would be on board with that plan?

 

MXMattii wrote:
In other worlds than that in America, racers get developed and then before joining factory team, they get one or two adjustment years. Last year Liam...

In other worlds than that in America, racers get developed and then before joining factory team, they get one or two adjustment years. Last year Liam Everts turned pro, but because KTM didn't want to smother him neither let him "swim or sink" they let hem adjust to weekly racing at Diga Pro Racing KTM. A decent satellite factory team. It worked because he grew week after week, found his feet, under an enourmous pressure and a year later he won his first Grand Prix. (If the owner of Diga didn't got sick both Coenen brothers would've been racing for him this year too. Now they got slotted in between the factory riders at the eleventh hour.)

For Yamaha you could create a good connection with ClubMX or some other team for example. But you seem ignorant to that kind of working. Bud Racing was the smaller team that first worked with Ferrandis, and when he was good enough he raced for CLS...

You seem fixated on Liam Everts' path but didn't his results dictate which team he was on last year, not some elaborate plan of slow growth? He seems to be an outlier when compared to other recent successful MX2 racers: Vialle, Benistant, Geerts, de Wolf, Prado, Jonass, Renaux, Herlings, etc. Didn't all of those guys go straight from EMX250 to a factory team for their rookie year of MX2?

Over here, just like in Europe, the kids and families want to advance from Kawasaki Team Green to Pro Circuit Kawasaki, or KTM Orange Brigade to Red Bull KTM, or Star/Blu Cru to Monster Star Racing Yamaha, etc. That means more money, better equipment, better training and support, basically the best chance to succeed in the 250 class. Even with that, not all succeed and that's not an indictment of the system.

 

MXMattii
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6/16/2023 5:41pm
romain524 wrote:
Jo never raced for KTM Japan, his dad was buying the bikes. Just his last year in supermini he got a race motor from Orange Brigade...

Jo never raced for KTM Japan, his dad was buying the bikes. Just his last year in supermini he got a race motor from Orange Brigade for Mammoth and LL.

In one of the interviews, I remember something like "most of the support still comes from Japan, even for the bike". But can't re-trace the interview or article. I do remember that he brought his first bike with him in his luggage and that he was very often alone with his mom and his sis. Because money didn't roll-in like with some other very early signed kids.

@GrapeApe: You talk without knowing a thing or two about the MXGP. Cherry Pick things out of messages and reply, instead of reading them properly.

Pauls Jonass  ≫ Marchetti Racing Team || Second season ≫ Red Bull KTM Factory Racing
Maxime Renaux ≫ Yamaha SM Action - M.C. Migliori || Second season ≫ Monster Energy Yamaha Factory Racing MX2 Team
Glenn Coldenhoff ≫ Jumbo TVE MX || Third season ≫ Nestaan JM KTM Racing Team
Andrea Adamo ≫ SM Action Racing Team || Third season ≫ Red Bull KTM Factory Racing

There are probably a ton more but I've wasted already to much time at you.

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