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cc for cc 250 2 strokes have more torque and horsepower than a 4 stroke hands down, the ONLY advantage to a 4 stroke is its ride-ability and they're so easy to ride
idk what you're trying to prove here, but the number's dont lie
The YZ250 Cedric was going to race a couple years ago put out 54.5 hp. and that even at the time was a 11 year old motor design.
Stewart cleaned house against 250fs on a 125... Since that time a stock 250f has picked up 3-5 hp depending on brand. If a pro 125 can mop the floor with a 35 hp 250f (factory bike was most likely closer to 38-39 even then).....I doubt 3-5hp is going to help it against a 54 hp monster.
The rules have created a strange situation with bikes. The reason a lot of riders choose a 250f is they are honestly not ready for the power a 250 2t makes, even though the bike is lighter and handles better. You have to remember before the 450f a 250 2 smoke was a bike people stayed off of a good while until they were ready. Instead you now make the jump from an ultra light 85/150 to a bike that is heavier than what used to be raced in super cross. Its just a weird situation. A 125 is a much more logical jump but a 125 doesn't fit in any classes to well anymore.
Now you have the riders that used to ride the 250 2ts obviously staying in the big bike classes where your options are pretty limited to a 450. If you took the 450 A riders, and Pro riders at events and dropped them down to the 250 class riding a 250 2t it would be the most ridiculously lopsided racing ever seen. A kid coming off a a 85/150f is obviously not going to ride a 47-51hp stock bike to its potential. That used to take years on a 125 before moving up.
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ever seen the results from a national enduro? guess who's winning? 2 strokes, guess how many are in the top 10? between 5-8 every race, hell steward baylor has been dominant on his ktm smoker for quite some time
and i think you have it the other way around, the only thing a 4 stroke is good for is play riding (crf50/klx110) and even then i think a pw80 would be more fun with a fmf fatty of course
This is not aimed at you trick, but for those saying why aren't people buying two strokes. Well go try and buy a new up to date 250 2 stroke(KTM 250sx), you will be waiting for quite a while because they are all sold out. Waiting list for them is quite long..........
People are getting tired of the 2k repair bill on a 4 stroke.....
I have also been at the track almost every weekend this year and have notice a large increase in 2 strokes showing up.
All i know is im a solid C grade rider and when i ride a two stroke my laps are all over the shop. on the 4 its a lot easier and i can focus on my cornering a lot better wich = better laps.
I love riding the 2 stroke its fun as hearing the thing scream but for me i race the 4 stroke.
On the repair bill, i have only had 1 big bill when i fucked up and didnt release the spring on the cam chain tensioner.( got 3 laps in then she locked up tight. New piston ,5 new stainless steel valves and some head repairs. got off lucky) Proper maintenance is key to these things and it will be trouble free.
Which to the other poster talking about 500s the easy answer is if development wouldn't have stopped in the 80s I would most certainly be on one. It would have 70hp, a power curve that felt electric and a 200 hour service life.
If you want to talk fuel consumption, the most effecient engines in the world are direct injected forced air diesel 2 strokes found in multi million dollar ships. You cannot change physics they are over 50% efficient, unmatched anywhere.
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If you want to get into consumption like I said a Modern 2t will produce more power than a 4t for each lb of fuel burned.
If you want to get into emissions a modern 2t can be cleaner than a 4t because it does not burn oil, it utilizes a sump design and an advanced hybrid turbo charger or supercharger to pressurize the cylinder. It can have less emissions because it burns less fuel than a 4t to make the same power.
You will probably see this design pop up in cars in the not to distant future. Eco motors out of detroit has something workable already, and its performance is pretty incredible. This is the company Bill Gates put 25 mil into.
I'm trying to justify the classification of the bikes based on their wide throttle open fuel consumption, not how economical they are through a days riding. Heck, sometimes we get better mileage out of our 450F than our 250F, but that dependent on the riding style.
It is silly to compare a 250 2t to a 250 4t. At any given RPM with the throttle wide open, the 250 2t will have double the gas mixture throughput of a 250 4t, hence double the energy content going through. Of course it is going to have more power.
At any given RPM with the throttle wide open, a 125 2t will have pretty much the same gas throughput as a 250 4t. The reason the 125 lacks power down low is due to the fact that is doesn't combust 100% of that mixture, as a portion of it escapes through the exhaust. At higher RPM though, the expansion chamber kicks in, and some of that lost fuel mixture is scavenged. That is why a 125 will have essentially the same peak hp as a 250F.
Now, I'm not saying it is fair that a 125 should have to race a 250F. Of course it isn't (well not now anyways, when they were first released, 125's were obviously still competitive on a pro level). But a 250F has no chance against a 250 2t. The answer lies somewhere in between 125cc and 250cc. But it will never have the exact same power curve as a 250F. If you had a 2 stroke displacement that matched the bottom end power of a 250F, it would have a higher peak power output. The perfect displacement would probably slightly lack in the bottom end, but be slightly better in the top end than the 250F. There would definitely be some sort of sacrifice there.
I've probably wasted my time writing this. I'm sure the taliban will still be convinced that equal displacement is the only way things could be fair.
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