UFC vs SX promotion

colorado2day
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colorado2day 1/3/2017 11:20am
1/3/2017 11:20am
burnside wrote:
More eyeballs watching SX of course trickles down to more participants. I find this idea that "mx doesn't need to grow" or "is fine the way...
More eyeballs watching SX of course trickles down to more participants.

I find this idea that "mx doesn't need to grow" or "is fine the way it is" or "we don't need to attract those viewers" rather defeatist and short sighted. Especially as kids media consumption and habits are changing.

I have a quote stuck in my mind, for some reason I think it came from Davey Coombes but could be totally wrong, was something along the lines of "never under estimate how much McGrath's charisma alone did for the growth of the sport". (anyone remember that?)

As a teenager, MC and Supercross VHS tapes got me itching to ride - and participate. Heck, how often do you hear of European pros that say they used to watch supercross as kids and dream of racing it...

To make supercross (or any sport) interesting, you need to care who wins. To keep inspiring new kids (and adults) to ride, we need interesting, nourishing media that inspires, gets them invested and makes them give a shit who wins.

The UFC media machine is great at this and there are lessons to be learnt as they in a short time span have taken a huge slice of a the young male demographic that brands such as Monster and Geico want to advertise to.

It appears like half the people commenting in here haven't watched any UFC media and are cutting off their nose to spite their face.... a common trend around here.
Thumbs up on that post Burnside. From a Not a UFC fan but can appreciate their marketing Evil
burnside
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burnside 1/3/2017 12:47pm
1/3/2017 12:47pm
colorado2day wrote:
Thumbs up on that post Burnside. From a Not a UFC fan but can appreciate their marketing Evil
hahaha. Cheers! Im a newly converted fan.
The bastards roped me in with narratives like this:

colorado2day
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colorado2day 1/3/2017 1:00pm
1/3/2017 1:00pm
colorado2day wrote:
Thumbs up on that post Burnside. From a Not a UFC fan but can appreciate their marketing Evil
burnside wrote:
hahaha. Cheers! Im a newly converted fan.
The bastards roped me in with narratives like this:

So your saying if SX did a vid like that with Kroc spouting off SX may pull some more fans ? To me that would be epic ! Evil

It aint gonna hurt.

I have a question. Why is PPV for SX not available for US viewers ? If it works for ufc.... Is Feld really afraid so many people would buy ppv that their TV ratings would suffer ? I wouldd buy it if I didnt have to see the track map all the freakin time and no commercials !
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Gooose 1/3/2017 1:21pm
1/3/2017 1:21pm Edited Date/Time 1/3/2017 1:26pm
UFC had 41 events in 2016 vs 17 that in its self is gonna draw more "fans" by brand saturation. They've had more events a year for the last 10 yrs than SX has kindof hard to compete. So out of 52 weeks there were 11 that someone wasn't watching a fight. Hard to compare marketing when you have 1/4 of the shows.
SX may need to promote better but I don't think trying to fallow a business that is putting on almost 4x the events is gonna help much. People forget about SX or just don't understand it.
Everyone has fought or watched someone fight in their life. Anyone can relate to it, be into it is your decision but still relatable.
As for cost MMA training is significantly cheaper than riding over a year when your getting into it. Local gym you can go to unlimited classes a month to train for 299 a month which ends up roughly 4k a yr.
Moto your bike decent used we'll say 2k. Practice @$35 a day is almost 2k if you can make it once a week for the yr. You're already at the same annual cost and haven't bought fuel, gear, wear parts, God forbid you blow up that used bike you got.

I get the idea of just copy them it works sounds good but there is far more that goes into it than just do what they're doing and you'll be successful.

As for splitting the show to different channels, wasn't there a ton of people bitching about not being able to watch it all on one channel last yr or the yr before. So loose the fans you have watching cause it'll be easier for someone's wife to watch lol
Sorry don't think the wife is gonna talk about SX at work or with the girls to draw more eyes to the event.

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burnside
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burnside 1/3/2017 1:42pm
1/3/2017 1:42pm
colorado2day wrote:
So your saying if SX did a vid like that with Kroc spouting off SX may pull some more fans ? To me that would be...
So your saying if SX did a vid like that with Kroc spouting off SX may pull some more fans ? To me that would be epic ! Evil

It aint gonna hurt.

I have a question. Why is PPV for SX not available for US viewers ? If it works for ufc.... Is Feld really afraid so many people would buy ppv that their TV ratings would suffer ? I wouldd buy it if I didnt have to see the track map all the freakin time and no commercials !
haha. Not suggesting anything should be forced but the UFC back up their events with so much ancillary media that collectively helps you get more invested and draw in fans. Id love to see more of that from Feld.

What have Feld put out for 2017 SX?
1 x lack luster preview show that didn't even inform the viewers of Dungey's injury or Roczen's dominant Outdoor form?

Gotta give props to Mathes and his Pulp/Racerx crew for their work, they getting me more hyped than Feld!

My 2 cents!
burnside
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burnside 1/3/2017 1:47pm
1/3/2017 1:47pm
Gooose wrote:
UFC had 41 events in 2016 vs 17 that in its self is gonna draw more "fans" by brand saturation. They've had more events a year...
UFC had 41 events in 2016 vs 17 that in its self is gonna draw more "fans" by brand saturation. They've had more events a year for the last 10 yrs than SX has kindof hard to compete. So out of 52 weeks there were 11 that someone wasn't watching a fight. Hard to compare marketing when you have 1/4 of the shows.
SX may need to promote better but I don't think trying to fallow a business that is putting on almost 4x the events is gonna help much. People forget about SX or just don't understand it.
Everyone has fought or watched someone fight in their life. Anyone can relate to it, be into it is your decision but still relatable.
As for cost MMA training is significantly cheaper than riding over a year when your getting into it. Local gym you can go to unlimited classes a month to train for 299 a month which ends up roughly 4k a yr.
Moto your bike decent used we'll say 2k. Practice @$35 a day is almost 2k if you can make it once a week for the yr. You're already at the same annual cost and haven't bought fuel, gear, wear parts, God forbid you blow up that used bike you got.

I get the idea of just copy them it works sounds good but there is far more that goes into it than just do what they're doing and you'll be successful.

As for splitting the show to different channels, wasn't there a ton of people bitching about not being able to watch it all on one channel last yr or the yr before. So loose the fans you have watching cause it'll be easier for someone's wife to watch lol
Sorry don't think the wife is gonna talk about SX at work or with the girls to draw more eyes to the event.
Fair points.
Again, not suggesting we copy UFC, but I think theres lessons to be learned from their marketing to the same demographic.
mxbenchracer 1/3/2017 3:33pm
1/3/2017 3:33pm
Gooose wrote:
UFC had 41 events in 2016 vs 17 that in its self is gonna draw more "fans" by brand saturation. They've had more events a year...
UFC had 41 events in 2016 vs 17 that in its self is gonna draw more "fans" by brand saturation. They've had more events a year for the last 10 yrs than SX has kindof hard to compete. So out of 52 weeks there were 11 that someone wasn't watching a fight. Hard to compare marketing when you have 1/4 of the shows.
SX may need to promote better but I don't think trying to fallow a business that is putting on almost 4x the events is gonna help much. People forget about SX or just don't understand it.
Everyone has fought or watched someone fight in their life. Anyone can relate to it, be into it is your decision but still relatable.
As for cost MMA training is significantly cheaper than riding over a year when your getting into it. Local gym you can go to unlimited classes a month to train for 299 a month which ends up roughly 4k a yr.
Moto your bike decent used we'll say 2k. Practice @$35 a day is almost 2k if you can make it once a week for the yr. You're already at the same annual cost and haven't bought fuel, gear, wear parts, God forbid you blow up that used bike you got.

I get the idea of just copy them it works sounds good but there is far more that goes into it than just do what they're doing and you'll be successful.

As for splitting the show to different channels, wasn't there a ton of people bitching about not being able to watch it all on one channel last yr or the yr before. So loose the fans you have watching cause it'll be easier for someone's wife to watch lol
Sorry don't think the wife is gonna talk about SX at work or with the girls to draw more eyes to the event.
To be fair not every UFC event is a smashing success, they have duds as well, what they do very well though is promoting the stars that they have built and building the shows around those guys. I agree that MX cant just copy and paste the UFCs promotion and over night have huge success. But the promos for SX are terrible, the shots of lights going off and some deep voiced goon yelling about "THE STARS OF MONSTER ENERGY AMA SUPER CROSS" and a few shots of some crashes ect, do not inspire people to watch or attend, IE spend money on tickets. The one UFC event I have gone too was GSP Vs Condit and most of the fights leading up to that fight were pretty weak because the Promoter knew people were there for GSP and he carried the show. The Flip to that is when the headliner gets hurt and the rest of the event is so weak that they cancel the show. To think that a race would get canceled because a top rider wouldn't be racing is laughable. Which goes to show that Moto has the talent, it just needs stars. When the Behind the Dream Series went from a look at the riders lives and prep and into a race recap show is when I started losing interest in SX.
colorado2day
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colorado2day 1/3/2017 4:38pm
1/3/2017 4:38pm
Fox Sports 2 is currently re- running the St. Louis Sx from 2016. They just advertised an upcoming UFC fight. Does FS2 advertise SX during UFC fight's ? Seems like a no brainer, but.....
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Pdub 1/3/2017 5:28pm
1/3/2017 5:28pm
So just to be clear... OP suggests SX could learn a thing or two from UFC promotions. It appears that the OP is defining success in this case by viewership of programming. Is that correct Burnside?

I could be wrong, but I think the way FELD defines success is through butts-in-seats? TV viewership is secondary. Either way, though, what we're saying is that it would be beneficial to the sport of motocross if more people watched supercross, on TV or in person.

If that is the thesis, I have to disagree. And I have long been a proponent of getting motocross on TV and the internet.

As other posters have pointed out, the "sport" is about the guys and gals who decide to make dirt biking their recreational drug of choice, and commit the time and resources necessary to enjoy it properly... in the dirt. It really had nothing to do with watching the pros do it on TV, or even in person at a stadium track that no mere mortal could even ride if given the chance. Now, the outdoor Nats are different in that Joe or Jill Blo can stand beside the fence and watch the pros shred the same track they rode the week before. THAT gets one pumped up! But of course, the only people who actually go to Nationals are the same "hardcore" fans that actually buy and ride dirt bikes...

So I think FELD and MXSports already understand that humongous TV ratings really aren't going to do much for their respective bottom lines. At the very least, I'm sure their number crunchers have done the cost/benefit analysis and have decided that they're spending enough on promotions as it is. It's a balancing act.
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kkawboy14 1/3/2017 5:32pm
1/3/2017 5:32pm
They need more fights in moto......they seem to hate them but then use them in all their promos!
colorado2day
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colorado2day 1/3/2017 5:40pm
1/3/2017 5:40pm
Pdub wrote:
So just to be clear... OP suggests SX could learn a thing or two from UFC promotions. It appears that the OP is defining success in...
So just to be clear... OP suggests SX could learn a thing or two from UFC promotions. It appears that the OP is defining success in this case by viewership of programming. Is that correct Burnside?

I could be wrong, but I think the way FELD defines success is through butts-in-seats? TV viewership is secondary. Either way, though, what we're saying is that it would be beneficial to the sport of motocross if more people watched supercross, on TV or in person.

If that is the thesis, I have to disagree. And I have long been a proponent of getting motocross on TV and the internet.

As other posters have pointed out, the "sport" is about the guys and gals who decide to make dirt biking their recreational drug of choice, and commit the time and resources necessary to enjoy it properly... in the dirt. It really had nothing to do with watching the pros do it on TV, or even in person at a stadium track that no mere mortal could even ride if given the chance. Now, the outdoor Nats are different in that Joe or Jill Blo can stand beside the fence and watch the pros shred the same track they rode the week before. THAT gets one pumped up! But of course, the only people who actually go to Nationals are the same "hardcore" fans that actually buy and ride dirt bikes...

So I think FELD and MXSports already understand that humongous TV ratings really aren't going to do much for their respective bottom lines. At the very least, I'm sure their number crunchers have done the cost/benefit analysis and have decided that they're spending enough on promotions as it is. It's a balancing act.
Sponsors, which these days partially pay the budget for OEM teams to go racing, like eyeballs on their logos. If they were only reaching the 'hardcore' fan then they are wasting their money.


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GuyB 1/3/2017 6:44pm
1/3/2017 6:44pm Edited Date/Time 1/3/2017 6:44pm
I do remember a couple years in Vegas that they had some cage fights on premises...but not UFC.
Pdub
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Pdub 1/3/2017 7:31pm
1/3/2017 7:31pm
colorado2day wrote:
Sponsors, which these days partially pay the budget for OEM teams to go racing, like eyeballs on their logos. If they were only reaching the 'hardcore'...
Sponsors, which these days partially pay the budget for OEM teams to go racing, like eyeballs on their logos. If they were only reaching the 'hardcore' fan then they are wasting their money.


Agreed. Red Bull is a great example of masterful branding. They also use a bit of a "shotgun" approach, sponsoring just about any type of activity their target youth demo might show an interest in. They cover a lot of bases.
colorado2day
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colorado2day 1/3/2017 7:42pm
1/3/2017 7:42pm
colorado2day wrote:
Sponsors, which these days partially pay the budget for OEM teams to go racing, like eyeballs on their logos. If they were only reaching the 'hardcore'...
Sponsors, which these days partially pay the budget for OEM teams to go racing, like eyeballs on their logos. If they were only reaching the 'hardcore' fan then they are wasting their money.


Pdub wrote:
Agreed. Red Bull is a great example of masterful branding. They also use a bit of a "shotgun" approach, sponsoring just about any type of activity...
Agreed. Red Bull is a great example of masterful branding. They also use a bit of a "shotgun" approach, sponsoring just about any type of activity their target youth demo might show an interest in. They cover a lot of bases.
I dont know the answer to this but does Red Bull do anything in UFC ?
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trailrider 1/3/2017 7:45pm
1/3/2017 7:45pm
People watch UFC for the brutal beat downs...if SX had more spectacular crashes you may see an up tick in attendance...for years SX aired commercials with that wicked get off..yep people came waiting to see crashes
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trailrider 1/3/2017 7:49pm
1/3/2017 7:49pm Edited Date/Time 1/3/2017 7:51pm


Advertising 8 crashes in what 12 frames

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Pdub
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Pdub 1/3/2017 8:50pm
1/3/2017 8:50pm
colorado2day wrote:
I dont know the answer to this but does Red Bull do anything in UFC ?
Good question, I had to look: Red Bull Athlete Browser

Answer is no.
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themxlab 1/3/2017 8:51pm
1/3/2017 8:51pm Edited Date/Time 1/3/2017 9:36pm
I edited the post to see if I could embed the video at a specific time. Haven't figured it out.

I enjoy watching both mixed martial arts/UFC and motocross. Maybe this doesn't belong here and like burnside wrote, "This isn't intended to start some kind of pissing match between UFC and SX”. I simply feel that any person would enjoy or even benefit by listening to these two interviews. I would love to hear interviews like this from people in every sport.

These interviews are from UFC 207's Post-fight press conference with Dominick Cruz and Cody Garbrandtt. Amazing! Sounds of honesty by both men.

Dominic Cruz - 25m 40s - 39m 35s https://youtu.be/iGy1cSSGFeU?t=25m40s

Cody Garbrandtt - 56m10s - 1h18m5s - https://youtu.be/iGy1cSSGFeU?t=56m10s


I've known Dominick Cruz is excellent at dissecting fights and I now know he can do it just as well with his life. It appears that he has a very good and honest mindset.

Cody Garbrandtt is entertaining, inspirational, makes you feel like there are some good people out in the world.

So many good lines, thoughts, intentions
colorado2day
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colorado2day 1/3/2017 9:01pm
1/3/2017 9:01pm
Pdub wrote:
Good question, I had to look: Red Bull Athlete Browser

Answer is no.
Must be Monster's fault ? ML512 care to weigh in on this ? (pun intended)
Funyun
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Funyun 1/4/2017 9:03am
1/4/2017 9:03am
Its hard to compare the two and the reason UFC is growing more rapidly is because its something more people can get entertainment out of. MX/SX is not going to really grow in fan base as much because people who dont ride aren't going to watch it. Even for people who do enjoy riding its is pretty boring and sometimes hard to even stay awake during a full night of SX.

Its also hard to do the same kind of promotion because UFC is just those 2 guys in a cage fighting it out where as SX is a gate full of people where most of them wont even see each other after the first few laps. Its hard to have rivalries that get people excited to watch in MX/SX because most of the time they arent battling each other. What would be exciting about 2 guys talking smack to each other and then after the race starts one is out front just cruising without anyone near him and the other is riding around in 5th place.
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TXDirt 1/4/2017 10:16am
1/4/2017 10:16am
SX is a sacred cow to the people making money off it. They make enough to be happy and they do not want to take risks with changing it up at all. There is not much investment back into SX. Investing means putting money in and taking on potential risks. The people in the money are not going to do that. It's like an old business who has enough clients to make money and stay in business, but they never change or advance their technology and invest in the future.

Just look at the TV package. It's not bad. But it's not good either. The powers that be should be investing heavily in technology. Scrap showing anything on TV and move purely to a subscription service that is 100% commercial free. That's a risk that takes investment, but the rewards could be quite lucrative.

Subscription based quality streaming is a huge area that SX is missing out. It's low hanging fruit that could pull in pretty big dollars if done right.

On top of a better subscription service, I think as a value add (think incremental monthly subscription cost), they should follow the top five to ten SX riders around from the moment they get to the stadium to the moment they leave. That's the real behind the scenes stuff that a lot of folks are not exposed to, but I believe they would absolutely pay to see. So at any point during the event I could pull up the Kenny cam or Dungey cam and follow them. Not during the race, but the behind the scenes pit stuff.

There is so much SX could be doing with technology to make money and provide existing fans services they would gladly pay extra for.

But nope. Keep doing the same thing. Don't touch that sacred cow.
mxbenchracer 1/4/2017 10:48am
1/4/2017 10:48am
Pdub wrote:
So just to be clear... OP suggests SX could learn a thing or two from UFC promotions. It appears that the OP is defining success in...
So just to be clear... OP suggests SX could learn a thing or two from UFC promotions. It appears that the OP is defining success in this case by viewership of programming. Is that correct Burnside?

I could be wrong, but I think the way FELD defines success is through butts-in-seats? TV viewership is secondary. Either way, though, what we're saying is that it would be beneficial to the sport of motocross if more people watched supercross, on TV or in person.

If that is the thesis, I have to disagree. And I have long been a proponent of getting motocross on TV and the internet.

As other posters have pointed out, the "sport" is about the guys and gals who decide to make dirt biking their recreational drug of choice, and commit the time and resources necessary to enjoy it properly... in the dirt. It really had nothing to do with watching the pros do it on TV, or even in person at a stadium track that no mere mortal could even ride if given the chance. Now, the outdoor Nats are different in that Joe or Jill Blo can stand beside the fence and watch the pros shred the same track they rode the week before. THAT gets one pumped up! But of course, the only people who actually go to Nationals are the same "hardcore" fans that actually buy and ride dirt bikes...

So I think FELD and MXSports already understand that humongous TV ratings really aren't going to do much for their respective bottom lines. At the very least, I'm sure their number crunchers have done the cost/benefit analysis and have decided that they're spending enough on promotions as it is. It's a balancing act.
Every one talks about how poorly the racers get paid, so I would say success would be a sport where the top 20 in each class are making great purse money. You know how that happens? Butts in the seats and eyes on the screen. When SX was on Speed, 99% of the commercials on the were about other shows that placed on Speed. So clearly nobody was interested in advertising on Speed when SX was on. Now imagine if the promotes brought the exposer to the sport to a place where they had fantastic viewership, and then companies like Apple, or Ford, or Home depot, you name it are paying good money to be in those slots instead of an add for Pinks all out. That can only be good for everyone involved. I'm out of the loop on whats being advertised now because I don't have speed or Fox sports anymore, but last I saw it was the same old same old. I would also argue that "the sport" is about much more then the people that ride, the whole point of racing is to get people to see it and want to go riding, so wouldn't step one be to get people to see it?.
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DR176 1/4/2017 10:54am
1/4/2017 10:54am
I've become a huge fan of the UFC as of the last year or two after listening to way too much of Joe Rogan's Podcast. Something that I wish SX would adopt is a small online video series leading up to A1 (and perhaps every race). The UFC is a marketing machine and they have a great web series that begins on Monday or Tuesday of fight week. The videos are by no means very rich with content, however they do give a bit of insight into the daily lives of the fighters and the events leading up to the fight. Here is an Example: https://youtu.be/9YfjXwB6B5w
burnside
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burnside 1/4/2017 1:32pm
1/4/2017 1:32pm
DR176 wrote:
I've become a huge fan of the UFC as of the last year or two after listening to way too much of Joe Rogan's Podcast. Something...
I've become a huge fan of the UFC as of the last year or two after listening to way too much of Joe Rogan's Podcast. Something that I wish SX would adopt is a small online video series leading up to A1 (and perhaps every race). The UFC is a marketing machine and they have a great web series that begins on Monday or Tuesday of fight week. The videos are by no means very rich with content, however they do give a bit of insight into the daily lives of the fighters and the events leading up to the fight. Here is an Example: https://youtu.be/9YfjXwB6B5w
Yes! Would love to see something like this in SX..
We'd be fiending over them this week if Feld made a similar real time series like this.
mxbenchracer 1/4/2017 2:37pm
1/4/2017 2:37pm
DR176 wrote:
I've become a huge fan of the UFC as of the last year or two after listening to way too much of Joe Rogan's Podcast. Something...
I've become a huge fan of the UFC as of the last year or two after listening to way too much of Joe Rogan's Podcast. Something that I wish SX would adopt is a small online video series leading up to A1 (and perhaps every race). The UFC is a marketing machine and they have a great web series that begins on Monday or Tuesday of fight week. The videos are by no means very rich with content, however they do give a bit of insight into the daily lives of the fighters and the events leading up to the fight. Here is an Example: https://youtu.be/9YfjXwB6B5w
burnside wrote:
Yes! Would love to see something like this in SX.. We'd be fiending over them this week if Feld made a similar real time series like...
Yes! Would love to see something like this in SX..
We'd be fiending over them this week if Feld made a similar real time series like this.
Just saw Hondas REDefined episode 1, like where they are going with that, I know teams have done these in the past though. Would be nice to see one that follows multiple teams throughout the week though.
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Motodave15 1/4/2017 6:06pm
1/4/2017 6:06pm
Just thought about it.

The content mx/sx releases is great, with the recent honda video and now the chad reed one's from today... the problem is....drumrolll

Getting it onto to T.V for more eyes to see because all we have on t.v. for the races is the race itself, no behind the scenes episodes no random t.v. channel to show these type of series.

There needs to be production analyst before the race... pre-race show... after-race show and then sprinkled throughout the weeks/days teams episodes like the honda one or the reed one....

we also have no analysis of our sport besides the short interviews between races like RC talking about the dirt in the corner lol
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Gale19XX 1/8/2017 5:25am
1/8/2017 5:25am
I'm all for an upgrade in marketing Supercross with the intent to grow the sport but I don't feel the UFC has necessarily done that. The UFC spent the last 15 years building and marketing a brand, not growing the sport. They tweaked some rules early on, but their current set of rules, and clueless athletic commissions are making it worse everyday. Locking guys into contracts for pennies, stalling their careers if they want, telling them what they have to wear, what they are allowed to tell the public via social media, not allowing personal sponsors to be advertised, etc, just doesn't seem to me like its growing a sport. Tons of MMA apparel and gear companies have went under due to losing those advertissements, in turn fighters losing sponsor money. Signing guys like CM Punk might have made the UFC some big bucks but took a bit of credibility away from the sport of MMA.

On that note, I get what you're saying. The UFC took and takes huge risks and obviously did well for themselves. Our sport could take a few more risks with marketing ideas but unfortunately, if the risk didn't work out, that would probably be the last one taken. I don't hate MMA by the way, I just don't care for the UFC. I'm a huge MMA fan. A good friend of mine is currently signed to the UFC, coming over from the WEC, and they've been good to him tho.

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