Will more then 50% of the ProMX riders be unemployed in 2018?

10/24/2016 7:08pm
I really hope this doesn't happen. I lose interest in SX after about 5-6 rounds. I'm just not that interested. As a fan, MX is where it's at and I will be very bummed if this actually happens.
Midwest_Mafia
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10/24/2016 7:15pm Edited Date/Time 10/24/2016 7:23pm
What measures could be taken to create more rides or teams? What could be done to create an environment where a Privateer can compete with the Elite? At least at a mechanical level....

One side comes entirely from outside sponsors and team owners investing into the sport, that would require some sort of return on their part for their efforts. This comes down to the promoters and gaining mainstream attention, through the t.v. package, timing and networks to exhibit the sport and create an environment where it becomes truly " ad based. " for those putting their money into the sport. Turning advertising and marketing into actual sales for these companies and owners, that's a whole cycle we haven't been able to figure out quite yet, outside of our industry

The other ideas are things we could do internally, regulations and spec's to level the playing field that way... The way it seems to be going, there need to be some changes. The entire 450 field is made up of " Name " guys... The hopes of young up and coming riders of getting a top tier factory ride seem to only become valid with a championship, even then it hasn't panned out for quite a few as they transition into the premier class.

I think one thing we could do immediately is change the age / title / points restrictions in the seeding classes, open that up so we can have career riders in the smaller class.... Leaving room for guys to continue their career there. This push that everyone should eventually wind up in the premier class is flawed ideology.. there's just no benefit to it.
Johnny Depp
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10/24/2016 8:04pm Edited Date/Time 10/25/2016 12:35pm
SX business model:

16 US races. 8 International races.

International races pay double points and are at the end of the US season. Separate Champion for US and Int. and World Champion. Manufacturer's points as well as Riders.

80 riders in 4 Quarterfinals eliminated down to 2 Semifinals and 1 Main. Ride anything.

Support class 125 2t under 18.
Johnny Depp
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10/25/2016 12:33pm Edited Date/Time 10/25/2016 12:34pm
I didn't mean drop the mike! Please cuss and discuss? It is the off season tradition Smile

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hillbilly
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10/25/2016 1:41pm Edited Date/Time 10/25/2016 1:42pm
I didn't mean drop the mike! Please cuss and discuss? It is the off season tradition Smile
What would happen is they'd do 25 sx races for a couple years,the outdoors would suffer ,the sx series wouldnt draw the crowd needed it goes belly up 3 yrs in and takes the outdoors with it.

kijen
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10/25/2016 1:52pm
I didn't mean drop the mike! Please cuss and discuss? It is the off season tradition Smile
hillbilly wrote:
What would happen is they'd do 25 sx races for a couple years,the outdoors would suffer ,the sx series wouldnt draw the crowd needed it goes...
What would happen is they'd do 25 sx races for a couple years,the outdoors would suffer ,the sx series wouldnt draw the crowd needed it goes belly up 3 yrs in and takes the outdoors with it.

Probably the most realistic view....Sx does not draw enough now, don't see how making global improves anything, viewers will be gained and also lost...this growing the sport crap is 180 out. Focus on grass roots, increase the number of riders not couch potatoes....
aroark247
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10/25/2016 3:35pm
Few things:
This would kill the privateer almost completely, no more 722, Nick Schmidt (good riders close being competitive in mains)

America is the largest consumer nation in the world; taking this international is NOT going to pack stadiums in Europe. Take a look at how well the SMX cup pulled in a crowd.

The European racers are every bit as talented and capable as the US however, initially they will not excel at a traditional sx track nor will their interest to compete and risk their chances in MXGP

US nationals- DEAD

Really the only people to gain from this would be entities in Europe getting a taste of what we have here, this would severely strain the grassroots here in the US which would trickle down with less sales, which I'm sure the Japanese would be stoked on that -NOT

As a summary: this New World Order seems to be the aim not only in this sport but in a ton of aspects of life in general, it won't work. I love watching SX/MX, and GP's separate and then MXDN.
This idea is like taking one step forward and then ten backward into a pit of dirty needles
Midwest_Mafia
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10/25/2016 6:34pm
25 races are too many for sx. Let's not tread on the nationals toe's, 20 is more reasonable, maybe one less off week to tighten the schedule?

The solution to our problem remains though, how do we get more money into the sport? How do we make it more accessible and appealing to the common public? Or is this just the nature of the beast? An isolated, niche sport tailored to enthusiasts because of the cost of entry, risk of injury etc...
kkawboy14
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10/25/2016 6:39pm Edited Date/Time 10/25/2016 6:40pm
25 races....14 minute mains and 4 minute qualifiers for triple the money payouts of the outdoors. It's a no brainer if your a Pro
Johnny Depp
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10/25/2016 6:48pm
I didn't mean drop the mike! Please cuss and discuss? It is the off season tradition Smile
hillbilly wrote:
What would happen is they'd do 25 sx races for a couple years,the outdoors would suffer ,the sx series wouldnt draw the crowd needed it goes...
What would happen is they'd do 25 sx races for a couple years,the outdoors would suffer ,the sx series wouldnt draw the crowd needed it goes belly up 3 yrs in and takes the outdoors with it.

My crystal ball looks more like packed races due to international competition and a better show creating a boom in grass roots and outdoors trying to make the big show.

Half empty or half full. That's why they call them promoters. Risk/ Reward.
10/25/2016 7:02pm
A European supercross series to help the mxgp riders build technique would be good, but be seperate from U.S. series. In a few years there would be little to separate the Americans from the Euros. They might see how the injuries shorten careers and take out top riders more often. They might get burnt out in their careers earlier too.
To me dirt bikes are outdoor motocross
Ehm24
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10/25/2016 8:08pm
I wish the riders would form a union. Less money for the promoters, more money for the riders and small teams.
hvaughn88
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10/25/2016 8:20pm
Ehm24 wrote:
I wish the riders would form a union. Less money for the promoters, more money for the riders and small teams.
Won't happen. The riders with the most influence are making bank and wont wanna mess with it. Plus, what exactly is it gonna do? If they were to unionize and then "strike," then you have a bunch of guys out of work with limited skill sets outside of the industry. Not exactly an ideal situation if your goal is more money. And correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Feld have a pretty stellar agreement with most of the stadiums that would make it very, very difficult for an opposing series to start? I really don't see the riders having any leverage whatsoever
10/25/2016 8:23pm
It would be nice if Supercross had a more laid back schedule. It is insane what they get put through. Sure the top 7 or 8 get compensated for it, but too much on the body. It is not like they are sitting behind the wheel.
A shorter Supercross season and maybe a couple more diverse out door races each year. Have a different one off outdoor track each year. Something built in the dunes, In baja,untouched grass track etc.. build outdoors back up. Moto cross will always have the one up over supercross on the experience, sitting in bleachers vs being on the terrain. It is sad to talk about American Motocross on a pro level suffering due to Supercross expanding.
Johnny Depp
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10/25/2016 8:51pm
Why does MX have to suffer due to SX expanding? Because there are 52 weeks in the year and SX uses 24 of them?

If MX is suffering perhaps they should consider how to improve it.

Different track locations
Different bikes allowed
Less ruts and jumps
A schedule that a privateer could afford to follow without criss-crossing the country
A class where up and comers don't have to race sand baggers
A pit row where you could buy authentic team gear
A format where there are more gate drops and less run aways
A spectator could know who won at the end of the day
If top riders choose SX only contracts for financial reasons you better make it worth their while


No one needs to be unemployed. You might have to change with the times though.

Or not, leave it alone and watch it die.
10/25/2016 10:47pm
I am not a fan of Supercross adding more events, it is just to get me through the winter until I can ride more. Motocross is fine, if one guy runs away he deserves it. It is a test of endurance and balls. Supercross with the 450s is not as exciting, more hybrid Daytona like tracks at speedways in warm weather areas would be a fresh change, longer tracks and better turns to pass on. Not this chase series layout either, I think a three moto MEC style would be a lot more exciting. Really though, is it really going to expand past where the Monster Jam dirt sits. Global supercross will only go as far as the overseas Monster Jams right? I doubt it will happen. Both American series could use a little variety on tracks and that could be a first step, start with that before things change too much.
Midwest_Mafia
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10/26/2016 2:05am
A riders union won't happen because everyone whose not a professional rider currently say it wont? These guys aren't dumb. Well, Most of them aren't. They'll figure it out sooner or later, the last few years surely are making people aware of the need for organization and structure to benefit all riders, on any level, From track design and safety, to pay out and influence on the series structure....
RG1
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10/26/2016 7:14am Edited Date/Time 10/26/2016 7:21am
Not a chance in hell this happens IMO. Let alone in 2 years. You think everyone in Europe is going to go from racing motocross the whole year round and racing pretty much no Supercross, to suddenly racing only Supercross? I just don't see it. I can see FELD expanding the normal SX series and putting a couple of European races. But it won't be at the expense of motocross in Europe. I do fear for the Nationals in the US though
aroark247
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10/26/2016 8:41am
This is a total loss for the little guy. Monster needs a reality check- they are one of the biggest making a push for this. This sport has been around long before energy drinks, and large fundamental shifts in the structure of the sport should not be dictated by a few (monster in particular) title sponsors who would cut their support ($) at the drop of a hat if their genius idea blows up
Johnny Depp
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10/26/2016 9:35am Edited Date/Time 10/26/2016 9:36am
I'm not too sure about connecting the dots that MORE races results in LESS employment?

If you want to see your sport go mainstream, then it takes Promoter's and Sponsor's willing to risk multi millions of dollars. Over the decades we have seen many of both come and go. Now 1 wants to step up to the plate and they are getting flack over it?

I miss the days of the Trans Am's but they are gone, along with Jaroslav Falta winning Supercross and 3 moto's outdoors.

The sky is not falling, that is the sun breaking through. And get off my grass you damn kids!
hvaughn88
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10/26/2016 9:41am Edited Date/Time 10/26/2016 9:41am
Moto seems to be stuck in limbo in regards to what it wants to be. Does it want to be big? Does it want to be small? It's almost like it wants the best of the both worlds (hey, who wouldn't) but doesn't want to accept the cons that are associated with either world. I don't have an answer, just an observation.
Johnny Depp
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10/26/2016 3:10pm
Just wondering how many riders are even "employed" in the MX industry.
The definition for me would be getting paid more than expenses at least to a level of minimum wage or about $15k per year.

I would take a wild ass guess at under 100 worldwide?

It is awesome to chase your dream, but eventually most will need to find a real job.
Johnny Depp
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10/26/2016 10:29pm Edited Date/Time 10/26/2016 10:30pm
So what racing format "employs" the most riders, and is that is even a criteria that should be considered?
Which responsibility of a Promoter comes 1st, an employer or an entertainer? If 1 employee filled the house like at a music concert it would be a success.

At what point in the results does it "pay" from the purse for the finish?

MEC - 1 full gate of pros (20)

SX - 2 full gates for each class (80)

MX- 2 full gates 4 each class (80)

GP- 2 full gates each class (80) no purse

If there is fear of less employment, where does it come from?



holeshot100
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10/27/2016 9:29am
Moto810 wrote:
If anything MXGP could get bigger. But yes the US outdoors would suffer. It just depends on the teams and riders. If many of the Europe...
If anything MXGP could get bigger. But yes the US outdoors would suffer. It just depends on the teams and riders. If many of the Europe riders want to get into SX then that could change things.
I don't know if "bigger" is the right term. Perhaps something more along the line of "getting MXGP back to where it once was".

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