Six of the top ten qualifying times at Toronto and are set by 250 riders

OldYZRider1
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OldYZRider1
Found this pretty interesting. One of them was Ferandis; how longs he be racing SX? While the new 450's have been improved and no doubt great bikes they're still losing traction as an all out racing platform in SX. I'd think some of these 450 guys might start to get embarrassed and perhaps mad that they're not really running the "premier" SX racing machine in what's considered the premier class.

It was said in another thread there was talk of switching to an MEC format. Well I think it's time to implement the full set of MEC rules i.e. any displacement bike, any engine type and no homologation.
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ocscottie
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ocscottie 3/4/2017 3:57pm
3/4/2017 3:57pm
Pretty sure you can race a 250 in the 450 class.
Matt Fisher 3/4/2017 4:09pm
3/4/2017 4:09pm
ocscottie wrote:
Pretty sure you can race a 250 in the 450 class.
Fredrik Noren raced his 250 in the 450 class on the west coast. Made some mains too.
OldYZRider1
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OldYZRider1 3/4/2017 4:11pm
3/4/2017 4:11pm Edited Date/Time 3/4/2017 7:01pm
ocscottie wrote:
Pretty sure you can race a 250 in the 450 class.
Yes the rules allow it but no factory backed teams will do it. Apparently that wouldn't fit well with the manufacturers advertising needs. They've massaged the rules through the years using the complicit rule making body (AMA) to meet their marketing objectives. Privateers won't do it due to the costs associated with a 250's expenses.

The whole systems upside down and surely confusing as hell to the casual fans in the stands which has gotta be the majority of SX attendees.
OldYZRider1
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OldYZRider1 3/4/2017 4:26pm
3/4/2017 4:26pm
Matt Fisher wrote:
Fredrik Noren raced his 250 in the 450 class on the west coast. Made some mains too.
I think that was a low budget effort to let him get more SX under his belt before the east 250 rounds. As such I'd guess he may have been riding a bike setup to the 250 class rules. And he did well. I really wonder how much better could he have done if his 250 were prepped to the allowed 450 class rules; high end suspension, etc.

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gpnewhouse 3/5/2017 2:48am
3/5/2017 2:48am
Matt Fisher wrote:
Fredrik Noren raced his 250 in the 450 class on the west coast. Made some mains too.
OldYZRider1 wrote:
I think that was a low budget effort to let him get more SX under his belt before the east 250 rounds. As such I'd guess...
I think that was a low budget effort to let him get more SX under his belt before the east 250 rounds. As such I'd guess he may have been riding a bike setup to the 250 class rules. And he did well. I really wonder how much better could he have done if his 250 were prepped to the allowed 450 class rules; high end suspension, etc.
I thought the only difference was the engine? What's different with the 450 class suspension?

Also if the 250s were the better bike then why doesn't anyone race the 350?
AdamWGolen 3/5/2017 5:29am
3/5/2017 5:29am
The track went away fast. That being said, don't the 250 guys hit the track first? Kind of like when the locals qualify fastest at southwick.
ML512
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ML512 3/5/2017 6:24am
3/5/2017 6:24am
OldYZRider1 wrote:
I think that was a low budget effort to let him get more SX under his belt before the east 250 rounds. As such I'd guess...
I think that was a low budget effort to let him get more SX under his belt before the east 250 rounds. As such I'd guess he may have been riding a bike setup to the 250 class rules. And he did well. I really wonder how much better could he have done if his 250 were prepped to the allowed 450 class rules; high end suspension, etc.
The forks wouldn't have made a difference, they're basically identical in Showa's case. The shock would've gone from a cast to a billet unit, but Showa's cast A-Kit shocks already have larger reservoir areas and compression adjusters. Realistically, it wouldn't have served for much of a difference.
YamaLink
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YamaLink 3/5/2017 6:52am
3/5/2017 6:52am
gpnewhouse wrote:
I thought the only difference was the engine? What's different with the 450 class suspension? Also if the 250s were the better bike then why doesn't...
I thought the only difference was the engine? What's different with the 450 class suspension?

Also if the 250s were the better bike then why doesn't anyone race the 350?
I believe the 350 was a lot more difficult to get great starts, plus in US SX the top factory guys weren't racing a 350. Was Andrew Short the main KTM or did Marvin do it for a few rounds?. I'm sure someone will bring up "what about Cairoli, he gets good starts." (did I spell that right?). Not apples to apples.
OldYZRider1
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OldYZRider1 3/5/2017 9:50am
3/5/2017 9:50am
I think part of the problem with the 350 is the weight; it's not significantly lighter than the 450.

And yes the track condition differences can account for some of the improved times for the 250's.

So those of us really familiar with the sport understand these differences and that the 450's require more effort from the riders to ride quickly. But the casual fans don't know this and surely wonder why a bike with close to twice the engine size doesn't perform significantly better. There seemed to be a definite distinction in the classes performance when we watched the 125 and 250 two strokes. The 500cc class went away when the 250's began to routinely outperform them in professional racing.

Jspazz
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Jspazz 3/5/2017 10:47am
3/5/2017 10:47am
There was almost nowhere the riders needed full throttle or a lot of low-end grunt on that track, except maybe coming out of the sand. The track was tighter than a nun's beaver.
Radman66
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Radman66 3/5/2017 12:17pm
3/5/2017 12:17pm
I credit the track prep more than the bikes. The track went away quick.

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