who is the favourite in 250 nationals?

sreitz711
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sreitz711 5/8/2012 5:56pm
5/8/2012 5:56pm
Barcia take it to the bank.
machine
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machine 5/8/2012 6:03pm
5/8/2012 6:03pm Edited Date/Time 5/8/2012 6:03pm
I like Roczen. but he can't finish a supercross sprint race without fading, due to an old arm injury or whatever it is, how do you think he is going to be able to sprint for 30+2 X2 without dropping anchor.
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b2 5/8/2012 6:07pm
5/8/2012 6:07pm
Baggett, sleeper pick.....Davalos
machine
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machine 5/8/2012 6:10pm
5/8/2012 6:10pm
Barcia...

My sleeper pick is Musquin

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Adam43
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Adam43 5/8/2012 6:10pm
5/8/2012 6:10pm
1. Roczen
2. Wilson
3. Tomac
4. Baggett
5. Barcia
pilotdude
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pilotdude 5/8/2012 7:59pm
5/8/2012 7:59pm
Anyone who didn't see what Tomac and Barcia did to their competition over the last 4 months is blind. And the tools who say Barcia can't ride outdoors apparently were in a coma during Unadilla and Southwick last year.
NoGo
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NoGo 5/8/2012 8:11pm
5/8/2012 8:11pm Edited Date/Time 5/8/2012 8:12pm
pilotdude wrote:
Anyone who didn't see what Tomac and Barcia did to their competition over the last 4 months is blind. And the tools who say Barcia can't...
Anyone who didn't see what Tomac and Barcia did to their competition over the last 4 months is blind. And the tools who say Barcia can't ride outdoors apparently were in a coma during Unadilla and Southwick last year.
Right , but the last 4 months was sx not mx. Completely different. Unadilla and southwick barcia was on a 450. We're you in a coma from hangtown-washougal when he was doing nothing on a 250. They have both done even better in a sx this year than last year. However it may very well be the same as last year where they were great indoors and far less than great outdoors.
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Derpin' DJ 5/8/2012 8:11pm
5/8/2012 8:11pm
There were a few instances last year where Barcia looked to be checking out before crashing out. If he can prevent those crashes, of course he will be a threat for the title. I think the experience on the 450, as well as the help from Stanton will definitely help
NoGo
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NoGo 5/8/2012 8:18pm
5/8/2012 8:18pm
Derpin' DJ wrote:
There were a few instances last year where Barcia looked to be checking out before crashing out. If he can prevent those crashes, of course he...
There were a few instances last year where Barcia looked to be checking out before crashing out. If he can prevent those crashes, of course he will be a threat for the title. I think the experience on the 450, as well as the help from Stanton will definitely help
I don't know what races your talking about where he nearly won on a 250. He got quite a few holeshots then crashed which is a result of his own mistakes. Even without the crashes he still gets ran down by the end of the motos and he doesn't seem to be able to move through the pack in either mx or sx. As far as working for Stanton goes hes had 2 public breakdowns since working with him.
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jndmx 5/8/2012 8:26pm
5/8/2012 8:26pm
NoGo wrote:
I don't know what races your talking about where he nearly won on a 250. He got quite a few holeshots then crashed which is a...
I don't know what races your talking about where he nearly won on a 250. He got quite a few holeshots then crashed which is a result of his own mistakes. Even without the crashes he still gets ran down by the end of the motos and he doesn't seem to be able to move through the pack in either mx or sx. As far as working for Stanton goes hes had 2 public breakdowns since working with him.
Dude WTF is your issue with Justin?
You never miss the chance to shit hammer the guy.

Did he fuck your girlfriend or something?
mdub45
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mdub45 5/8/2012 8:35pm
5/8/2012 8:35pm
just out of curiosity,when is the last time a rider won a 250f supercross championship and outdoor championship in the same year?
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Derpin' DJ 5/8/2012 8:40pm
5/8/2012 8:40pm
Dungey in 2009
NoGo
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NoGo 5/8/2012 8:42pm
5/8/2012 8:42pm
jndmx wrote:
Dude WTF is your issue with Justin?
You never miss the chance to shit hammer the guy.

Did he fuck your girlfriend or something?
How am I shit hammering him? Or whatever that means.

Those are all facts. That should be presented everytime someone wants to tout him as god on a Honda. He is great indoors. Has great sprint speed. But the FACT is he is not good outdoors on a 250. He did good on a 450 in a hand full of races. But he had done nothing of merit on small bike outdoors.

You act like I sit around saying he fucking sucks and will never do anything with his career. And I've never said anything close to that.
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pilotdude 5/8/2012 8:50pm
5/8/2012 8:50pm
pilotdude wrote:
Anyone who didn't see what Tomac and Barcia did to their competition over the last 4 months is blind. And the tools who say Barcia can't...
Anyone who didn't see what Tomac and Barcia did to their competition over the last 4 months is blind. And the tools who say Barcia can't ride outdoors apparently were in a coma during Unadilla and Southwick last year.
NoGo wrote:
Right , but the last 4 months was sx not mx. Completely different. Unadilla and southwick barcia was on a 450. We're you in a coma...
Right , but the last 4 months was sx not mx. Completely different. Unadilla and southwick barcia was on a 450. We're you in a coma from hangtown-washougal when he was doing nothing on a 250. They have both done even better in a sx this year than last year. However it may very well be the same as last year where they were great indoors and far less than great outdoors.
Tomac and Barcia were completely different riders this year than last year. Both have matured immensely. Barcia is working with Stanton and it shows. Tomac put Wilson down hard and has clearly decided to get serious. Both were a level above their competition in supercross, which is more often than not what happens before riders rise up and put the hurt on their competition outdoors.
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haydos25 5/8/2012 8:53pm
5/8/2012 8:53pm
Bagget didnt do anything to special in SX last year eithr but came out and crushed the field outdoors. Look at his form from daytona, the closest thing to an outdoor race all year, fella was on a mission and caught barcia twice from a fair way back.

My moneys on him to come through with the goods this year, followed by roczen, wilson (if fit) and tomac.

But who knows, tedesco could lay some tyla rattray style on these youngens and win it with consistency and experience. Stupider things have happened.
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tbanks 5/8/2012 8:57pm
5/8/2012 8:57pm
I think the favorite is still Wilson, if he races. He was on another level last year.

Wilson, Tomac, Barcia, Roczen, Baggett, and Davalos
NoGo
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NoGo 5/8/2012 9:00pm
5/8/2012 9:00pm Edited Date/Time 5/8/2012 9:01pm
pilotdude wrote:
Tomac and Barcia were completely different riders this year than last year. Both have matured immensely. Barcia is working with Stanton and it shows. Tomac put...
Tomac and Barcia were completely different riders this year than last year. Both have matured immensely. Barcia is working with Stanton and it shows. Tomac put Wilson down hard and has clearly decided to get serious. Both were a level above their competition in supercross, which is more often than not what happens before riders rise up and put the hurt on their competition outdoors.
Barcia is working with Stanton and as already stated since he started working with him has had 2 public breakdowns (bercy and Houston). Tomac lost his title last year in a shit deal with Hansen. Barcia won beating Wilson had Wilson not been there he likely would have had the same win streak he had this year . They are both an agreed level above in sx but outdoors Wilson and baggett and even rattray were more than a level above both tomac and barcia and the rest of the class.

As for your last statement the only riders I've seen go from a regional title to putting a hurt on the conp outdoors are dungey and rv and the both won only one sx lites title.
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pilotdude 5/8/2012 10:04pm
5/8/2012 10:04pm
Ricky Carmichael, James Stewart, Chad Reed, Ryan Villopoto, Ryan Dungey, etc. etc. etc.

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NoGo
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NoGo 5/8/2012 10:44pm
5/8/2012 10:44pm Edited Date/Time 5/8/2012 10:54pm
pilotdude wrote:
Ricky Carmichael, James Stewart, Chad Reed, Ryan Villopoto, Ryan Dungey, etc. etc. etc.
Dungey and RV I know for a fact have had 2 lites titles in one year.dont think reed has ever even won a 125 national title. Carmichael has won every title he was fully healthy for, ii think? And Stewart won 2 125 titles in 04 but had already had a national title to his name. Dungey wasn't even on another level in sx in 2010 only won by about 3points, but he won it and was able to come into his own after RVs departure from the class.

Wilson is the previous champ an is still in the class this year albeit with an injured shoulder. But my point is dungey came out on top after the #1 guy left. He was able to come into his own in his final year. The following year canard finally had a healthy season. Now here we've got tomac and barcia, both healthy and on the line for every 250 Moto. The #1 rider from last year is still there and there are now even more fast guys in the class. So there's no case of the #1 guy being gone or them finally being healthy. Therefor , if they weren't already in the mix in summers past then having another great sx season doesn't indicate or change their fate for the outdoors.
TripleDigit 5/9/2012 2:53am
5/9/2012 2:53am
pilotdude wrote:
Anyone who didn't see what Tomac and Barcia did to their competition over the last 4 months is blind. And the tools who say Barcia can't...
Anyone who didn't see what Tomac and Barcia did to their competition over the last 4 months is blind. And the tools who say Barcia can't ride outdoors apparently were in a coma during Unadilla and Southwick last year.
SX and MX can be hard to compare,Barcia is definately an indoor specialist and Tomac could be said to be more like the same,but I'd agree that they they're better riders this year though and should be up there outdoors

It's more like other guys are more true MX riders,the 2 KTM boys are in the series now and are in that vein,SX is something they've had to get to grips with,Bagget is a proven outdoor specialist too

Its Bagget and Roczen for me,but I think it'll come down to how well Kroc will adapt to th US tracks,arguably theyre faster,smoother and less demanding than what he's used to,and shorter by about 3 laps too.its going to be pretty tight at the sharp end and probably a few different winners
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PressPassP 5/9/2012 4:42am
5/9/2012 4:42am
Huckster wrote:
Marvin has a broken hand and may not even ride Hangtown from his interview on RacerX.....Wilson is banged up as well.... Roczen seems to be battling...
Marvin has a broken hand and may not even ride Hangtown from his interview on RacerX.....Wilson is banged up as well....
Roczen seems to be battling arm pump or fitness issues and who knows which Blake Baggett will show up. Hopefully its a competitive outdoors unlike the East coast SX....
Hopefully all 3 can get a bit more fitness back by Hangtown,Musquin has had nothing but problems since he's been over,poor guy deserves a break!

I just wanna see them all fit and all having a genuine shot at it,I'm still uncertain about how bad Roczen's armpump issues are as I raised in another thread


http://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Moto-Related,20/Roczen-arm-problems,12378…
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Crush 5/9/2012 5:36am
5/9/2012 5:36am
Dano39 wrote:
Last years point Top Five Wilson - 538 Ratray - 472 Baggett - 469 Tomac - 314 Cunningham - 311 An indoor 250 SX title is...
Last years point Top Five

Wilson - 538
Ratray - 472
Baggett - 469
Tomac - 314
Cunningham - 311

An indoor 250 SX title is not even comparable to going after an outdoor 250 MX title. While Barcia and Eli look great this year so far, it's not any indication of what they will do in a couple of weeks at Hangtown. As Barcia, although even more solid looking this year indoors, won the 250 SX title last year, and look how his 250 outdoors went!

I'll pick Baggett even though my instinct says not to. What is it he lacks? Focus... mental toughness? He's a bad dude when he's on so I hope he get's it together.

Roczen's fresh blood so you can't count him out as an upset but at the same time "craziness" usually follows the rookies! As it did Marvin can last year.

Can't wait no matter.... BRING ONNNNNNNNNNN the Outdoors!
Yup!!!

Barcia and Eli rode great last year in SX as well and never looked a threat outdoors at all...

If Wilson stays healthy he's better outdoors than in... Kenny and Marvin will be amazing...
wired4speed 5/9/2012 5:46am
5/9/2012 5:46am
Barcia, Tomac and Bogle are going to be one of the best outdoor teams to compete against the Mitch's elite squad. Wilson and Baggett have proved themselves capable of winning motos and championships. Throw in the most solid KTM team in years with Roczen and Musquin who also can win this championship too. Wharton, Stewart and Sipes have great outdoor speed and if they find that zone also have the ability to win moto's. Davolos and Anderson are going to have to step it up in the outdoors to run with these guys. My dark horse for challenging any of the above for a championship is Bogle. He simply has great indoor and outdoor speed.
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-eagle- 5/9/2012 7:43am
5/9/2012 7:43am
Geico is gonna be nasty.
SX Champs aside:
Bogle killed it last fall and Wilbur is right on the cusp.
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pilotdude 5/9/2012 8:37am
5/9/2012 8:37am
-eagle- wrote:
Geico is gonna be nasty.
SX Champs aside:
Bogle killed it last fall and Wilbur is right on the cusp.
Someone gets it.
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1-forty-8 5/9/2012 8:40am
5/9/2012 8:40am
All I know is that this year, imo the 250 ama class is where it's at. It's what I'm most excited about anyway. I think our sport is in very good hands right now, and don't we get to add AC96 to that class at some point next year..? Good times brothers, good times Grinning
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pilotdude 5/9/2012 8:57am
5/9/2012 8:57am
pilotdude wrote:
Ricky Carmichael, James Stewart, Chad Reed, Ryan Villopoto, Ryan Dungey, etc. etc. etc.
NoGo wrote:
Dungey and RV I know for a fact have had 2 lites titles in one year.dont think reed has ever even won a 125 national title...
Dungey and RV I know for a fact have had 2 lites titles in one year.dont think reed has ever even won a 125 national title. Carmichael has won every title he was fully healthy for, ii think? And Stewart won 2 125 titles in 04 but had already had a national title to his name. Dungey wasn't even on another level in sx in 2010 only won by about 3points, but he won it and was able to come into his own after RVs departure from the class.

Wilson is the previous champ an is still in the class this year albeit with an injured shoulder. But my point is dungey came out on top after the #1 guy left. He was able to come into his own in his final year. The following year canard finally had a healthy season. Now here we've got tomac and barcia, both healthy and on the line for every 250 Moto. The #1 rider from last year is still there and there are now even more fast guys in the class. So there's no case of the #1 guy being gone or them finally being healthy. Therefor , if they weren't already in the mix in summers past then having another great sx season doesn't indicate or change their fate for the outdoors.
Dude, I'm not quite sure where you're headed with the all this. Tomac and Barcia didn't just win their championships, they crushed their competition. Just crushed them. That builds huge confidence. They are fitter and stronger this year by far. Both are healthy with no injuries. Barcia gave Dungey fits at Unadilla and then WON Southwick during a hurricane, both rides coming in the last part of the season.

At some point, all the superstars rose up and showed they had moved up to a new level. Reed, Carmichael, Stewart, Windham, Villopoto, Dungey, etc. Tomac and Barcia showed that this supercross season.

As far as Barcia melting down, that is a product of him being both young and filled with an overwhelming desire to win, which by the way, many riders lack.

Favorites in the 250 class this year?

1. Barcia/Tomac--Both dominated in SX, both uninjured, both fit, both working with strong mentors.

2. Roczen--Great speed but injury rumors make me pause.

3. Musquin--Great speed also, could be his breakout year outdoors.

4. Wilson--Injured shoulder is a major cause for concern.

5. Baggett--3 Seconds a lap faster than anyone/12th place for no reason doesn't win championships.
bartoner
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bartoner 5/9/2012 9:01am
5/9/2012 9:01am
Hot Sauce....
2strokerider 5/9/2012 9:04am
5/9/2012 9:04am
I think we may well see a non american podium this year in the 250f class- Roczen will win the championship with Wilson and Musquin 2nd and 3rd. I think Baggett will be very fast on his good days, but he needs to find more consistency than last year (finish better on his bad days) Barcia is unproven on a 250f outdoors, he's going to have to make huge improvements on the last couple of seasons to win a moto this year in such a stacked class! Tomac I'm unsure of- I know he is capable of winning but he didnt impress me last year outdoors. Bogle will win a couple of moto's i think.

Its definitely the most stacked class ive ever seen, going to be some great racing! Just hope wilsons shoulder is ok and he's somewhere near 100% going into round one, same with Kenny and all the other contenders- it would be cool to see them all at 100% banging bars all summer!! Smile
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tbanks 5/9/2012 9:11am
5/9/2012 9:11am
bartoner wrote:
Hot Sauce....
He will be a factor, but I expect he will need 3 or more rounds before we see something solid from him. He hasn't raced outdoors for 2 years now?

I don't doubt his ability, but the sprinting that these boys do nowadays in the early laps will be difficult for him to adjust to IMO.

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