It's official: DeCoster to KTM

RACEGUY
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9/7/2010 3:57pm Edited Date/Time 9/7/2010 4:00pm
I can feel the flames now.

1). The personnel issue is still WAAYYY out there, so we're not sure who will be riding or wrenching for KTM USA next year. The speculation far outweighs the facts in evidence. We know who will be running the show. We have a very basic knowledge of Mike's "relationship" with the company. It's all question marks from there. I do not believe DeCoster would have significant problems with Mike if other influences were taken out of the equation.

2). I don't give a shit if you're Larry Brooks, or Larry the Cable Guy. The idea that you can tell the displacement of an internal combustion engine by listening to it (live or on TV or over the internet) totally disregards all the factors that create the engine's "note", from the well-known differences in exhaust and fuel between GP and US bikes, to the effects of compression ratios, valve size and configuration, cam profile, ignition timing, throttle body design, and airbox configuration. Managing engine/exhaust output sound has been significant in the engineering of both motorcycles (trying to make Hondas sound like Harleys) and current performance cars (trying to make high tech Fords, Dodges, and Chevys sound like early muscle-cars).

3). It amazes me that anyone would ask the question "WHY" AC and KTM might go for the 450 versus the 350 at altitude. That "infernal conbustion engine" is a big air pump. In the mountains, there is less air to be pumped. Gimmee a big gulpin' cylinder any time.

4). Consumers in the US have been shown a side of KTM that only exists there. Elsewhere in the world, Austrian orange bikes are the standard the others are playing catch-up to.KTM has listened to the consumer and even added a linkage to a bike that probably didn't need it, because your huge US market really wanted it, even if it was for no good reason. They have continued to provide 2-strokes as asked for by the consumer and have more than lived down the criticism of e-start on both 2 and 4 strokes.

Roger D and KTM will do well together.

Damn , dudes!! The Austrians didn't bomb Pearl Harbour. Why are we hatin' on KTM?Wink
Mod Killer
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9/7/2010 5:50pm
Crash82 wrote:
When he was leading the points and smoking everyone on Suzuki before his bad crash his Dad was there. It's his business who he wants around...
When he was leading the points and smoking everyone on Suzuki before his bad crash his Dad was there. It's his business who he wants around him, he asked everyone very nicely to leave his Dad out of it, you should respect that man. How would you feel if a online community attacked your Dad every time your name came up? In this day and age of BS press releases and mystery, he came online with his true feelings just saying you should respect that or at least appreciate it.
well said crash.

99% of these idiots dont have the slightest clue what its like to be under the microscope of the american public. we build em up just to tear em to pieces.

not sayin TA hasnt earned his rep. just sayin that most couldnt last a day in the spotlight without melting down. hell, meltdowns are a regular here and were mostly anonymous.

perspective and empathy are way too much to ask for let alone intelligence and thinking before typing.
themrtoad
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9/8/2010 12:44am
cpj36 wrote:
Of course you can't tell, you don't know as much about MX as LB, that's why you think AC is really on a 350 even though...
Of course you can't tell, you don't know as much about MX as LB, that's why you think AC is really on a 350 even though he doesn't have to be. Either that or blinded by the sun shining out AC's ass.
themrtoad wrote:
Yeah and my dad is stronger than your dad... You don't knw what kind of information I have about MX. I attacked your idol LB because...
Yeah and my dad is stronger than your dad...

You don't knw what kind of information I have about MX. I attacked your idol LB because he claimed he could tell the difference in cc from a video on internet. If he knows so much about engines that was a stupid thing to say.

I didn't comment on his side of what happened between Alessi/Cairoli/KTM when Mike was in Europe testing and training. I heard different stories of what happened and don't know which one to believe. Let's just say there's another version being telled by a lot of people over here...

As for the personal insults you wrote I guess they make me look stupid and you appears to be very mature and intelligent!
cpj36 wrote:
LB is far from my idol. You can tell a lot from a video actually and TV is what most of these posts and opinions are...
LB is far from my idol. You can tell a lot from a video actually and TV is what most of these posts and opinions are based on anyway. It's real similar to the way the Euro guys watch Barcia on TV and come to the conclusion that he would have nothing for Roczen, a kid that was about 8 sec a lap off his pace 2 years ago. Or how Anstie was a guaranteed top 5 when he showed up. Or Searle, or Tyla. If first hand experience is required to post this place would be dead.

From a video most of us can easily see the answers to never ending debates on here like why 250's can run 450 times, where the 350 is competitive, why Mike gets shitty starts, etc. Of course it helps when Mike even says what we're thinking.

You may be right but Mike's comments, his competitors and guys like LB and DC all question AC's bike, and why not? It's perfectly within the rules to run more than 350cc.

BTW, since you have information, do you have any information as to why AC was considering a 450 for Colorado? I keep asking but nobody answers.

I have no info on this. I guess on sea level with a really rutted and bumpy track you can go as fast or even faster with less hp/torque/weight and therefore the 350 is their choice.

If they believe they will face something that's almost the opposite of that, the 450 may be the better choice.

I don't see the conspiracy?

Why do you bring up FIM riders vs AMA riders?

I actually belive it's more interesting to discuss with people who knows what they are talking about. First hand experience will always beat listening to an engine on the internet in my world.
cpj36
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9/8/2010 5:12am
Allright, I'll make this real simple. As several of you have noted the 350 makes less power than a 450 at altitude, how does it not also make less power than a 450 at sea level? See where I'm going with this?

The Shop

cpj36
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9/8/2010 5:22am
themrtoad wrote:
I have no info on this. I guess on sea level with a really rutted and bumpy track you can go as fast or even faster...
I have no info on this. I guess on sea level with a really rutted and bumpy track you can go as fast or even faster with less hp/torque/weight and therefore the 350 is their choice.

If they believe they will face something that's almost the opposite of that, the 450 may be the better choice.

I don't see the conspiracy?

Why do you bring up FIM riders vs AMA riders?

I actually belive it's more interesting to discuss with people who knows what they are talking about. First hand experience will always beat listening to an engine on the internet in my world.
We're talking about Mike's problems and that seems to be starts. On the start where Mike's getting beat, there's a lot of guys that can use all of a 450, there's a few guys that claim to want everything a 450 has everywhere on the track but 10' off the gate a 350 can't match a 450. Altitude or sea level.
BobbyM
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9/8/2010 5:27am Edited Date/Time 9/8/2010 5:30am
Crash82 wrote:
He's fourth in the points on a new bike and a new team, new wrench, coming off 3 really bad injuries in a row, he's also...
He's fourth in the points on a new bike and a new team, new wrench, coming off 3 really bad injuries in a row, he's also going up against Dungey with Goose and bike that has been dialed in for quite sometime, he'll get it together, but i bet you he won't quit, you're going to eat those words.
KAWboy14 wrote:
the only way allessi will ever win is if he dumps his dad and hires some tru professionals and learns to have fun again racing. the...
the only way allessi will ever win is if he dumps his dad and hires some tru professionals and learns to have fun again racing.

the bike he is riding has nothing to do with him not winning.......that kid with his head screwed on straight could win on a rupp minibike!
Crash82 wrote:
When he was leading the points and smoking everyone on Suzuki before his bad crash his Dad was there. It's his business who he wants around...
When he was leading the points and smoking everyone on Suzuki before his bad crash his Dad was there. It's his business who he wants around him, he asked everyone very nicely to leave his Dad out of it, you should respect that man. How would you feel if a online community attacked your Dad every time your name came up? In this day and age of BS press releases and mystery, he came online with his true feelings just saying you should respect that or at least appreciate it.
i like mike...but please crash, stfu man. why are you arguing on here about mike?

talking to the kid at a local yocal track in alabamy doesn't mean shit man. you talk like you know him and are privy to his inner feelings but i don't think you are.

and the statement about tony in yer post makes no sense whatsoever. and it wasn't even a crash that messed mike up...jesus man give it a rest
themrtoad
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9/8/2010 5:28am
cpj36 wrote:
Allright, I'll make this real simple. As several of you have noted the 350 makes less power than a 450 at altitude, how does it not...
Allright, I'll make this real simple. As several of you have noted the 350 makes less power than a 450 at altitude, how does it not also make less power than a 450 at sea level? See where I'm going with this?
Less HP in a dyno doesn't always mean slower laptimes. As long as they stay above a certain amount of torque and hp, they think it doesn't matter and the good sides of a 350 makes up for it.

On a high altitude they are afraid that the torque and hp will be so low that they will be at disadvantage. I guess a 250f could compete with the 450's on certain tracks, but perhaps not at a power robbing track at high altitude.

If you are looking for a bike to buy for a specifik event, and that event is MXON at a high altitude maybe the 350 isn't the best choice.

Question - Are you forced by someone to run a KTM 350 at this years MXON or are you just looking for conspiracys. Are you looking to excuse your own poor performances? Mikes performances? or are you questioning Cairolis performance? Are you uncomfortable with KTM being a major player?
cpj36
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9/8/2010 6:25am
themrtoad wrote:
Less HP in a dyno doesn't always mean slower laptimes. As long as they stay above a certain amount of torque and hp, they think it...
Less HP in a dyno doesn't always mean slower laptimes. As long as they stay above a certain amount of torque and hp, they think it doesn't matter and the good sides of a 350 makes up for it.

On a high altitude they are afraid that the torque and hp will be so low that they will be at disadvantage. I guess a 250f could compete with the 450's on certain tracks, but perhaps not at a power robbing track at high altitude.

If you are looking for a bike to buy for a specifik event, and that event is MXON at a high altitude maybe the 350 isn't the best choice.

Question - Are you forced by someone to run a KTM 350 at this years MXON or are you just looking for conspiracys. Are you looking to excuse your own poor performances? Mikes performances? or are you questioning Cairolis performance? Are you uncomfortable with KTM being a major player?
What seems to be overlooked is that they made the 350 because the the FIM made a silly rule that changed displacement to 350cc, not because it was somehow better.

When both riders are using all available HP/Torque, less means slower, all day long. And laptimes don't mean much when for example, a smaller bike running 450 times finds himself having to turn inside a 450 or race one uphill, or long laomy start maybe.
cpj36
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9/8/2010 6:27am Edited Date/Time 9/8/2010 6:29am
themrtoad wrote:
Less HP in a dyno doesn't always mean slower laptimes. As long as they stay above a certain amount of torque and hp, they think it...
Less HP in a dyno doesn't always mean slower laptimes. As long as they stay above a certain amount of torque and hp, they think it doesn't matter and the good sides of a 350 makes up for it.

On a high altitude they are afraid that the torque and hp will be so low that they will be at disadvantage. I guess a 250f could compete with the 450's on certain tracks, but perhaps not at a power robbing track at high altitude.

If you are looking for a bike to buy for a specifik event, and that event is MXON at a high altitude maybe the 350 isn't the best choice.

Question - Are you forced by someone to run a KTM 350 at this years MXON or are you just looking for conspiracys. Are you looking to excuse your own poor performances? Mikes performances? or are you questioning Cairolis performance? Are you uncomfortable with KTM being a major player?
dehner47
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9/8/2010 8:02am
how about we just get to the end of this debate. someone give a privetter who is in the final moto some protest $$$$ to "protest" the 350 and see what the displacement comes out to. that should end all debates on this drawn out topic...
cpj36
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9/8/2010 9:54am
dehner47 wrote:
how about we just get to the end of this debate. someone give a privetter who is in the final moto some protest $$$$ to "protest"...
how about we just get to the end of this debate. someone give a privetter who is in the final moto some protest $$$$ to "protest" the 350 and see what the displacement comes out to. that should end all debates on this drawn out topic...
What would you protest? 350cc displacement isn't the class limit anyway. We already know Mike's bike is 350cc, but unlike a GP bike it has to be.
peelout719
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9/8/2010 10:12am

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