13yr old passed away today in Tx

Indy mxer wrote:

I've been doing mx since I was 15 and I'm now 57. So I've seen a lot. Mostly good, but some bad. What happened to this...

I've been doing mx since I was 15 and I'm now 57. So I've seen a lot. Mostly good, but some bad.
What happened to this boy is more than tragic. And as a Father of 4, my heart goes out to the family.
But for some of you to say it couldn't be prevented is total BS.

It's quite simple. If big bikes and mini's aren't on the track at the same time they can't collide! It's called minimizing risk, not eliminating it. That's why most liability policies require it.

Maybe it's just me, but I just don't see how anyone can think having these bikes on the track at the same time is a good thing.
Whats the upside?

I'll just say, in 20+ years of promoting races, although we've had our share of bad getoff's, pile ups and injuries, and we're not perfect, we've never had an accident involving a big bike and a mini. And as long as I'm involved we won't. I never want to be in a position where I have to explain to a parent why his child got run over by a big bike.
Hell, I get nervous sometimes when the 85's and 65's are out there together, let alone big bikes..

But just as in all accidents, some are preventable. Hopefully, as with all tragic events, something good comes out of this.
It's a discussion that needs to be had.

But you're right, every promoter needs to do whats best for their situation.

Indy mxer wrote:

I've been doing mx since I was 15 and I'm now 57. So I've seen a lot. Mostly good, but some bad. What happened to this...

I've been doing mx since I was 15 and I'm now 57. So I've seen a lot. Mostly good, but some bad.
What happened to this boy is more than tragic. And as a Father of 4, my heart goes out to the family.
But for some of you to say it couldn't be prevented is total BS.

It's quite simple. If big bikes and mini's aren't on the track at the same time they can't collide! It's called minimizing risk, not eliminating it. That's why most liability policies require it.

Maybe it's just me, but I just don't see how anyone can think having these bikes on the track at the same time is a good thing.
Whats the upside?

I'll just say, in 20+ years of promoting races, although we've had our share of bad getoff's, pile ups and injuries, and we're not perfect, we've never had an accident involving a big bike and a mini. And as long as I'm involved we won't. I never want to be in a position where I have to explain to a parent why his child got run over by a big bike.
Hell, I get nervous sometimes when the 85's and 65's are out there together, let alone big bikes..

But just as in all accidents, some are preventable. Hopefully, as with all tragic events, something good comes out of this.
It's a discussion that needs to be had.

But you're right, every promoter needs to do whats best for their situation.

txgoon wrote:

He probably would have passed even if it was a 50. He got hit (from what I understand from the kid who hit him) on the...

He probably would have passed even if it was a 50. He got hit (from what I understand from the kid who hit him) on the back his neck. They went off the face at the same time. Nothing could be done. IMO people need to stop complaining about organizing practice and start demanding flaggers. I could understand if the are slow and arent hitting anything.

bish153 wrote:

First all, I don't believe your story about you being asked to leave village Creek because you were to fast. I have ridden village when there...

First all, I don't believe your story about you being asked to leave village Creek because you were to fast. I have ridden village when there ware 500 riders and I have been there when I have been the only one on the track. In my almost 20 years of experience at vc, I have never heard of this situation, period!
Second for you to compare getting landed on by a 450 to getting landed on by a 50, is just ignorant on many levels. Simple fact is, if the kid was not on the track with a 450, he would not have been landed on by a 450!
Also explain to me how a flag get would have prevented this incident?

bish153 wrote:

First all, I don't believe your story about you being asked to leave village Creek because you were to fast. I have ridden village when there...

First all, I don't believe your story about you being asked to leave village Creek because you were to fast. I have ridden village when there ware 500 riders and I have been there when I have been the only one on the track. In my almost 20 years of experience at vc, I have never heard of this situation, period!
Second for you to compare getting landed on by a 450 to getting landed on by a 50, is just ignorant on many levels. Simple fact is, if the kid was not on the track with a 450, he would not have been landed on by a 450!
Also explain to me how a flag get would have prevented this incident?

CamP wrote:

Just to clear up some misinformation, there was not a 450 involved in this accident.

Indy mxer wrote:

I've been doing mx since I was 15 and I'm now 57. So I've seen a lot. Mostly good, but some bad. What happened to this...

I've been doing mx since I was 15 and I'm now 57. So I've seen a lot. Mostly good, but some bad.
What happened to this boy is more than tragic. And as a Father of 4, my heart goes out to the family.
But for some of you to say it couldn't be prevented is total BS.

It's quite simple. If big bikes and mini's aren't on the track at the same time they can't collide! It's called minimizing risk, not eliminating it. That's why most liability policies require it.

Maybe it's just me, but I just don't see how anyone can think having these bikes on the track at the same time is a good thing.
Whats the upside?

I'll just say, in 20+ years of promoting races, although we've had our share of bad getoff's, pile ups and injuries, and we're not perfect, we've never had an accident involving a big bike and a mini. And as long as I'm involved we won't. I never want to be in a position where I have to explain to a parent why his child got run over by a big bike.
Hell, I get nervous sometimes when the 85's and 65's are out there together, let alone big bikes..

But just as in all accidents, some are preventable. Hopefully, as with all tragic events, something good comes out of this.
It's a discussion that needs to be had.

But you're right, every promoter needs to do whats best for their situation.

txgoon wrote:

He probably would have passed even if it was a 50. He got hit (from what I understand from the kid who hit him) on the...

He probably would have passed even if it was a 50. He got hit (from what I understand from the kid who hit him) on the back his neck. They went off the face at the same time. Nothing could be done. IMO people need to stop complaining about organizing practice and start demanding flaggers. I could understand if the are slow and arent hitting anything.

bish153 wrote:

First all, I don't believe your story about you being asked to leave village Creek because you were to fast. I have ridden village when there...

First all, I don't believe your story about you being asked to leave village Creek because you were to fast. I have ridden village when there ware 500 riders and I have been there when I have been the only one on the track. In my almost 20 years of experience at vc, I have never heard of this situation, period!
Second for you to compare getting landed on by a 450 to getting landed on by a 50, is just ignorant on many levels. Simple fact is, if the kid was not on the track with a 450, he would not have been landed on by a 450!
Also explain to me how a flag get would have prevented this incident?

Indy mxer wrote:

Thank you Bish153.You put it better than I did. Big bikes and little bikes don't mix. That was the only point I was trying to make...

Thank you Bish153.You put it better than I did. Big bikes and little bikes don't mix.
That was the only point I was trying to make.

All the posts trying to explain it away by saying it couldn't be prevented are absurd. This young boys tragic death could have easily been prevented. It just takes a little extra effort by the promoter.

Indy mxer wrote:

Thank you Bish153.You put it better than I did. Big bikes and little bikes don't mix. That was the only point I was trying to make...

Thank you Bish153.You put it better than I did. Big bikes and little bikes don't mix.
That was the only point I was trying to make.

All the posts trying to explain it away by saying it couldn't be prevented are absurd. This young boys tragic death could have easily been prevented. It just takes a little extra effort by the promoter.

CamP wrote:

The outcome could have been the same if both boys were on full size bikes or 85's. If they were riding same size bikes when this...

The outcome could have been the same if both boys were on full size bikes or 85's. If they were riding same size bikes when this accident occurred, the loss of life would not be any less tragic.

Jesse Masterpool was killed when he tangled with another 85.

bish153 wrote:

Your right Cam, but with your idea of thinking we should just let any size bike and any skill level run together, because accidents happen. I'm...

Your right Cam, but with your idea of thinking we should just let any size bike and any skill level run together, because accidents happen. I'm sorry but this is not rational thinking. Yes incidents are going to happen but we can limit them by taking proper precautions. I can't argue if he would have been landed on by an 85 or smaller bike that it may or may not have changed the outcome, but that's not what happened. You have no argument, it's like you saying you don't put a seat belt around your kid because people die with seat belts on all the time.

bish153 wrote:

Your right Cam, but with your idea of thinking we should just let any size bike and any skill level run together, because accidents happen. I'm...

Your right Cam, but with your idea of thinking we should just let any size bike and any skill level run together, because accidents happen. I'm sorry but this is not rational thinking. Yes incidents are going to happen but we can limit them by taking proper precautions. I can't argue if he would have been landed on by an 85 or smaller bike that it may or may not have changed the outcome, but that's not what happened. You have no argument, it's like you saying you don't put a seat belt around your kid because people die with seat belts on all the time.

CamP wrote:

I'm not arguing for, or against split practices. I've been riding RV 3 days a week all summer. There have been several days when the track...

I'm not arguing for, or against split practices. I've been riding RV 3 days a week all summer. There have been several days when the track was crowded and they split it up. That's a pragmatic approach that I agree with. When this incident occurred, it was in the afternoon and there were only about 10 riders on the track. It was a fairly slow group and none of them were hitting the big jumps. I feel that it was a reasonably safe time for a experienced 85 rider to be on the track. If it was my kid, I wouldn't have any problem with him being out there at the time.

CamP wrote:

I'm 50 and have been racing since 1980. I've been regularly riding at this track since it opened in 2006. It is the busiest North Texas...

I'm 50 and have been racing since 1980.

I've been regularly riding at this track since it opened in 2006. It is the busiest North Texas track, and it has the safest layout, imo. This is because you can see the backside of every jump if you look up track. Over 80,000 riders have passed through their gates and this is the first. If you analyze the statistics it's about 80X safer to ride this track than it is to ride a street bike.

ruckus wrote:

Camp when i ran txmotocross.com and there was a death at another track.. People went on attack! It was vicious what people said and accused. The...

Camp when i ran txmotocross.com and there was a death at another track.. People went on attack! It was vicious what people said and accused. The very logic you described is similar to what i was saying. Out of respect to our fallen brothers i wont bring up the details but one was result of impact from another bike. My point: ignore all this and be there for the family and your RV buddies. You wont make progress on the internet with this. Please give my best to Tanners family and The Lux's too. Ill be seeing ya around out there. Hang in there.


To the guy saying he was booted from vc: either you drastically misunderstood or you really pissed someone off. Either way - you arent telling the whole story. I dont actually care but im pretty damn familiar with how they run things.

Cygnus wrote:

I can't believe what this thread turned into. What a bunch of shit. Someone need to delete about half or more of this crap and get...

I can't believe what this thread turned into. What a bunch of shit. Someone need to delete about half or more of this crap and get it down to the rememberance thread that it should be.

Cygnus wrote:

I can't believe what this thread turned into. What a bunch of shit. Someone need to delete about half or more of this crap and get...

I can't believe what this thread turned into. What a bunch of shit. Someone need to delete about half or more of this crap and get it down to the rememberance thread that it should be.

Indy mxer wrote:

I've been doing mx since I was 15 and I'm now 57. So I've seen a lot. Mostly good, but some bad. What happened to this...

I've been doing mx since I was 15 and I'm now 57. So I've seen a lot. Mostly good, but some bad.
What happened to this boy is more than tragic. And as a Father of 4, my heart goes out to the family.
But for some of you to say it couldn't be prevented is total BS.

It's quite simple. If big bikes and mini's aren't on the track at the same time they can't collide! It's called minimizing risk, not eliminating it. That's why most liability policies require it.

Maybe it's just me, but I just don't see how anyone can think having these bikes on the track at the same time is a good thing.
Whats the upside?

I'll just say, in 20+ years of promoting races, although we've had our share of bad getoff's, pile ups and injuries, and we're not perfect, we've never had an accident involving a big bike and a mini. And as long as I'm involved we won't. I never want to be in a position where I have to explain to a parent why his child got run over by a big bike.
Hell, I get nervous sometimes when the 85's and 65's are out there together, let alone big bikes..

But just as in all accidents, some are preventable. Hopefully, as with all tragic events, something good comes out of this.
It's a discussion that needs to be had.

But you're right, every promoter needs to do whats best for their situation.

txgoon wrote:

He probably would have passed even if it was a 50. He got hit (from what I understand from the kid who hit him) on the...

He probably would have passed even if it was a 50. He got hit (from what I understand from the kid who hit him) on the back his neck. They went off the face at the same time. Nothing could be done. IMO people need to stop complaining about organizing practice and start demanding flaggers. I could understand if the are slow and arent hitting anything.

bish153 wrote:

First all, I don't believe your story about you being asked to leave village Creek because you were to fast. I have ridden village when there...

First all, I don't believe your story about you being asked to leave village Creek because you were to fast. I have ridden village when there ware 500 riders and I have been there when I have been the only one on the track. In my almost 20 years of experience at vc, I have never heard of this situation, period!
Second for you to compare getting landed on by a 450 to getting landed on by a 50, is just ignorant on many levels. Simple fact is, if the kid was not on the track with a 450, he would not have been landed on by a 450!
Also explain to me how a flag get would have prevented this incident?