Is 15 weeks to long for these guys to get a break?

GuyB
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GuyB 4/6/2014 7:39pm
4/6/2014 7:39pm
TripleFive wrote:
I think it's dumb to pretend to know what these guys need. I also think it's dumb that there isn't a riders union to address concerns...
I think it's dumb to pretend to know what these guys need.

I also think it's dumb that there isn't a riders union to address concerns like this.
So say there was a union. And say all the riders could make a really good living from it.

Then say ticket prices jumped by 25%. Or maybe even 100%. Would you still be down with it?

Would the TV package be better? Would we draw more fans than we so now?

Trust me, I'm not arguing that there shouldn't be something that helps out the riders. But I do think there would be consequences that you may not have considered.

Now with that out of the way, I've done all the races in the series long enough to know that the travel is no picnic, and I'm not racing or training like the riders, or having to work through injuries like they do. Of course, I also know that there's no shortage of people who'd happily sign up to do it.

I can say with certainty that airline travel gets less fun every year. The weekly battle for overhead bin space, more full flights, and airlines that try and squeeze every nickel they can from you. Early boarding options, bag fees, premium seat options, etc.

I'm looking forward to the weekend off after Seattle. But would more breaks during SX really help out? I'd question that. I don't think it would make any difference in recovery time for the big injuries these guys get. One thing it would do is trim the time between SX and the Nationals. I don't think many of the riders would be in favor of that.

If I remember correctly, there's also an agreement that limits the number of pro SX and MX events. That's something I'd guess all the teams agree on.
Mxdnusa
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Mxdnusa 4/6/2014 7:49pm
4/6/2014 7:49pm
I don't think it's too long. Hockey is a pretty physically demanding sport. 82 games,2-3 games a week in 9 months. Countless miles traveling. They have a union too. So does every other sport.
EastCoastMx
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EastCoastMx 4/6/2014 7:51pm
4/6/2014 7:51pm
Traveling that much must be really hard on these guys as well as the teams and all the supporting staff. They need breaks for family time. It takes a special person to commit to the nomad life style. I've had some offers to take a job that requires travel and passed on it.
TripleFive 4/6/2014 8:34pm
4/6/2014 8:34pm
GuyB wrote:
So say there was a union. And say all the riders could make a really good living from it. Then say ticket prices jumped by 25%...
So say there was a union. And say all the riders could make a really good living from it.

Then say ticket prices jumped by 25%. Or maybe even 100%. Would you still be down with it?

Would the TV package be better? Would we draw more fans than we so now?

Trust me, I'm not arguing that there shouldn't be something that helps out the riders. But I do think there would be consequences that you may not have considered.

Now with that out of the way, I've done all the races in the series long enough to know that the travel is no picnic, and I'm not racing or training like the riders, or having to work through injuries like they do. Of course, I also know that there's no shortage of people who'd happily sign up to do it.

I can say with certainty that airline travel gets less fun every year. The weekly battle for overhead bin space, more full flights, and airlines that try and squeeze every nickel they can from you. Early boarding options, bag fees, premium seat options, etc.

I'm looking forward to the weekend off after Seattle. But would more breaks during SX really help out? I'd question that. I don't think it would make any difference in recovery time for the big injuries these guys get. One thing it would do is trim the time between SX and the Nationals. I don't think many of the riders would be in favor of that.

If I remember correctly, there's also an agreement that limits the number of pro SX and MX events. That's something I'd guess all the teams agree on.
The problems that you mentioned would all eventually be corrected by the invisible hand.

The riders, in my opinion, should have the ability to price the fans out of the sport if that's what they believe their labor to be worth. After all, they are the talent and the ones gambling with their lives.

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GuyB
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GuyB 4/6/2014 8:46pm
4/6/2014 8:46pm
GuyB wrote:
So say there was a union. And say all the riders could make a really good living from it. Then say ticket prices jumped by 25%...
So say there was a union. And say all the riders could make a really good living from it.

Then say ticket prices jumped by 25%. Or maybe even 100%. Would you still be down with it?

Would the TV package be better? Would we draw more fans than we so now?

Trust me, I'm not arguing that there shouldn't be something that helps out the riders. But I do think there would be consequences that you may not have considered.

Now with that out of the way, I've done all the races in the series long enough to know that the travel is no picnic, and I'm not racing or training like the riders, or having to work through injuries like they do. Of course, I also know that there's no shortage of people who'd happily sign up to do it.

I can say with certainty that airline travel gets less fun every year. The weekly battle for overhead bin space, more full flights, and airlines that try and squeeze every nickel they can from you. Early boarding options, bag fees, premium seat options, etc.

I'm looking forward to the weekend off after Seattle. But would more breaks during SX really help out? I'd question that. I don't think it would make any difference in recovery time for the big injuries these guys get. One thing it would do is trim the time between SX and the Nationals. I don't think many of the riders would be in favor of that.

If I remember correctly, there's also an agreement that limits the number of pro SX and MX events. That's something I'd guess all the teams agree on.
TripleFive wrote:
The problems that you mentioned would all eventually be corrected by the invisible hand. The riders, in my opinion, should have the ability to price the...
The problems that you mentioned would all eventually be corrected by the invisible hand.

The riders, in my opinion, should have the ability to price the fans out of the sport if that's what they believe their labor to be worth. After all, they are the talent and the ones gambling with their lives.
Screw PED testing. I think we need to test for the presence of "Invisible Hand."
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GIwasB4 4/6/2014 8:51pm
4/6/2014 8:51pm
GuyB wrote:
So say there was a union. And say all the riders could make a really good living from it. Then say ticket prices jumped by 25%...
So say there was a union. And say all the riders could make a really good living from it.

Then say ticket prices jumped by 25%. Or maybe even 100%. Would you still be down with it?

Would the TV package be better? Would we draw more fans than we so now?

Trust me, I'm not arguing that there shouldn't be something that helps out the riders. But I do think there would be consequences that you may not have considered.

Now with that out of the way, I've done all the races in the series long enough to know that the travel is no picnic, and I'm not racing or training like the riders, or having to work through injuries like they do. Of course, I also know that there's no shortage of people who'd happily sign up to do it.

I can say with certainty that airline travel gets less fun every year. The weekly battle for overhead bin space, more full flights, and airlines that try and squeeze every nickel they can from you. Early boarding options, bag fees, premium seat options, etc.

I'm looking forward to the weekend off after Seattle. But would more breaks during SX really help out? I'd question that. I don't think it would make any difference in recovery time for the big injuries these guys get. One thing it would do is trim the time between SX and the Nationals. I don't think many of the riders would be in favor of that.

If I remember correctly, there's also an agreement that limits the number of pro SX and MX events. That's something I'd guess all the teams agree on.
TripleFive wrote:
The problems that you mentioned would all eventually be corrected by the invisible hand. The riders, in my opinion, should have the ability to price the...
The problems that you mentioned would all eventually be corrected by the invisible hand.

The riders, in my opinion, should have the ability to price the fans out of the sport if that's what they believe their labor to be worth. After all, they are the talent and the ones gambling with their lives.
Are you a union worker?
TripleFive 4/6/2014 9:00pm
4/6/2014 9:00pm
GIwasB4 wrote:
Are you a union worker?
No, just a committed libertarian.
GIwasB4
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GIwasB4 4/6/2014 9:02pm
4/6/2014 9:02pm
GIwasB4 wrote:
Are you a union worker?
TripleFive wrote:
No, just a committed libertarian.
You have no horse in this race then.
GIwasB4
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GIwasB4 4/6/2014 9:06pm
4/6/2014 9:06pm
TripleFive wrote:
False.
prove it?
TripleFive 4/6/2014 9:22pm
4/6/2014 9:22pm
TripleFive wrote:
False.
GIwasB4 wrote:
prove it?
The rider's are currently in a position of diminished bargaining power because they are not allowed to freely associate. Instead of moving towards a point where riders no longer choose to pursue a career in this sport because of how they are treated, I would prefer to see collective bargaining.
GIwasB4
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GIwasB4 4/6/2014 9:26pm
4/6/2014 9:26pm
TripleFive wrote:
False.
GIwasB4 wrote:
prove it?
TripleFive wrote:
The rider's are currently in a position of diminished bargaining power because they are not allowed to freely associate. Instead of moving towards a point where...
The rider's are currently in a position of diminished bargaining power because they are not allowed to freely associate. Instead of moving towards a point where riders no longer choose to pursue a career in this sport because of how they are treated, I would prefer to see collective bargaining.
My 2004 Mini SX Las Vegas rear fender.
GIwasB4
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GIwasB4 4/6/2014 9:29pm
4/6/2014 9:29pm
It's a side show.
The elephants and other captive animals work for peanuts.
You pay to see them entertain you.
lostboy819 4/6/2014 9:31pm
4/6/2014 9:31pm
TripleFive wrote:
The problems that you mentioned would all eventually be corrected by the invisible hand. The riders, in my opinion, should have the ability to price the...
The problems that you mentioned would all eventually be corrected by the invisible hand.

The riders, in my opinion, should have the ability to price the fans out of the sport if that's what they believe their labor to be worth. After all, they are the talent and the ones gambling with their lives.
Yes they are the talent but lets not go overboard with the "gambling with their lives" talk. Yes racing is dangerous but for the most part its not a life and death gamble.
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GuyB 4/6/2014 9:35pm
4/6/2014 9:35pm
This o e's dangling over the edge of Dumbgeon-worthy bring your best argument to bring it back from the edge.
lostboy819 4/6/2014 9:35pm
4/6/2014 9:35pm
TripleFive wrote:
False.
GIwasB4 wrote:
prove it?
TripleFive wrote:
The rider's are currently in a position of diminished bargaining power because they are not allowed to freely associate. Instead of moving towards a point where...
The rider's are currently in a position of diminished bargaining power because they are not allowed to freely associate. Instead of moving towards a point where riders no longer choose to pursue a career in this sport because of how they are treated, I would prefer to see collective bargaining.
I don't think the riders are mistreated but when they choose not to pursue a MX career its usually in direct proportion of how good they are and how far they can realistically go.
TripleFive 4/6/2014 9:38pm
4/6/2014 9:38pm
GuyB wrote:
This o e's dangling over the edge of Dumbgeon-worthy bring your best argument to bring it back from the edge.
GIwasB4
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GIwasB4 4/6/2014 9:41pm
4/6/2014 9:41pm
GuyB wrote:
This o e's dangling over the edge of Dumbgeon-worthy bring your best argument to bring it back from the edge.
I was not arguing it, although I will debate it.

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GIwasB4
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GIwasB4 4/6/2014 9:50pm
4/6/2014 9:50pm
GIwasB4 wrote:
It's a side show.
The elephants and other captive animals work for peanuts.
You pay to see them entertain you.
It's no different.
You get all chest pumped up and pay the same amount for tickets to see your bad ass truck smashes, or a WW wrestler, or an MMA fighter. Take your kids, drink a few $8 beers. Then bitch about what the show participants make? NO
Join a union, it gets better.
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OW38B 4/6/2014 10:23pm
4/6/2014 10:23pm
KMC440 wrote:
Five rounds in Cali with a 15 round season .... a Seattle and Phoenix round ... hmmmm doesn't look too good for the rest of the...
Five rounds in Cali with a 15 round season .... a Seattle and Phoenix round ... hmmmm doesn't look too good for the rest of the country ... Blink Sad
Don't forget about Las Vegas, closer than Phoenix to SoCal..

There is a good reason they are this way.
TripleDigit 4/7/2014 12:09am
4/7/2014 12:09am
I don't see the issue really,people sign up for way tougher deals in life for far less reward depending on what level a rider is possibly ,but the lower lights are chasing their dreams,and big bucks of the top guys,it's gonna be a harder slog for them if they're not getting so much in return ,an in-flight a week is nothing for riders,or the drive time from Anaheim to Pheonix then Anaheim etc,the team's face more upheaval logistic wise and workload,,it's a travelling Circus around the country.
If it was a real circus at the end of the day,these guys would be performing every night,and taking the while deal down themselves to move on at the end of the week
From experience It's probably tougher working for top motorcycle riders,the rewards are far less
c3011
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c3011 4/7/2014 6:30am
4/7/2014 6:30am
There are other sports that have just as dragged out or even more dragged out schedules than motocross and are just as physically demanding. The injuries are going to happen, my questions is why are all of the MX racers getting sick when athletes from other very physically demanding sports with many more players involved not having the sickness issues that the pro MX racers seem to always be dealing with. Are all of the trainers these guys hiring really as knowledgeable as they claim to be or just good at running people hard and not completely educated on the complete training process? Also, just using James as an example if the riders are as sick as they claim and in the condition that James appeared to be on TV should they be racing even on a given night to ensure the safety of that rider as well as the other riders?
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c3011 4/7/2014 6:41am
4/7/2014 6:41am
TripleFive wrote:
I think it's dumb to pretend to know what these guys need. I also think it's dumb that there isn't a riders union to address concerns...
I think it's dumb to pretend to know what these guys need.

I also think it's dumb that there isn't a riders union to address concerns like this.
GuyB wrote:
So say there was a union. And say all the riders could make a really good living from it. Then say ticket prices jumped by 25%...
So say there was a union. And say all the riders could make a really good living from it.

Then say ticket prices jumped by 25%. Or maybe even 100%. Would you still be down with it?

Would the TV package be better? Would we draw more fans than we so now?

Trust me, I'm not arguing that there shouldn't be something that helps out the riders. But I do think there would be consequences that you may not have considered.

Now with that out of the way, I've done all the races in the series long enough to know that the travel is no picnic, and I'm not racing or training like the riders, or having to work through injuries like they do. Of course, I also know that there's no shortage of people who'd happily sign up to do it.

I can say with certainty that airline travel gets less fun every year. The weekly battle for overhead bin space, more full flights, and airlines that try and squeeze every nickel they can from you. Early boarding options, bag fees, premium seat options, etc.

I'm looking forward to the weekend off after Seattle. But would more breaks during SX really help out? I'd question that. I don't think it would make any difference in recovery time for the big injuries these guys get. One thing it would do is trim the time between SX and the Nationals. I don't think many of the riders would be in favor of that.

If I remember correctly, there's also an agreement that limits the number of pro SX and MX events. That's something I'd guess all the teams agree on.
The majority of MX bike owners are a different breed if the prices jump drastically you very possibly will lose the series. We've all seen the guys that buy the $8000 bike, but buy a $75 helmet and complain about paying to ride a well run and groomed riding facility and let it go under. My view is there are (2) groups, MX bike owners and regular rider/racers and the owners usually screw everything up for the regular riders/racers when it comes to $. I think MX bike owners are going to complain less about the high price of beer than they will about the cost of tickets going up and possibly not attend a race.
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jonjon714 4/7/2014 6:56am
4/7/2014 6:56am
jonjon714 wrote:
Man...just think about the amount of travel the teams have the last three rounds. Seattle all the way to Jersey and then back to Vegas. Burnt-the...
Man...just think about the amount of travel the teams have the last three rounds. Seattle all the way to Jersey and then back to Vegas. Burnt-the freak-out man!
500guy wrote:
outside of the Truck drivers, I doubt the travel has much impact , 2 hrs more for the riders and most train in Florida so NJ...
outside of the Truck drivers, I doubt the travel has much impact , 2 hrs more for the riders and most train in Florida so NJ would be closer.
This isn't the old day's with the riders driving everywhere although I think they would benefit from driving to as many rounds as possible to avoid airports and their germ factories.
I was thinking more about the privateers....actually, is that term even relevant anymore - PRIVATEER? How about "smaller teams"? Yeah, that's it, I was thinking more about the smaller teams.
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disbanded 4/7/2014 7:05am
4/7/2014 7:05am
Are the actual racers asking for more time off?

I'm the one here that needs more time off!!!
DDub8
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DDub8 4/7/2014 9:22am
4/7/2014 9:22am
Fewer races won't happen... until the sport is no longer profitable for the promoters. Those who have the money make the rules.

Look at the NFL. The players have a union and appear to have bargaining power and what ends up happening to them? Extended schedule... more Thursday night games after 3 days rest... extended preseason... playing games outside of the US which means more travel... most of the high salaries paid to the very top tier of player... all adding up to more profits for the owners. NFL players are constantly getting hurt and sacrificing their bodies and future lives to play the sport and there's no shortage of replacements ready to do the same.

Story for SX isn't so different except replace owners with Feld and remove the rider's union and perceived bargaining power that would come with it. It's a show. I was at the Houston race this weekend and not a single person sitting around me could name more than 3 or 4 riders but they all enjoyed the jumps and crashes.
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Grizz 4/7/2014 11:23am
4/7/2014 11:23am
500guy wrote:
outside of the Truck drivers, I doubt the travel has much impact , 2 hrs more for the riders and most train in Florida so NJ...
outside of the Truck drivers, I doubt the travel has much impact , 2 hrs more for the riders and most train in Florida so NJ would be closer.
This isn't the old day's with the riders driving everywhere although I think they would benefit from driving to as many rounds as possible to avoid airports and their germ factories.
Grizz wrote:
Avoiding germs lowers your immune system and makes it easier to get much more ill.
Isn't that common sense?
TripleFive wrote:
Are you really trying to suggest that a break would [i]increase[/i] the riders likelihood of falling ill because they are not exposed to the same amount...
Are you really trying to suggest that a break would increase the riders likelihood of falling ill because they are not exposed to the same amount of germs?
No... my response actually had nothing to do with the main topic, so never mind.

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