Sandbaggers

Huckster wrote:

That's BS. In the plus class everyone is the same age. Just because one guy who was a pro stopped riding, doesnt mean he should be...

That's BS. In the plus class everyone is the same age. Just because one guy who was a pro stopped riding, doesnt mean he should be able to drop back down. He is still the same age as the guys he used to race with and beat when he was skilled enough to earn his pro license or move up to the A class. The guys riding 30 B/C, NEVER were fast enough to earn either their A or Pro cards, plain and simple.(except for the ones that the AMA/MxSports let slip by)

I will never understand the ex Pro and A guys complaining about RC, Emig, Reynard or any factory guy coming back and racing the Vet classes but yet have no issue with dropping themselves down to B. Am I the only guy that see's the unbelievable irony in this?

Wahoo214 wrote:

JBlain619, Vet Classes are tough because a 45 yr old guy is nothing like when he was a fast A Class 17 year old. And guys...

JBlain619, Vet Classes are tough because a 45 yr old guy is nothing like when he was a fast A Class 17 year old. And guys like RC #4 show up at LL and take a trophy from a guy that never raced Pro, that sucks. Personally I would be honored to be on the track with some of my heros from back in the day, but any former Pro should not be at an Amature national

Huckster wrote:

That's BS. In the plus class everyone is the same age. Just because one guy who was a pro stopped riding, doesnt mean he should be...

That's BS. In the plus class everyone is the same age. Just because one guy who was a pro stopped riding, doesnt mean he should be able to drop back down. He is still the same age as the guys he used to race with and beat when he was skilled enough to earn his pro license or move up to the A class. The guys riding 30 B/C, NEVER were fast enough to earn either their A or Pro cards, plain and simple.(except for the ones that the AMA/MxSports let slip by)

I will never understand the ex Pro and A guys complaining about RC, Emig, Reynard or any factory guy coming back and racing the Vet classes but yet have no issue with dropping themselves down to B. Am I the only guy that see's the unbelievable irony in this?

njracer46 wrote:

I agree with you, someone who has raced A or pro should not be able to drop down to b/c. Once you're fast, you're always fast...

I agree with you, someone who has raced A or pro should not be able to drop down to b/c. Once you're fast, you're always fast. You may not have the endurance you once had.

I have a friend who raced A class and went to LL in A and B class. He had a few top 5's but nothing major. So this was back in early 2000's, over 10 years ago. He just started riding again this past year, and he still smokes all of us. He can run with the fast guys at the track but only for a lap or two. His speed is still there, but in a race I don't think he'd stand a chance. Maby if he started training again.

I just don't get it, he said he wants to drop down and do 30 b/c at the ranch, I called him out on it.

I just turned 25 and this will be my first year in +25b, point is I don't think I should be racing against ex pros.

I know every case is different but most are just trying to get around the rules

FLmxer wrote:

Our at the moment internet tough guy was actually really fast I guess. I was looking at the old sandbagging thread and thought this was funny...

Our at the moment internet tough guy was actually really fast I guess. I was looking at the old sandbagging thread and thought this was funny.
Quote from someone:
"The ex pro riders are shinning in that class as well. J. Blain & D. Brewer and both ex pros in the B/C class. What a crock!

It comes down to character and self respect. "
Good stuff right there.

JBlain619 wrote:

I hadn't touched a motorcycle in 10+ years and I wasn't arrogant enough to come back and think I could run A class speed. I was...

I hadn't touched a motorcycle in 10+ years and I wasn't arrogant enough to come back and think I could run A class speed. I was told by the AMA that because I never reached "Pro-Expert" status in AMA Pro Racing, that I could return to the B class. And they reccomended it.

So smart guy, ever heard of Keith Turpin??? Well if not, he was the 1986 Supercross East Champion, 1987 Supercross East runner up and former factory rider for Honda and Suzuki and he got the same Re-classification as I did. As a matter of fact, he told me to get the re-classification.

Thanks for the label of internet tough guy as well!

JBlain619 wrote:

Remember, this rule just changed in 2009 I believe. DC and MX Sports stepped in and changed it. Your buddy won't be able to. Its in...

Remember, this rule just changed in 2009 I believe. DC and MX Sports stepped in and changed it. Your buddy won't be able to. Its in the LL sublemental rules.

njracer46 wrote:

Good to know! I notice 25 B is under advancement classes, I've been racing the B class for about 4 years. Never had any wins but...

Good to know!

I notice 25 B is under advancement classes, I've been racing the B class for about 4 years. Never had any wins but a few top 5's but mid pack- to top 10 on average.

If I start doing good in the 25+ B class will they advance me into A? We were talking about this the other night, I am definatly not an A rider, anyone got info on this?

Huckster wrote:

That's BS. In the plus class everyone is the same age. Just because one guy who was a pro stopped riding, doesnt mean he should be...

That's BS. In the plus class everyone is the same age. Just because one guy who was a pro stopped riding, doesnt mean he should be able to drop back down. He is still the same age as the guys he used to race with and beat when he was skilled enough to earn his pro license or move up to the A class. The guys riding 30 B/C, NEVER were fast enough to earn either their A or Pro cards, plain and simple.(except for the ones that the AMA/MxSports let slip by)

I will never understand the ex Pro and A guys complaining about RC, Emig, Reynard or any factory guy coming back and racing the Vet classes but yet have no issue with dropping themselves down to B. Am I the only guy that see's the unbelievable irony in this?

njracer46 wrote:

I agree with you, someone who has raced A or pro should not be able to drop down to b/c. Once you're fast, you're always fast...

I agree with you, someone who has raced A or pro should not be able to drop down to b/c. Once you're fast, you're always fast. You may not have the endurance you once had.

I have a friend who raced A class and went to LL in A and B class. He had a few top 5's but nothing major. So this was back in early 2000's, over 10 years ago. He just started riding again this past year, and he still smokes all of us. He can run with the fast guys at the track but only for a lap or two. His speed is still there, but in a race I don't think he'd stand a chance. Maby if he started training again.

I just don't get it, he said he wants to drop down and do 30 b/c at the ranch, I called him out on it.

I just turned 25 and this will be my first year in +25b, point is I don't think I should be racing against ex pros.

I know every case is different but most are just trying to get around the rules

FLmxer wrote:

Our at the moment internet tough guy was actually really fast I guess. I was looking at the old sandbagging thread and thought this was funny...

Our at the moment internet tough guy was actually really fast I guess. I was looking at the old sandbagging thread and thought this was funny.
Quote from someone:
"The ex pro riders are shinning in that class as well. J. Blain & D. Brewer and both ex pros in the B/C class. What a crock!

It comes down to character and self respect. "
Good stuff right there.

JBlain619 wrote:

I hadn't touched a motorcycle in 10+ years and I wasn't arrogant enough to come back and think I could run A class speed. I was...

I hadn't touched a motorcycle in 10+ years and I wasn't arrogant enough to come back and think I could run A class speed. I was told by the AMA that because I never reached "Pro-Expert" status in AMA Pro Racing, that I could return to the B class. And they reccomended it.

So smart guy, ever heard of Keith Turpin??? Well if not, he was the 1986 Supercross East Champion, 1987 Supercross East runner up and former factory rider for Honda and Suzuki and he got the same Re-classification as I did. As a matter of fact, he told me to get the re-classification.

Thanks for the label of internet tough guy as well!

FLmxer wrote:

I got Keith's jersey and unfortunately it disintegrated years ago. I just thought the quote was funny given the recent comedy. Yea your tough as tears...

I got Keith's jersey and unfortunately it disintegrated years ago. I just thought the quote was funny given the recent comedy. Yea your tough as tears, sharp as soap and bright as night and wow also an internet tough guy too. So there you go . I don't think your meltdown will be as big as it could be though. We have lined up together as well I am sure. Good times. Please don't call me names. It hurts my feeling... I think.

JBlain619 wrote:

Depends on your District. In the MDRA/District 6, I believe the RPV can accumulate in the Vet classes and force you out of the class. Check...

Depends on your District. In the MDRA/District 6, I believe the RPV can accumulate in the Vet classes and force you out of the class. Check the AMA Racing website. You can go in and check your results, averages, and RPV. Just keep an eye on it!

Squid-mom wrote:

No, he rode for Honda after Suzuki Won 450B on a Suzuki in 2009, rode a Honda in the A classes in 2010

GrapeApe wrote:

. . . and then Team Green Kawasaki in 2011. I forgot about that brief stint on Honda between Suzuki and Kawasaki. Apparently they owed him...

. . . and then Team Green Kawasaki in 2011. I forgot about that brief stint on Honda between Suzuki and Kawasaki. Apparently they owed him a pro career for the 6th and 7th he got them at LL's in 2010, though.

newmann wrote:

Oh for shits sake, excuse me for only mentioning Honda. I didn't follow his career closely but do remember seeing him on Honda's, a whole damn...

Oh for shits sake, excuse me for only mentioning Honda. I didn't follow his career closely but do remember seeing him on Honda's, a whole damn fleet of them. And I do remember him posting here about getting lots of support and now there's none. Don't know how many of those Honda's they bought on their own, maybe all of them. Point is, less free shit for the kids at Chicken Licks Raceway would leave more for the ones trying to make a go in the pro ranks.


Been seeing his name on the big screen a lot here lately, so glad to see him getting to the races.

Wahoo214 wrote:

Have you seen some of the 45+, 50+, or 60+ riders? They may not have ridden for over 25 years and weigh 130lbs more than when...

Have you seen some of the 45+, 50+, or 60+ riders? They may not have ridden for over 25 years and weigh 130lbs more than when they last rode. Telling someone like that, that they will need to ride A class is stupid. They will not come back to riding. On the other if you are a former card carrying Pro you should not be in an Amature National. You are not an Amature.

JBlain619 wrote:

I hadn't touched a motorcycle in 10+ years and I wasn't arrogant enough to come back and think I could run A class speed. I was...

I hadn't touched a motorcycle in 10+ years and I wasn't arrogant enough to come back and think I could run A class speed. I was told by the AMA that because I never reached "Pro-Expert" status in AMA Pro Racing, that I could return to the B class. And they reccomended it.

So smart guy, ever heard of Keith Turpin??? Well if not, he was the 1986 Supercross East Champion, 1987 Supercross East runner up and former factory rider for Honda and Suzuki and he got the same Re-classification as I did. As a matter of fact, he told me to get the re-classification.

Thanks for the label of internet tough guy as well!

FLmxer wrote:

I got Keith's jersey and unfortunately it disintegrated years ago. I just thought the quote was funny given the recent comedy. Yea your tough as tears...

I got Keith's jersey and unfortunately it disintegrated years ago. I just thought the quote was funny given the recent comedy. Yea your tough as tears, sharp as soap and bright as night and wow also an internet tough guy too. So there you go . I don't think your meltdown will be as big as it could be though. We have lined up together as well I am sure. Good times. Please don't call me names. It hurts my feeling... I think.

JBlain619 wrote:

I'll give you an even funnier story. Brewer and I raced against each other as kids and into the A class. We both had similar paths...

I'll give you an even funnier story. Brewer and I raced against each other as kids and into the A class. We both had similar paths, had families, jobs etc and basically walked away from racing. We both started racing the exact same year and got more notoriety that year than we did our whole lives! My fiance, who was a really fast WMA rider and the only girl to ever qualify for all the boys classes at LL, still gives me shit to this day about me riding B/C at LL.

FLmxer wrote:

I got Keith's jersey and unfortunately it disintegrated years ago. I just thought the quote was funny given the recent comedy. Yea your tough as tears...

I got Keith's jersey and unfortunately it disintegrated years ago. I just thought the quote was funny given the recent comedy. Yea your tough as tears, sharp as soap and bright as night and wow also an internet tough guy too. So there you go . I don't think your meltdown will be as big as it could be though. We have lined up together as well I am sure. Good times. Please don't call me names. It hurts my feeling... I think.

JBlain619 wrote:

I'll give you an even funnier story. Brewer and I raced against each other as kids and into the A class. We both had similar paths...

I'll give you an even funnier story. Brewer and I raced against each other as kids and into the A class. We both had similar paths, had families, jobs etc and basically walked away from racing. We both started racing the exact same year and got more notoriety that year than we did our whole lives! My fiance, who was a really fast WMA rider and the only girl to ever qualify for all the boys classes at LL, still gives me shit to this day about me riding B/C at LL.

Wahoo214 wrote:

Your Fiance is Lisa Akin Wagner?

Huckster wrote:

No one is telling them they have to ride anything, but if they want to try to qualify for LL, they need to abide by the...

No one is telling them they have to ride anything, but if they want to try to qualify for LL, they need to abide by the rules. Anyone who has held a pro license at any time in their career or been an A rider should not be allowed to race a B/C class regardless if they gained 200lb's or been off a bike for 25 yrs. Have some pride and race the +35, +40, +45 etc. classes which are open to all.

JBlain619 wrote:

No, Amber Hughes. Lisa rode in the womans class and possibly an ability class. Lisa was a fast chick back in the day though! Amber rode...

No, Amber Hughes. Lisa rode in the womans class and possibly an ability class. Lisa was a fast chick back in the day though! Amber rode with the boys every year from 50's-125 Schoolboy.

Wahoo214 wrote:

Lisa rode several LLs and 3 of which were in the 100cc class against riders like Jeff Stanton, Donnie Schmit, and many others. I believe she...

Lisa rode several LLs and 3 of which were in the 100cc class against riders like Jeff Stanton, Donnie Schmit, and many others. I believe she is the first Female racer to race in a "Abilities" class at LL

Huckster wrote:

No one is telling them they have to ride anything, but if they want to try to qualify for LL, they need to abide by the...

No one is telling them they have to ride anything, but if they want to try to qualify for LL, they need to abide by the rules. Anyone who has held a pro license at any time in their career or been an A rider should not be allowed to race a B/C class regardless if they gained 200lb's or been off a bike for 25 yrs. Have some pride and race the +35, +40, +45 etc. classes which are open to all.

Wahoo214 wrote:

There are no B/C class at LL for the 35, 40, 45+ riders. But my point is mostly with former Pros riding an Amature National. If...

There are no B/C class at LL for the 35, 40, 45+ riders. But my point is mostly with former Pros riding an Amature National. If they choose to do so, they should be in Pro Sport not an age group class. They should have some "pride" as you say and allow those who are true amatures chase thier glory.

DC wrote:

Lisa Akin was also a top-ten rider in the 100cc class in 1981, the year before the first Loretta Lynn's, and back when there wasn't a...

Lisa Akin was also a top-ten rider in the 100cc class in 1981, the year before the first Loretta Lynn's, and back when there wasn't a Women's class….

But I have a question for Wahoo214: "former Pros riding an Amature National. If they choose to do so, they should be in Pro Sport not an age group class. They should have some "pride" as you say and allow those who are true amatures chase thier glory."

What about me? I am 48 years old, I raced pro in 1985, and then went to college and went on to work in the industry. I don't have much time to race because I basically have two jobs, and I lost my clutch finger in an accident in 2009…

I have "pride" in my brief days as a pro, but do you really think that 30 years later I belong in the 450 Pro Sport class at Loretta Lynn's, or in the +45 class? Because if I was limited to Pro Sport and racing against teenagers, I am not sure I would have much of a chance to participate, or the will to continue even racing. How can the "me" in 2014 be anywhere near as competitive as the "me" in 1984 would have been against today's Pro Ams.

And that's the conundrum of the age groups: we get slower as we get older, yet "once fast, always fast" somehow means we still belong out there in the Pro Sport class thirty years later…

DC
MX Sports

DC wrote:

Lisa Akin was also a top-ten rider in the 100cc class in 1981, the year before the first Loretta Lynn's, and back when there wasn't a...

Lisa Akin was also a top-ten rider in the 100cc class in 1981, the year before the first Loretta Lynn's, and back when there wasn't a Women's class….

But I have a question for Wahoo214: "former Pros riding an Amature National. If they choose to do so, they should be in Pro Sport not an age group class. They should have some "pride" as you say and allow those who are true amatures chase thier glory."

What about me? I am 48 years old, I raced pro in 1985, and then went to college and went on to work in the industry. I don't have much time to race because I basically have two jobs, and I lost my clutch finger in an accident in 2009…

I have "pride" in my brief days as a pro, but do you really think that 30 years later I belong in the 450 Pro Sport class at Loretta Lynn's, or in the +45 class? Because if I was limited to Pro Sport and racing against teenagers, I am not sure I would have much of a chance to participate, or the will to continue even racing. How can the "me" in 2014 be anywhere near as competitive as the "me" in 1984 would have been against today's Pro Ams.

And that's the conundrum of the age groups: we get slower as we get older, yet "once fast, always fast" somehow means we still belong out there in the Pro Sport class thirty years later…

DC
MX Sports

JBlain619 wrote:

DC, did Lisa qualify for a pro national? Or am I thinking of Sue Fish?

GeorgiePorgie wrote:

Another thing young people don't realize....... People 17 years old think: "man, the +30 isn't that competitive, I can't wait till I get to be 30...

Another thing young people don't realize.......

People 17 years old think: "man, the +30 isn't that competitive, I can't wait till I get to be 30 it will be easier then." Then they turn 30 and they find out their racing THE SAME PEOPLE THEY RACED WHEN THEY WERE 17. So it's still competitive. Quit bitching! I lined up with Millsapps, Ryan Villopoto, JLaw numerous other fast riders and they smoked me every chance I got. So I can expect now that we are 27 years old and if we all end up at Loretta's in an age class.....they may be there and they're going to beat me as they did 15 years ago.

Chad Wages, Evenou, Jay Weller lined up at qualifiers last year...they smoked me when we were 17. I'd imagine they'll smoke me now. But I'm not gonna scream bitch and moan that they had their glory days and shouldn't be allowed to race Vet classes! Remember we are all paying to race. Have fun and stfu and accept sandbagging as part of the sport.

Wahoo214 wrote:

DC, at local race you should line up in the 45+ class, but if you chose to go to an Amature National, I believe that you...

DC, at local race you should line up in the 45+ class, but if you chose to go to an Amature National, I believe that you have had your chance and suceeded. You or any former Pro should not be allowed in an Amature class at a National, it is time to let others have their glory. The Vet classes have been reduced and the number of entrants have been cut. Let the true Amatures have thier chance. The pro sport comment was really more a knock at the swipe that Huckster took at Vets.

DC wrote:

I don't think now is the time to split off Loretta Lynn's into separate weeks for the Vets. We've been doing it like this since the...

I don't think now is the time to split off Loretta Lynn's into separate weeks for the Vets. We've been doing it like this since the very first one back in 1982 and while it's not a perfect system, it's as fair as we can make it. Some may think it's wrong to have a Jeff Emig or Mark Barnett come back and race as vets; others may relish the chance to race with a legend like that. But to tell anyone that they can't race an age class because they used to be good, or even are still good, doesn't seem like a good step forward.

On another note, no woman has ever qualified for a pro national or supercross, though there is a story that I heard that a woman was able to race the 1982 or '83 Denver 500 National because there was not a full gate, but I have yet to find proof as in the full results (no woman is listed in the top twenty in The Vault, but I can't find the whole class) and/or photos or printed stories about it… Anyone here has any info, send it my way!

And JBlaine, you mentioned you were looking for the '81 Amateur National at Byron, but that year's AMA Amateur National was in RedBud, and the Youth National was in Reidsville, North Carolina. Did you mean RedBud?

DC
MX Sports