Another Riding Tip by Gary Semics

GarySemics
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Edited Date/Time 1/19/2013 2:42pm
Hey guys, anyone up for some riding tips?

Differences between 2 strokes and 4 strokes

Ever since sometime in the early 80s two strokes have put to good use the development of a power valve in the exhaust port. This power valve has smoothed out the hit of the two stroke’s power band a great deal. But in order to get a lot of horsepower out of that two stoke engine they still have a certain amount of hit to the power band. This is the biggest difference between the two and four stroke. The four stroke is just smooth tractor like power right off idle all the way upstairs. This is why the four strokes depend less on the clutch and more on throttle control. You don’t have to help it into the power with the clutch nearly as much as with the two strokes.

The other difference is with engine braking. When you’re going down a straight away and you shut off the throttle on a two stroke the back pressure from the engine will slow you down a little, but on the four stroke this engine braking is much stronger. This will make the Exit Dex of a corner (where you go from braking to accelerating) easier. You don’t have to be quite as precise with the brakes. This engine braking effect will affect you on jumps too because if you roll the throttle off on the take off of a jump it will throw the front end down much more on a four stroke. This won’t be as noticeable if you’re in a higher gear.

Since you don’t have to be as precise with the clutch and throttle and the brakes on a 4 stroke they are easier to ride.

At this point in time that’s the main differences between the 2 and 4 strokers. The actually riding techniques are the same. The way I see it it’s all good.

All the details for the clutch, throttle and shifting techniques are shown in this DVD; https://gsmxs.com/shop/motocross-clutch-throttle-shifting-techniques/


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PRM31
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1/13/2013 6:02pm
Aside from starting on an XR-75 in the mid-70s, I rode 2-strokes exclusively. I rode a friends CRF-250 at Budds Creek and rolled off the throttle over small jump at the base of a downhill and nearly went over the bars. That was my lesson in the difference you described and from that point on I made sure to keep the throttle changes minimal over the jumps. Have to say I have come to appreciate the CRF and its electic feeling motor.
wildbill
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1/13/2013 7:16pm
Good stuff Gary.

Got any good bobbym stories?
GarySemics
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1/14/2013 8:04am
wildbill wrote:
Good stuff Gary.

Got any good bobbym stories?
Not following you here? Who is bobbym??? Unsure
1/14/2013 8:49am
I took one of Gary's two day classes in Ohio 10-12 years ago when I was struggling in the C class. Prior to the class I had invested in all the hop up parts and suspension work I could afford and none of it made one shit bit of difference. Oh when I did case a jump it was smoother and my bike sounded bad ass but the trophies were few to nonexistent. I cannot stress how improved my whole skill set became after those two days. I have a barn full of trophies and one season championship under my belt (now retired from racing) and I really have to thank Gary for running a great program. BTW all that information helped me not only in MX but HS, GNCC, Ice Racing and Flat track.

If I were to do it again I would have gone to several of Gary's classes when i was younger and only invested in better safety equipment.

BTW I'm not trying to spam Gary's Schools but just giving you in my opinion the best advice I could to anyone who lines up on a gate.

The Shop

Camp332
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1/14/2013 9:21am
wildbill wrote:
Good stuff Gary.

Got any good bobbym stories?
GarySemics wrote:
Not following you here? Who is bobbym??? Unsure
Just a "never was" who gets faster n faster the longer he stopped racing hahahaaa
GarySemics
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1/14/2013 1:08pm
wildbill wrote:
Good stuff Gary.

Got any good bobbym stories?
GarySemics wrote:
Not following you here? Who is bobbym??? Unsure
Camp332 wrote:
Just a "never was" who gets faster n faster the longer he stopped racing hahahaaa
Oh I see, like the older I get the faster I was. Smile
level
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1/14/2013 3:12pm
When I bought my 06 CRF250 the engine braking was my favorite thing about it. I love being able to let off the throttle going into a corner and it slowed me down. Really didn't have to use the brakes. It made riding more fun and easier and helped on arm pump. Engine braking has been cut down significantly since 06 though.
GarySemics
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1/14/2013 3:39pm
level wrote:
When I bought my 06 CRF250 the engine braking was my favorite thing about it. I love being able to let off the throttle going into...
When I bought my 06 CRF250 the engine braking was my favorite thing about it. I love being able to let off the throttle going into a corner and it slowed me down. Really didn't have to use the brakes. It made riding more fun and easier and helped on arm pump. Engine braking has been cut down significantly since 06 though.
Yea, and to go fast you can't just rely on engine braking, you have to have good braking control too.
WeiserGuy
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1/14/2013 4:08pm Edited Date/Time 1/14/2013 4:14pm
My oh my what great memories I have hammering out countless hours of Semics drills. My dad was a tight ass & never sent me to one of your school's, even thou we aren't even 2 hours from there. I myself was a beginner motocrosser that had only 3 harescramble races under my belt and laps put down on a couple backyard mx tracks.. So needless to say I wasn't blitzing the whoops, railing berms or throwing fat whips. I was nothing more than a back marker in the 85cc 7-11 class of the local racing scene. I bullshit you not within that same season I ended up beating kids that were waxing my ass at the start of it . Without a doubt the reason I made such quick improvements was by watching Semics VHS tapes (yes vhs) and religiously performing those drills for hours.. Turn tracks were what helped me the most, they're the ticket.. I'd recommend any of your dvd's or tapes.
Grizz
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1/14/2013 5:15pm
Gary, what is the guys name that owns that track in Florida that you were at two Saturdays ago (Sky Top MX?)? I was the kid on the Kawi number 400. I don't remember that guys name, my friend knew him so we got to come out and ride haha.
GarySemics
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1/14/2013 6:04pm
Grizz wrote:
Gary, what is the guys name that owns that track in Florida that you were at two Saturdays ago (Sky Top MX?)? I was the kid...
Gary, what is the guys name that owns that track in Florida that you were at two Saturdays ago (Sky Top MX?)? I was the kid on the Kawi number 400. I don't remember that guys name, my friend knew him so we got to come out and ride haha.
The owner's name is Spencer Hess.
wildbill
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1/14/2013 6:33pm
GarySemics wrote:
Not following you here? Who is bobbym??? Unsure
Camp332 wrote:
Just a "never was" who gets faster n faster the longer he stopped racing hahahaaa
GarySemics wrote:
Oh I see, like the older I get the faster I was. Smile
norcal pro from back in the day. Infamous with his vocabulary on the mx boards. Bauer keeps the North v South battle going in this thread.

http://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Moto-Related,20/BobbyM,1233022?exclusive_forum_user=true&page=3

1/14/2013 8:14pm
GarySemics wrote:
Hey guys, anyone up for some riding tips? [b]Differences between 2 strokes and 4 strokes[/b] Ever since sometime in the early 80s two strokes have put...
Hey guys, anyone up for some riding tips?

Differences between 2 strokes and 4 strokes

Ever since sometime in the early 80s two strokes have put to good use the development of a power valve in the exhaust port. This power valve has smoothed out the hit of the two stroke’s power band a great deal. But in order to get a lot of horsepower out of that two stoke engine they still have a certain amount of hit to the power band. This is the biggest difference between the two and four stroke. The four stroke is just smooth tractor like power right off idle all the way upstairs. This is why the four strokes depend less on the clutch and more on throttle control. You don’t have to help it into the power with the clutch nearly as much as with the two strokes.

The other difference is with engine braking. When you’re going down a straight away and you shut off the throttle on a two stroke the back pressure from the engine will slow you down a little, but on the four stroke this engine braking is much stronger. This will make the Exit Dex of a corner (where you go from braking to accelerating) easier. You don’t have to be quite as precise with the brakes. This engine braking effect will affect you on jumps too because if you roll the throttle off on the take off of a jump it will throw the front end down much more on a four stroke. This won’t be as noticeable if you’re in a higher gear.

Since you don’t have to be as precise with the clutch and throttle and the brakes on a 4 stroke they are easier to ride.

At this point in time that’s the main differences between the 2 and 4 strokers. The actually riding techniques are the same. The way I see it it’s all good.

All the details for the clutch, throttle and shifting techniques are shown in this DVD; https://gsmxs.com/shop/motocross-clutch-throttle-shifting-techniques/


Gary, i remember you doing a private lesson in 1988 with dave castillo and mark peters in the hills of laguna beach, up and over the hill from the old ATK factory. we were bummed that our secrete riding spot was found by you and big mouth peters. soon after that time the helicopter patrolled it regularly.
1/14/2013 11:34pm
So there I was riding some International events in Belgium way back in 1982. We ran into Gary Semics a few times at some practice tracks around Genk as he was riding the 500 GPs. As the story goes, Gary finished in front of a Factory Honda rider and they didn't like it too much and told Gary he should pull over for their guy. I'm pretty sure he said no way. The next week Gary was on a Factory Honda and he was again in front of their guy........What do you think happened? Any truth to this Gary?
GarySemics
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1/15/2013 5:11am
So there I was riding some International events in Belgium way back in 1982. We ran into Gary Semics a few times at some practice tracks...
So there I was riding some International events in Belgium way back in 1982. We ran into Gary Semics a few times at some practice tracks around Genk as he was riding the 500 GPs. As the story goes, Gary finished in front of a Factory Honda rider and they didn't like it too much and told Gary he should pull over for their guy. I'm pretty sure he said no way. The next week Gary was on a Factory Honda and he was again in front of their guy........What do you think happened? Any truth to this Gary?
Yes, there's a lot of truth to it. The shit really hit the fan at the fourth round in Sittendorf Austria. I was running in front of their 2 Honda riders Graham Noyce and Andrea Malerb for most of the 40 minute moto. I didn't know it but the head of Japan's racing department was on the track with a pit board telling me to let them by. I saw him but never read the board, wouldn't have let them by anyway.

After the race he sent his assistant over to find out why I didn't give in. I explained why should I as I'm a privateer with bikes and parts from the German Importer. I found out later he was going to force the importer to pull my support. He didn't know DeCoster was already working a plan to get me on a factory bike. Roger made it happen a few rounds later putting me on the 1981 factory bike with tons of new parts. But there was an arrangement that if a factory rider was trying to pass I would have to let them by. But I didn't have to slow up and let them catch me. I agreed and it all worked out pretty well. I ended up 7th in the series that year (1982).
GarySemics
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1/15/2013 5:15am Edited Date/Time 1/15/2013 7:10am
GarySemics wrote:
Hey guys, anyone up for some riding tips? [b]Differences between 2 strokes and 4 strokes[/b] Ever since sometime in the early 80s two strokes have put...
Hey guys, anyone up for some riding tips?

Differences between 2 strokes and 4 strokes

Ever since sometime in the early 80s two strokes have put to good use the development of a power valve in the exhaust port. This power valve has smoothed out the hit of the two stroke’s power band a great deal. But in order to get a lot of horsepower out of that two stoke engine they still have a certain amount of hit to the power band. This is the biggest difference between the two and four stroke. The four stroke is just smooth tractor like power right off idle all the way upstairs. This is why the four strokes depend less on the clutch and more on throttle control. You don’t have to help it into the power with the clutch nearly as much as with the two strokes.

The other difference is with engine braking. When you’re going down a straight away and you shut off the throttle on a two stroke the back pressure from the engine will slow you down a little, but on the four stroke this engine braking is much stronger. This will make the Exit Dex of a corner (where you go from braking to accelerating) easier. You don’t have to be quite as precise with the brakes. This engine braking effect will affect you on jumps too because if you roll the throttle off on the take off of a jump it will throw the front end down much more on a four stroke. This won’t be as noticeable if you’re in a higher gear.

Since you don’t have to be as precise with the clutch and throttle and the brakes on a 4 stroke they are easier to ride.

At this point in time that’s the main differences between the 2 and 4 strokers. The actually riding techniques are the same. The way I see it it’s all good.

All the details for the clutch, throttle and shifting techniques are shown in this DVD; https://gsmxs.com/shop/motocross-clutch-throttle-shifting-techniques/


Gary, i remember you doing a private lesson in 1988 with dave castillo and mark peters in the hills of laguna beach, up and over the...
Gary, i remember you doing a private lesson in 1988 with dave castillo and mark peters in the hills of laguna beach, up and over the hill from the old ATK factory. we were bummed that our secrete riding spot was found by you and big mouth peters. soon after that time the helicopter patrolled it regularly.
Weinert, Mosier, Eierstead and I started riding and making tracks in those hills years before that. Weinert and I could ride from our house to the tracks easily. We started to be exited by guys in trucks with dogs and rifles. Helicopters were the easy way out.
WeiserGuy
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1/15/2013 12:22pm
Mr. Semics are you currently working with any top sx/mx riders? Also I always wondered if you have worked with any GNCC riders, considering many top pros have rode outta the Lisbon/Salem area over the years?
GarySemics
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1/15/2013 2:21pm
WeiserGuy wrote:
Mr. Semics are you currently working with any top sx/mx riders? Also I always wondered if you have worked with any GNCC riders, considering many top...
Mr. Semics are you currently working with any top sx/mx riders? Also I always wondered if you have worked with any GNCC riders, considering many top pros have rode outta the Lisbon/Salem area over the years?
I've been helping Zach Bell with the mental side of things for about a month now. I haven't done much with any top GNCC riders lately. I did help Chuck Woodford, Fred Andrews and Mike Lafferty in the early 90s.
Grizz
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1/16/2013 8:28am
Grizz wrote:
Gary, what is the guys name that owns that track in Florida that you were at two Saturdays ago (Sky Top MX?)? I was the kid...
Gary, what is the guys name that owns that track in Florida that you were at two Saturdays ago (Sky Top MX?)? I was the kid on the Kawi number 400. I don't remember that guys name, my friend knew him so we got to come out and ride haha.
GarySemics wrote:
The owner's name is Spencer Hess.
Thank you! I was thinking Jason, lol
ford832
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1/16/2013 3:23pm
Good info but aren't you supposed to learn to one thing before moving on to the next?
I'll let you know when I've mastered the whip.I'm only 47 so it shouldn't take too long......Silly
peelout
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1/16/2013 3:29pm
@ Gary

your schools helped me get somewhere with moto i never thought i was able. i did every school that came to Utah, and eventually became friends with Larry Morton and even did some demo work for his riding school when he branched away from the Semics Schools. just wanted to poke my head in your thread and tell you personally, thank you for putting together such a great school and great videos. i wore out my VHS cassettes. - Garet
GarySemics
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1/16/2013 5:07pm
Grizz wrote:
Gary, what is the guys name that owns that track in Florida that you were at two Saturdays ago (Sky Top MX?)? I was the kid...
Gary, what is the guys name that owns that track in Florida that you were at two Saturdays ago (Sky Top MX?)? I was the kid on the Kawi number 400. I don't remember that guys name, my friend knew him so we got to come out and ride haha.
GarySemics wrote:
The owner's name is Spencer Hess.
Grizz wrote:
Thank you! I was thinking Jason, lol
Jason is Spencer's son.
GarySemics
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1/16/2013 5:09pm
peelout wrote:
@ Gary your schools helped me get somewhere with moto i never thought i was able. i did every school that came to Utah, and eventually...
@ Gary

your schools helped me get somewhere with moto i never thought i was able. i did every school that came to Utah, and eventually became friends with Larry Morton and even did some demo work for his riding school when he branched away from the Semics Schools. just wanted to poke my head in your thread and tell you personally, thank you for putting together such a great school and great videos. i wore out my VHS cassettes. - Garet
Thanks Garet, that's good to hear.
RonSkj
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1/19/2013 6:43am
GarySemics wrote:
Yes, there's a lot of truth to it. The shit really hit the fan at the fourth round in Sittendorf Austria. I was running in front...
Yes, there's a lot of truth to it. The shit really hit the fan at the fourth round in Sittendorf Austria. I was running in front of their 2 Honda riders Graham Noyce and Andrea Malerb for most of the 40 minute moto. I didn't know it but the head of Japan's racing department was on the track with a pit board telling me to let them by. I saw him but never read the board, wouldn't have let them by anyway.

After the race he sent his assistant over to find out why I didn't give in. I explained why should I as I'm a privateer with bikes and parts from the German Importer. I found out later he was going to force the importer to pull my support. He didn't know DeCoster was already working a plan to get me on a factory bike. Roger made it happen a few rounds later putting me on the 1981 factory bike with tons of new parts. But there was an arrangement that if a factory rider was trying to pass I would have to let them by. But I didn't have to slow up and let them catch me. I agreed and it all worked out pretty well. I ended up 7th in the series that year (1982).
1981 and you had to make an agreement to let the factory guys by. Fast forward to 2012, Are these type of agreements still going on ?

Maybe that is why MA800 can't get help from Suzuki..
GarySemics
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Lisbon, OH, USA
1/19/2013 2:42pm
GarySemics wrote:
Yes, there's a lot of truth to it. The shit really hit the fan at the fourth round in Sittendorf Austria. I was running in front...
Yes, there's a lot of truth to it. The shit really hit the fan at the fourth round in Sittendorf Austria. I was running in front of their 2 Honda riders Graham Noyce and Andrea Malerb for most of the 40 minute moto. I didn't know it but the head of Japan's racing department was on the track with a pit board telling me to let them by. I saw him but never read the board, wouldn't have let them by anyway.

After the race he sent his assistant over to find out why I didn't give in. I explained why should I as I'm a privateer with bikes and parts from the German Importer. I found out later he was going to force the importer to pull my support. He didn't know DeCoster was already working a plan to get me on a factory bike. Roger made it happen a few rounds later putting me on the 1981 factory bike with tons of new parts. But there was an arrangement that if a factory rider was trying to pass I would have to let them by. But I didn't have to slow up and let them catch me. I agreed and it all worked out pretty well. I ended up 7th in the series that year (1982).
RonSkj wrote:
1981 and you had to make an agreement to let the factory guys by. Fast forward to 2012, Are these type of agreements still going on...
1981 and you had to make an agreement to let the factory guys by. Fast forward to 2012, Are these type of agreements still going on ?

Maybe that is why MA800 can't get help from Suzuki..
No that sort of thing very rarely ever goes on. Honda of Japan was getting nervous because their high dollar GP riders weren't getting the results they expected. So they sent one of the main bosses from Japan. His job was to do whatever he had to in order to get results. It was a very rare deal I got caught in the middle of.

Here's a photo of me on the works bike with Andrea Vormans in tow.

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