The fastest guy on the track

TDeath21
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3/16/2015 8:28am Edited Date/Time 3/16/2015 8:29am
The fastest guy doesn't always win. The best guy does though. Starts are key.
DonM
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3/16/2015 8:35am
Flex wrote:
If this is true then Jeremy Martin was not fast enough to qualify for the main event.
DonM wrote:
He wasn't because he didn't...
Flex wrote:
I'm not arguing it, but if you use this theory, Jeremy Martin does not have what it takes to be fast enough to be a main...
I'm not arguing it, but if you use this theory, Jeremy Martin does not have what it takes to be fast enough to be a main event guy consistently.

2 years ago Villopoto was also not fast enough to make a main event and Roczen was not fast enough to make a main event couple years ago either.
My point is that speed is only a piece of the puzzle and the two examples you have used above show that.
Racing is about winning and winning is who crosses the finish line first...nothing else matters....nobody gets a bonus or points for the fastest lap.
At no point did I say that Jeremy doesn't have what it takes to consistently make the main, but on Saturday he did not and that's all that matters.
SigPig
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3/16/2015 8:39am Edited Date/Time 3/16/2015 8:40am
TDeath21 wrote:
The fastest guy doesn't always win. The best guy does though. Starts are key.
The fastest guy always wins. That is how he got to the checkers first.

Even my Wife understands this concept.
MXP
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3/16/2015 8:45am
TDeath21 wrote:
The fastest guy doesn't always win. The best guy does though. Starts are key.
SigPig wrote:
The fastest guy always wins. That is how he got to the checkers first.

Even my Wife understands this concept.

"Even my Wife understands this concept"

I'm guessing she won't be reading your remark? Grinning .

The Shop

APLMAN99
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3/16/2015 8:49am
SigPig wrote:
is the one who gets to the checkers first.

I think some people are confused about how racing works.
It only takes one race to show how wrong you are.
Chad Reed, Daytona, 2008.

As for a series, is any sane individual able to argue that James Stewart wasn't the fastest guy in the 2003 125 Nationals, even though he finished 3rd at the end of the season?
SigPig
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3/16/2015 8:58am
SigPig wrote:
is the one who gets to the checkers first.

I think some people are confused about how racing works.
APLMAN99 wrote:
It only takes one race to show how wrong you are. Chad Reed, Daytona, 2008. As for a series, is any sane individual able to argue...
It only takes one race to show how wrong you are.
Chad Reed, Daytona, 2008.

As for a series, is any sane individual able to argue that James Stewart wasn't the fastest guy in the 2003 125 Nationals, even though he finished 3rd at the end of the season?
Pretty sure that mechanicals are part of racing and that suffering one is a big hinderance to your race speed.
DonM
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3/16/2015 9:09am
SigPig wrote:
is the one who gets to the checkers first.

I think some people are confused about how racing works.
APLMAN99 wrote:
It only takes one race to show how wrong you are. Chad Reed, Daytona, 2008. As for a series, is any sane individual able to argue...
It only takes one race to show how wrong you are.
Chad Reed, Daytona, 2008.

As for a series, is any sane individual able to argue that James Stewart wasn't the fastest guy in the 2003 125 Nationals, even though he finished 3rd at the end of the season?
Pretty sure he's right, the stories don't really matter, the goal is to win the championship and in the future the records will show that James was 3rd in 2003. History won't remember why.
Just go into the vault for the 70's and 80's and all you're going to see is who won races and who the champions are, I can guarantee you that there are hundreds of stories of who was fastest or who should have won but didn't that are lost in history. All anybody remembers or cares about is who win races and who was the champion.
Thelen20
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3/16/2015 9:17am Edited Date/Time 3/16/2015 9:18am
But what if another guy actually had the fastest lap but it was triple to triple instead of finish line to finish line. Would Blake still be the fastest guy last night???














Lol
TDeath21
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3/16/2015 10:04am
TDeath21 wrote:
The fastest guy doesn't always win. The best guy does though. Starts are key.
SigPig wrote:
The fastest guy always wins. That is how he got to the checkers first.

Even my Wife understands this concept.
You don't understand.

Reed Daytona 08

Dungey Freestone 11

Barcia when the lapper took him out on the last lap

Herlings Lommel MXoN Race 3

Many things can happen that prevent the fastest guy from winning. Most of the time, it's getting a bad start. That's all part of racing. The fastest guy doesn't always win. In motor sports, anything can happen.
APLMAN99
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3/16/2015 10:07am
SigPig wrote:
is the one who gets to the checkers first.

I think some people are confused about how racing works.
APLMAN99 wrote:
It only takes one race to show how wrong you are. Chad Reed, Daytona, 2008. As for a series, is any sane individual able to argue...
It only takes one race to show how wrong you are.
Chad Reed, Daytona, 2008.

As for a series, is any sane individual able to argue that James Stewart wasn't the fastest guy in the 2003 125 Nationals, even though he finished 3rd at the end of the season?
DonM wrote:
Pretty sure he's right, the stories don't really matter, the goal is to win the championship and in the future the records will show that James...
Pretty sure he's right, the stories don't really matter, the goal is to win the championship and in the future the records will show that James was 3rd in 2003. History won't remember why.
Just go into the vault for the 70's and 80's and all you're going to see is who won races and who the champions are, I can guarantee you that there are hundreds of stories of who was fastest or who should have won but didn't that are lost in history. All anybody remembers or cares about is who win races and who was the champion.
Another falsehood.

People remember the losers of the battle of the Alamo as heroes. History remembers Magoo being Hannah's equal or better many times, despite not having the wins due to equipment failure.

Now if you're talking about the lazy, casual, uneducated fans you may have a point. But those folks probably aren't going to be looking at the record books anyway.
MXP
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3/16/2015 10:16am
Well it's obvious. We need at least 2 checkered flags.

A red/white checkered flag for every fastest lap, and the black/white checkered flag for the very end.

Whoever gets the most red/white checkered flags, gets a free dinner at Outback.
DonM
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3/16/2015 10:24am
It's all in the eyes of the beholder, as I remember it Magoo came after Hannah's broken leg and the true equal to Hannah at the time was Marty Tripes.
I was around at the time of Magoo in fact I was wrenching for a top rider and what I remember of Magoo was that his crashing was epic and frequent. Of course in those days everybody wasn't on a stop watch so we didn't know who set the fastest lap time, but my guess would be that Magoo was right there. The term most associated with Magoo at the time was wild and most of his DNF's were attributed to crashing and not mechanicals.
Fast laps mean nothing if you don't win...
MXP
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3/16/2015 10:33am
DonM wrote:
It's all in the eyes of the beholder, as I remember it Magoo came after Hannah's broken leg and the true equal to Hannah at the...
It's all in the eyes of the beholder, as I remember it Magoo came after Hannah's broken leg and the true equal to Hannah at the time was Marty Tripes.
I was around at the time of Magoo in fact I was wrenching for a top rider and what I remember of Magoo was that his crashing was epic and frequent. Of course in those days everybody wasn't on a stop watch so we didn't know who set the fastest lap time, but my guess would be that Magoo was right there. The term most associated with Magoo at the time was wild and most of his DNF's were attributed to crashing and not mechanicals.
Fast laps mean nothing if you don't win...
Hannah vs Tripes is true. Until the water skiing accident. Magoo was a little later, while Hannah was trying to regain his form. Which for a short time, he did. Until breaking his wrist(s). Magoo made his biggest mark in the Shultz, Bailey, O'mara era.
dirtjumpcycle
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3/16/2015 10:35am
Bros. In reality, no one is the fastest on the track, and everyone is the fastest on the track. It's all relative really. Physics 101 bros.
huck
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3/16/2015 10:37am
Unless they start handing out checks for fastest lap times, I think I'd settle for crossing the finish line first...and being the fastest rider to do so....
Zracer
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3/16/2015 10:38am
TDeath21 wrote:
The fastest guy doesn't always win. The best guy does though. Starts are key.
SigPig wrote:
The fastest guy always wins. That is how he got to the checkers first.

Even my Wife understands this concept.
TDeath21 wrote:
You don't understand. Reed Daytona 08 Dungey Freestone 11 Barcia when the lapper took him out on the last lap Herlings Lommel MXoN Race 3 Many...
You don't understand.

Reed Daytona 08

Dungey Freestone 11

Barcia when the lapper took him out on the last lap

Herlings Lommel MXoN Race 3

Many things can happen that prevent the fastest guy from winning. Most of the time, it's getting a bad start. That's all part of racing. The fastest guy doesn't always win. In motor sports, anything can happen.
Holy fuck this thread is at epic levels of stupid.Every example you gave they lost. IE somebody else got to the checkers before them.If 2 objects leave point A (the start line) at the same time and one reaches point B (the finish line) before the other , he will have traveled an equal distance in less time.IE a greater speed. The faster guy will always get to the finish line 1st in this universe. Reed wasnt faster, he never even finished. How the fuck do you not get that?
MXP
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3/16/2015 10:40am
Bros. In reality, no one is the fastest on the track, and everyone is the fastest on the track. It's all relative really. Physics 101 bros.
Whew! That's good news for Dustin Pipes.
MXP
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3/16/2015 10:42am Edited Date/Time 3/16/2015 10:43am
Bros. In reality, no one is the fastest on the track, and everyone is the fastest on the track. It's all relative really. Physics 101 bros.
MXP wrote:
Whew! That's good news for Dustin Pipes.
1
MXP
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3/16/2015 10:44am
SigPig wrote:
The fastest guy always wins. That is how he got to the checkers first.

Even my Wife understands this concept.
TDeath21 wrote:
You don't understand. Reed Daytona 08 Dungey Freestone 11 Barcia when the lapper took him out on the last lap Herlings Lommel MXoN Race 3 Many...
You don't understand.

Reed Daytona 08

Dungey Freestone 11

Barcia when the lapper took him out on the last lap

Herlings Lommel MXoN Race 3

Many things can happen that prevent the fastest guy from winning. Most of the time, it's getting a bad start. That's all part of racing. The fastest guy doesn't always win. In motor sports, anything can happen.
Zracer wrote:
Holy fuck this thread is at epic levels of stupid.Every example you gave they lost. IE somebody else got to the checkers before them.If 2 objects...
Holy fuck this thread is at epic levels of stupid.Every example you gave they lost. IE somebody else got to the checkers before them.If 2 objects leave point A (the start line) at the same time and one reaches point B (the finish line) before the other , he will have traveled an equal distance in less time.IE a greater speed. The faster guy will always get to the finish line 1st in this universe. Reed wasnt faster, he never even finished. How the fuck do you not get that?
You have to include the "UNTIL" factor. Grinning
huck
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3/16/2015 10:50am
For those of you still saying that the fastest rider is the one with the best lap time...

If I race a marathon and take off like a bat out of hell and run the first mile in 5:30....everybody else paces themselves for the whole 26 miles...so around mile 3 they all pass me and finish ahead of me, never running a 5:30 mile....does that mean that I can say I was the fastest runner there?

DonM
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3/16/2015 10:53am
Back in the day we didn't know who the fastest was.....only who won....but if we had electronic scoring like we do now we wouldn't have anywhere to debate it because there wasn't an internet....I guess we just sat around and had a few beers and bench raced the what ifs and shoulda coulda woulda's....
dirtjumpcycle
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3/16/2015 11:02am
Bros. In reality, no one is the fastest on the track, and everyone is the fastest on the track. It's all relative really. Physics 101 bros.
MXP wrote:
Whew! That's good news for Dustin Pipes.
Oh snap Woohoo Woohoo Woohoo
SigPig
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3/16/2015 11:07am
MXP wrote:

"Even my Wife understands this concept"

I'm guessing she won't be reading your remark? Grinning .
You are correct sir. Wink
TDeath21
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3/16/2015 1:37pm Edited Date/Time 3/16/2015 1:37pm
SigPig wrote:
The fastest guy always wins. That is how he got to the checkers first.

Even my Wife understands this concept.
TDeath21 wrote:
You don't understand. Reed Daytona 08 Dungey Freestone 11 Barcia when the lapper took him out on the last lap Herlings Lommel MXoN Race 3 Many...
You don't understand.

Reed Daytona 08

Dungey Freestone 11

Barcia when the lapper took him out on the last lap

Herlings Lommel MXoN Race 3

Many things can happen that prevent the fastest guy from winning. Most of the time, it's getting a bad start. That's all part of racing. The fastest guy doesn't always win. In motor sports, anything can happen.
Zracer wrote:
Holy fuck this thread is at epic levels of stupid.Every example you gave they lost. IE somebody else got to the checkers before them.If 2 objects...
Holy fuck this thread is at epic levels of stupid.Every example you gave they lost. IE somebody else got to the checkers before them.If 2 objects leave point A (the start line) at the same time and one reaches point B (the finish line) before the other , he will have traveled an equal distance in less time.IE a greater speed. The faster guy will always get to the finish line 1st in this universe. Reed wasnt faster, he never even finished. How the fuck do you not get that?
How the fuck do you not understand that there are other factors in racing besides speed that will determine your overall finishing position? Good god your reading comprehension has to be at a 3rd grade level. I'm done responding to this thread.
TailSoHard
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3/16/2015 2:33pm
Zracer wrote:
No it really doesnt depend. Baggett had the fastest lap but Dungey was the fastest rider. I know this cause he crossed the finish line, completing...
No it really doesnt depend. Baggett had the fastest lap but Dungey was the fastest rider. I know this cause he crossed the finish line, completing 20 laps ,before anyone else. Its a space, time thing. The only racing in the world where you can be the fastest and still lose is bracket racing.
"The only racing in the world where you can be the fastest and still lose is bracket racing."

There are a whole lot of Enduro racers out there that would disagree with you lol
Outsider
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3/16/2015 2:41pm
I pooped a baby's arm this morning
toroP
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3/16/2015 2:42pm
BB had the fastest lap time.
Could RD or MM clocked a better time if they needed to?
Fastest lap time does not equal fastest rider. Fastest lap time = fastest lap time.
toroP
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3/16/2015 2:51pm
TDeath21 wrote:
How the fuck do you not understand that there are other factors in racing besides speed that will determine your overall finishing position? Good god your...
How the fuck do you not understand that there are other factors in racing besides speed that will determine your overall finishing position? Good god your reading comprehension has to be at a 3rd grade level. I'm done responding to this thread.
Points are awarded for the fastest average lap time. This affects how fast a rider is willing to ride any given lap. So the fastest individual lap time does not necessarily reveal the fastest rider.
DonM
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3/16/2015 2:54pm
TDeath21 wrote:
How the fuck do you not understand that there are other factors in racing besides speed that will determine your overall finishing position? Good god your...
How the fuck do you not understand that there are other factors in racing besides speed that will determine your overall finishing position? Good god your reading comprehension has to be at a 3rd grade level. I'm done responding to this thread.
Ummmm....there is only one that counts....lap speed means nothing if you don't win...zero, nada, zilch
3/16/2015 2:55pm Edited Date/Time 3/16/2015 2:57pm
TDeath21 wrote:
You don't understand. Reed Daytona 08 Dungey Freestone 11 Barcia when the lapper took him out on the last lap Herlings Lommel MXoN Race 3 Many...
You don't understand.

Reed Daytona 08

Dungey Freestone 11

Barcia when the lapper took him out on the last lap

Herlings Lommel MXoN Race 3

Many things can happen that prevent the fastest guy from winning. Most of the time, it's getting a bad start. That's all part of racing. The fastest guy doesn't always win. In motor sports, anything can happen.
Zracer wrote:
Holy fuck this thread is at epic levels of stupid.Every example you gave they lost. IE somebody else got to the checkers before them.If 2 objects...
Holy fuck this thread is at epic levels of stupid.Every example you gave they lost. IE somebody else got to the checkers before them.If 2 objects leave point A (the start line) at the same time and one reaches point B (the finish line) before the other , he will have traveled an equal distance in less time.IE a greater speed. The faster guy will always get to the finish line 1st in this universe. Reed wasnt faster, he never even finished. How the fuck do you not get that?
TDeath21 wrote:
How the fuck do you not understand that there are other factors in racing besides speed that will determine your overall finishing position? Good god your...
How the fuck do you not understand that there are other factors in racing besides speed that will determine your overall finishing position? Good god your reading comprehension has to be at a 3rd grade level. I'm done responding to this thread.
As a JS fan I can't explain how many times I've said this to people. Looks like it doesn't take a fanboy to understand this concept, after all. Dipshits like zracer are too busy using every trick they can think of to discredit speed to realize how dumb their argument is.

At the very least, the person with the fastest average speed is the fastest rider (from lap 2 to the finish). But as you said, DNF's can ruin a rider's average speed, too. Mechanicals are completely unrelated to a rider's performance, which is what true speed is all about. Why would I want to factor the machine's integrity into a comparison of who the most badass rider on any given night was? I wouldn't.

This dude and the OP have to be trolling. I mean holy fuck.

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