VW TDI

Mx4life320
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Mx4life320
Edited Date/Time 2/11/2016 4:07pm
Anyone besides me get caught up in this? Not sure whats gonna happen, but doesn't look to good. From all the articles i have been reading, the majority are saying its going 1 of 2 ways. Flash the programmer and reprogram it, and/or add DEF to the years that didn't have it.

What do you guys all think?
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philG
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philG 9/23/2015 2:11pm
9/23/2015 2:11pm
I think everyone is doing the same.
TXDirt
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TXDirt 9/23/2015 2:26pm
9/23/2015 2:26pm
From what I read some of the regulations have gotten a bit impractical to the point where the cars run like shit. Who knows how to get a car to run properly? EPA or VW?

Maybe this is incorrect but it sounds like some of the changes they were making was to get the cars to run better. When they were tested against some EPA stats they changed the programming during the tests. Then after the tests they changed it back so car would run optimally.

If you want your VW to be sluggish and run like shit then go get it repogrgramed. Else leave it as is.

Just some stuff I have been reading. Makes some sense.
71Fish
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71Fish 9/23/2015 3:58pm
9/23/2015 3:58pm
I've only read the headlines so I don't know the details. What I do know is that vehicle emissions make cars run worse and wastes gas.
anelson509 9/23/2015 6:39pm
9/23/2015 6:39pm
Really curious to see how this is gonna go. Actually bought a 2015 Passat TDI 3 weeks ago. My timing was great on this one haha...

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vet323
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vet323 9/23/2015 6:39pm
9/23/2015 6:39pm
There are drawbacks to any "solution" that is imposed on VW at this point. Adding a urea system retroactively will be really expensive (on top of the EPA fines- up to over $37k /car) and reprogramming to get the numbers in line will make those TDI's run like shit and get horrible mileage.

VW can kiss the diesel market goodbye in north America, and their gas engine car sales are going to go into the crapper as well.
zlowery
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zlowery 9/29/2015 3:59pm
9/29/2015 3:59pm
I bought a 2014 jetta last year. Documented every mile. 41mpg average. I really hope this all plays out okay for me $$$ wise. Don't want the car if mpg or performance suffers. 6th vw diesel in my family. Whats odd is that my parents 12 passat takes urea. When i bought mine, my dad and i were scratching our heads on why mine doesnt??! Guess we know now...
ns503
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ns503 9/30/2015 4:06am
9/30/2015 4:06am
Don't want the car if mpg or performance suffers.

From what I know, if they 'fix' it, that is what will happen.

But your NOx emissions will decrease.

I don't think I'd do a thing if I had one - it's like they factory chipped it.
Mx4life320
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Mx4life320 9/30/2015 4:19am
9/30/2015 4:19am
Yea, I think that's what they are going to do for the fix, detune it. Which sucks. I feel like that's kinda illegal because now they sold me a car that doesn't meet the specs of what they said it would.

But we will see.
zlowery
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zlowery 9/30/2015 4:42am
9/30/2015 4:42am
For sure it's like a factory chip. My brother made that point. Hopefully in PA here, they don't refuse to re-register unless it's fixed!
Mx4life320
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Mx4life320 9/30/2015 4:54am
9/30/2015 4:54am
zlowery wrote:
For sure it's like a factory chip. My brother made that point. Hopefully in PA here, they don't refuse to re-register unless it's fixed!
I am sure they will refuse to register. If it comes to that, you can just get the car "Fixed" so it has the paper work, then take the car to a performance shop, and they can re-flash the chip and you can go back to where you were or get even more power outta it.
Yes that will eliminate the NOx fix but your car will be back to normal. If people are so worried about the VW diesel emissions, go check out what an 18 wheeler puts out.

huck
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huck 9/30/2015 5:39am
9/30/2015 5:39am
The EPA spent $92,000,000 on office furniture in the last 10 years. FUCK THEM!
three9zero
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three9zero 9/30/2015 4:51pm
9/30/2015 4:51pm
These guys can solve your problem if you have to get the reflash done.....Just send them your ECU and blamo, faster and better mpg that you had in the first place

http://www.malonetuning.com/
Olson
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Olson 10/1/2015 11:16am
10/1/2015 11:16am
Just found out today my Audi A6 is one of the cars on the list. FML!
Mx4life320
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Mx4life320 10/1/2015 11:24am
10/1/2015 11:24am
three9zero wrote:
These guys can solve your problem if you have to get the reflash done.....Just send them your ECU and blamo, faster and better mpg that you...
These guys can solve your problem if you have to get the reflash done.....Just send them your ECU and blamo, faster and better mpg that you had in the first place

http://www.malonetuning.com/
Thanks, but I know people locally that can do it. I wouldn't want to send my ECU out and not have a car for a week...




The more and more I read about this, I just don't see the customer being happy with any solution.





Olson
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Olson 10/1/2015 11:33am
10/1/2015 11:33am
three9zero wrote:
These guys can solve your problem if you have to get the reflash done.....Just send them your ECU and blamo, faster and better mpg that you...
These guys can solve your problem if you have to get the reflash done.....Just send them your ECU and blamo, faster and better mpg that you had in the first place

http://www.malonetuning.com/
Mx4life320 wrote:
Thanks, but I know people locally that can do it. I wouldn't want to send my ECU out and not have a car for a week...
Thanks, but I know people locally that can do it. I wouldn't want to send my ECU out and not have a car for a week...




The more and more I read about this, I just don't see the customer being happy with any solution.





Same here. I can't see anyone except if you know nothing about cars and don't follow the news that would roll over and do the "fix" without any compensation. You basically get a worse car than what you paid for and a lower resale value.
CrGuy2T
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CrGuy2T 2/10/2016 8:02am
2/10/2016 8:02am
We have one as well. I don't want to participate in the buy back unless there will be another TDI available. Gonna wait it out and see. I'll take the good will package as it time for a transmission inspection on our car.
newmann
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newmann 2/10/2016 9:03am
2/10/2016 9:03am
Diminished resale value will be the key factor in all of this. Goodwill is one thing but people will be ready to pounce for some DV money.

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CrGuy2T
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CrGuy2T 2/10/2016 10:00am
2/10/2016 10:00am
newmann wrote:
Diminished resale value will be the key factor in all of this. Goodwill is one thing but people will be ready to pounce for some DV...
Diminished resale value will be the key factor in all of this. Goodwill is one thing but people will be ready to pounce for some DV money.
Hopefully it's a nice check if this decision is made. We don't plan on selling ours.
Andy_Greenney 2/10/2016 1:22pm
2/10/2016 1:22pm
I haven't really kept track of the issue this side of the pond, how are records being kept on the cars that are being re-flashed/rectified to meet the emissions regs?
And if records aren't being kept why have it done?
newmann
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newmann 2/10/2016 3:08pm
2/10/2016 3:08pm
So the whole deal is that VW and maybe some others pulled a fast one on emission regs? They make a vehicle that performs well and efficiently squeezes every mile possible out of a gallon of fuel yet when the diagnostic port gets "violated" it sends faulty codes that everything is tree hugger friendly? Unplug the diagnostic cable and it reverts back to the badass fuel efficient mode?
KMC440
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KMC440 2/10/2016 3:43pm
2/10/2016 3:43pm
Mx4life320 wrote:
I am sure they will refuse to register. If it comes to that, you can just get the car "Fixed" so it has the paper work...
I am sure they will refuse to register. If it comes to that, you can just get the car "Fixed" so it has the paper work, then take the car to a performance shop, and they can re-flash the chip and you can go back to where you were or get even more power outta it.
Yes that will eliminate the NOx fix but your car will be back to normal. If people are so worried about the VW diesel emissions, go check out what an 18 wheeler puts out.

Then go count how many diesel Passats it'll take to haul 46,000 pounds of anything anywhere.

I'll take the nuisance of one truck thank you.
steed 2.0
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steed 2.0 2/10/2016 9:29pm
2/10/2016 9:29pm
newmann wrote:
So the whole deal is that VW and maybe some others pulled a fast one on emission regs? They make a vehicle that performs well and...
So the whole deal is that VW and maybe some others pulled a fast one on emission regs? They make a vehicle that performs well and efficiently squeezes every mile possible out of a gallon of fuel yet when the diagnostic port gets "violated" it sends faulty codes that everything is tree hugger friendly? Unplug the diagnostic cable and it reverts back to the badass fuel efficient mode?
Mx4life320
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Mx4life320 2/11/2016 5:07am
2/11/2016 5:07am
newmann wrote:
So the whole deal is that VW and maybe some others pulled a fast one on emission regs? They make a vehicle that performs well and...
So the whole deal is that VW and maybe some others pulled a fast one on emission regs? They make a vehicle that performs well and efficiently squeezes every mile possible out of a gallon of fuel yet when the diagnostic port gets "violated" it sends faulty codes that everything is tree hugger friendly? Unplug the diagnostic cable and it reverts back to the badass fuel efficient mode?
Yea, that's basically whats happening. Everyone is all upset because the TDI emits 3 times as much nitrogen oxide as what is legal. Yet, no one looks at how much semis, or tractors emit. Seems to me a car getting 40-50 MPG would have far better emissions per mile then the 2000 f150 that your neighbor drives getting 8 mpg.

SEE ARE125 2/11/2016 8:37am
2/11/2016 8:37am Edited Date/Time 2/11/2016 8:55am
Mx4life320 wrote:
Yea, that's basically whats happening. Everyone is all upset because the TDI emits 3 times as much nitrogen oxide as what is legal. Yet, no one...
Yea, that's basically whats happening. Everyone is all upset because the TDI emits 3 times as much nitrogen oxide as what is legal. Yet, no one looks at how much semis, or tractors emit. Seems to me a car getting 40-50 MPG would have far better emissions per mile then the 2000 f150 that your neighbor drives getting 8 mpg.

LMAO, so semi's just skirt around the EPA rules? Wrong. Semi's have had DPFs since 2007, and DEF was added in 2011. Hell, a new John Deere tractor that will never leave the farm now has to meet emission standards. It isn't just passenger vehicles. A quick google search shows that the average VW TDI emits 0.4 grams/mile of nitrogen oxide. The average semi emits 8.6 grams/mile. Now let's compare:

A VW Passat TDI moves a 3,500lb car and emits 0.4 grams per mile of nitrogen oxide, which equates to 0.000114 grams per lb moved.

A Semi moves 80,000lbs and emits 8.6 grams per mile of nitrogen oxide, which equates to .000107 grams per lb moved.

Therefore, although the semi emits more total nitrogen oxide, compared to the work being done and the weight being moved, it emits LESS nitrogen oxide than the VW Passat TDI.
Mx4life320
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Mx4life320 2/11/2016 11:39am
2/11/2016 11:39am
Mx4life320 wrote:
Yea, that's basically whats happening. Everyone is all upset because the TDI emits 3 times as much nitrogen oxide as what is legal. Yet, no one...
Yea, that's basically whats happening. Everyone is all upset because the TDI emits 3 times as much nitrogen oxide as what is legal. Yet, no one looks at how much semis, or tractors emit. Seems to me a car getting 40-50 MPG would have far better emissions per mile then the 2000 f150 that your neighbor drives getting 8 mpg.

SEE ARE125 wrote:
LMAO, so semi's just skirt around the EPA rules? Wrong. Semi's have had DPFs since 2007, and DEF was added in 2011. Hell, a new John...
LMAO, so semi's just skirt around the EPA rules? Wrong. Semi's have had DPFs since 2007, and DEF was added in 2011. Hell, a new John Deere tractor that will never leave the farm now has to meet emission standards. It isn't just passenger vehicles. A quick google search shows that the average VW TDI emits 0.4 grams/mile of nitrogen oxide. The average semi emits 8.6 grams/mile. Now let's compare:

A VW Passat TDI moves a 3,500lb car and emits 0.4 grams per mile of nitrogen oxide, which equates to 0.000114 grams per lb moved.

A Semi moves 80,000lbs and emits 8.6 grams per mile of nitrogen oxide, which equates to .000107 grams per lb moved.

Therefore, although the semi emits more total nitrogen oxide, compared to the work being done and the weight being moved, it emits LESS nitrogen oxide than the VW Passat TDI.
Maybe I didn't say it correct. I dont mean to say that they don't have to meet emission standards. But why are they less strict on those?

Also, the semi emits that at a full load? How much does it emit during a half load or and empty load?


None the less we are getting off topic

What and when is VW going to do about the fix.
SEE ARE125 2/11/2016 12:14pm
2/11/2016 12:14pm
Mx4life320 wrote:
Maybe I didn't say it correct. I dont mean to say that they don't have to meet emission standards. But why are they less strict on...
Maybe I didn't say it correct. I dont mean to say that they don't have to meet emission standards. But why are they less strict on those?

Also, the semi emits that at a full load? How much does it emit during a half load or and empty load?


None the less we are getting off topic

What and when is VW going to do about the fix.
Ok, I took it at face value, "no one looks at how much semis, or tractors emit." I don't for a second think they're less strict, I actually believe they are more strict. I just think it's all relative to the differences in vehicles. There's such a huge difference in engine displacement, work load, etc between the two vehicles.

As for VW, a buyback might not be that bad. I remember Toyota was paying a premium for Tacoma's several years ago for premature frame rust issues.
gt80rider
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gt80rider 2/11/2016 3:35pm
2/11/2016 3:35pm
newmann wrote:
Diminished resale value will be the key factor in all of this. Goodwill is one thing but people will be ready to pounce for some DV...
Diminished resale value will be the key factor in all of this. Goodwill is one thing but people will be ready to pounce for some DV money.
This is truth. I don't have one, but my best buddy does. He works at a large auto auction, all those cars are worth absolutely zero right now. Dealers won't pay one single penny for them at auction, dealers won't pay diddly for one as a trade, and the private market price is in the shitter too. After getting "fixed" they will be worth "something", but those owners are gonna take a good hard f'n on this one. Sucks for those people as they were typically hardcore vw owners.
MR. X
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MR. X 2/11/2016 3:58pm
2/11/2016 3:58pm
A good friend of mine traded his diesel VW in a week before shit hit the fan. Talk about good timing.

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