AFFORDABLE CARE ACT

Brad460
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Fantasy
11/1/2013 7:28pm
Rates will level off in five years? What data did you base that on?

Rates will likely be sky-rocketing very soon for people who manage to sign up for Obamatax because not enough "payers" will be signed up. Only the "takers" are eager to sign up...well.... like you OF
TeamGreen
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11/1/2013 8:13pm
oldfart wrote: There's cost reduction taking place now.

BWAHAHAHAHAHA
philG
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11/2/2013 12:19am
so you cant buy something from another state???

What the hell kind of restrictive practice is that............just plain fucking dumb.

The Shop

vet323
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11/2/2013 7:19am
They passed those laws in the last two years? That is the definition of "Too little, too late" doncha think?
vet323
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11/2/2013 7:21am
philG wrote:
so you cant buy something from another state???

What the hell kind of restrictive practice is that............just plain fucking dumb.
Don.t tell that to oldfart-he will try to tell you that restricting interstate sales makes insurance cheaper.
Brad460
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Fantasy
11/2/2013 8:05am
Great theory...that exactly how I know rates will sky-rocket. Whenever the left says something the opposite is certain to be true.

The difference is that facts actually support the opposite of what the left is saying.

I will never forget the day before Healthcare.gov went live, you were so excited you started you're own thread about it. Funny thing is not even some crazy " righties" could have predicted how badly it would have gone.

Problem for the Democrats is that the livelihood of Obamatax relies on getting this website going. They absolutely cannot delay the mandate -as much as they would like to hit pause and fix the site that would spell disaster.
RocketLab
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11/2/2013 8:12am
Yes, good read. This is how we got stuck in the system we're in.

Early industrial sickness insurance purchased through employers was one influential economic origin of the current American health care system.[9] These late-19th-century and early-20th-century sickness insurance schemes were generally inexpensive for workers: their small scale and local administration kept overhead low, and because the people who purchased insurance were all employees of the same company, that prevented people who were already ill from buying in.[9] The presence of employer-based sickness funds may have contributed to why the idea of government-based insurance did not take hold in the United States at the same time that the United Kingdom and the rest of Europe was moving toward socialized schemes like the UK National Insurance Act of 1911.[9] Thus, at the beginning of the 20th century, Americans were used to associating insurance with employers, which paved the way for the beginning of third party health insurance in the 1930s.
11/2/2013 8:39am
I am all for finding a way to get to universal healthcare coverage, unfortunately Obama was extremely deceptive and is utterly incompetent at implementing a satsfactory system. The thing about Obama is he just flat out sucks at his job, well except for the politician stuff, that he is great at.
RocketLab
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11/2/2013 8:41am
I am all for finding a way to get to universal healthcare coverage, unfortunately Obama was extremely deceptive and is utterly incompetent at implementing a satsfactory...
I am all for finding a way to get to universal healthcare coverage, unfortunately Obama was extremely deceptive and is utterly incompetent at implementing a satsfactory system. The thing about Obama is he just flat out sucks at his job, well except for the politician stuff, that he is great at.
So you're for single payer?
vet323
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11/2/2013 8:52am
You don't understand the difference between wishing for failure and predicting failure.

Should I remind you that only 123 people signed up for Romneycare in the entire first month? Nah, that's like, facts and shit, there's no place for that in these threads!

Here's a fact-you guys claim that 7million will sign up for "private" insurance in the first year. If things don't improve dramatically, it will be more like 3million (if you are lucky). There will be far more people signing up for Medicare than private insurance (whoops, there goes that $100-$250billion you guys were going to "save" from Medicare to help pay for this debacle).




You started out two weeks ago claiming that the website was, what?-$95million? Now you are saying it's at $155million? What number will you be at a week from now?
11/2/2013 8:59am Edited Date/Time 11/2/2013 8:59am
I am all for finding a way to get to universal healthcare coverage, unfortunately Obama was extremely deceptive and is utterly incompetent at implementing a satsfactory...
I am all for finding a way to get to universal healthcare coverage, unfortunately Obama was extremely deceptive and is utterly incompetent at implementing a satsfactory system. The thing about Obama is he just flat out sucks at his job, well except for the politician stuff, that he is great at.
RocketLab wrote:
So you're for single payer?
I am for individual state systems. If some states want single payer then that's okay with me.
11/2/2013 9:41am
I can speak for myself thanks. There are wide variety of systems that can work effectively. I think the primary factor of success or failure of a healthcare system is the citizenry rather than the system itself. Socialized medicine works well in Scandinavian countries, works okay in others but won't work on the Federal level well in the US. The type of system isn't necessarily the problem it is those who run and use it that are.
11/2/2013 10:06am
No and yes. Right now our government does suck and that does have a lot to do with Americans in general, but in regards to socialized systems it has to do with America being a far more diverse nation than any of the Social Democracies. Unlike those countries we share little of the same values, culture and history yet the principles the US was founded emphasize individualism, liberty and personal responsibility. We just are not set up for that kind of system at least not at the Federal level although I think some states could do fine with it.
RocketLab
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11/2/2013 11:02am
I am all for finding a way to get to universal healthcare coverage, unfortunately Obama was extremely deceptive and is utterly incompetent at implementing a satsfactory...
I am all for finding a way to get to universal healthcare coverage, unfortunately Obama was extremely deceptive and is utterly incompetent at implementing a satsfactory system. The thing about Obama is he just flat out sucks at his job, well except for the politician stuff, that he is great at.
RocketLab wrote:
So you're for single payer?
I am for individual state systems. If some states want single payer then that's okay with me.
State by state doesn't work and leaves their uninsured at the mercy of totally political decisions by their Republican governors. The governor of my state, you may have heard of the intellectual Rick Perry, has nixed tens of billions in Medicare funds due to his political stance. Might offend the base for his presidential run. He has not offered up an alternative to cover the highest uninsured state population in the nation. Leaving people to die, get sick or whatever so that his quest to be president is not harmed.

RocketLab
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11/2/2013 11:33am
philG
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11/2/2013 11:46am
well anyone that cant see that is part of the problem , not part of the solution.

Thinking that either party is gonna make a difference is the main problem, its difficult to expect politicians to make a positive impact for Joe Public, when the entire reason they get there is because they are bankrolled by people who have a vested interest in them not making a difference........anyone who actually tells it like it is gets shut down by zero media coverage, and thats the end of it.

If you honestly think that Obama and Romney were the best two people you could find to be president , in a country of 300million, it kind of explains the jam you are in.

If Romney was in a middle eastern country, the US would have him labelled as a religious extremist.
Choppy
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11/2/2013 11:47am
Rocket lab,
Explain to me how Obama did not lie to people when he said, " If you like your health-care plan, you'll be able to keep your health-care plan, period. No one will take it away, no matter what"

Or when he said," Nothing in this plan will require you or your employer to change the coverage or the doctor you have"

Or when he said, "If you like your doctor, you're going to be able to keep your doctor. If you like your plan, keep your plan

Or when he said, "If you already have health care, you don't have to do anything"

...
So how did he not lie to millions of people or do you admit that he did lie to us for three years?
vet323
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11/2/2013 12:00pm Edited Date/Time 11/2/2013 12:01pm
philG wrote:
well anyone that cant see that is part of the problem , not part of the solution. Thinking that either party is gonna make a difference...
well anyone that cant see that is part of the problem , not part of the solution.

Thinking that either party is gonna make a difference is the main problem, its difficult to expect politicians to make a positive impact for Joe Public, when the entire reason they get there is because they are bankrolled by people who have a vested interest in them not making a difference........anyone who actually tells it like it is gets shut down by zero media coverage, and thats the end of it.

If you honestly think that Obama and Romney were the best two people you could find to be president , in a country of 300million, it kind of explains the jam you are in.

If Romney was in a middle eastern country, the US would have him labelled as a religious extremist.
"If Romney was in a middle eastern country, the US would have him labelled as a religious extremist. "


Yeah, 'cause of all those people the Mormons decapitated.
philG
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11/2/2013 12:22pm
well my advice is stop arguing amongst yourselves , and realise that 300 odd people have more wealth than 300 billion others..

You have a constitution, use it....
Titan1
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11/2/2013 12:40pm Edited Date/Time 11/2/2013 12:42pm
How is taxing the rich more, going to make the poor rich?

Taxes won't solve the income gap....neither will entitlement programs.

Wealth isn't a zero sum game.
11/2/2013 12:47pm
No, like I said in values. European Social Democracies are primarily made up of people who share the same values so they can have social systems that meet the needs of the vast majority. We don't have much for shared values here. We are a melting pot. Those countries are not.
11/2/2013 12:58pm
RocketLab wrote:
So you're for single payer?
I am for individual state systems. If some states want single payer then that's okay with me.
RocketLab wrote:
State by state doesn't work and leaves their uninsured at the mercy of totally political decisions by their Republican governors. The governor of my state, you...
State by state doesn't work and leaves their uninsured at the mercy of totally political decisions by their Republican governors. The governor of my state, you may have heard of the intellectual Rick Perry, has nixed tens of billions in Medicare funds due to his political stance. Might offend the base for his presidential run. He has not offered up an alternative to cover the highest uninsured state population in the nation. Leaving people to die, get sick or whatever so that his quest to be president is not harmed.

Is that what the majority of Texans want though? Don't you think Perry is representing the values / priorities of his constituents? Though I am fairly conservative I live in a state that is extremely liberal and I don't mind it because though I have many disagreements with policy I share many of the same values as the liberals here. If we wen't to a single payer system I think it would work because most people in Washington share similar values and priorities.
11/2/2013 1:29pm
I think most people wan't Affordable healthcare and i think many if not most wan't everybody to have healthcare. The thing people who provide their own healthcare are concerned about (and rightly so) is that their costs are going to increase substantially while conversely their coverage and quality of care is going to decrease in order to provide healthcare to those who can not or will not provide it for themselves. The primary problem with Obamacare is it's namesake.
RocketLab
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11/2/2013 2:44pm
Choppy wrote:
Rocket lab, Explain to me how Obama did not lie to people when he said, " If you like your health-care plan, you'll be able to...
Rocket lab,
Explain to me how Obama did not lie to people when he said, " If you like your health-care plan, you'll be able to keep your health-care plan, period. No one will take it away, no matter what"

Or when he said," Nothing in this plan will require you or your employer to change the coverage or the doctor you have"

Or when he said, "If you like your doctor, you're going to be able to keep your doctor. If you like your plan, keep your plan

Or when he said, "If you already have health care, you don't have to do anything"

...
So how did he not lie to millions of people or do you admit that he did lie to us for three years?
The accusation that he lied can be culled down to semantics. Maybe lied, maybe misled, it's not important. What is important is that those whose policies are cancelled had insurance that isn't worth a damn. And those that were on the news complaining about it when pressed admitted that their policy wasn't good.

And most of those that are getting those kinds of policies change every 2 years on average either upon discovering it ain't worth a damn or the insurance company cancels the plan because they aren't making enough on it.

So all this hair pulling and jumping about because Obama "lied is just a smokescreen for the bigger truth that policies have to meet a certain threshold or they aren't allowed to be pushed otto the public.
RocketLab
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11/2/2013 2:51pm
I am for individual state systems. If some states want single payer then that's okay with me.
RocketLab wrote:
State by state doesn't work and leaves their uninsured at the mercy of totally political decisions by their Republican governors. The governor of my state, you...
State by state doesn't work and leaves their uninsured at the mercy of totally political decisions by their Republican governors. The governor of my state, you may have heard of the intellectual Rick Perry, has nixed tens of billions in Medicare funds due to his political stance. Might offend the base for his presidential run. He has not offered up an alternative to cover the highest uninsured state population in the nation. Leaving people to die, get sick or whatever so that his quest to be president is not harmed.

Is that what the majority of Texans want though? Don't you think Perry is representing the values / priorities of his constituents? Though I am fairly...
Is that what the majority of Texans want though? Don't you think Perry is representing the values / priorities of his constituents? Though I am fairly conservative I live in a state that is extremely liberal and I don't mind it because though I have many disagreements with policy I share many of the same values as the liberals here. If we wen't to a single payer system I think it would work because most people in Washington share similar values and priorities.
Representation is a farce. Through gerrymandering, voter suppression, lying, Citizens United and voter ignorance true representation no longer exists. The fact that 25 percent of all Texans are not insured speaks more to the truth than assuming that the majority of Texans do not want health care coverage.

Look at all the Republican governors who were adamantly opposed to ACA then switched midstream to get in. Rick Scott of Florida famously changed his mind yet the state Republicans won't let him implement it. I would say they are more representative and responsible for their citizens that Governor Hair who wants to look good for the Republican primaries.
RocketLab
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11/2/2013 2:58pm
11/2/2013 3:18pm
RocketLab wrote:
Representation is a farce. Through gerrymandering, voter suppression, lying, Citizens United and voter ignorance true representation no longer exists. The fact that 25 percent of all...
Representation is a farce. Through gerrymandering, voter suppression, lying, Citizens United and voter ignorance true representation no longer exists. The fact that 25 percent of all Texans are not insured speaks more to the truth than assuming that the majority of Texans do not want health care coverage.

Look at all the Republican governors who were adamantly opposed to ACA then switched midstream to get in. Rick Scott of Florida famously changed his mind yet the state Republicans won't let him implement it. I would say they are more representative and responsible for their citizens that Governor Hair who wants to look good for the Republican primaries.
So, are you saying more people in Texas are for Obamacare than are against it and Rick Perry is being obstructive? i don't really care about political posturing (that is what these clowns do) I care about a workable healthcare plan that benefits the nation as a whole which is administrated by honest, competent people. The ACA seems to be non of those things.
RocketLab
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11/3/2013 11:38am
So, are you saying more people in Texas are for Obamacare than are against it and Rick Perry is being obstructive? i don't really care about...
So, are you saying more people in Texas are for Obamacare than are against it and Rick Perry is being obstructive? i don't really care about political posturing (that is what these clowns do) I care about a workable healthcare plan that benefits the nation as a whole which is administrated by honest, competent people. The ACA seems to be non of those things.
" I care about a workable healthcare plan that benefits the nation as a whole which is administrated by honest, competent people. The ACA seems to be non of those things."

So based on your wants it sounds like Medicare for all fits your bill.

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