DV on Villo's bike mxgp

Motocross83 3/1/2015 4:04am
3/1/2015 4:04am
DavidVuillemin wrote:
Did you really need Rattray's confirmation to believe their set-ups were horrible? I just needed a couch, a wifi connection and to watch 15min of Moto...
Did you really need Rattray's confirmation to believe their set-ups were horrible? I just needed a couch, a wifi connection and to watch 15min of Moto 2 after my son's basketball game... Factory this. Magnesium this. Air that. Oil this. Titanium that. Aluminum this. And no one from the team/entourage saw from the side of the track (since he started riding in Europe) that his forks looked like a packing machine on a road construction site?
Tbh, yes I did. I suspected that his settings weren't perfect but it was hard to tell for sure. A rider can look "off" if he's simply struggling with the track and/or hasn't raced in months etc.
St Ann More 3/1/2015 4:14am
3/1/2015 4:14am
GATOR wrote:
Yeah, real bad suspension. I'm pretty sure that's why he stalled on the grid.
Tongue
DavidVuillemin wrote:
And from my close source in Qatar, it wasn't electrical neither...
Shhh, don't ruin that excuse...
DavidVuillemin 3/1/2015 4:18am
3/1/2015 4:18am
St Ann More wrote:
Shhh, don't ruin that excuse...
What I know is that he lost (broke?)his rear brake in the 2nd moto and rode for most of the race without it I guess
philG
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philG 3/1/2015 4:25am
3/1/2015 4:25am
St Ann More wrote:
Shhh, don't ruin that excuse...
DavidVuillemin wrote:
What I know is that he lost (broke?)his rear brake in the 2nd moto and rode for most of the race without it I guess
He said 'it felt funny' which leads me to belive they couldnt find anything broken when he got back, my guess from the lap times is that it went when Febvre passed him maybe, he lost a bunch of time then.. up to then the laptimes suggest he was running steadily at his pace for the weekend

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Paulbeds
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Paulbeds 3/1/2015 4:36am
3/1/2015 4:36am
I just hope this race could finish all the offenses and throwing shits of many americans here at the racers riding the world championship.
It is not good and nothing to do with good sportmanships when I come here reading about Villopoto and friends could dethrone our riders (here in Europe) on smaller bikes...riding with one hand behind the back...leaving the starting gate after 30 seconds...and all this kind of bullshits

I get upset with many of my friends for the respect they have toward the USA riders... without knowing how the Americans fans(not all, but too many here) have only bad things to say about Cairoli and friends.

I hope you understand by this race that we need your respect too, the same way we always respect the USA riders...
Crush
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Crush 3/1/2015 4:41am
3/1/2015 4:41am
Grips and Graphics!

Where's Keefer? We need 20 seconds!
mccread
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mccread 3/1/2015 5:24am
3/1/2015 5:24am Edited Date/Time 3/1/2015 5:25am
bsharkey wrote:
isn't Rv using guys who have raced over in Europe forever and not some guys from over here in the US.. if what DV says is...
isn't Rv using guys who have raced over in Europe forever and not some guys from over here in the US.. if what DV says is true how can they fuck his bike setup that bad. also someone mentioned he doesn't look as fit but hes been on the bike for awhile now. what confuses me is he has been to Europe several times for the mxdn and had done well against the same guys with little or no time on the track
GPs are harder than the MXDN, there's more depth and the track is rougher at a GP.

RV's team, KRT, had success last year at Qatar with Paulin, Frossard and Covington got a third - maybe RV went with his own US based settings because he felt more comfortable.

Rattray surprises me the most... how can he be so shocked that Milestone is different to GP tracks?! He raced GPs for years before he went to US and raced them last year as well, maybe he has given RV some bad advice - It was silly not to do pre-season races as well. That;s where a lot of the GP guys shake off the bugs.

Saying that JVH didn't feel comfortable on the track either and couldn't get a good set up. It's kind of a funky track. RV should be fine next week.. but other guys will be quicker too.
TheCynic82 3/1/2015 5:27am
3/1/2015 5:27am
Fuck its not that the team dont have the right settings for this track.
Its that RV and his crew didnt want to spend time adjusting to a different riding style because you know, he didnt need it....
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DonM 3/1/2015 5:30am
3/1/2015 5:30am
GATOR wrote:
Yeah, real bad suspension. I'm pretty sure that's why he stalled on the grid.
Tongue
DavidVuillemin wrote:
And from my close source in Qatar, it wasn't electrical neither...
It appeared to me that the gate drop in the first moto was very quick after the 5 sec board and it just caught him off guard...not like in the US where they always drop it close to the same every time....As we know it's why Alessi is the holeshot king...count and go!
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mx965 3/1/2015 6:30am
3/1/2015 6:30am
I agree with everything DV said thats why i posted it. Coming from one of the top guys in the sport at one point and still dudes that own 2 sets of gear and ride 3 times a year think they know better.
500guy
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500guy 3/1/2015 6:37am
3/1/2015 6:37am

I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and GP's on set up ?


is it the speed ?
Fraser
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Fraser 3/1/2015 6:41am
3/1/2015 6:41am
Wasn't RV's set up quite different to most of the other US riders though?
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Olson 3/1/2015 6:46am
3/1/2015 6:46am
500guy wrote:
I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and...

I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and GP's on set up ?


is it the speed ?
I think the speed is pretty similar. AMA doesn't show average speed on the results protocol. Average speed from the winner in Qatar was 52km/h which is pretty standard. FIM want's the speed to stay under 50km/h for all FIM tracks. Not sure about the rules in GP racing. The main difference is the developments of the braking bumps. They gets more square in the GPs and in the AMA they get longer/rolling ruts.
MR. X
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MR. X 3/1/2015 6:53am
3/1/2015 6:53am
He needs to learn how to go fast through lines that are carved out by slower riders..ya ya that's it.
philG
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philG 3/1/2015 6:54am
3/1/2015 6:54am
500guy wrote:
I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and...

I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and GP's on set up ?


is it the speed ?
no , its the way the tracks are prepped... 2 day race, up to 5 classes, most of the time the tracks are left alone unless the weather dictates otherwise, apart from refacing jumps where needed.

The GP guys have a set up that is plush, because unlike US tracks that are usually ripped deep , and run for one day , the tracks harden off so you have lots of square edge bumps in ruts , and in the landings etc.

You cant ride balls out on tracks like this without a perfect set up, when you watch places like Utah and Elsinore etc, they hardly ever shut off, the finesse isnt there,its just wide open and sit back.

This is why people think the GP guys arent fast, because they dont look fast, but they just have a setup that soaks up the bumps and makes them look comfy

Steve Gutteridge said he though RV looked real fast, but was surprised how far down he was... and thats the key. Looking fast isnt enough.

Nathan Watson never looks fast , but he was right behind RV in timed practice, and he has always been known as a sand specialist. He was only kept off pole in Finland last year by Filip Bengtson.. Being team mate with Nagl has helped him find the setup he needs to have , and learn to ride with.
Tyrell
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Tyrell 3/1/2015 6:55am
3/1/2015 6:55am
I seem to remember that DV used to beat McGrath and Carmichael straight up on occasion.

I wouldn't describe him as a never was.

I personally like him for the fact that he shares he opinions with us and find his stuff interesting to read / listen to.
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Tumic 3/1/2015 6:58am
3/1/2015 6:58am
philG wrote:
no , its the way the tracks are prepped... 2 day race, up to 5 classes, most of the time the tracks are left alone unless...
no , its the way the tracks are prepped... 2 day race, up to 5 classes, most of the time the tracks are left alone unless the weather dictates otherwise, apart from refacing jumps where needed.

The GP guys have a set up that is plush, because unlike US tracks that are usually ripped deep , and run for one day , the tracks harden off so you have lots of square edge bumps in ruts , and in the landings etc.

You cant ride balls out on tracks like this without a perfect set up, when you watch places like Utah and Elsinore etc, they hardly ever shut off, the finesse isnt there,its just wide open and sit back.

This is why people think the GP guys arent fast, because they dont look fast, but they just have a setup that soaks up the bumps and makes them look comfy

Steve Gutteridge said he though RV looked real fast, but was surprised how far down he was... and thats the key. Looking fast isnt enough.

Nathan Watson never looks fast , but he was right behind RV in timed practice, and he has always been known as a sand specialist. He was only kept off pole in Finland last year by Filip Bengtson.. Being team mate with Nagl has helped him find the setup he needs to have , and learn to ride with.
Nailed it!
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tomm55x 3/1/2015 7:05am
3/1/2015 7:05am
DV you are the man!! I would take Vuillemins advice over anybodys, the guy was there, done that and won at it and won at it in American racing also. he is NOT some has been that doesn't know anything,the stuff he says is common sense knowledge for him, for people to be disrespectful to a legend of MX and SX is very rude to say the least, he is just calling it like he see's it.

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DonM
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DonM 3/1/2015 7:06am
3/1/2015 7:06am
500guy wrote:
I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and...

I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and GP's on set up ?


is it the speed ?
Couple of factors, they don't add sand and dig it deep so every track has pretty close to the same loam and the GP tracks are shorter so they run many more laps through the race weekend. GP tracks times are usually in the 1:50's while the US tracks are well over 2:00's sometimes into the 2:20's.
As far as the "we race over two days without any track prep" is way over rated you have have maybe only 60 riders on the track during that time while in the US you have close to 100 so I don't buy that reasoning. Long story short is shorter lap times plus a different approach to track prep equals a choppier surface.
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TeamGreen 3/1/2015 7:09am
3/1/2015 7:09am
mx621 wrote:
Send Mikey Williamson now!!
DavidVuillemin wrote:
To do what? Put new graphics on? Change the grips? Polish the frame? I don't think that would change anything to RV's set up. You guys...
To do what? Put new graphics on? Change the grips? Polish the frame? I don't think that would change anything to RV's set up. You guys need to stop believing that the mechanics set up the bikes. They know stuff but they have no idea how to make an EFI curve or a fork valving. The guys you never see and behind the scenes do that stuff. Factory mechanics, most of them, don't open an engine, a shock, a set of forks and don't use Excel to come up with EFI set up. You gotta freaking wake up at one point, guys...
OK

Then we'll send Rick Ash and Ross Maeda
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Olson 3/1/2015 7:10am
3/1/2015 7:10am
500guy wrote:
I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and...

I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and GP's on set up ?


is it the speed ?
DonM wrote:
Couple of factors, they don't add sand and dig it deep so every track has pretty close to the same loam and the GP tracks are...
Couple of factors, they don't add sand and dig it deep so every track has pretty close to the same loam and the GP tracks are shorter so they run many more laps through the race weekend. GP tracks times are usually in the 1:50's while the US tracks are well over 2:00's sometimes into the 2:20's.
As far as the "we race over two days without any track prep" is way over rated you have have maybe only 60 riders on the track during that time while in the US you have close to 100 so I don't buy that reasoning. Long story short is shorter lap times plus a different approach to track prep equals a choppier surface.
60? So WMX, EMX doesn't go fast enough to make any ruts and braking bumps?
DonM
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DonM 3/1/2015 7:11am
3/1/2015 7:11am
500guy wrote:
I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and...

I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and GP's on set up ?


is it the speed ?
philG wrote:
no , its the way the tracks are prepped... 2 day race, up to 5 classes, most of the time the tracks are left alone unless...
no , its the way the tracks are prepped... 2 day race, up to 5 classes, most of the time the tracks are left alone unless the weather dictates otherwise, apart from refacing jumps where needed.

The GP guys have a set up that is plush, because unlike US tracks that are usually ripped deep , and run for one day , the tracks harden off so you have lots of square edge bumps in ruts , and in the landings etc.

You cant ride balls out on tracks like this without a perfect set up, when you watch places like Utah and Elsinore etc, they hardly ever shut off, the finesse isnt there,its just wide open and sit back.

This is why people think the GP guys arent fast, because they dont look fast, but they just have a setup that soaks up the bumps and makes them look comfy

Steve Gutteridge said he though RV looked real fast, but was surprised how far down he was... and thats the key. Looking fast isnt enough.

Nathan Watson never looks fast , but he was right behind RV in timed practice, and he has always been known as a sand specialist. He was only kept off pole in Finland last year by Filip Bengtson.. Being team mate with Nagl has helped him find the setup he needs to have , and learn to ride with.
How many GP's actually have all 5 classes there at the same time?
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DonM 3/1/2015 7:15am
3/1/2015 7:15am
500guy wrote:
I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and...

I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and GP's on set up ?


is it the speed ?
DonM wrote:
Couple of factors, they don't add sand and dig it deep so every track has pretty close to the same loam and the GP tracks are...
Couple of factors, they don't add sand and dig it deep so every track has pretty close to the same loam and the GP tracks are shorter so they run many more laps through the race weekend. GP tracks times are usually in the 1:50's while the US tracks are well over 2:00's sometimes into the 2:20's.
As far as the "we race over two days without any track prep" is way over rated you have have maybe only 60 riders on the track during that time while in the US you have close to 100 so I don't buy that reasoning. Long story short is shorter lap times plus a different approach to track prep equals a choppier surface.
Olson wrote:
60? So WMX, EMX doesn't go fast enough to make any ruts and braking bumps?
Not this weekend...and I would say that the women probably don't add much to the roughness of the track.
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chrisbuehler 3/1/2015 7:23am
3/1/2015 7:23am
tomm55x wrote:
DV you are the man!! I would take Vuillemins advice over anybodys, the guy was there, done that and won at it and won at it...
DV you are the man!! I would take Vuillemins advice over anybodys, the guy was there, done that and won at it and won at it in American racing also. he is NOT some has been that doesn't know anything,the stuff he says is common sense knowledge for him, for people to be disrespectful to a legend of MX and SX is very rude to say the least, he is just calling it like he see's it.
X2. How about the SX season he was leading the points when he got hurt in a photo shoot. Didn't that field have RC in it? Yeah, DV really blows. Fucking love it, guy comes into this thread and lays the smack down. Great info David! Thanks for posting
philG
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philG 3/1/2015 7:25am
3/1/2015 7:25am
500guy wrote:
I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and...

I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and GP's on set up ?


is it the speed ?
DonM wrote:
Couple of factors, they don't add sand and dig it deep so every track has pretty close to the same loam and the GP tracks are...
Couple of factors, they don't add sand and dig it deep so every track has pretty close to the same loam and the GP tracks are shorter so they run many more laps through the race weekend. GP tracks times are usually in the 1:50's while the US tracks are well over 2:00's sometimes into the 2:20's.
As far as the "we race over two days without any track prep" is way over rated you have have maybe only 60 riders on the track during that time while in the US you have close to 100 so I don't buy that reasoning. Long story short is shorter lap times plus a different approach to track prep equals a choppier surface.
When we get back to Europe , there will always be 2 and sometimes 3 support classes, all over subcribed in EMX125 and EMX250 60 riders in each going for 40 places, dont think that because you only see 60 riders on TV that that is all there is.

EMX125 60
EMX250 60
EMX300 20
WMX 20

Plus GP's 60

Close to 200 riders,
In Qatar , there was only the Women, and the Qatari national series, so it was less than that.
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PressPassP 3/1/2015 7:26am
3/1/2015 7:26am Edited Date/Time 3/1/2015 7:28am
500guy wrote:
I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and...

I won't argue that the set up needs to be different, I just want to know why there is such a big difference between USA and GP's on set up ?


is it the speed ?
philG wrote:
no , its the way the tracks are prepped... 2 day race, up to 5 classes, most of the time the tracks are left alone unless...
no , its the way the tracks are prepped... 2 day race, up to 5 classes, most of the time the tracks are left alone unless the weather dictates otherwise, apart from refacing jumps where needed.

The GP guys have a set up that is plush, because unlike US tracks that are usually ripped deep , and run for one day , the tracks harden off so you have lots of square edge bumps in ruts , and in the landings etc.

You cant ride balls out on tracks like this without a perfect set up, when you watch places like Utah and Elsinore etc, they hardly ever shut off, the finesse isnt there,its just wide open and sit back.

This is why people think the GP guys arent fast, because they dont look fast, but they just have a setup that soaks up the bumps and makes them look comfy

Steve Gutteridge said he though RV looked real fast, but was surprised how far down he was... and thats the key. Looking fast isnt enough.

Nathan Watson never looks fast , but he was right behind RV in timed practice, and he has always been known as a sand specialist. He was only kept off pole in Finland last year by Filip Bengtson.. Being team mate with Nagl has helped him find the setup he needs to have , and learn to ride with.
DonM wrote:
How many GP's actually have all 5 classes there at the same time?
There's quite a few more classes in Europe when the EMX series runs with the GPs

Edit,Phil can type faster
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philG 3/1/2015 7:33am
3/1/2015 7:33am
PressPassP wrote:
There's quite a few more classes in Europe when the EMX series runs with the GPs

Edit,Phil can type faster
thats what happens when its pissing down with rain and you have loads to do outside..
DonM
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DonM 3/1/2015 7:35am
3/1/2015 7:35am
philG wrote:
no , its the way the tracks are prepped... 2 day race, up to 5 classes, most of the time the tracks are left alone unless...
no , its the way the tracks are prepped... 2 day race, up to 5 classes, most of the time the tracks are left alone unless the weather dictates otherwise, apart from refacing jumps where needed.

The GP guys have a set up that is plush, because unlike US tracks that are usually ripped deep , and run for one day , the tracks harden off so you have lots of square edge bumps in ruts , and in the landings etc.

You cant ride balls out on tracks like this without a perfect set up, when you watch places like Utah and Elsinore etc, they hardly ever shut off, the finesse isnt there,its just wide open and sit back.

This is why people think the GP guys arent fast, because they dont look fast, but they just have a setup that soaks up the bumps and makes them look comfy

Steve Gutteridge said he though RV looked real fast, but was surprised how far down he was... and thats the key. Looking fast isnt enough.

Nathan Watson never looks fast , but he was right behind RV in timed practice, and he has always been known as a sand specialist. He was only kept off pole in Finland last year by Filip Bengtson.. Being team mate with Nagl has helped him find the setup he needs to have , and learn to ride with.
DonM wrote:
How many GP's actually have all 5 classes there at the same time?
PressPassP wrote:
There's quite a few more classes in Europe when the EMX series runs with the GPs

Edit,Phil can type faster
I knew that the races in Europe had the support classes but wasn't sure how many, when I hit a few GP's 2yrs ago I want to say they had the 125's at one and the 250 EMX at the other. I think the biggest difference is the track prep and how in the US every track has some type of "other" dirt added and then ripped deeply into the existing surface, that equals less square edge. Now that POS track from this weekend cannot be simulated or recreated anywhere else on this planet....
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mmcmx 3/1/2015 7:35am
3/1/2015 7:35am
DonM wrote:
How many GP's actually have all 5 classes there at the same time?
I think all the GP's held in Europe have at least 4 classes.
Zracer
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Zracer 3/1/2015 7:41am
3/1/2015 7:41am
My question to DV is why did you try to help him and give advice in the 1st place?

Post a reply to: DV on Villo's bike mxgp