Track sued for $2.2 mill- what's your opinion?

I think it's b.s.

Riding is an eXtreme sport, if it's too eXtreme go play golf or something.
There are always gray areas in these deals, but this rider rode into the danger, the danger didn't ride to him.

There were a ton of Hazzards on the Saddleback and Indian Dunes trails.
imho seems, common sense is not so common these days.

This is the way I see this one.
REGARDLESS of how well you think you know a track or area, you should ALWAYS take a sight lap, or ride within CONTROL (ie. being able to stop on a dime) EVERYTIME you ride. I have ridden the same track 4 days in a row, and ruts had developed on landings that were not there before, jump faces had changed, things are NOT the same as the day prior. I read this post several times, and it was stated that the trail that previously existed was now grated and much wider. Now perhaps this is just me being of logical thinking, but that says to me that SOMETHING had changed in the last 7 years. Perhaps he should have checked it out, just to see what all the GRADING was for. Now all that said, I feel for the guy, I would be pretty torn up to not be able to ride again.
Here is the deal, when we sign up to ride a track it is OUR responsibility to ride within our limits and on the track that is PROVIDED. Many tracks are barely scraping by as it is, some do not have the personnel to groom the track everyday. Many are using old equipment and trying to nurse it along as long as possible. If you happen to be riding on track that has not been groomed after a rain, and you see a spot on the track that could cause you to crash then you simply AVOID IT! You choose to ride there, and sometimes you are doing so not knowing the condition of the track. If you know that a certain track grooms several times a day then only ride there.
Every track is run by PEOPLE, and sometimes people do stupid things. If you are riding and see a tractor on the side of the track were it COULD cause harm, tell the track staff and if they don't move it then DON'T chance the obstacle!
Now if a track KNOWINGLY has something that could harm riders, ie. metal rebar in the track, or piano wire through the whoops, and doesn't address it. Then you can sue! Otherwise, we take our lives in our own hands everytime we throw a leg over the bike. If you can not accept those terms, then you have NO BUSINESS throwing your leg over a bike.

You'd think that the track would post caution/warning notices for a hazard like that, something similar to what ski areas do......

[quote="APLMAN":16r6hsu1]You'd think that the track would post caution/warning notices for a hazard like that, something similar to what ski areas do......[/quote:16r6hsu1]

Whether lurking or actually being here, RC16 is laughing his ass off at you guys.

[quote="APLMAN":1tdpb4q6]You'd think that the track would post caution/warning notices for a hazard like that, something similar to what ski areas do......[/quote:1tdpb4q6]

No kidding. Could you imagine going to a ski resort and taking off on one of the branches of the intermediate hills only to find out it now leads to a blind cliff? With no "trail closed," "danger ahead," or fences warning you? That's just nuts and asking for a lawsuit.

It would be interesting to hear more of Sand Hill's or the Gun Club's story. The story is kind of confusing. Most Motocross tracks don't have open riding trails, also, that the public is supposed to be on.

Yes, I think some are confusing a track with a trail.
It is not unreasonable to think a cleared, graded and groomed trail will not lead to a blind cliff.

No matter if I'm trail riding or moto practice at any facility, I always ride with caution until I get famailar with the territory. In the woods, never ride faster than your eyes can see and your brakes can stop you.

My opinion? Between noise issues, eco-freak soil erosion, dust, animal habitat and vehicle emission issues, and lawsuits over track "negligence", this sport won't be around in 10 years anyway.

[quote="REFEREE":1fiy283c]No matter if I'm trail riding or moto practice at any facility, I always ride with caution until I get famailar with the territory. In the woods, never ride faster than your eyes can see and your brakes can stop you.[/quote:1fiy283c]

Understood, but in reading that description, the road ahead just vanished to a 20ft cliff...probably would've flown off it at almost any speed.
[quote:1fiy283c]
...approached the trees on a flat straight of way and slowed down as he rounded the trees to get to the ravine trail had taken in the past. The edge of the cliff blended in with the roadway in the distance and he thought the trail dipped down and continued. Much to his surprise, he found himself in mid-air, flying off a cliff onto the rocks below.[/quote:1fiy283c]

Seems that he did slow down and that his thought that the cleared and graded trail "dipped down and continued"

Understand this, I think the gun club is far more at fault than the track due to their removal of the fence, lack of markings, and grooming a trail off a cliff.
However, the track should have maintained better control of their boundaries.

I am going to send out a letter to all the tracks in my state and see if we can't get together on a law similar to the Equine law here .

TITLE 13. COURTS AND COURT PROCEDURE
ARTICLE 21. DAMAGES
PART 1. GENERAL PROVISIONS

C.R.S. 13-21-119 (1994)

13-21-119. Equine activities - llama activities - legislative declaration - exemption from civil liability

(1) The general assembly recognizes that persons who participate in equine activities or llama activities may incur injuries as a result of the risks involved in such activities. The general assembly also finds that the state and its citizens derive numerous economic and personal benefits from such activities. It is, therefore, the intent of the general assembly to encourage equine activities and llama activities by limiting the civil liability of those involved in such activities.

(2) As used in this section, unless the context otherwise requires:

(a) "Engages in a llama activity" means riding, training, assisting in medical treatment of, driving, or being a passenger upon a llama, whether mounted or unmounted or any person assisting a participant or show management. The term "engages in a llama activity" does not include being a spectator at a llama activity, except in cases where the spectator places himself in an unauthorized area and in immediate proximity to the llama activity.

(a.5) "Engages in an equine activity" means riding, training, assisting in medical treatment of, driving, or being a passenger upon an equine, whether mounted or unmounted or any person assisting a participant or show management. The term "engages in an equine activity" does not include being a spectator at an equine activity, except in cases where the spectator places himself in an unauthorized area and in immediate proximity to the equine activity.

(b) "Equine" means a horse, pony, mule, donkey, or hinny.

(c) "Equine activity" means:

(I) Equine shows, fairs, competitions, performances, or parades that involve any or all breeds of equines and any of the equine disciplines, including, but not limited to, dressage, hunter and jumper horse shows, grand prix jumping, three-day events, combined training, rodeos, driving, pulling, cutting, polo, steeplechasing, English and western performance riding, endurance trail riding and western games, and hunting;

(II) Equine training or teaching activities or both;

(III) Boarding equines;

(IV) Riding, inspecting, or evaluating an equine belonging to another, whether or not the owner has received some monetary consideration or other thing of value for the use of the equine or is permitting a prospective purchaser of the equine to ride, inspect, or evaluate the equine;

(V) Rides, trips, hunts, or other equine activities of any type however informal or impromptu that are sponsored by an equine activity sponsor; and

(VI) Placing or replacing horseshoes on an equine.

(d) "Equine activity sponsor" means an individual, group, club, partnership, or corporation, whether or not the sponsor is operating for profit or nonprofit, which sponsors, organizes, or provides the facilities for, an equine activity, including but not limited to: Pony clubs, 4-H clubs, hunt clubs, riding clubs, school and college- sponsored classes, programs and activities, therapeutic riding programs, and operators, instructors, and promoters of equine facilities, including but not limited to stables, clubhouses, ponyride strings, fairs, and arenas at which the activity is held.

(e) "Equine professional" means a person engaged for compensation:

(I) In instructing a participant or renting to a participant an equine for the purpose of riding, driving, or being a passenger upon the equine; or

(II) In renting equipment or tack to a participant.

(f) "Inherent risks of equine activities" and "inherent risks of llama activities" means those dangers or conditions which are an integral part of equine activities or llama activities, as the case may be, including, but not limited to:

(I) The propensity of the animal to behave in ways that may result in injury, harm, or death to persons on or around them;

(II) The unpredictability of the animal's reaction to such things as sounds, sudden movement, and unfamiliar objects, persons, or other animals;

(III) Certain hazards such as surface and subsurface conditions;

(IV) Collisions with other animals or objects;

(V) The potential of a participant to act in a negligent manner that may contribute to injury to the participant or others, such as failing to maintain control over the animal or not acting within his or her ability.

(f.1) "Llama" means a South American camelid which is an animal of the genus lama, commonly referred to as a "one l lama", including llamas, alpacas, guanacos, and vicunas.

(f.2) "Llama activity" means:

(I) Llama shows, fairs, competitions, performances, packing events, or parades that involve any or all breeds of llamas;

(II) Using llamas to pull carts or to carry packs or other items;

(III) Using llamas to pull travois-type carriers during rescue or emergency situations;

(IV) Llama training or teaching activities or both;

(V) Taking llamas on public relations trips or visits to schools or nursing homes;

(VI) Participating in commercial packing trips in which participants pay a llama professional to be a guide on a hike leading llamas;

(VII) Boarding llamas;

(VIII) Riding, inspecting, or evaluating a llama belonging to another, whether or not the owner has received some monetary consideration or other thing of value for the use of the llama or is permitting a prospective purchaser of the llama to ride, inspect, or evaluate the llama;

(IX) Using llamas in wool production;

(X) Rides, trips, or other llama activities of any type however informal or impromptu that are sponsored by a llama activity sponsor; and

(XI) Trimming the nails of a llama.

(f.3) "Llama activity sponsor" means an individual, group, club, partnership, or corporation, whether or not the sponsor is operating for profit or nonprofit, which sponsors, organizes, or provides the facilities for, a llama activity, including but not limited to: Llama clubs, 4-H clubs, hunt clubs, riding clubs, school and college- sponsored classes, programs and activities, therapeutic riding programs, and operators, instructors, and promoters of llama facilities, including but not limited to stables, clubhouses, fairs, and arenas at which the activity is held.

(f.4) "Llama professional" means a person engaged for compensation:

(I) In instructing a participant or renting to a participant a llama for the purpose of riding, driving, or being a passenger upon the llama; or

(II) In renting equipment or tack to a participant.

(g) "Participant" means any person, whether amateur or professional, who engages in an equine activity or who engages in a llama activity, whether or not a fee is paid to participate in such activity.

(3) Except as provided in subsection (4) of this section, an equine activity sponsor, an equine professional, a llama activity sponsor, a llama professional, a doctor of veterinary medicine, or any other person, which shall include a corporation or partnership, shall not be liable for an injury to or the death of a participant resulting from the inherent risks of equine activities, or from the inherent risks of llama activities and, except as provided in subsection (4) of this section, no participant nor participant's representative shall make any claim against, maintain an action against, or recover from an equine activity sponsor, an equine professional, a llama activity sponsor, a llama professional, a doctor of veterinary medicine, or any other person for injury, loss, damage, or death of the participant resulting from any of the inherent risks of equine activities or resulting from any of the inherent risks of llama activities.

(4) (a) This section shall not apply to the horse racing industry as regulated in article 60 of title 12, C.R.S.

(b) Nothing in subsection (3) of this section shall prevent or limit the liability of an equine activity sponsor, an equine professional, a llama activity sponsor, a llama professional, or any other person if the equine activity sponsor, equine professional, llama activity sponsor, llama professional, or person:

(I) (A) Provided the equipment or tack, and knew or should have known that the equipment or tack was faulty, and such equipment or tack was faulty to the extent that it did cause the injury; or

( Provided the animal and failed to make reasonable and prudent efforts to determine the ability of the participant to engage safely in the equine activity or llama activity and determine the ability of the participant to safely manage the particular animal based on the participant's representations of his ability;

(II) Owns, leases, rents, or otherwise is in lawful possession and control of the land or facilities upon which the participant sustained injuries because of a dangerous latent condition which was known to the equine activity sponsor, equine professional, llama activity sponsor, llama professional, or person and for which warning signs have not been conspicuously posted;

(III) Commits an act or omission that constitutes willful or wanton disregard for the safety of the participant, and that act or omission caused the injury;

(IV) Intentionally injures the participant.

(c) Nothing in subsection (3) of this section shall prevent or limit the liability of an equine activity sponsor, equine professional, llama activity sponsor, or llama professional:

(I) Under liability provisions as set forth in the products liability laws; or

(II) Under liability provisions in section 35-46-102, C.R.S.

(5) (a) Every equine professional shall post and maintain signs which contain the warning notice specified in paragraph (b) of this subsection (5). Such signs shall be placed in a clearly visible location on or near stables, corrals, or arenas where the equine professional conducts equine activities if such stables, corrals, or arenas are owned, managed, or controlled by the equine professional. The warning notice specified in paragraph (b) of this subsection (5) shall appear on the sign in black letters, with each letter to be a minimum of one inch in height. Every written contract entered into by an equine professional for the providing of professional services, instruction, or the rental of equipment or tack or an equine to a participant, whether or not the contract involves equine activities on or off the location or site of the equine professional's business, shall contain in clearly readable print the warning notice specified in paragraph (b) of this subsection (5).

(b) The signs and contracts described in paragraph (a) of this subsection (5) shall contain the following warning notice:

[size=150:2ai7l6hk]WARNING
Under Colorado Law, an equine professional is not liable for an injury to or the death of a participant in equine activities resulting from the inherent risks of equine activities, pursuant to section 13-21-119, Colorado Revised Statutes.[/size:2ai7l6hk]

(6) (a) Every llama professional shall post and maintain signs which contain the warning notice specified in paragraph (b) of this subsection (6). Such signs shall be placed in a clearly visible location on or near stables, corrals, pens, or arenas where the llama professional conducts llama activities if such stables, corrals, pens, or arenas are owned, managed, or controlled by the llama professional. The warning notice specified in paragraph (b) of this subsection (6) shall appear on the sign in black letters, with each letter to be a minimum of one inch in height. Every written contract entered into by a llama professional for the providing of professional services, instruction, or the rental of equipment or tack or a llama to a participant, whether or not the contract involves llama activities on or off the location or site of the llama professional's business, shall contain in clearly readable print the warning notice specified in paragraph (b) of this subsection (6).

Lets say you board your horse at someones place and get hurt riding it because your horse threw you into a ravine you cannot sue .They won't even look at a case.

That's similar to Colorado's skier responsibility law. They had to pass it to keep a vital industry, skiing, open.

Yes it is. We really need a law like this for motorcyclists. I am going to talk with my lawer on monday and see what can be done .

Can a ski resort legally clear and groom a trail to go off a cliff and not be held liable?

Well, the skiers that do cliffs don't like grooming, so they don't groom them. But there are cliffs in-bounds at ski areas if that's what you are asking. They do usually mark them as dangers if it's cleared above them, but there are plenty of cliffs available through some woods that are unmarked.

[img:362an64a]http://wetasschronicles.com/archives/images/SnowboardJump.jpg[/img:362a…]


For the snowboarders and freestylers they do create some huge cliffs and plant them smack in the middle of slopes.


[img:362an64a]http://photographers.snowboard-revolution.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/0…]

[quote="Rim Lock":q1r0o6u3][quote="APLMAN":q1r0o6u3]You'd think that the track would post caution/warning notices for a hazard like that, something similar to what ski areas do......[/quote:q1r0o6u3]

Whether lurking or actually being here, RC16 is laughing his ass off at you guys.[/quote:q1r0o6u3]


Then he'd be misunderstanding the issue also......

[quote="APLMAN":2yjdvcwq]

Then he'd be misunderstanding the issue also......[/quote:2yjdvcwq]Agreed

[quote="MXRose3":13ptcn74][quote="drmarkr":13ptcn74][quote="MXRose3":13ptcn74]It hadn't rained in days. They could have fixed that.

Would you ride on a track that had a big hole in the middle of the track after a big jump?[/quote:13ptcn74]

No. I'm smart enough to roll around the tracks I ride and check out obstacles that might be dangerous if I make a mistake and wind up where I didn't plan on being.

So you would have sued the track owners/operators for your son's lack of proper sighting of the track and it's obstacles, and then riding off course and striking one of these obstacles? Gimme a break....

MR[/quote:13ptcn74]

He saw the obstacle and had missed it (barely) the lap before.
The next lap he made a *slight mistake and just barely overjumped it and ended up off the track. Other people were jumping it and BARELY missing it also. It could have happened to anyone that day, but it just happened to happen to my son.
The author of this post wanted opinions and I'm giving an account of mine.
I'm sorry I did, I won't post in this thread anymore - but don't call me an asshole.
Carry on.[/quote:13ptcn74]

How long before a sue happy rider applies MXroses' theory to coming up short on a double?

"Well, he cleared it 3 times before he came up short and got hurt"

Your arguement has RC16 all over it.

Design flaw, you know?

[quote="Farva":394pa7xm][quote="MXRose3":394pa7xm][quote="drmarkr":394pa7xm]It hadn't rained in days. They could have fixed that.

Would you ride on a track that had a big hole in the middle of the track after a big jump?[/quote:394pa7xm]

No. I'm smart enough to roll around the tracks I ride and check out obstacles that might be dangerous if I make a mistake and wind up where I didn't plan on being.

So you would have sued the track owners/operators for your son's lack of proper sighting of the track and it's obstacles, and then riding off course and striking one of these obstacles? Gimme a break....

MR[/quote:394pa7xm]

He saw the obstacle and had missed it (barely) the lap before.
The next lap he made a *slight mistake and just barely overjumped it and ended up off the track. Other people were jumping it and BARELY missing it also. It could have happened to anyone that day, but it just happened to happen to my son.
The author of this post wanted opinions and I'm giving an account of mine.
I'm sorry I did, I won't post in this thread anymore - but don't call me an asshole.
Carry on.[/quote:394pa7xm]


So that kid of yours barely missed it the lap before and then the next lap decided to try and barely miss it again? Did you drop him on his head as a kid?[/quote]

If so, the child may be entitled to compensation for such negligent care....

[quote="JustMX":1g4chu4q][quote="MXRose3":1g4chu4q]
He saw the obstacle and had missed it (barely) the lap before.
The next lap he made a *slight mistake and just barely [u:1g4chu4q][b:1g4chu4q]overjumped[/b:1g4chu4q][/u:1g4chu4q] it and ended up off the track. Other people were jumping it and BARELY missing it also. It could have happened to anyone that day, but it just happened to happen to my son.
The author of this post wanted opinions and I'm giving an account of mine.
I'm sorry I did, I won't post in this thread anymore - but don't call me an asshole.
Carry on.[/quote:1g4chu4q]

How long before a sue happy rider applies MXroses' theory to coming up short on a double?

"Well, he cleared it 3 times before he came up short and got hurt"

Your arguement has RC16 all over it.

Design flaw, you know?[/quote:1g4chu4q]

Can you read? He slightly OVERJUMPED IT and couldn't avoid a [b:1g4chu4q]10' DEEP HOLE [/b:1g4chu4q]in the track.

Would you accept the fact that 10' DEEP hole was in the track?
Damn, I said I wasn't going to make any remarks on this, but as long as you guys keep bringing my name up in this I'm going to.

[quote="MXRose3":55dpajzh][quote="JustMX":55dpajzh][quote="MXRose3":55dpajzh]
He saw the obstacle and had missed it (barely) the lap before.
The next lap he made a *slight mistake and just barely [u:55dpajzh][b:55dpajzh]overjumped[/b:55dpajzh][/u:55dpajzh] it and ended up off the track. Other people were jumping it and BARELY missing it also. It could have happened to anyone that day, but it just happened to happen to my son.
The author of this post wanted opinions and I'm giving an account of mine.
I'm sorry I did, I won't post in this thread anymore - but don't call me an asshole.
Carry on.[/quote:55dpajzh]

How long before a sue happy rider applies MXroses' theory to coming up short on a double?

"Well, he cleared it 3 times before he came up short and got hurt"

Your arguement has RC16 all over it.

Design flaw, you know?[/quote:55dpajzh]

Can you read? He slightly OVERJUMPED IT and couldn't avoid a [b:55dpajzh]10' DEEP HOLE [/b:55dpajzh]in the track.

Would you accept the fact that 10' DEEP hole was in the track?
Damn, I said I wasn't going to make any remarks on this, but as long as you guys keep bringing my name up in this I'm going to.[/quote:55dpajzh]

Personaly if I feel that something is that unsafe I will pack up the van and leave. As far as your name being brought up you made the bed and now have to sleep in it my advice is to just not click on the link.

[quote="Farva":2wgh91zy]
Personaly if I feel that something is that unsafe I will pack up the van and leave. As far as your name being brought up you made the bed and now have to sleep in it my advice is to just not click on the link.[/quote:2wgh91zy]

We had driven 12 hours to get to this track.
Next time, I will pack my shit up and leave.
Trouble is, even with a hazard like this, someone else will ride it and get hurt and sue.
If you personally want tracks to stay open, they need to be a little more responsible than that - thats all I'm trying to say.
I had never seen anything more negligent at a track in my life - and I've been riding motocross tracks for 20 some years.
Don't reply to me on here - I'm taking your advice and not clicking this post anymore.

In Rosie's defense, he/she did say that they did not sue.