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How the heck r you?
Hey, Dinks ?
Anyway, I'm not trying to do anything
or cause any harm......
Heck it's just harmless "chatter" to me.
Never know what someone will say,
might just be useful, but ,"cussing, fighting, etc.,
Wow............emotions at full bore.
Me, I can turn it on & off, like a switch.
Some, well looky here, serious..........!
These sites are fun, pass time, but not to be taken
SERIOUS!
If so, that's SERIOUS!
Dave O.
The Shop
DeCal Works Huge Plastic Inventory of UFO and Polisport kits.
Luxon 4-Post Bar Mounts
$189.95 - $239.95
KTM & TM make 144cc 2-strokes
My opinion is that these should be allowed to run in the 250F class and not the 250 2-stroke.
These rules are 5 years to late
Poor Bobby getting bashed with his wooden leg. WOW!!
Decisions shouldn't be made based on how they affect big Amateur championship events.
They should be run based on how they affect new people coming into the sport.
On that end the fourstrokes have been a disaster.
New riders can't work on their own stuff, the bikes are way to easy to hop on and ride faster than their skills should let them, and the expense is unbelieveable even if they do follow strict maintainance schedules.
Fourstrokes have turned our sport from sandlot baseball into polo.
An elitist sport where it is understood that you have to have more than one pony in the stable.
Amateur racing is AMA/American Motorcyclist Association
Certainly not the Am guys and kids that just want to race for their own pleasure unless you are backed up by some serious cash that is.
Definitely not the track owners that now have to deal with ever increasing noise complaints and the sudden BS "Zoning problems" that are being aggravated by those noisy ass tractors.
Not to mention tha dwindling number of folks entering the sport which drive down profit and closes riding areas.
So I would have to think that you mean the OEM's when you say "We win!!"
Newsflash...
When you price your product out of the reach of your target demographic you don't win ultimately everybody loses.
Seeing good rider going max on a tiddler or 250 was much more enjoyable than the same rider going "full" on a F.
I don't understand how people don't want them to mix again?
The only reason I download Stew the even smaller, or Justin engine torture Barcia was because they where riding smokers. That has to have some value?
Pit Row
The McGrath Invitational is a great example of the 250F.
JOSH Grant was hole-shotting and passing 450's all weekend.
We shall most likely have 50/ 65s and 85s mixing gas for the foreseeable future -
why can't we have 125.s and 250 two-smokers, then?.
And WHY must we jump kids to a 250F ?
I enjoy my four-strokes, too - but I'll be damned if they take my two-smokers
away.
We def need to find away to keep 2 smokes in the game... And, I think it's
gonna happen.
Plus, what the HELL will the off-roaders, GNCC guys and free-stylers do without
new 2 smokes?
Have you ever tried to make four stroke noises ? It's impossible.
The "BRAAAAP" rolls out the back of the mouth like freshly greased wheel-bearings
on a KX-2 fiddy...
Fast forward 10 years in technology and the 4 strokes are way ahead. I think they need to make the rules a better reflection of what is really a flash back to the eighties. Have a 125 class a 250 class and an open class. You can choose to run what you want; 4 stroke or 2, you decide but the displacement issue is almost irrelevant now.
I would love to see someone line up on a 500cc modern frame two stroke and see what happens against a 450 4t.
Now before the debate rages on... some people are better on a 4t and some on a 2t it all depends on your style and the type of track. For me I can run almost identical lap times on 4t or 2t. The 4stroke gets me a way better start but I last longer on the 2t...
Time for a change...lets just make it an cc class and let people choose what they want to ride.
If current EFI technology was applied to 2-strokes, we would have a cleaner and more durable 2-stroke engine.
My feeling is, they should allow them to be in the same class. The factory supported riders (w/big HP 250f's) will be on current 4-strokes. Privateer guys will be able to compete better on the 2-strokes, because of less cost to maintain and no need for motor hop-ups.
Now this will create a problem down the road when the factory guys will be getting beat by lesser riders on 2-strokes. Maybe then they will put some technology into the 2-stroke engine design.
The car and boat companies have plenty wild 2-stroke engine designs tucked away in their R&D departments. Now it's time we start to see some of that technology, before we're all riding electric bikes.
In terms of power and reliability, a CR500AF is better hands-down than a CRF450R. Handling is better in my opinion, but I guess that's a subjective thing. If factories had a reason to build them, like rules that match bikes cc to cc, we'd have incredible 450cc and 250cc two strokes, and I doubt that would put four strokes out of business - lots of guys would still prefer them because the powerband is flatter and lots of guys would just rather ride them in spite of not having quite as much power.
Here are just a few:
nothing will happen 'till it needs to happen!
That's the problem.It all happened to quick.
Again, no one, no one at least that I've ever heard
ever said what would be, as far as the,
Noise levels,
service cost,
parts & accessories costs,
injuries (due to motor issues)
etc........................
Economy or not, worldwide 4stks. are being sold!
But for every 1 sold, some people I believe are lost.
Lost & or fed-up with it all.
Moto as a sport has it's costs, like other sports do.
But 4stks. upped the ante way way to high for most
over the long haul.
It's simply a matter of dollars & cents.
Most avid moto or offroad buddies of mine, now with kids
who ride or race as well have said for yrs. now to me that
4stks. are killing it for them financially. The fun's still there
& those family moments too, but the cost is out weighing
the "fun factor". As the kids get older, say driving age plus,
many have said they're done for now!
Too bad.................................
Don't recall hearing anything similar concerning 2stks!!!!!!!
Dave O.
"hmmmmm............Dave, it sounds like you're coming around on the 2-stroke side."
Funny, I never really left...........!
Shoot, my old "torque wrench" is ready!
Haven't bought myself 1 of those $350 plus
models yet, borrowed 'em!
I like it all.
Outside of the economy again, the
manufactures & sanctioning bodies did this
all to themselves.
They did, really!
Now, yrs. into it all later it's showing.
It's showing worldwide I'm afraid!
The answer?
Certainly not more of the same.
They've proved it! That if you build it, they will come.
We did...........
Now what?
If all involved dried their faces with cash money, then my rant
would be in vein, but not many if any I know do so with their hard
earned cash. With 4stks. though, they are!!!!!!!!!!
So again I ask, is the new wave better full circle then the old.
????????
Dave O.
The 2-stroke rule may be the thing this sport needs to prosper this difficult time.
383ci vette for example against a 383ci vette with a supercharger? Same cc.....fair? No
350ci motor versus a 350ci diesel....both stock....race them on a road course. Fair? No!
Yamaha R1 versus a Yamaha R1 with a turbo....equal? No!!
a 4 stroke versus a 2 stroke of the same CC will never EVER be equal or fair because of how they make their power. EVER.
Anybody on this board can race a 2 stroke at ANY given time....at ANY race. There are those out there who can beat 250Fs on 125Ts. Now lets put 250T's against 250Fs and eeveryone switch to a 250T because the so called displacement HANDICAP runs in the 22 strokes favor and then the 250F is no longer around. For those who hate 4 strokes thre are MANY people who LOVE the 4 stroke.
Main point.......JUST BECAUSE its cc for cc.....does not make it equal or fair due to the fact of how they make their power!!!! Read my examples above....cc for cc doesnt make it fair always. Yes.....a 250F against a 250F is fair or a 250T vs a 250T is fair....but a 250T vs a 250F is not fair by no margin. So what do you do to make BOTH sides happy? I don' t have the answer.
Again.
Once you get into the big bikes, the valve munchers have beaten the pingers cc for cc on MX tracks for over a decade. But they did it straight up, and that is the point.
Post a reply to: "Wings of Change"...( a 250 is a 250...! )