"You didn't do that, you didn't achieve that"

vet323
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Edited Date/Time 7/25/2012 4:03pm
President Obama's stupid remarks say a lot about how he thinks about business and businessmen. Those words will haunt him every day up until the election.

Not hard to believe that someone like he feels that way, I mean he graduated from Harvard Law and made the Review despite achieving no educational distinction, he's President without ever having to hold or perform at a job, he won the Nobel Prize without doing anything-probably would make anyone think that way, right?
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Shiftfaced
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7/19/2012 7:37am
Tell me how you take ANYTHING to market without the benefit of roads; telephone/internet; or TV.

We have socially provided the path that some of you think you did all on your own.
72kiteboarder
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7/19/2012 7:54am
Of course his "Stupid" comments are being taken out of context by people that have their own agenda. But hey, don't let facts ruin a good bashing.
Crashinskinoff
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7/19/2012 7:54am Edited Date/Time 7/19/2012 7:58am
Big business and rich folks pay for the roads they pay most of the taxes in this country, the folks on welfare with 17 kids that get back a bigger tax refund than they paid in dang sure didn't provide anything. LOL you pay for phones, Internet and TV man, but hey Government gets a nice cut from there also. Read this...

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/07/18/youre-wrong-president-obama-c…

It's pretty much untouchable, LMAO! You didn't build your business or work your ass off or put your own blood and sweat into your business, we gave you roads! Really?

Man I heard exactly what Obummer said, he said it and he meant it, he is that stupid. No need for me to post any more in this one. It pretty much stands on it's own.

Actually you don't have to read it was a video and the words came right out of his mouth in the usual smart Alec way.
vet323
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7/19/2012 8:01am
Shiftfaced wrote:
Tell me how you take ANYTHING to market without the benefit of roads; telephone/internet; or TV. We have socially provided the path that some of you...
Tell me how you take ANYTHING to market without the benefit of roads; telephone/internet; or TV.

We have socially provided the path that some of you think you did all on your own.
No shit, Shitfaced. You have also "provided the path" that people who don't achieve use. How in the hell is it possible for some to achieve when others don't, even though you provided them the same path?

EVERYBODY uses roads, even those that don't "achieve". For Christ's sake, Ted Bundy used the roads and the telephone and watched TV too-do we all get to share the credit for his achievements?

Besides, it's a stupid strawman argument, anyway. Are serious Republicans advocating for discontinuing government road building? Eliminating public education funding?, Putting a halt to public funding of research and development?

If you put all of the Federal funding for all of that stuff. it's probably not even 1/3 of the budget.

The Shop

vet323
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7/19/2012 8:03am
Yes, they can read, but they can't necessarily understand-know what I mean?


Of course you don't.
vet323
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7/19/2012 8:05am
Of course his "Stupid" comments are being taken out of context by people that have their own agenda. But hey, don't let facts ruin a good...
Of course his "Stupid" comments are being taken out of context by people that have their own agenda. But hey, don't let facts ruin a good bashing.
Explain the context that would not make them stupid.

I saw the whole speech and those comments were stupid, he'll spend the next several months try to put them back into his mouth.
72kiteboarder
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7/19/2012 8:07am
Exactly, you saw the speech but you didn't hear it or listen to what he was saying until you heard a soundbite.
vet323
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7/19/2012 8:08am
"Partisan hackery"....HA!

Strong words from someone like you! Vital's foremost authority on partisan haackery!
jndmx
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7/19/2012 8:10am
vet323 wrote:
"Partisan hackery"....HA!

Strong words from someone like you! Vital's foremost authority on partisan haackery!
Pot.....Kettle......
vet323
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7/19/2012 8:10am
Exactly, you saw the speech but you didn't hear it or listen to what he was saying until you heard a soundbite.
I guess oldfart didn't understand it, either-he quoted from it a couple minutes ago.

Explain it to me, what did he say that I didn't understand?
Shiftfaced
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7/19/2012 8:11am Edited Date/Time 7/19/2012 8:22am
Shiftfaced wrote:
Tell me how you take ANYTHING to market without the benefit of roads; telephone/internet; or TV. We have socially provided the path that some of you...
Tell me how you take ANYTHING to market without the benefit of roads; telephone/internet; or TV.

We have socially provided the path that some of you think you did all on your own.
vet323 wrote:
No shit, Shitfaced. You have also "provided the path" that people who don't achieve use. How in the hell is it possible for some to achieve...
No shit, Shitfaced. You have also "provided the path" that people who don't achieve use. How in the hell is it possible for some to achieve when others don't, even though you provided them the same path?

EVERYBODY uses roads, even those that don't "achieve". For Christ's sake, Ted Bundy used the roads and the telephone and watched TV too-do we all get to share the credit for his achievements?

Besides, it's a stupid strawman argument, anyway. Are serious Republicans advocating for discontinuing government road building? Eliminating public education funding?, Putting a halt to public funding of research and development?

If you put all of the Federal funding for all of that stuff. it's probably not even 1/3 of the budget.
Some people take advantage of the opportunities that our society provides them; others let those opportunities pass them by.

The point I am making is that we socially provide a network for each other to succeed. Nobody is on an island, and nobody did it ALL BY THEMSELVES. We ALL benefit from the social resources that we share the costs on.

You know this and I know this. You are trying to make an argument out of something that Obama did not say. Much like those who said that "he" took all the credit for killing Osama bin Laden.

Neither are truthful arguments. Either you are an idiot, or a liar. Which is it?
I'll let you choose.
jndmx
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7/19/2012 8:11am
Exactly, you saw the speech but you didn't hear it or listen to what he was saying until you heard a soundbite.
vet323 wrote:
I guess oldfart didn't understand it, either-he quoted from it a couple minutes ago. Explain it to me, what did he say that I didn't understand...
I guess oldfart didn't understand it, either-he quoted from it a couple minutes ago.

Explain it to me, what did he say that I didn't understand?
The parts right before and after the soundbite you are crowing about......you know, the parts that supply context.
vet323
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7/19/2012 8:34am
Shiftfaced wrote:
Some people take advantage of the opportunities that our society provides them; others let those opportunities pass them by. The point I am making is that...
Some people take advantage of the opportunities that our society provides them; others let those opportunities pass them by.

The point I am making is that we socially provide a network for each other to succeed. Nobody is on an island, and nobody did it ALL BY THEMSELVES. We ALL benefit from the social resources that we share the costs on.

You know this and I know this. You are trying to make an argument out of something that Obama did not say. Much like those who said that "he" took all the credit for killing Osama bin Laden.

Neither are truthful arguments. Either you are an idiot, or a liar. Which is it?
I'll let you choose.
"The point I am making is that we socially provide a network for each other to succeed. Nobody is on an island, and nobody did it ALL BY THEMSELVES. We ALL benefit from the social resources that we share the costs on."



Who has said that they did it ALL BY THEMSELVES without benefit of roads, teachers or telephones?
vet323
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7/19/2012 8:39am
Exactly, you saw the speech but you didn't hear it or listen to what he was saying until you heard a soundbite.
vet323 wrote:
I guess oldfart didn't understand it, either-he quoted from it a couple minutes ago. Explain it to me, what did he say that I didn't understand...
I guess oldfart didn't understand it, either-he quoted from it a couple minutes ago.

Explain it to me, what did he say that I didn't understand?
jndmx wrote:
The parts right before and after the soundbite you are crowing about......you know, the parts that supply context.
So, he didn't make the "point" that we all share in the roads, infrastructure and defense that provide the structure that allows success? Therefore nobody can claim sole authorship of their success? I didn't understand that correctly?

Help me out.
borg
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7/19/2012 9:59am
What he said speaks for itself. Sort of juvenile logic but not totally untrue. The bigger issue to me is why did he say it. To prove that government works? That if not for government nobody would have success? North Korea has roads and bridges and so does Cuba. They also have smart people. Where's all the success? I owe my success to Columbus? Or the Pilgrims? How far do you take this? It really was a dumb thing to say but it worked on some of you apparently. He knows how to speak to his audience. It will dog him though, right up until November.
jtomasik
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7/19/2012 10:00am
vet323 wrote:
President Obama's stupid remarks say a lot about how he thinks about business and businessmen. Those words will haunt him every day up until the election...
President Obama's stupid remarks say a lot about how he thinks about business and businessmen. Those words will haunt him every day up until the election.

Not hard to believe that someone like he feels that way, I mean he graduated from Harvard Law and made the Review despite achieving no educational distinction, he's President without ever having to hold or perform at a job, he won the Nobel Prize without doing anything-probably would make anyone think that way, right?
I didn't listen to the speech, and I usually don't listen to either Obama or Romney speeches, because they're just a big bullshit snow job to get them into office. I will say that most of Romney's money comes from capital gains. So, his wealth was made by investments and not creating some value-added function to society. But, that's really irrelevant, anyway. The important point is whether he, or Obama, have any viable plans to fix what's broken. Truth is, neither do.
jonjon714
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7/19/2012 10:15am
Sorry, this sounds like it's coming from someone who never had their own business. Where's the teleprompter when you need it?

But you know what, I’m not going to see us gut the investments that grow our economy to give tax breaks to me or Mr. Romney or folks who don’t need them. So I’m going to reduce the deficit in a balanced way. [...]

There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me -- because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t -- look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something -- there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. (Applause.)

If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business -- you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.

The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.
vet323
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7/19/2012 10:20am
What he said is the closest someone who has only ever signed the BACK of a check can come to understanding business.
jonjon714
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7/19/2012 10:21am
It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. In most cases that exactly what it is...
jonjon714
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7/19/2012 10:22am
vet323 wrote:
What he said is the closest someone who has only ever signed the BACK of a check can come to understanding business.
Has he even worked in private industry? Ever?
jonjon714
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7/19/2012 10:35am
APLMAN99
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Fantasy
7/19/2012 10:36am
I'm always surprised (or maybe disappointed) that all the conservatives who espouse "trickle down, supply side" economic thoughts fail to apply the same rationale to taxes paid. If the rich are paying the taxes, aren't the poor paying them indirectly?
vet323
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7/19/2012 10:40am
APLMAN99 wrote:
I'm always surprised (or maybe disappointed) that all the conservatives who espouse "trickle down, supply side" economic thoughts fail to apply the same rationale to taxes...
I'm always surprised (or maybe disappointed) that all the conservatives who espouse "trickle down, supply side" economic thoughts fail to apply the same rationale to taxes paid. If the rich are paying the taxes, aren't the poor paying them indirectly?
I agree with that fully- why can't both things be true?
gabrielmalinois
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7/19/2012 11:24am
Hmmmm, I wonder who might of said this, any ideas oldfart?

High taxes stifle innovation, prevent saving, destroy production, crush the middle class and the poor, and discourage investment. Every American is entitled to the fruits of his labor, especially during these tough economic times. Lowering taxes will leave you more money to take care of yourself and your family, and it will allow businesses greater opportunities to hire new workers, increase current salaries, and expand their companies.
gabrielmalinois
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7/19/2012 12:00pm
My point is that I agree with this statement especially the first part that says "high taxes stifle innovation and destroy production". It seems to me the person you quoted believes high taxes spur innovation, and increase production right? So which is it? Which principle do you believe? I just wish I knew who said it.
APLMAN99
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7/19/2012 12:11pm
APLMAN99 wrote:
I'm always surprised (or maybe disappointed) that all the conservatives who espouse "trickle down, supply side" economic thoughts fail to apply the same rationale to taxes...
I'm always surprised (or maybe disappointed) that all the conservatives who espouse "trickle down, supply side" economic thoughts fail to apply the same rationale to taxes paid. If the rich are paying the taxes, aren't the poor paying them indirectly?
vet323 wrote:
I agree with that fully- why can't both things be true?
You'll have to ask the folks who claim that the poor pay no taxes............
vet323
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7/19/2012 12:31pm Edited Date/Time 7/19/2012 12:32pm
APLMAN99 wrote:
I'm always surprised (or maybe disappointed) that all the conservatives who espouse "trickle down, supply side" economic thoughts fail to apply the same rationale to taxes...
I'm always surprised (or maybe disappointed) that all the conservatives who espouse "trickle down, supply side" economic thoughts fail to apply the same rationale to taxes paid. If the rich are paying the taxes, aren't the poor paying them indirectly?
vet323 wrote:
I agree with that fully- why can't both things be true?
APLMAN99 wrote:
You'll have to ask the folks who claim that the poor pay no taxes............
Let me ask you-in what way do the poor pay taxes?

I believe they do, by the way-I just want to see if we're on the same wavelength.
Shiftfaced
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7/19/2012 12:53pm
vet323 wrote:
I agree with that fully- why can't both things be true?
APLMAN99 wrote:
You'll have to ask the folks who claim that the poor pay no taxes............
vet323 wrote:
Let me ask you-in what way do the poor pay taxes? I believe they do, by the way-I just want to see if we're on the...
Let me ask you-in what way do the poor pay taxes?

I believe they do, by the way-I just want to see if we're on the same wavelength.
Back when I was making $35,000, and renting, I paid taxes.

Now that I make $70,000, but have my mortgage interest write-off, I get refunds.

The "poor" cannot manipulate the "system" like the have's can.......
APLMAN99
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Fantasy
7/19/2012 12:58pm
vet323 wrote:
I agree with that fully- why can't both things be true?
APLMAN99 wrote:
You'll have to ask the folks who claim that the poor pay no taxes............
vet323 wrote:
Let me ask you-in what way do the poor pay taxes? I believe they do, by the way-I just want to see if we're on the...
Let me ask you-in what way do the poor pay taxes?

I believe they do, by the way-I just want to see if we're on the same wavelength.
The "ways" are obviously innumerable. In any transaction they participate in, the costs of "extra taxes" are a factor. Just as the claim that allowing the rich to keep more of their money means that income will "trickle down" the system, the concept would equally apply to costs and/or taxes.
vet323
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7/19/2012 1:12pm
APLMAN99 wrote:
You'll have to ask the folks who claim that the poor pay no taxes............
vet323 wrote:
Let me ask you-in what way do the poor pay taxes? I believe they do, by the way-I just want to see if we're on the...
Let me ask you-in what way do the poor pay taxes?

I believe they do, by the way-I just want to see if we're on the same wavelength.
APLMAN99 wrote:
The "ways" are obviously innumerable. In any transaction they participate in, the costs of "extra taxes" are a factor. Just as the claim that allowing the...
The "ways" are obviously innumerable. In any transaction they participate in, the costs of "extra taxes" are a factor. Just as the claim that allowing the rich to keep more of their money means that income will "trickle down" the system, the concept would equally apply to costs and/or taxes.
So.......increasing the corporate tax rate will only add to the poor's burden?

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