Ryan Dungey: St. Louis - Discussing His Thoughts on the Chase Format

TDeath21
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TDeath21 4/17/2016 8:10am
4/17/2016 8:10am
Chase format is the dumbest idea ever. It's literally just for excitement and takes away the hard work the leader (in this case Dungey) has put in. We could theoretically make every sport exciting all the time. After 3 and a half quarters of a football or basketball game, reset the score to 0. After 8 innings of baseball, reset the score to 0. 5 minutes left in a hockey game, reset the score to 0. Yeah it would always be an exciting finish, but it's not like those teams were evenly matched. Not to mention motor sports are on a different track all the time. Tracks toward the end of the year could favor one rider over the other. Yet another variable is the riders not in the chase that could impact the outcome. Imagine the NFL playoffs being played with each team able to select players from other non playoff teams to play for them.
h&m_cycle
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h&m_cycle 4/17/2016 8:19am
4/17/2016 8:19am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 8:43am
Without pure luck, you have to be able to win in the regular season leading up to the chase...
That means I have 8 guys...



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FlaNard 4/17/2016 8:46am
4/17/2016 8:46am
TDeath21 wrote:
Chase format is the dumbest idea ever. It's literally just for excitement and takes away the hard work the leader (in this case Dungey) has put...
Chase format is the dumbest idea ever. It's literally just for excitement and takes away the hard work the leader (in this case Dungey) has put in. We could theoretically make every sport exciting all the time. After 3 and a half quarters of a football or basketball game, reset the score to 0. After 8 innings of baseball, reset the score to 0. 5 minutes left in a hockey game, reset the score to 0. Yeah it would always be an exciting finish, but it's not like those teams were evenly matched. Not to mention motor sports are on a different track all the time. Tracks toward the end of the year could favor one rider over the other. Yet another variable is the riders not in the chase that could impact the outcome. Imagine the NFL playoffs being played with each team able to select players from other non playoff teams to play for them.
This. All of this.
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Jimmy_Sloan 4/17/2016 8:51am
4/17/2016 8:51am
Jimmy_Sloan wrote:
Why should he be in favor of it? In what way is it fair to Dungey to reset the points? Dungey is not the only one...
Why should he be in favor of it? In what way is it fair to Dungey to reset the points?

Dungey is not the only one not too hip on the idea, Roczen doesn't want it as well.
Crush wrote:
It's fair the minute the rules are set and it's the same for everyone. If they do it it's not like they're announcing it next week...
It's fair the minute the rules are set and it's the same for everyone. If they do it it's not like they're announcing it next week effective immediately.
So it's fair to say to the guy who has built a 30 point lead, "Hey. we are resetting the points for everyone! What that means is that your 30 point lead that YOU built up through wins is now gone, and all the other riders are going to be caught up to you."

Get real.

Even the riders themselves have said that's not right.

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shanes
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shanes 4/17/2016 8:53am
4/17/2016 8:53am
TDeath21 wrote:
Chase format is the dumbest idea ever. It's literally just for excitement and takes away the hard work the leader (in this case Dungey) has put...
Chase format is the dumbest idea ever. It's literally just for excitement and takes away the hard work the leader (in this case Dungey) has put in. We could theoretically make every sport exciting all the time. After 3 and a half quarters of a football or basketball game, reset the score to 0. After 8 innings of baseball, reset the score to 0. 5 minutes left in a hockey game, reset the score to 0. Yeah it would always be an exciting finish, but it's not like those teams were evenly matched. Not to mention motor sports are on a different track all the time. Tracks toward the end of the year could favor one rider over the other. Yet another variable is the riders not in the chase that could impact the outcome. Imagine the NFL playoffs being played with each team able to select players from other non playoff teams to play for them.
FlaNard wrote:
This. All of this.
well said the most stupid idea ever put up how to ruin a great championship
Canerat
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Canerat 4/17/2016 8:53am
4/17/2016 8:53am
Can someone please explain the Chase Format to as as I am unable to view the Vid.

Thanks.
DonM
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DonM 4/17/2016 8:57am
4/17/2016 8:57am
If they want a closer points race to make it more exciting why not just change the way points are paid?? Points for qualifying, points for qualifying races...bonus point races ect... The chase is not the direction this needs to go.
If the chase is so successful in Nascar then why have they changed it almost every year from the time they introduced it...but Feld has a better idea....right....
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Crush 4/17/2016 9:00am
4/17/2016 9:00am
Jimmy_Sloan wrote:
So it's fair to say to the guy who has built a 30 point lead, "Hey. we are resetting the points for everyone! What that means...
So it's fair to say to the guy who has built a 30 point lead, "Hey. we are resetting the points for everyone! What that means is that your 30 point lead that YOU built up through wins is now gone, and all the other riders are going to be caught up to you."

Get real.

Even the riders themselves have said that's not right.
Ya, it's fair if they know that going in. Of course it is. Same rules for anyone and you know it going in. It's not like they're sleeping with a hot chick and being told after she's got the clap.
DonM
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DonM 4/17/2016 9:06am
4/17/2016 9:06am
Jimmy_Sloan wrote:
So it's fair to say to the guy who has built a 30 point lead, "Hey. we are resetting the points for everyone! What that means...
So it's fair to say to the guy who has built a 30 point lead, "Hey. we are resetting the points for everyone! What that means is that your 30 point lead that YOU built up through wins is now gone, and all the other riders are going to be caught up to you."

Get real.

Even the riders themselves have said that's not right.
Crush wrote:
Ya, it's fair if they know that going in. Of course it is. Same rules for anyone and you know it going in. It's not like...
Ya, it's fair if they know that going in. Of course it is. Same rules for anyone and you know it going in. It's not like they're sleeping with a hot chick and being told after she's got the clap.
No but its like finding after working so hard to get the hot chick realizing that she would have slept with you anyways and that she will now sleep with all your friends equally as much starting today....
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Jimmy_Sloan 4/17/2016 9:08am
4/17/2016 9:08am
Jimmy_Sloan wrote:
So it's fair to say to the guy who has built a 30 point lead, "Hey. we are resetting the points for everyone! What that means...
So it's fair to say to the guy who has built a 30 point lead, "Hey. we are resetting the points for everyone! What that means is that your 30 point lead that YOU built up through wins is now gone, and all the other riders are going to be caught up to you."

Get real.

Even the riders themselves have said that's not right.
Crush wrote:
Ya, it's fair if they know that going in. Of course it is. Same rules for anyone and you know it going in. It's not like...
Ya, it's fair if they know that going in. Of course it is. Same rules for anyone and you know it going in. It's not like they're sleeping with a hot chick and being told after she's got the clap.
You're missing the point here. The unfairness is the system itself which effectively takes away a points lead. It doesn't matter if all the riders know the system going in, it it is the system itself that is unfair. What's the point of having 17 rounds when there will be a reset after 11? Why not just have 6 rounds? And why stop there? Why not have reset-reset after 16 rounds so that the only race that matters is the final race?
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kongols 4/17/2016 9:10am
4/17/2016 9:10am
Jimmy_Sloan wrote:
So it's fair to say to the guy who has built a 30 point lead, "Hey. we are resetting the points for everyone! What that means...
So it's fair to say to the guy who has built a 30 point lead, "Hey. we are resetting the points for everyone! What that means is that your 30 point lead that YOU built up through wins is now gone, and all the other riders are going to be caught up to you."

Get real.

Even the riders themselves have said that's not right.
Crush wrote:
Ya, it's fair if they know that going in. Of course it is. Same rules for anyone and you know it going in. It's not like...
Ya, it's fair if they know that going in. Of course it is. Same rules for anyone and you know it going in. It's not like they're sleeping with a hot chick and being told after she's got the clap.
Jimmy_Sloan wrote:
You're missing the point here. The unfairness is the system itself which effectively takes away a points lead. It doesn't matter if all the riders know...
You're missing the point here. The unfairness is the system itself which effectively takes away a points lead. It doesn't matter if all the riders know the system going in, it it is the system itself that is unfair. What's the point of having 17 rounds when there will be a reset after 11? Why not just have 6 rounds? And why stop there? Why not have reset-reset after 16 rounds so that the only race that matters is the final race?
Are you saying NBA, NHL, NFL and any other sport is unfair?
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DPR250R 4/17/2016 9:19am
4/17/2016 9:19am
GuyB wrote:
He was actually a lot more open to it than I thought he might be.
Probably because he knows, if he keeps this up, he would win either way.
500guy
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500guy 4/17/2016 9:21am
4/17/2016 9:21am
There is no need for a chase or playoff system, outside of the Vegas Final I never see any of these racers "Mail it in"
The top guy's are intense competitors and will always be.

The Chase or playoff will just be make believe hype to get stupid people excited. I have no idea why people think alienating the core fans is a good idea to grow a sport.
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Feint 4/17/2016 9:27am
4/17/2016 9:27am
kongols wrote:
Are you saying NBA, NHL, NFL and any other sport is unfair?
Do you want to change it so the riders who aren't in the top 10 can't race the chase rounds? That would be closer to how playoffs work in other sports. Oh and we'd have to do everything heads up. So the 1st place guy going in only has to race the last place that made it for the first round. Now we are getting there.

Or maybe you could just realize that racing and sports that are two groups head to head are so dissimilar that trying to say something that works for one will work for the other requires an almost brain dead level of stupidity.
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Jimmy_Sloan 4/17/2016 9:28am
4/17/2016 9:28am
Crush wrote:
Ya, it's fair if they know that going in. Of course it is. Same rules for anyone and you know it going in. It's not like...
Ya, it's fair if they know that going in. Of course it is. Same rules for anyone and you know it going in. It's not like they're sleeping with a hot chick and being told after she's got the clap.
Jimmy_Sloan wrote:
You're missing the point here. The unfairness is the system itself which effectively takes away a points lead. It doesn't matter if all the riders know...
You're missing the point here. The unfairness is the system itself which effectively takes away a points lead. It doesn't matter if all the riders know the system going in, it it is the system itself that is unfair. What's the point of having 17 rounds when there will be a reset after 11? Why not just have 6 rounds? And why stop there? Why not have reset-reset after 16 rounds so that the only race that matters is the final race?
kongols wrote:
Are you saying NBA, NHL, NFL and any other sport is unfair?
I've already explained in other threads why playoff systems work in team sports such as football, baseball, and basketball:

Motocross, unlike say football or basketball, or baseball rewards finishing positions by a points-base system. In football, the winning team does not receive extra points for a win, they get a win or a loss. Not only that, but in other sports that have a play off type system, like football, you have numerous teams winning on the same day so it makes sense to have a play off type of system where teams get eliminated. In motocross, you have one winner per class, and points are rewarded based on finishing position so it makes much better sense to not have a play off type of system.

The chase system is for entertainment purposes only and it essentially makes building up a points lead moot since it will be severely diminished by a reset.
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kongols 4/17/2016 9:38am
4/17/2016 9:38am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 9:39am
Feint wrote:
Do you want to change it so the riders who aren't in the top 10 can't race the chase rounds? That would be closer to how...
Do you want to change it so the riders who aren't in the top 10 can't race the chase rounds? That would be closer to how playoffs work in other sports. Oh and we'd have to do everything heads up. So the 1st place guy going in only has to race the last place that made it for the first round. Now we are getting there.

Or maybe you could just realize that racing and sports that are two groups head to head are so dissimilar that trying to say something that works for one will work for the other requires an almost brain dead level of stupidity.
I`m not saying anything. The sport is about making money. Current system rarely work. I haven`t analyzed chase format for myself, I have just general idea. They are trying to make it more exsiding for viewers, even if it sucks balls for a points leader. I`m not for and not against it.
dhp_mma94
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dhp_mma94 4/17/2016 9:38am
4/17/2016 9:38am
u might as well out put the chase format in the AMA outdoor series
kkawboy14
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kkawboy14 4/17/2016 9:40am
4/17/2016 9:40am
Feint wrote:
Do you want to change it so the riders who aren't in the top 10 can't race the chase rounds? That would be closer to how...
Do you want to change it so the riders who aren't in the top 10 can't race the chase rounds? That would be closer to how playoffs work in other sports. Oh and we'd have to do everything heads up. So the 1st place guy going in only has to race the last place that made it for the first round. Now we are getting there.

Or maybe you could just realize that racing and sports that are two groups head to head are so dissimilar that trying to say something that works for one will work for the other requires an almost brain dead level of stupidity.
kongols wrote:
I`m not saying anything. The sport is about making money. Current system rarely work. I haven`t analyzed chase format for myself, I have just general idea...
I`m not saying anything. The sport is about making money. Current system rarely work. I haven`t analyzed chase format for myself, I have just general idea. They are trying to make it more exsiding for viewers, even if it sucks balls for a points leader. I`m not for and not against it.
It's not gonna be bad for the points leader if he gets 2 pay days!

Now, if all he gets is robbed of his points lead......

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DonM
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DonM 4/17/2016 9:41am
4/17/2016 9:41am
One thing it will do is make the race for 10th leading up to the chase more exciting....Dry
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h&m_cycle 4/17/2016 9:51am
4/17/2016 9:51am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 9:54am
kongols wrote:
Are you saying NBA, NHL, NFL and any other sport is unfair?
Clueless... You don't live here... In the playoffs for team sports, the teams with the best record gets HOME FIELD ADVANTAGE... Till the FINAL TWO MEET! Then they swap home field advantage in their final playoff...
The regular season MEANS SOMETHING...
Now the regular season MEANS NOTHING if you get a early win, go on vacation...

The only exception is college basketball... Without gambling college basketball wouldn't be on tv in most markets...

And NASCAR did the chase for 2 reasons...

1. to stop Jimmy Johnson...

2. to give Dale JR. a chance at a title... That's why NASCAR expanded the # of drivers in the chase...
Hell, at Taladega Al., if Jr. crashes out early, half the grandstands are full...
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Dezerted 4/17/2016 10:15am
4/17/2016 10:15am
ML512 wrote:
http://www.vitalmx.com/videos/features/Ryan-Dungey-St-Louis-Discussing-His-Thoughts-on-the-Chase-Format,13511/ML512,13480
http://www.vitalmx.com/videos/features/Ryan-Dungey-St-Louis-Discussing-…
Jimmy_Sloan wrote:
Why should he be in favor of it? In what way is it fair to Dungey to reset the points? Dungey is not the only one...
Why should he be in favor of it? In what way is it fair to Dungey to reset the points?

Dungey is not the only one not too hip on the idea, Roczen doesn't want it as well.
We get it you're a diehard Dungey fan and you don't want anything to come between him and his Villopoto years..(title after title after title etc...)
DonM
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DonM 4/17/2016 10:33am
4/17/2016 10:33am
ML512 wrote:
http://www.vitalmx.com/videos/features/Ryan-Dungey-St-Louis-Discussing-His-Thoughts-on-the-Chase-Format,13511/ML512,13480
http://www.vitalmx.com/videos/features/Ryan-Dungey-St-Louis-Discussing-…
Jimmy_Sloan wrote:
Why should he be in favor of it? In what way is it fair to Dungey to reset the points? Dungey is not the only one...
Why should he be in favor of it? In what way is it fair to Dungey to reset the points?

Dungey is not the only one not too hip on the idea, Roczen doesn't want it as well.
Dezerted wrote:
We get it you're a diehard Dungey fan and you don't want anything to come between him and his Villopoto years..(title after title after title etc...)
Well that certainly explains why Roczen is against it....It really doesn't matter who you're a fan of, it's about going against what this sport was built on...hey I have an idea lets only have a one moto outdoors so people will be able to figure out who the winner is....let me know how that works out...
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Dezerted 4/17/2016 10:42am
4/17/2016 10:42am
Waaaaaaa
Jimmy_Sloan
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Jimmy_Sloan 4/17/2016 10:43am
4/17/2016 10:43am
Dezerted wrote:
We get it you're a diehard Dungey fan and you don't want anything to come between him and his Villopoto years..(title after title after title etc...)
And you're a diehard retard.
Jmma
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Jmma 4/17/2016 11:16am
4/17/2016 11:16am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 11:18am
"Are you saying NBA, NHL, NFL and any other sport is unfair?"

In all these other sports all the teams don't play against each other every week. In motocross / supercross its 20 riders against 20 riders each week. Every race itself is a championship / chase for each individual event. The Heat races and Semi's and LCQ along with 2 motos outdoors are a type of chase format already. A race winner is "Champion" of the night. A "chase" type format for the season Championship would be ridiculous for MX /SX. The main reason all the other sports have a playoff system that lets just about all teams in is because the owners and networks can make more money. Being a MX or SX champion stands for being the best and most consistent over 12 -16 races, persevering thru nagging injuries and being consistent each and every week. What might be better is if each rider had his 2 worst results not count as that would make up for fluke mechanical DNF's but otherwise the point system and format as it stands is pretty sound.
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bob567 4/17/2016 11:24am
4/17/2016 11:24am
DonM wrote:
One thing it will do is make the race for 10th leading up to the chase more exciting....Dry
Yes this will change the language in the riders contracts for sure. Might help the racing at the non lapper level for 2017.
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Katoomey 4/17/2016 11:44am
4/17/2016 11:44am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 11:45am
Why do you guys just assume that everyone will just start over with zero points like the previous races didnt even exist?

The races leading up to the "finale" or whatever you want to call it, will have to have meaning, and like playoffs or championship rounds in other sports, not everyone will make it.

The first part of the season will have to accumulate towards something.

I just think that the pre championship rounds should have less points and maybe a lighter schedule, like no semis.

Then the championship rounds should forgo qualifying, give heat gate pics in relation to pre-championship point standings, introduce semi-qualifying, and increase the laps of the main event.
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kkawboy14 4/17/2016 11:59am
4/17/2016 11:59am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 12:01pm
Katoomey wrote:
Why do you guys just assume that everyone will just start over with zero points like the previous races didnt even exist? The races leading up...
Why do you guys just assume that everyone will just start over with zero points like the previous races didnt even exist?

The races leading up to the "finale" or whatever you want to call it, will have to have meaning, and like playoffs or championship rounds in other sports, not everyone will make it.

The first part of the season will have to accumulate towards something.

I just think that the pre championship rounds should have less points and maybe a lighter schedule, like no semis.

Then the championship rounds should forgo qualifying, give heat gate pics in relation to pre-championship point standings, introduce semi-qualifying, and increase the laps of the main event.
Because EVERYTHING they do is dumb!

I mean what Moran made the decision to let DD go?
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Katoomey 4/17/2016 12:19pm
4/17/2016 12:19pm
kkawboy14 wrote:
Because EVERYTHING they do is dumb!

I mean what Moran made the decision to let DD go?
You do understand that the AMA is the sanctioning body, and that Feld is the promoter, yeah?

...and just to humor myself...you do realize that Dianna Dahlgren is as replaceable as a spark plug in a clapped out 125 2-sroke with the power valve stuck closed, dont you?
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ocscottie 4/17/2016 12:42pm
4/17/2016 12:42pm
GuyB wrote:
He was actually a lot more open to it than I thought he might be.
...and made a great point, they race 34 races where we have 17.

I strongly dislike the idea, the whole deal with the SX grind, being able to be on your game having 17 races in 18 weekends is what makes the SX title so impressive IMO

Post a reply to: Ryan Dungey: St. Louis - Discussing His Thoughts on the Chase Format