The Ukraine is in a tight spot

Sandvik74
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3/8/2022 8:41am Edited Date/Time 3/8/2022 8:42am
Muttly wrote:
Not being an ass, but I’ve got to say something. How could the Russians know who’s an Enemy Combatant and who’s a non-threat Civilian? Are all...
Not being an ass, but I’ve got to say something. How could the Russians know who’s an Enemy Combatant and who’s a non-threat Civilian?

Are all the Freedom Fighting volunteers uniformed up?

War is a shitty deal.
Yes they have uniforms. And all Ukraine soldiers have yellow tape or some sort of fabric tied around their arms and legs. And Russians have red tape or fabric
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WCRider
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3/8/2022 8:50am
The western part of the Roman Empire then collapsed, with the eastern part continuing on quite a bit longer. In the same sense “The West” is likely to struggle for a while, but it might be fast to collaps. The only thing that’s clear about the changing world order is that Americans can shape their role in it and that they’are likely to mess it up. The United States Will Be Shocked by Its Future. Same for Europe. I'll take a bet on it.
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Muttly
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3/8/2022 8:50am
Muttly wrote:
Not being an ass, but I’ve got to say something. How could the Russians know who’s an Enemy Combatant and who’s a non-threat Civilian? Are all...
Not being an ass, but I’ve got to say something. How could the Russians know who’s an Enemy Combatant and who’s a non-threat Civilian?

Are all the Freedom Fighting volunteers uniformed up?

War is a shitty deal.
Sandvik74 wrote:
Yes they have uniforms. And all Ukraine soldiers have yellow tape or some sort of fabric tied around their arms and legs. And Russians have red...
Yes they have uniforms. And all Ukraine soldiers have yellow tape or some sort of fabric tied around their arms and legs. And Russians have red tape or fabric
Gotcha.
tuggy450
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3/8/2022 8:56am
If you haven't watched, watch it. I don't think it tells the whole story, but at least it is insight into the issues. Or you can go with the guy wants my backyard and doesn't want me to call the cops theory.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=If61baWF4GE
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The Shop

no_teeth
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3/8/2022 9:07am
Sandvik74 wrote:
I said ALMOST zero, there is never 0% chance of not war in this world. And yes im aware there are pros and cons of both...
I said ALMOST zero, there is never 0% chance of not war in this world. And yes im aware there are pros and cons of both sides of it. And just because you are a Nato member i don’t think it means you get all the bells and whistles automatically. There are several types of Nato contracts. Correct me if im wrong.

And im pretty sure we would get military equipment help from the EU just like Ukraine does, and they are neihter EU or Nato member.

Im not trying to be an asshole, id just rather enjoy my life than risking being cannon meat because of a Nato membership.
I`m telling you, you have all the percents all wrong in your posts.

You really think that by being "nice and silent" neutral country, will help if Russia wants or needs to take Finland? They are basically killing their own people now in Ukraine. They won`t a give rats ass what we have done here previously or how good and nice we`ve been. I cant believe how people in Finland still think so.
We have sold our independecy to EU that makes the laws an directives that we obey, but EU don`t have any defence forces of any kind. I`d rather be in NATO than in EU if I had to choose one. We already have an ally, so we are not neutral and this ally doesn`t give us any protection.

You really think that Estonia should be more worried than Finland?

It`s simple. You have real allies fighting with you (NATO) or you fight alone. At the moment NATO is the only thing that might prevent Russia attacking IF it wants to attack Finland.

In any case it`s not your decision you have to go to fight for your country. The decision is made in Kreml.
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Sandvik74
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3/8/2022 9:34am Edited Date/Time 3/8/2022 9:38am
Sandvik74 wrote:
I said ALMOST zero, there is never 0% chance of not war in this world. And yes im aware there are pros and cons of both...
I said ALMOST zero, there is never 0% chance of not war in this world. And yes im aware there are pros and cons of both sides of it. And just because you are a Nato member i don’t think it means you get all the bells and whistles automatically. There are several types of Nato contracts. Correct me if im wrong.

And im pretty sure we would get military equipment help from the EU just like Ukraine does, and they are neihter EU or Nato member.

Im not trying to be an asshole, id just rather enjoy my life than risking being cannon meat because of a Nato membership.
no_teeth wrote:
I`m telling you, you have all the percents all wrong in your posts. You really think that by being "nice and silent" neutral country, will help...
I`m telling you, you have all the percents all wrong in your posts.

You really think that by being "nice and silent" neutral country, will help if Russia wants or needs to take Finland? They are basically killing their own people now in Ukraine. They won`t a give rats ass what we have done here previously or how good and nice we`ve been. I cant believe how people in Finland still think so.
We have sold our independecy to EU that makes the laws an directives that we obey, but EU don`t have any defence forces of any kind. I`d rather be in NATO than in EU if I had to choose one. We already have an ally, so we are not neutral and this ally doesn`t give us any protection.

You really think that Estonia should be more worried than Finland?

It`s simple. You have real allies fighting with you (NATO) or you fight alone. At the moment NATO is the only thing that might prevent Russia attacking IF it wants to attack Finland.

In any case it`s not your decision you have to go to fight for your country. The decision is made in Kreml.
What contract says that Russia will attack us because we are not a Nato member? We will see about my numbers when we have joined Nato.

Even if we would be attacked as Nato members i don’t belive no one would do shit, they would say they don’t want to get involved in a war against Russia because it would escalate to nuclear war. They would say best they can do is a couple of rounds of ammo.

We have fought against them twice without help, we could handle them again a third time with only some
Ammo help. They are still just as shitty fighting as they were in the world wars. And no one want’s to fight another countries war anyway.

That’s how i see it, we would get the ammo help we need anyways without beeing a member of Nato.
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no_teeth
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3/8/2022 10:00am
Sandvik74 wrote:
I said ALMOST zero, there is never 0% chance of not war in this world. And yes im aware there are pros and cons of both...
I said ALMOST zero, there is never 0% chance of not war in this world. And yes im aware there are pros and cons of both sides of it. And just because you are a Nato member i don’t think it means you get all the bells and whistles automatically. There are several types of Nato contracts. Correct me if im wrong.

And im pretty sure we would get military equipment help from the EU just like Ukraine does, and they are neihter EU or Nato member.

Im not trying to be an asshole, id just rather enjoy my life than risking being cannon meat because of a Nato membership.
no_teeth wrote:
I`m telling you, you have all the percents all wrong in your posts. You really think that by being "nice and silent" neutral country, will help...
I`m telling you, you have all the percents all wrong in your posts.

You really think that by being "nice and silent" neutral country, will help if Russia wants or needs to take Finland? They are basically killing their own people now in Ukraine. They won`t a give rats ass what we have done here previously or how good and nice we`ve been. I cant believe how people in Finland still think so.
We have sold our independecy to EU that makes the laws an directives that we obey, but EU don`t have any defence forces of any kind. I`d rather be in NATO than in EU if I had to choose one. We already have an ally, so we are not neutral and this ally doesn`t give us any protection.

You really think that Estonia should be more worried than Finland?

It`s simple. You have real allies fighting with you (NATO) or you fight alone. At the moment NATO is the only thing that might prevent Russia attacking IF it wants to attack Finland.

In any case it`s not your decision you have to go to fight for your country. The decision is made in Kreml.
Sandvik74 wrote:
What contract says that Russia will attack us because we are not a Nato member? We will see about my numbers when we have joined Nato...
What contract says that Russia will attack us because we are not a Nato member? We will see about my numbers when we have joined Nato.

Even if we would be attacked as Nato members i don’t belive no one would do shit, they would say they don’t want to get involved in a war against Russia because it would escalate to nuclear war. They would say best they can do is a couple of rounds of ammo.

We have fought against them twice without help, we could handle them again a third time with only some
Ammo help. They are still just as shitty fighting as they were in the world wars. And no one want’s to fight another countries war anyway.

That’s how i see it, we would get the ammo help we need anyways without beeing a member of Nato.
Sorry about derailing this topic. This is about Ukraine, not Finland.

From Finland point of view it`s as simple as always has been. Either you have real allies or not.
I`d rather have it the having allies way.

iF Russia wants or needs to attack, nuke, invade or whatever Finland, it will try to do that. No matter what we or you do. We should have strong army and strong allies with real army to prevent and make it not tempting and as costly as possible for attacker.
If you have served in finnish army/defence forced you know what we are prepared for. Good for defending our country but limited resources of men (and women) and equipment.

Try to relax and forget about the nuclear attacks. Smile

Let`s donate some money for Ukraine and hope for the best for Ukrainian people. That`s all you and I can do now.
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flarider
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3/8/2022 10:43am
BREAKING—McDonald's has announced it will temporarily close all restaurants and pause all operations in Russia. @McDonalds is hugely popular in 🇷🇺, with around 850 stores and 62,000 employees.
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plowboy
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3/8/2022 11:01am
flarider wrote:
BREAKING—McDonald's has announced it will temporarily close all restaurants and pause all operations in Russia. @McDonalds is hugely popular in 🇷🇺, with around 850 stores and...
BREAKING—McDonald's has announced it will temporarily close all restaurants and pause all operations in Russia. @McDonalds is hugely popular in 🇷🇺, with around 850 stores and 62,000 employees.
A day late and a..ruble short. I reckon a happy meal costs about $10,000 dollars now. Probably didn't have any customers anyway. Seriously though...it's funny to consider that something as stupid as a big Mac could possibly cause the population to reconsider what's going on.
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flarider
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3/8/2022 11:02am
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent capabilities.

HUGE news for #Ukraine.
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Sandvik74
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3/8/2022 11:16am
flarider wrote:
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent...
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent capabilities.

HUGE news for #Ukraine.
Will that be concidered like Nato joined the war?
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Muttly
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3/8/2022 11:19am
flarider wrote:
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent...
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent capabilities.

HUGE news for #Ukraine.
Sandvik74 wrote:
Will that be concidered like Nato joined the war?
Pretty much. Gentleman, I’m pretty sure we’re actively watching the inroads to WWIII.
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flarider
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3/8/2022 11:21am Edited Date/Time 3/8/2022 11:22am
flarider wrote:
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent...
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent capabilities.

HUGE news for #Ukraine.
Sandvik74 wrote:
Will that be concidered like Nato joined the war?
It's a 3 way swap

We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's

Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because they do not know how to fly US planes

They'll be Ukrainian planes
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Muttly
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3/8/2022 11:26am
flarider wrote:
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent...
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent capabilities.

HUGE news for #Ukraine.
Sandvik74 wrote:
Will that be concidered like Nato joined the war?
flarider wrote:
It's a 3 way swap We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because...
It's a 3 way swap

We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's

Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because they do not know how to fly US planes

They'll be Ukrainian planes
This isn’t a game of checkers, this is Chess.
Sandvik74
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3/8/2022 11:36am Edited Date/Time 3/8/2022 11:40am
flarider wrote:
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent...
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent capabilities.

HUGE news for #Ukraine.
Sandvik74 wrote:
Will that be concidered like Nato joined the war?
flarider wrote:
It's a 3 way swap We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because...
It's a 3 way swap

We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's

Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because they do not know how to fly US planes

They'll be Ukrainian planes
But Poland is a member of Nato?

Edit: It probably counts like just giving military equipment like before?
Muttly
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3/8/2022 11:40am
Sandvik74 wrote:
Will that be concidered like Nato joined the war?
flarider wrote:
It's a 3 way swap We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because...
It's a 3 way swap

We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's

Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because they do not know how to fly US planes

They'll be Ukrainian planes
Sandvik74 wrote:
But Poland is a member of Nato?

Edit: It probably counts like just giving military equipment like before?
Poland is an Original member of NATO, since 1945.

You can wiggle around and put any spin you want on it. At that point the United States will have entered the War.
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flarider
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Sandvik74 wrote:
Will that be concidered like Nato joined the war?
flarider wrote:
It's a 3 way swap We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because...
It's a 3 way swap

We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's

Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because they do not know how to fly US planes

They'll be Ukrainian planes
Sandvik74 wrote:
But Poland is a member of Nato?

Edit: It probably counts like just giving military equipment like before?
That's my guess

Sure Russia sees it differently
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Muttly
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3/8/2022 11:46am
flarider wrote:
It's a 3 way swap We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because...
It's a 3 way swap

We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's

Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because they do not know how to fly US planes

They'll be Ukrainian planes
Sandvik74 wrote:
But Poland is a member of Nato?

Edit: It probably counts like just giving military equipment like before?
flarider wrote:
That's my guess

Sure Russia sees it differently
It might be looked at differently, if they weren’t already in the middle of a shooting War. Had we done this six months ago, no big deal. Today, it’s an Act of War.
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Sandvik74
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3/8/2022 11:46am
My guess is that if a NATO country gives planes it’s a little bit like NATO is ’closing the sky’ over Ukraine.

But we will probably get a statement from Mr.Putin over that one.
Bill_Carroll
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3/8/2022 11:47am
two of the main complainers about msm unironically posting fucking tucker carlson……………
First i'll ask you are you talking about me?
Just don't want to assume like you are in this statement.

When did I complain about msm?. I get all my news from Vital informers of course.
And how could anyone disagree with Bryce Mitchell in the video I posted?
or you just didn't even watch it because you hate Tucker Carlson so much?

My bet is the latter, thats like eating shit because you dislike Broccoli so bad.

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GrapeApe
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3/8/2022 11:52am
flarider wrote:
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent...
NEW -- #Poland has agreed to deploy *all* of its MiG-29 jets to the U.S. AB at Rammstein, in exchange for "used" U.S. aircraft with equivalent capabilities.

HUGE news for #Ukraine.
Sandvik74 wrote:
Will that be concidered like Nato joined the war?
flarider wrote:
It's a 3 way swap We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because...
It's a 3 way swap

We're selling Poland old US jets in exchange for all their MiG29's

Then Poland is giving them to the Ukraine's because they do not know how to fly US planes

They'll be Ukrainian planes
I think The Ukraine is getting Poland's MiGs, and the US will backfill Poland with F-16s.
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kongols
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3/8/2022 11:54am
If im not mistaken, these are not first planes given to Ukraine during war.
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kongols
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3/8/2022 12:00pm
What Russia does not like is NATO countries hosting Ukraine planes.
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plowboy
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3/8/2022 12:04pm
Realistically, giving the Ukrainian pilots aircraft they are familiar with is the fastest way to get them in the air and doing work. I doubt we're giving Poland worn out planes. Somewhere, Boeing or Lockheed board members are lighting big cigars.
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Muttly
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3/8/2022 12:06pm
kongols wrote:
What Russia does not like is NATO countries hosting Ukraine planes.
Think back to the Cold War, when the UN and USSR were direct adversaries.

Of course Putin isn’t going to like it. Especially when has stated reason for the invasion is to keep the UN off his doorstep.

Kind of like Osama going to hide in Pakistan.
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kongols
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3/8/2022 12:10pm Edited Date/Time 3/8/2022 12:11pm
kongols wrote:
What Russia does not like is NATO countries hosting Ukraine planes.
Muttly wrote:
Think back to the Cold War, when the UN and USSR were direct adversaries. Of course Putin isn’t going to like it. Especially when has stated...
Think back to the Cold War, when the UN and USSR were direct adversaries.

Of course Putin isn’t going to like it. Especially when has stated reason for the invasion is to keep the UN off his doorstep.

Kind of like Osama going to hide in Pakistan.
I don't think any nato country is hosting Ukraine planes. They use their own airports.
Its just something Russia warned poland and Romania about.
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indy_maico
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3/8/2022 12:10pm
kongols wrote:
If im not mistaken, these are not first planes given to Ukraine during war.
It's no different to the Stingers, Javelins, small arms, ammo, and money flowing into Ukraine from NATO and other countries.

Just more tools for the toolbox.
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plowboy
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3/8/2022 12:23pm
kongols wrote:
What Russia does not like is NATO countries hosting Ukraine planes.
Muttly wrote:
Think back to the Cold War, when the UN and USSR were direct adversaries. Of course Putin isn’t going to like it. Especially when has stated...
Think back to the Cold War, when the UN and USSR were direct adversaries.

Of course Putin isn’t going to like it. Especially when has stated reason for the invasion is to keep the UN off his doorstep.

Kind of like Osama going to hide in Pakistan.
kongols wrote:
I don't think any nato country is hosting Ukraine planes. They use their own airports.
Its just something Russia warned poland and Romania about.
Well, the Polish MiGs are at Ramstein AB in Germany now. I'd guess the Ukrainian pilots and ground crews will go there for familiarization flights. Probably relabelling the switches from Polish to whatever the Ukrainians can read. Plus there's a lot of bits and pieces that may not jive and have to be swapped out. Bomb racks, rocket launchers, missle rails and their associated wiring and switches are NOT interchangeable. I haven't heard if Poland was using Russian munitions on those MiGs or if they were adapted for Nato stuff.
kongols
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3/8/2022 12:32pm
I still hope they reach agreement soon. Language from kiev and moscow sugests they are close.
During last meeting moscow had documents with them, ready to be signed. Kiev took them home to take a closer look.
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