sx was ruined by 450s

Phillip_Lamb
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Phillip_Lamb
not entirely but i dont remember seeing guys doing this on 250 two strokes. more to the point of sections becoming too easy to jump. still impressive
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GuyB
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GuyB 3/9/2017 10:02am
3/9/2017 10:02am
It's definitely impressive. The four-strokes have definitely made possible things that were previously impossible. But as the bikes have gotten better, so has the technique...and the overall depth of the talent in the field.
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MX Guy 3/9/2017 10:05am
3/9/2017 10:05am
Dead horse.
TXDirt
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TXDirt 3/9/2017 10:06am
3/9/2017 10:06am
Jump for show corner for dough.
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ATKpilot99 3/9/2017 10:08am
3/9/2017 10:08am
GuyB wrote:
It's definitely impressive. The four-strokes have definitely made possible things that were previously impossible. But as the bikes have gotten better, so has the technique...and the...
It's definitely impressive. The four-strokes have definitely made possible things that were previously impossible. But as the bikes have gotten better, so has the technique...and the overall depth of the talent in the field.
I agree except for the depth. You can narrow down who's going to win to 2 or 3 riders.

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GuyB
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GuyB 3/9/2017 10:12am
3/9/2017 10:12am
ATKpilot99 wrote:
I agree except for the depth. You can narrow down who's going to win to 2 or 3 riders.
There's always a small handful of guys you expect to be podium contenders every week. But the depth of guys who have good technique is much better than it was years ago.

Remember BITD when they used to have Friday practices because not many guys had access to SX tracks? Smile
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CrGuy2T 3/9/2017 10:14am
3/9/2017 10:14am
Who cares it's called evolution. Get over it.
ATKpilot99
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ATKpilot99 3/9/2017 10:23am
3/9/2017 10:23am
GuyB wrote:
There's always a small handful of guys you expect to be podium contenders every week. But the depth of guys who have good technique is much...
There's always a small handful of guys you expect to be podium contenders every week. But the depth of guys who have good technique is much better than it was years ago.

Remember BITD when they used to have Friday practices because not many guys had access to SX tracks? Smile
Yep
cameron96
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cameron96 3/9/2017 10:23am
3/9/2017 10:23am
Yea back in 2011 the sport was much better. Didn't know they ran 2 stroke that year tho
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CEMX182 3/9/2017 10:27am
3/9/2017 10:27am
GuyB wrote:
There's always a small handful of guys you expect to be podium contenders every week. But the depth of guys who have good technique is much...
There's always a small handful of guys you expect to be podium contenders every week. But the depth of guys who have good technique is much better than it was years ago.

Remember BITD when they used to have Friday practices because not many guys had access to SX tracks? Smile
Only cool thing like that I can remember, is Pontiac used to have an Amateur day. I can remember getting my PW stuck on the top of a face haha
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Xeno 3/9/2017 10:33am
3/9/2017 10:33am Edited Date/Time 3/9/2017 10:33am
I thought this thread was going to be about how quickly the SX tracks break down.

Carry on...
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-MAVERICK- 3/9/2017 10:44am
3/9/2017 10:44am Edited Date/Time 3/9/2017 10:45am
This needs to be shown to Ralph Sheheen. Definition: Real Quad!
GuyB
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GuyB 3/9/2017 10:45am
3/9/2017 10:45am Edited Date/Time 3/9/2017 10:45am
brocster wrote:
triple, triple, quad...
Huh...guess it depends on how you count the jumps. For me it'd be more like...

Not doing that, or that, that either.
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gt80rider 3/9/2017 10:58am
3/9/2017 10:58am Edited Date/Time 3/9/2017 10:59am
CrGuy2T wrote:
Who cares it's called evolution. Get over it.
Thank goodness for evolution... Bike sales are in the shitter just like entries at local races... YAY!!!!
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davistld01 3/9/2017 11:11am
3/9/2017 11:11am
In my mind, it's not the 450's that have negatively effected SX...it's the serious injuries that have become so common due to the extra power of the bikes and the more intense obstacles on the tracks because of it. It just doesn't seem that we saw as many really serious injuries before the 4-strokes came.
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jmx411 3/9/2017 11:14am
3/9/2017 11:14am
Love the 450s and the things guys can do on the bike now. Never want to go back to 2-strokes.
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nrosso391 3/9/2017 11:35am
3/9/2017 11:35am
I wouldn't say ruined. But its taken it into a direction that it shouldn't have gone. I wouldn't say the pros techniques are better, if anything they're worse. It takes less skill to go thru a section than it used to. Bikes have GOBS of HP now and are more rideable. The actual talent you had to have to ride those 250's was much higher that a 450 now. 450's are easier to ride and have more traction, don't get that confused with "guys have better technique now" because they can jump triple, quad, quad in every section with ease. That's all power and big brass balls, not technique.

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nrosso391
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nrosso391 3/9/2017 11:40am
3/9/2017 11:40am
CrGuy2T wrote:
Who cares it's called evolution. Get over it.
gt80rider wrote:
Thank goodness for evolution... Bike sales are in the shitter just like entries at local races... YAY!!!!
YUP! Sport has been going downhill the fastest since 2006. My first brand new YZ250F in 2004 was around $3500 sale price. Now they're over double that! That's insane.
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JBecker 72 3/9/2017 11:48am
3/9/2017 11:48am
It's crazy watching guys like Top Jimmy, Ryan Surratt, and Mookie practice. They look unstoppable. Then you see how they do in the races compared to the top guys, and you realize how far the sport has been pushed.

I love both two and four stroke bikes. And I wouldn't lay the blame entirely on four strokes for the slump sales are in. Motorsports are expensive, and we still aren't back to the pre recession days when it comes to your average Joe's disposable income.
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scott_nz 3/9/2017 12:00pm
3/9/2017 12:00pm Edited Date/Time 3/9/2017 12:01pm
GuyB wrote:
It's definitely impressive. The four-strokes have definitely made possible things that were previously impossible. But as the bikes have gotten better, so has the technique...and the...
It's definitely impressive. The four-strokes have definitely made possible things that were previously impossible. But as the bikes have gotten better, so has the technique...and the overall depth of the talent in the field.
ATKpilot99 wrote:
I agree except for the depth. You can narrow down who's going to win to 2 or 3 riders.
Mcgrath went 15-1 on a 2 stroke, RC went 15-2 on one as well, with only one other winner both those years,

depth has varied a fair bit over the years, I dont think there has been a year in the four stroke era with only 2 winners in a season, 06 with Reed, RC and JS is the about the closest,
ATKpilot99
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ATKpilot99 3/9/2017 12:07pm
3/9/2017 12:07pm
scott_nz wrote:
Mcgrath went 15-1 on a 2 stroke, RC went 15-2 on one as well, with only one other winner both those years, depth has varied a...
Mcgrath went 15-1 on a 2 stroke, RC went 15-2 on one as well, with only one other winner both those years,

depth has varied a fair bit over the years, I dont think there has been a year in the four stroke era with only 2 winners in a season, 06 with Reed, RC and JS is the about the closest,
Thats true . My point was we always hear how crazy deep the field is each year when really its not a whole lot different.
early
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early 3/9/2017 12:12pm
3/9/2017 12:12pm
scott_nz wrote:
Mcgrath went 15-1 on a 2 stroke, RC went 15-2 on one as well, with only one other winner both those years, depth has varied a...
Mcgrath went 15-1 on a 2 stroke, RC went 15-2 on one as well, with only one other winner both those years,

depth has varied a fair bit over the years, I dont think there has been a year in the four stroke era with only 2 winners in a season, 06 with Reed, RC and JS is the about the closest,
ATKpilot99 wrote:
Thats true . My point was we always hear how crazy deep the field is each year when really its not a whole lot different.
I wonder what year had the most sx winners? More relevent for the modern era 1980(?)-present.
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Sidecar 3/9/2017 12:21pm
3/9/2017 12:21pm
All sports evolve, look at BMX, comparing what current pros do to the early 00s then the 90s then the 80s.... All eras had amazing talent and hp figures sure haven't improved but the sport is immensely different same with skateboarding or surfing and many other sports, 125, 250, 250f or 450 2 stroke or 4 stroke the bar would still be higher today.

OPs video is rad though!!!
Dirty Points 3/9/2017 12:45pm
3/9/2017 12:45pm
I have to say, there's nothing "too easy" about what is happening in that Insta vid
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JM485 3/9/2017 12:49pm
3/9/2017 12:49pm
nrosso391 wrote:
I wouldn't say ruined. But its taken it into a direction that it shouldn't have gone. I wouldn't say the pros techniques are better, if anything...
I wouldn't say ruined. But its taken it into a direction that it shouldn't have gone. I wouldn't say the pros techniques are better, if anything they're worse. It takes less skill to go thru a section than it used to. Bikes have GOBS of HP now and are more rideable. The actual talent you had to have to ride those 250's was much higher that a 450 now. 450's are easier to ride and have more traction, don't get that confused with "guys have better technique now" because they can jump triple, quad, quad in every section with ease. That's all power and big brass balls, not technique.
Ya, there was no technique at all in that video.Pinch

It's comments like this that make me wonder if most people here have ever ridden a bmx bike and learned how to downside landings and keep speed. It's a technique, just like you're seeing here. Everyone is faster now then they were 20 years ago, it's just evolution of technique and style, not just because the bikes are better.
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brocster 3/9/2017 1:08pm
3/9/2017 1:08pm
brocster wrote:
triple, triple, quad...
GuyB wrote:
Huh...guess it depends on how you count the jumps. For me it'd be more like...

Not doing that, or that, that either.
right! you said it. I count "jumps" (mounds of dirt) not the possibility of the places to land...


have fun!


btw. I would struggle with however they are laid out and probably just jump the table in the middle as "one" jump Wink
jorgechavez 3/9/2017 1:29pm
3/9/2017 1:29pm
nrosso391 wrote:
I wouldn't say ruined. But its taken it into a direction that it shouldn't have gone. I wouldn't say the pros techniques are better, if anything...
I wouldn't say ruined. But its taken it into a direction that it shouldn't have gone. I wouldn't say the pros techniques are better, if anything they're worse. It takes less skill to go thru a section than it used to. Bikes have GOBS of HP now and are more rideable. The actual talent you had to have to ride those 250's was much higher that a 450 now. 450's are easier to ride and have more traction, don't get that confused with "guys have better technique now" because they can jump triple, quad, quad in every section with ease. That's all power and big brass balls, not technique.
Yeah there's absolutely no technique to handling that motorcycle at that speed and making sure it doesn't buck you off like it so easily can.
nrosso391
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nrosso391 3/9/2017 1:31pm
3/9/2017 1:31pm Edited Date/Time 3/9/2017 1:32pm
jorgechavez wrote:
Yeah there's absolutely no technique to handling that motorcycle at that speed and making sure it doesn't buck you off like it so easily can.
I'm not saying they're skill-less. I never said they didn't have technique. I'm saying you can ride a 450 very lazy, jump easier and STILL be going faster.

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