What's the point of the GPS?

SirReelMX
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SirReelMX
Edited Date/Time 5/28/2012 10:38am
So, what's the point of running the gps units outdoors? I work doing gis analysis and just can't see the point? Is there some sort of engine diagnostics hooked up too? Or is this just for checking times on each section of the track? Just curious.
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Matthes
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Matthes 5/27/2012 2:49pm
5/27/2012 2:49pm
SirReelMX wrote:
So, what's the point of running the gps units outdoors? I work doing gis analysis and just can't see the point? Is there some sort of...
So, what's the point of running the gps units outdoors? I work doing gis analysis and just can't see the point? Is there some sort of engine diagnostics hooked up too? Or is this just for checking times on each section of the track? Just curious.
You can have a track layout in front of you (from the GPS) and then click on a section and see what the bike was doing at that section, on that lap via the mapping. It's huge help instead of a rider telling u about what a bike is doing in a certain section, you can look it up now via the GPS and see for sure if bike was wide-open, off throttle, lean, rich, etc, etc.
72kiteboarder
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72kiteboarder 5/27/2012 2:51pm
5/27/2012 2:51pm
They can see their Speed through different sections to see where they are doing good/bad?
SirReelMX
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SirReelMX 5/27/2012 2:59pm
5/27/2012 2:59pm
SirReelMX wrote:
So, what's the point of running the gps units outdoors? I work doing gis analysis and just can't see the point? Is there some sort of...
So, what's the point of running the gps units outdoors? I work doing gis analysis and just can't see the point? Is there some sort of engine diagnostics hooked up too? Or is this just for checking times on each section of the track? Just curious.
Matthes wrote:
You can have a track layout in front of you (from the GPS) and then click on a section and see what the bike was doing...
You can have a track layout in front of you (from the GPS) and then click on a section and see what the bike was doing at that section, on that lap via the mapping. It's huge help instead of a rider telling u about what a bike is doing in a certain section, you can look it up now via the GPS and see for sure if bike was wide-open, off throttle, lean, rich, etc, etc.
Ok, so this is tied in to some sort of tracking of bike internals. When I think gps, it's just giving location, and maybe speed. Didn't realize they were already storing all that other stuff. I.e. throttle position, etc. or is all of that done by the "GPS" too? If that's the case, then it's way more than GPS in those trick little boxes.
Pdub
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Pdub 5/27/2012 3:02pm
5/27/2012 3:02pm
wiki "telemetry"

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SirReelMX
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SirReelMX 5/27/2012 3:02pm
5/27/2012 3:02pm
And this leads me to another question. Any teams looking for a good gis analyst / developer? LOL.
SirReelMX
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SirReelMX 5/27/2012 3:07pm
5/27/2012 3:07pm Edited Date/Time 5/27/2012 3:10pm
Pdub wrote:
wiki "telemetry"
I get that. I was just puzzled by tv, track announcer, and journalists all mentioning GPS being allowed now. When I guess the real thing that is being allowed is some sort of telemetry storage device that also includes a GPS unit. Has the telemetry storage always been allowed? Or did this come via the fuel injection setup?
mxracer450
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mxracer450 5/27/2012 3:18pm
5/27/2012 3:18pm
I'm not sure...But from what I inferred from the broadcast It's a new change for this year. I guess with everything going electronic maybe the AMA decided it was time to get out of the 70's. There's no reason why technological advances shouldn't be allowed in our sport.

What is the AMA's justification for not allowing these things? Traction control? On-board telemetry? Forced induction? It doesn't make sense to me. Maybe it's an American thing? Nascar is the same way. MotoGP, F1, The Japanese nationals. All of these are pushing their respective sports forward with new technology and not letting old tech stagnate progress. It just doesn't make sense to me. Does anyone here have any more info or a reason why?

Is there a link or anything I can do some more reading on the subject? I mean I understand that for the average joe...This stuff means a raise in price for the bikes if it makes its way into the hands of the consumer. But at the same time...I still think its kind of hard to justify the price of the bikes the way they currently are. I'd love to see what it costs to produce the average Japanese MX bike compared to what they sell them for.

So...Anybody?
GuyB
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GuyB 5/27/2012 3:25pm
5/27/2012 3:25pm
SirReelMX wrote:
Ok, so this is tied in to some sort of tracking of bike internals. When I think gps, it's just giving location, and maybe speed. Didn't...
Ok, so this is tied in to some sort of tracking of bike internals. When I think gps, it's just giving location, and maybe speed. Didn't realize they were already storing all that other stuff. I.e. throttle position, etc. or is all of that done by the "GPS" too? If that's the case, then it's way more than GPS in those trick little boxes.
The GPS is just part of the data logging. GPS doesn't "do" anything, other than allow you to match up the track location data to what the bike's doing on the track.
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GuyB 5/27/2012 3:28pm
5/27/2012 3:28pm
mxracer450 wrote:
I'm not sure...But from what I inferred from the broadcast It's a new change for this year. I guess with everything going electronic maybe the AMA...
I'm not sure...But from what I inferred from the broadcast It's a new change for this year. I guess with everything going electronic maybe the AMA decided it was time to get out of the 70's. There's no reason why technological advances shouldn't be allowed in our sport.

What is the AMA's justification for not allowing these things? Traction control? On-board telemetry? Forced induction? It doesn't make sense to me. Maybe it's an American thing? Nascar is the same way. MotoGP, F1, The Japanese nationals. All of these are pushing their respective sports forward with new technology and not letting old tech stagnate progress. It just doesn't make sense to me. Does anyone here have any more info or a reason why?

Is there a link or anything I can do some more reading on the subject? I mean I understand that for the average joe...This stuff means a raise in price for the bikes if it makes its way into the hands of the consumer. But at the same time...I still think its kind of hard to justify the price of the bikes the way they currently are. I'd love to see what it costs to produce the average Japanese MX bike compared to what they sell them for.

So...Anybody?
Would you like to see what a car costs to make vs. suggested retail? An iPhone? A house?
mxracer450
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mxracer450 5/27/2012 3:31pm
5/27/2012 3:31pm
GuyB wrote:
Would you like to see what a car costs to make vs. suggested retail? An iPhone? A house?
Well...I already know the iPhone one...Plenty of sites to break that down already. And I've worked construction so I know the house one generally as well. Is this a taboo question? I'm genuinely curious how much of a markup there is. I understand some of the cost is spread out for R&D. But I can't imagine the materials themselves are all that expensive.

But anyway... My main question is why the technology isn't allowed to be developed, and more importantly implemented.
SirReelMX
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SirReelMX 5/27/2012 3:36pm
5/27/2012 3:36pm
SirReelMX wrote:
Ok, so this is tied in to some sort of tracking of bike internals. When I think gps, it's just giving location, and maybe speed. Didn't...
Ok, so this is tied in to some sort of tracking of bike internals. When I think gps, it's just giving location, and maybe speed. Didn't realize they were already storing all that other stuff. I.e. throttle position, etc. or is all of that done by the "GPS" too? If that's the case, then it's way more than GPS in those trick little boxes.
GuyB wrote:
The GPS is just part of the data logging. GPS doesn't "do" anything, other than allow you to match up the track location data to what...
The GPS is just part of the data logging. GPS doesn't "do" anything, other than allow you to match up the track location data to what the bike's doing on the track.
I guess that's the part that is news to me. I was thinking "what good does knowing where the bike was." didn't realize that they were already logging all the other stats. I thought that was not aloud. Or only aloud in practice. Is that still the case?

And slightly unrelated. Did JGR ever say what the red light was by the header on the #7 bike? I'm guessing part of this logging?
MX558
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MX558 5/27/2012 5:08pm
5/27/2012 5:08pm
The data they get now will help them later when they start using TC if their not already. The AMA couldn't catch flies with shit. That' is how it all started in AMA roadracing. They couldn't catch the cheaters (Yosh Suzuki) so they just made it legal instead.
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es337 5/27/2012 6:31pm
5/27/2012 6:31pm
MX558 wrote:
The data they get now will help them later when they start using TC if their not already. The AMA couldn't catch flies with shit. That'...
The data they get now will help them later when they start using TC if their not already. The AMA couldn't catch flies with shit. That' is how it all started in AMA roadracing. They couldn't catch the cheaters (Yosh Suzuki) so they just made it legal instead.
i'm no expert, but i think tc in motocross would be slightly easier to notice than its use in roadracing.
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500guy 5/27/2012 6:38pm
5/27/2012 6:38pm
I'm a little disappointed. I thought he meant the GP's and was getting ready for a USA vs the World thread.
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PaleBlue 5/28/2012 12:35am
5/28/2012 12:35am
500guy wrote:
I'm a little disappointed. I thought he meant the GP's and was getting ready for a USA vs the World thread.
Ditto. (but not dissapointed , relieved Laughing )
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mark_swart 5/28/2012 5:04am
5/28/2012 5:04am
GuyB wrote:
Would you like to see what a car costs to make vs. suggested retail? An iPhone? A house?
Oh I get it, it's a PROFIT deal!!
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WhKnuckle 5/28/2012 7:12am
5/28/2012 7:12am
I'm still not sure TC is going to help in moto like it does in road racing. In road racing, you never have intentional wheelspin, in moto you do it all the time. In road racing, the wheels are always on the ground, in moto they're off the ground a lot. It's two whole different animals.

I can see data logging to help the team with tires, gearing, engine control settings, etc, but only in the hands of a really good data diagnostician. For the average guy, the diagnosis is, get on the gas earlier, stay on it longer, get in better shape and don't fall down.
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TeamGreen 5/28/2012 7:15am
5/28/2012 7:15am
To answer the original question:

The point of Global Positioning Satellites is to help all the poor lost souls traveling the globe know EXACTLY where they are.

I'm jus' sayin'...

(And, yes, I'm jus' fckn w/ya)

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ADynes
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ADynes 5/28/2012 7:28am
5/28/2012 7:28am
WhKnuckle wrote:
I'm still not sure TC is going to help in moto like it does in road racing. In road racing, you never have intentional wheelspin, in...
I'm still not sure TC is going to help in moto like it does in road racing. In road racing, you never have intentional wheelspin, in moto you do it all the time. In road racing, the wheels are always on the ground, in moto they're off the ground a lot. It's two whole different animals.

I can see data logging to help the team with tires, gearing, engine control settings, etc, but only in the hands of a really good data diagnostician. For the average guy, the diagnosis is, get on the gas earlier, stay on it longer, get in better shape and don't fall down.
^this
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kardy 5/28/2012 8:10am
5/28/2012 8:10am
mxracer450 wrote:
I'm not sure...But from what I inferred from the broadcast It's a new change for this year. I guess with everything going electronic maybe the AMA...
I'm not sure...But from what I inferred from the broadcast It's a new change for this year. I guess with everything going electronic maybe the AMA decided it was time to get out of the 70's. There's no reason why technological advances shouldn't be allowed in our sport.

What is the AMA's justification for not allowing these things? Traction control? On-board telemetry? Forced induction? It doesn't make sense to me. Maybe it's an American thing? Nascar is the same way. MotoGP, F1, The Japanese nationals. All of these are pushing their respective sports forward with new technology and not letting old tech stagnate progress. It just doesn't make sense to me. Does anyone here have any more info or a reason why?

Is there a link or anything I can do some more reading on the subject? I mean I understand that for the average joe...This stuff means a raise in price for the bikes if it makes its way into the hands of the consumer. But at the same time...I still think its kind of hard to justify the price of the bikes the way they currently are. I'd love to see what it costs to produce the average Japanese MX bike compared to what they sell them for.

So...Anybody?
AMA's got nothin' to do with it.
Coly243
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Coly243 5/28/2012 8:13am
5/28/2012 8:13am
500guy wrote:
I'm a little disappointed. I thought he meant the GP's and was getting ready for a USA vs the World thread.
I was with you there....


lol
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Sweendoggy 5/28/2012 8:15am
5/28/2012 8:15am
WhKnuckle wrote:
I'm still not sure TC is going to help in moto like it does in road racing. In road racing, you never have intentional wheelspin, in...
I'm still not sure TC is going to help in moto like it does in road racing. In road racing, you never have intentional wheelspin, in moto you do it all the time. In road racing, the wheels are always on the ground, in moto they're off the ground a lot. It's two whole different animals.

I can see data logging to help the team with tires, gearing, engine control settings, etc, but only in the hands of a really good data diagnostician. For the average guy, the diagnosis is, get on the gas earlier, stay on it longer, get in better shape and don't fall down.
Same thing can be said for Road Racing. Used to work for a top american kart racer, and we had systems like this. 90% of the paddock had NO idea how to interpret it...haha
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BobbyM 5/28/2012 10:38am
5/28/2012 10:38am
SirReelMX wrote:
Ok, so this is tied in to some sort of tracking of bike internals. When I think gps, it's just giving location, and maybe speed. Didn't...
Ok, so this is tied in to some sort of tracking of bike internals. When I think gps, it's just giving location, and maybe speed. Didn't realize they were already storing all that other stuff. I.e. throttle position, etc. or is all of that done by the "GPS" too? If that's the case, then it's way more than GPS in those trick little boxes.
GuyB wrote:
The GPS is just part of the data logging. GPS doesn't "do" anything, other than allow you to match up the track location data to what...
The GPS is just part of the data logging. GPS doesn't "do" anything, other than allow you to match up the track location data to what the bike's doing on the track.
bingo

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