If Muhammad Ali Raced Motocross

P
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1/17/2012 3:02pm
reded wrote:
Lets see...dark skinned, talks a lot (about himself) and ain't too bad at his craft.....Hmmmmm.
mxgeoff wrote:
Mate please. please don't ever compare Stewart to Ali. One is a World legend and one isn't even an Motocross legend.
If James retired peole would be talking about many of his rides for years and years and years. He's a legend in the sport.


P
P
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1/17/2012 3:03pm
MotoChief wrote:
If Muhammed Ali raced Motocross he would still be a shit talking, draft dodging adulterer.
PaleBlue wrote:
oh! I sense a little hostility there!
mxgeoff wrote:
I love Ali, one of my all time hero's, but he's got it pretty much spot on there. We love our sportsman, but outside the sport...
I love Ali, one of my all time hero's, but he's got it pretty much spot on there. We love our sportsman, but outside the sport we let them do what they want and accept it.
He might have been those things, but he would have been kicking ass on a regular.


P
jtomasik
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1/17/2012 3:05pm
reded wrote:
Lets see...dark skinned, talks a lot (about himself) and ain't too bad at his craft.....Hmmmmm.
mxgeoff wrote:
Mate please. please don't ever compare Stewart to Ali. One is a World legend and one isn't even an Motocross legend.
P wrote:
If James retired peole would be talking about many of his rides for years and years and years. He's a legend in the sport. P
If James retired peole would be talking about many of his rides for years and years and years. He's a legend in the sport.


P
Well, MX/SX fans will. But, outside of MX/SX? I doubt it. Ali, on the other hand, transgressed his sport into the limelight of the general media, and in a big enough way that a great many non-boxing fans know quite a bit about him.
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1/17/2012 3:09pm
mxgeoff wrote:
Mate please. please don't ever compare Stewart to Ali. One is a World legend and one isn't even an Motocross legend.
P wrote:
If James retired peole would be talking about many of his rides for years and years and years. He's a legend in the sport. P
If James retired peole would be talking about many of his rides for years and years and years. He's a legend in the sport.


P
jtomasik wrote:
Well, MX/SX fans will. But, outside of MX/SX? I doubt it. Ali, on the other hand, transgressed his sport into the limelight of the general media...
Well, MX/SX fans will. But, outside of MX/SX? I doubt it. Ali, on the other hand, transgressed his sport into the limelight of the general media, and in a big enough way that a great many non-boxing fans know quite a bit about him.
To be honest with you there might be more people that know James Stewart Jr. than know RC or MC. I've met quite a few people, not all black, that have said that they knew who James was from seeing him on TV. I doubt that those same people know RC or MC. They probably know Travis Pastrana though.

I would assume that when the word legend is used in MX/SX it would refer to "inside" of the moto world. The move that he pulled in Chad will be remembered for a LOOOOOOONG time.


P

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mxgeoff
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1/17/2012 3:10pm
jasonv43 wrote:
Which racer would he be similar to? [img]http://www.maniacworld.com/muhammad-ali.jpg[/img] Happy Birthday Champ!!!
Which racer would he be similar to?



Happy Birthday Champ!!!
Ali was that good even RC, Everts, McGrath, De Coster and Cairoli all rolled into one don't match up.
jtomasik
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1/17/2012 3:18pm
P wrote:
To be honest with you there might be more people that know James Stewart Jr. than know RC or MC. I've met quite a few people...
To be honest with you there might be more people that know James Stewart Jr. than know RC or MC. I've met quite a few people, not all black, that have said that they knew who James was from seeing him on TV. I doubt that those same people know RC or MC. They probably know Travis Pastrana though.

I would assume that when the word legend is used in MX/SX it would refer to "inside" of the moto world. The move that he pulled in Chad will be remembered for a LOOOOOOONG time.


P
More than RC or MC outside our sport? I believe that. But, nowhere near the magnitude of Ali, and that's what we're talking about. We're talking apples and oranges comparing Ali's popularity to Stewart's. And, I'd go even farther and say more outside the community know Pastrana than Stewart.

Check back in 10 to 20 years and let's see who remembers what. Our champions, however great, fade drastically. Maybe as the sport grows (I don't know if it has over the past 10 or so years), the legends will hold on to their "worth" longer. Hannah used to pull some wild shit I never thought would be forgotten, but it has, and it's not because what he did was any less than the move Stewart pulled on Reed.

As far as game-changers in our sport, like Ali changed his, I'd go with Hannah and MC as having the biggest impacts.
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1/17/2012 3:23pm
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff is going to say that James isn't a legend in moto then there probably aren't any legends in moto.

Either way, I still say Hannah. MC didn't really talk enough shit IMO. He didn't just walk around like he was the shit he told you as well.


P
jtomasik
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1/17/2012 3:28pm
P wrote:
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff...
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff is going to say that James isn't a legend in moto then there probably aren't any legends in moto.

Either way, I still say Hannah. MC didn't really talk enough shit IMO. He didn't just walk around like he was the shit he told you as well.


P
Oh, gotcha.

And with MC, I was only referring to impact on riding in the sport. You're right he didn't talk shit.

J-Law would probably take the shit-talking award, maybe more so than Hannah? I'm trying to find the proper train-wreck boxer J-Law's career could be represented by...was thinking one of the Spinks, but that's probably too good...lol.
mxgeoff
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1/17/2012 3:33pm
P wrote:
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff...
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff is going to say that James isn't a legend in moto then there probably aren't any legends in moto.

Either way, I still say Hannah. MC didn't really talk enough shit IMO. He didn't just walk around like he was the shit he told you as well.


P
In my opinion legends are guys who broke records or are in amongst the all time greats. I am not sure Stewart is there yet. Titles wise he wouldn't be in the top ten would he??? Maybe he is. I guess a couple of 125cc mx, one 250 mx and a couple of sx 450 or not?
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1/17/2012 3:37pm
jtomasik wrote:
Oh, gotcha. And with MC, I was only referring to impact on riding in the sport. You're right he didn't talk shit. J-Law would probably take...
Oh, gotcha.

And with MC, I was only referring to impact on riding in the sport. You're right he didn't talk shit.

J-Law would probably take the shit-talking award, maybe more so than Hannah? I'm trying to find the proper train-wreck boxer J-Law's career could be represented by...was thinking one of the Spinks, but that's probably too good...lol.
Tommy "The Duke" Morrison is pretty close to a Jlaw story. Talent, opportunity, drugs, jail and so on.
jtomasik
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1/17/2012 3:39pm
P wrote:
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff...
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff is going to say that James isn't a legend in moto then there probably aren't any legends in moto.

Either way, I still say Hannah. MC didn't really talk enough shit IMO. He didn't just walk around like he was the shit he told you as well.


P
mxgeoff wrote:
In my opinion legends are guys who broke records or are in amongst the all time greats. I am not sure Stewart is there yet. Titles...
In my opinion legends are guys who broke records or are in amongst the all time greats. I am not sure Stewart is there yet. Titles wise he wouldn't be in the top ten would he??? Maybe he is. I guess a couple of 125cc mx, one 250 mx and a couple of sx 450 or not?
Depends on how you define "legend". Some would argue Jean-Michel Bayle was a legend, and he didn't win that much. Henry's a legend, and he didn't win that much.

I'd say Stew is in that class, easily. Heck, the guy went undefeated outdoors. Only the GOAT can claim that, besides Stewy.
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1/17/2012 3:54pm
P wrote:
If James retired peole would be talking about many of his rides for years and years and years. He's a legend in the sport. P
If James retired peole would be talking about many of his rides for years and years and years. He's a legend in the sport.


P
People who love Motocross/Supercross will always talk about his dominance on a 125. His style and ability to get everything and more out of a 125cc two-stroke is unmatched. Anyone who watched him ride a KX125 in person will forever have those images in their mind in reference to absolute perfection on a 125.
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1/17/2012 4:14pm
P wrote:
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff...
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff is going to say that James isn't a legend in moto then there probably aren't any legends in moto.

Either way, I still say Hannah. MC didn't really talk enough shit IMO. He didn't just walk around like he was the shit he told you as well.


P
mxgeoff wrote:
In my opinion legends are guys who broke records or are in amongst the all time greats. I am not sure Stewart is there yet. Titles...
In my opinion legends are guys who broke records or are in amongst the all time greats. I am not sure Stewart is there yet. Titles wise he wouldn't be in the top ten would he??? Maybe he is. I guess a couple of 125cc mx, one 250 mx and a couple of sx 450 or not?
So let me get this straight, you don't even know what you are comparing his record too???

He has 11 LL's Am. titles and the most on a mini, he is first on the all-time wins list in 125/Lites AMA Nationals, he is tied with Jeff Emig at 5th on the 250/Motocross Nationals class wins list, and he is third on the SX all-times wins list. He has won titles from the 50 class up through 450's and has one undefeated season in 450 MX and one season where he won 11 out of 12 races in the 125/Lites class. Oh, I forgot to mention that he revolutionized the sport when he took the "scrub" to the next level. Lastly, his move on Chad Reed at dilla is one of the most ballzie moves in the sport ever.

If that doesn't get him to legend status then there are A LOT of guys that will drop out of legend status.

P
elsinore
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1/17/2012 4:58pm
MotoChief wrote:
If Muhammed Ali raced Motocross he would still be a shit talking, draft dodging adulterer.
MotoChief speaks the truth. P wins this round over mxgeoff, and I still wish Joe Frazier and George Foreman had KO'd that loud mouthed Cassius Clay.
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1/17/2012 6:03pm
Js7 .... Rope Adope
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1/17/2012 8:59pm
James is great and has done plenty for the sport. Most of all he broke the color barrier. Although he didn't have to deal with what Jackie Robinson did when he broke the color barrier.

Winning in the amateurs is nothing, I mean does it matter how many amateur wins a baseball pitcher had? His professional career so far has been a disappointment. With the talent he has, he like Alessi would of been expected to have more wins.

Guess we all have a different idea on what makes someone a legend.
ocscottie
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1/17/2012 9:05pm
hmmmm

jasonv43
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1/17/2012 9:18pm
ocscottie wrote:
hmmmm [img]http://www.southparkgalleries.ie/images/RS%20090%20B%20.jpg[/img]
hmmmm

The original GOAT.
StatutoryApe
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1/17/2012 9:31pm
jasonv43 wrote:
Which racer would he be similar to? [img]http://www.maniacworld.com/muhammad-ali.jpg[/img] Happy Birthday Champ!!!
Which racer would he be similar to?



Happy Birthday Champ!!!
GuyB wrote:
Dunno...but he'd have handling problems due to excessive headshake.

Yeah, I know that was bad, but I couldn't resist.
HA!!!!!!!!
P
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1/17/2012 9:42pm
wawazat wrote:
James is great and has done plenty for the sport. Most of all he broke the color barrier. Although he didn't have to deal with what...
James is great and has done plenty for the sport. Most of all he broke the color barrier. Although he didn't have to deal with what Jackie Robinson did when he broke the color barrier.

Winning in the amateurs is nothing, I mean does it matter how many amateur wins a baseball pitcher had? His professional career so far has been a disappointment. With the talent he has, he like Alessi would of been expected to have more wins.

Guess we all have a different idea on what makes someone a legend.
I guess that being in the top 5 in all time wins in one class, the top three in another class, and the having the most wins in another class isn't enough??? You're an idiot.

James may not have as many wins as people may have "expected", but his win total is more than enough to classify him as a legend. You may not like him, you may not ever respect him, but people will be talking about some of his rides and battles years from now.


P
1/17/2012 9:47pm
I think Stewart is definitely a legend in racing circles. He will be discussed for many things good and bad, but he will surely be remembered.
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1/17/2012 9:55pm
mxgeoff wrote:
Ali was that good even RC, Everts, McGrath, De Coster and Cairoli all rolled into one don't match up.
hahahahahahahaha you really just put Cairoli in that group. That was hilarious.
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1/17/2012 10:49pm
P wrote:
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff...
I'm not saying that James, or anyone else in moto would be considered a legend to the general public, but I am saying that if mxgeoff is going to say that James isn't a legend in moto then there probably aren't any legends in moto.

Either way, I still say Hannah. MC didn't really talk enough shit IMO. He didn't just walk around like he was the shit he told you as well.


P
mxgeoff wrote:
In my opinion legends are guys who broke records or are in amongst the all time greats. I am not sure Stewart is there yet. Titles...
In my opinion legends are guys who broke records or are in amongst the all time greats. I am not sure Stewart is there yet. Titles wise he wouldn't be in the top ten would he??? Maybe he is. I guess a couple of 125cc mx, one 250 mx and a couple of sx 450 or not?
P wrote:
So let me get this straight, you don't even know what you are comparing his record too??? He has 11 LL's Am. titles and the most...
So let me get this straight, you don't even know what you are comparing his record too???

He has 11 LL's Am. titles and the most on a mini, he is first on the all-time wins list in 125/Lites AMA Nationals, he is tied with Jeff Emig at 5th on the 250/Motocross Nationals class wins list, and he is third on the SX all-times wins list. He has won titles from the 50 class up through 450's and has one undefeated season in 450 MX and one season where he won 11 out of 12 races in the 125/Lites class. Oh, I forgot to mention that he revolutionized the sport when he took the "scrub" to the next level. Lastly, his move on Chad Reed at dilla is one of the most ballzie moves in the sport ever.

If that doesn't get him to legend status then there are A LOT of guys that will drop out of legend status.

P
My bad, he is a legend, but i have to admit i say that through gritted teeth. He belongs up there with the greats.
PaleBlue
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1/18/2012 12:07am
It's a shame we're not talking bike racing in general, rather than the niche sport that is mx, 'cos then we'd have a worthy candidate - V. Rossi 46. No dispute there, I think..........
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1/18/2012 3:23am
PaleBlue wrote:
It's a shame we're not talking bike racing in general, rather than the niche sport that is mx, 'cos then we'd have a worthy candidate -...
It's a shame we're not talking bike racing in general, rather than the niche sport that is mx, 'cos then we'd have a worthy candidate - V. Rossi 46. No dispute there, I think..........
+ 1
wawazat
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1/18/2012 8:41am
wawazat wrote:
James is great and has done plenty for the sport. Most of all he broke the color barrier. Although he didn't have to deal with what...
James is great and has done plenty for the sport. Most of all he broke the color barrier. Although he didn't have to deal with what Jackie Robinson did when he broke the color barrier.

Winning in the amateurs is nothing, I mean does it matter how many amateur wins a baseball pitcher had? His professional career so far has been a disappointment. With the talent he has, he like Alessi would of been expected to have more wins.

Guess we all have a different idea on what makes someone a legend.
P wrote:
I guess that being in the top 5 in all time wins in one class, the top three in another class, and the having the most...
I guess that being in the top 5 in all time wins in one class, the top three in another class, and the having the most wins in another class isn't enough??? You're an idiot.

James may not have as many wins as people may have "expected", but his win total is more than enough to classify him as a legend. You may not like him, you may not ever respect him, but people will be talking about some of his rides and battles years from now.


P
To me "wins" doesn't make someone a legend. Wins will get you into hall of fames, legends are not always the guys with the most stats, points, or wins.

It's not a hate on James take with me, he is one of my favorite riders. In fact I picked him to take the title this year.. Hmm, maybe picking James to win does make me an idiot..
mxgeoff
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1/18/2012 9:07am
mxgeoff wrote:
Ali was that good even RC, Everts, McGrath, De Coster and Cairoli all rolled into one don't match up.
cmess77 wrote:
hahahahahahahaha you really just put Cairoli in that group. That was hilarious.
Cairoli has 5 World MX titles from 7 years (lost two titles one by 4 points and the other because he got injured mid-season while battling for the title) and is fourth on the all time GP winners list behind Everts, Robert and Smets. He is probably only half way through his career and YES I put him with these guys.
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1/18/2012 9:34am Edited Date/Time 1/18/2012 9:35am
Switch wrote:
Easily Stewart... who else leaves that many competitors laid out when hes done?
Ali never knocked himself out of competition.

But I get what you're saying lol
mxgeoff
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1/18/2012 9:37am
Switch wrote:
Easily Stewart... who else leaves that many competitors laid out when hes done?
mrquick wrote:
Ali never knocked himself out of competition.

But I get what you're saying lol
"I ain't got no quarrel with them Vietcong" kept him out of boxing for some time. Just saying.
P
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1/18/2012 3:36pm
wawazat wrote:
James is great and has done plenty for the sport. Most of all he broke the color barrier. Although he didn't have to deal with what...
James is great and has done plenty for the sport. Most of all he broke the color barrier. Although he didn't have to deal with what Jackie Robinson did when he broke the color barrier.

Winning in the amateurs is nothing, I mean does it matter how many amateur wins a baseball pitcher had? His professional career so far has been a disappointment. With the talent he has, he like Alessi would of been expected to have more wins.

Guess we all have a different idea on what makes someone a legend.
P wrote:
I guess that being in the top 5 in all time wins in one class, the top three in another class, and the having the most...
I guess that being in the top 5 in all time wins in one class, the top three in another class, and the having the most wins in another class isn't enough??? You're an idiot.

James may not have as many wins as people may have "expected", but his win total is more than enough to classify him as a legend. You may not like him, you may not ever respect him, but people will be talking about some of his rides and battles years from now.


P
wawazat wrote:
To me "wins" doesn't make someone a legend. Wins will get you into hall of fames, legends are not always the guys with the most stats...
To me "wins" doesn't make someone a legend. Wins will get you into hall of fames, legends are not always the guys with the most stats, points, or wins.

It's not a hate on James take with me, he is one of my favorite riders. In fact I picked him to take the title this year.. Hmm, maybe picking James to win does make me an idiot..
Shit, even without looking at his wins or titles his move on Chad Reed at dilla made him a lock for going down in history. People still talk about that and I don't know of anyone that has done it sense. It might happen again and if it does everyone will say "did you see what so-and-so did to so-and-so, just like Stewart did to Reed.


P

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