Do they use the Bulldozers at Glen Helen to ?

bullpen658 wrote:

Glen Helen belongs on the national circuit. Period. Not sure what the fuck all this other bullshit is about "natural terrain" and shit like that but...

Glen Helen belongs on the national circuit. Period.

Not sure what the fuck all this other bullshit is about "natural terrain" and shit like that but that is a fact. That is a MAN'S track. There is nothing like it anywhere in the world. There are a bunch of other killer tracks out there but Glen Helen? COME ON!!!!!!

Someone please unfuck this situation.

mt798 wrote:

I miss Whitney. That track got really rough and the hill was brutal at times. Not much man made stuff till table-tops came along. Just another...

I miss Whitney. That track got really rough and the hill was brutal at times. Not much man made stuff till table-tops came along. Just another great track on the RIP list...

DrSweden wrote:

I have watched GPs since early eighties, and have newer seen a natural track ever other in Enduro. Big diff from Sweden compared to the US...

I have watched GPs since early eighties, and have newer seen a natural track ever other in Enduro. Big diff from Sweden compared to the US is that the Swedish tracks these days are pretty poorly maintained, and only passionate non profit people which ends up with limping old farts born in the fifties, that have nothing better to do, mounts the tractors while babbling about "real tracks" less jumps (pretty hard to build jumps with a tractor) while those tracks in the US I rode were close to amusing parks, with perfect jumps every 50 ft. I'm really impressed by how tracks are being dealt with in America, its all business. Groom it, make it more spectacular and more people will come wichs means profit. Here all tracks are owned by non profit type of organization, no one will get a salary or wealth if they make the best track ever, so they all end up being old school more natural and totally sux as in fun. So I salute this effort by GH!

gnarwhip wrote:

Yeah Mt. St. Helens isn't natural terrain at all.

jamma10 wrote:

Virtually ALL the tracks were natural in the GPs until the early 90's, which is when we started adopting elements of Supercross in Europe. Tracks like...

Virtually ALL the tracks were natural in the GPs until the early 90's, which is when we started adopting elements of Supercross in Europe. Tracks like Namur, Farleigh Castle, Hawkstone Park, Gaildorf, Maggiora, Roggenburg, Kester, Cingoli, Cserénfa... they were all natural.

Youthstream have thankfully stopped their little foray down the route of 100% manmade circuits after heavy criticism from fans. They recognised that the fans didn't care for them and I think there is a pretty good mix of circuits on the calendar now, though there is still a universal blue print of sorts when it comes to building jumps, and this seems to be the case the world over.

I'm not against modern obstacles and big jumps at all, I'm all for them. But for me personally I feel its vital that tracks should blend these things with undulating, natural terrain and some unique features and not necessarily prepped in a particular way*. Its something I feel quite strongly about.

As someone mentioned earlier, I would actually quite like to see the occasional race held on grass circuits where the track develops spontaneously over the course of the day or weekend, instead of absolutely everything being fabricated by hand as it often is these days.

(* sand tracks are the only exception because the ever changing surface provides the challenge itself)

OW38B wrote:

I know they added the tabletop "do hickey" a few years ago, but this is close to all natural. [img]https://radmx.com/Pics/tracks/Unadilla.jpg[/img]

I know they added the tabletop "do hickey" a few years ago, but this is close to all natural.

500guy wrote:

Groom the Natural terrain 160 Ft uphill Jumps ? Rip the Natural Sand section 36" Deep ? Build a Natural Bowl turn 3 stories high...

Groom the Natural terrain 160 Ft uphill Jumps ?

Rip the Natural Sand section 36" Deep ?

Build a Natural Bowl turn 3 stories high ?

Pave a Natural path straight up hill ?


All this el la Natural talk makes me puke.

2 Stokes and Glen Helen are dead to Pro racing

Fuggin get over it.

FreshTopEnd wrote:

The problem is a lot of people are making different points, not the same points, and they all get conflated into the same argument as if...

The problem is a lot of people are making different points, not the same points, and they all get conflated into the same argument as if people are talking about the same thing in the same sense. And then because people are so entrenched in their particular stand, they borrow those other arguments as ammo whether the point is apt or they even agree with it.

There are plenty of people decrying the Utah and Elsinore tracks as man-made supercross tracks masquerading as motocross, and then rant for Davey to give Bud whatever Bud wants to get Glen Helen back on the schedule. But these features aren't any less man made and/or supercrossy:











What gets it a pass? This:



Do I have a problem with that? Only the hypocrisy, which was Jay's point. I love the track. I know some riders don't, but I am a fan. The surrounding area is the anus of California, but I have 40 years of trudging to places to see races so as a fan with a legacy I don't pay attention to that.

Bud can demand whatever terms he wants for right to use Glen Helen. It's a viable enterprise without the national and I am sure his businesses independent of the industry leave him flush (although apparently not flush enough to pay the Asterisk rig after contracting them to cover the medical requirements for the GP). He's got the leverage of not being need and having a rabid band of supporters, including a mouthpiece in MXA, who think he's entitled to have a national and Davey's screwing him out of it. It's not Davey's job to give Bud everything he wants, if even Davey could. And that's even without considering the legacy of difficulty working with Bud and his people over the years. That's what this is about. It's not about Elsinore or Pala or Miller or whether Glen Helen is an epic track. Its not about man made tracks or dangerous supercross features or natural motocross or old school values. It's about none of that.