cr125 water pump/clutch cover help 1985/1986

bogrolls
Profile picture for user bogrolls
Posts
8
Joined
4/10/2017
Location
AU
bogrolls
Edited Date/Time 4/12/2019 5:48pm
Gday,

I'm restoring a 1985 cr125. Like many others my clutch cover was corroded beyond repair and I did get a 1986 replacement but would really like some input on what i found next.

The 1985 cr125 cover I have has 600 stamped on it, the 1986 one is slightly wider and has 700 stamped on it. This added width means the 1985 water pump shaft does not quite fit right. It's very hard to find information on exactly this point, there's plenty around about repairing covers and what not, but I can't find reference anywhere to the changes in the water pump shaft.

My measuring was done poorly sorry, but the 1985 shaft is 75mm in length, I expect the 1986 is about 3-5mm longer.

The 1986 shaft is the one with the plastic insert/ramps, the 1985 is the one without. This checks out on the honda parts manuals.

My issue is I need to find someone with knowledge of this and am trying very hard to find a 1986 cr125 shaft to physically measure and see if it fits. If anyone has any ideas of somewhere wrecking a 1986 that I can buy this part from please let me know!

Anyone with any info on this topic I'd love to hear from you. Sorry for all the pictures, I hope this thread can be of use for people in the future so I've included as much info/pics as I can.

Thanks a heap,

Bogrolls

My 1985 water pump shaft


My 1985 water pump shaft parts


My 1985 water pump shaft


Honda microfische diagram showing 1985 and 1986 difference. All other parts are the same.


My 1985 clutch cover, notice depth/length of posts


The clymer manual page


1986 cover depth


1986 cover


1985 cover


|
Smed
Profile picture for user Smed
Posts
114
Joined
11/21/2016
Location
KYABRAM, VIC AU
Smed 6/18/2017 12:12am
6/18/2017 12:12am
Looks like you have one of Russells alloy covers yeah? He must have used the 86 cover to copy for 84-6, I can check my 85 shaft & let you know what I find, when I done the original fitment a couple of years back I dunno if my bike had a 85 or 86 cover as I had 2 or 3 different ones, whichever one I had it fitted perfect when I swapped
the shaft from old to new, I am in Vic give me a call in a couple of days if you like & we can have a chat 0418 274861 Chris
bogrolls
Profile picture for user bogrolls
Posts
8
Joined
4/10/2017
Location
AU
bogrolls 6/18/2017 3:44pm
6/18/2017 3:44pm
Gday Chris,

Thanks so much for taking the time to respond. I'm very keen to make sure an 86 shaft will do the trick, i've been trying hard to find one to buy but haven't had any luck so far.

I'll watch this thread and give you a buzz in a couple of days as you've said.

Cheers,
Mat
Smed
Profile picture for user Smed
Posts
114
Joined
11/21/2016
Location
KYABRAM, VIC AU
Smed 6/18/2017 5:39pm
6/18/2017 5:39pm
Cool mate, I just remembered a small issue I had with my alloy cover, the 2 towers that hold the ATAC spring assy where not machined down far enough, my water pump gear was not turning as the teeth where hitting them, I used a die grinder & took the machining down further, I told Russell about it & he said he would check & re machine them deeper, Looks to me like yours is not done, Is that your problem?
bogrolls
Profile picture for user bogrolls
Posts
8
Joined
4/10/2017
Location
AU
bogrolls 6/18/2017 7:57pm
6/18/2017 7:57pm
Smed wrote:
Cool mate, I just remembered a small issue I had with my alloy cover, the 2 towers that hold the ATAC spring assy where not machined...
Cool mate, I just remembered a small issue I had with my alloy cover, the 2 towers that hold the ATAC spring assy where not machined down far enough, my water pump gear was not turning as the teeth where hitting them, I used a die grinder & took the machining down further, I told Russell about it & he said he would check & re machine them deeper, Looks to me like yours is not done, Is that your problem?
Interesting, the issue is as you say the gear does grind on the 2 towers for sure. I figured that was happening because I had the gear/shaft and that the spacing on the 86 shaft was different to what I had. Even if those posts were flat I think i'd have issues with the shaft being too short.

Have your posts been grinded right the way to the bearing face ?

I think these 3 are what the 1986 one looks like, looking at the outside face of the gear how it's not perfectly flat i figured it must sit away from the cover a little bit unlike the 1985. I don't know if you remember but is this what yours looked like ?





The Shop

See All »
mattbrown342
Profile picture for user mattbrown342
Posts
9
Joined
3/13/2019
Location
Weatherford, TX US
mattbrown342 3/13/2019 5:13am
3/13/2019 5:13am
I’m in the exact same situation. I’m restoring a 85 CR125 and bought a cover from Russel that is 700 cm. I’m I nterestd to see if the 86 water pump worked.
bogrolls
Profile picture for user bogrolls
Posts
8
Joined
4/10/2017
Location
AU
bogrolls 3/14/2019 1:21pm
3/14/2019 1:21pm
mattbrown342 wrote:
I’m in the exact same situation. I’m restoring a 85 CR125 and bought a cover from Russel that is 700 cm. I’m I nterestd to see...
I’m in the exact same situation. I’m restoring a 85 CR125 and bought a cover from Russel that is 700 cm. I’m I nterestd to see if the 86 water pump worked.
Gday Matt,

Would you believe i'm still working on the bike. I went ahead and purchased the 86 gear and it fits the cover but i have not yet assembled that part of the engine so i can't say for sure that it'll be 100%.

This weekend I can send you pics of the 86 water pump and anything else you're interested in. I'd like to keep in touch with someone else restoring this exact model bike.

Here's what i've done lately, pressed all new swing arm, linkage, steering stem bearings and actually started slowly reassembling. My shock is being rebuilt which is due back on the 27th.








Cheers.
Smed
Profile picture for user Smed
Posts
114
Joined
11/21/2016
Location
KYABRAM, VIC AU
Smed 3/14/2019 4:46pm
3/14/2019 4:46pm
Looking good, I have got side tracked with my 85 CR125 too, I have brought a 84 & then some Mugen parts to go on it so it's been moved up in the line but am racing my 74 CR125 & 79 CR250 at the moment so they are taking up time/Dollars.
mattbrown342
Profile picture for user mattbrown342
Posts
9
Joined
3/13/2019
Location
Weatherford, TX US
mattbrown342 3/14/2019 5:59pm
3/14/2019 5:59pm
Hey, thanks for the response. The Paint looks great. I just finished tearing mine down. I paid $100 for the bike. It was pretty toast. I’ve had to order lots of parts. So no savings. I’ll definitely have more into it than it’s worth. I hoped to be racing this summer, but this is taking longer than anticipated. Finding parts for a 40 year bike is time consuming. This is my first full restoration and will be a challenge.

I ordered an 86 shaft after talking with a parts guy who has helped a few guys in the same situation. I’ll upload some pictures of my progress tomorrow.
bogrolls
Profile picture for user bogrolls
Posts
8
Joined
4/10/2017
Location
AU
bogrolls 3/28/2019 3:17pm
3/28/2019 3:17pm Edited Date/Time 3/28/2019 3:19pm
Gday,

Sounds good, I started looking at the engine a bit more and put in the water pump/governor stuff. I found that the sealing washer between the impeller and the seal was different on the 86 from the 85 so bought the right one from Honda (still readily available). So far it looks like it will all fit, I didn't actually press it all the way in over the dowels yet because i'll do that later when gaskets and what not are in place and ready.

Also received my rebuilt shock back and have recently had to search high and low for fork bushings as mine were flogged out. Happy to say I found a place in Australia that had 2 left (motoretro), CMSNL have them but it's expensive to get stuff shipped from there, I cleaned up my forks with wet and dry and gave a bit of a polish, they're not perfect but look neat enough. I've got another set of forks that are in better shape that I'll clean up if it's required.

I also cleaned up all the linkage bolts and attached it to the frame, starting to take shape.











Brian_Bowles 4/10/2019 7:47am
4/10/2019 7:47am
mattbrown342 wrote:
Hey, thanks for the response. The Paint looks great. I just finished tearing mine down. I paid $100 for the bike. It was pretty toast. I’ve...
Hey, thanks for the response. The Paint looks great. I just finished tearing mine down. I paid $100 for the bike. It was pretty toast. I’ve had to order lots of parts. So no savings. I’ll definitely have more into it than it’s worth. I hoped to be racing this summer, but this is taking longer than anticipated. Finding parts for a 40 year bike is time consuming. This is my first full restoration and will be a challenge.

I ordered an 86 shaft after talking with a parts guy who has helped a few guys in the same situation. I’ll upload some pictures of my progress tomorrow.
I hear you! I am doing a 1986 CR125 now. I may have to get an aluminum clutch cover. I will know when I get the old one off. When I take the clutch cover off do I need to remove the impeller? Also, how do I know if the seal is bad or the cover needs to be replaced?
bogrolls
Profile picture for user bogrolls
Posts
8
Joined
4/10/2017
Location
AU
bogrolls 4/12/2019 3:30am
4/12/2019 3:30am
From my point of view both of the original covers I had were either needing to be repaired or replaced, and it was obvious. Like most others they were badly corroded around the impeller. You do have to remove the impeller to swap the seal over the water pump shaft, as for how to know if the seal is bad I don’t really know. I’m far from a motorbike mechanic I just tinker and am slowly going through each part of the bike one by one. I like maintaining my bikes my main bike is a ktm 200exc and it rarely needs anything done on it.

I got my rebuilt forks back from the shop this week so might have a go at getting the frame down off the table and reassemble a bit more.

I also jb welded the cracked sprocket cover post back on to the engine case.




mattbrown342
Profile picture for user mattbrown342
Posts
9
Joined
3/13/2019
Location
Weatherford, TX US
mattbrown342 4/12/2019 5:01am
4/12/2019 5:01am
mattbrown342 wrote:
Hey, thanks for the response. The Paint looks great. I just finished tearing mine down. I paid $100 for the bike. It was pretty toast. I’ve...
Hey, thanks for the response. The Paint looks great. I just finished tearing mine down. I paid $100 for the bike. It was pretty toast. I’ve had to order lots of parts. So no savings. I’ll definitely have more into it than it’s worth. I hoped to be racing this summer, but this is taking longer than anticipated. Finding parts for a 40 year bike is time consuming. This is my first full restoration and will be a challenge.

I ordered an 86 shaft after talking with a parts guy who has helped a few guys in the same situation. I’ll upload some pictures of my progress tomorrow.
Brian_Bowles wrote:
I hear you! I am doing a 1986 CR125 now. I may have to get an aluminum clutch cover. I will know when I get the...
I hear you! I am doing a 1986 CR125 now. I may have to get an aluminum clutch cover. I will know when I get the old one off. When I take the clutch cover off do I need to remove the impeller? Also, how do I know if the seal is bad or the cover needs to be replaced?
In short, yes you will need to remove the impeller. As far as knowing if the cover needs replacing, just as bogrolls stated, it’ll be obvious. The sealing surfaces will be corroded and badly pitted. I spoke with a local machinist who said he could weld new magnesium into the cover and remachine it. To me, it just made more sense to buy the aluminum cover from Russell and not worry about corrosion in the future. I’m no expert, and just like bogrolls, I’m working through my bike one part at a time. I’ll post a few photos later. Enjoy the ride.
Brian_Bowles 4/12/2019 7:20am
4/12/2019 7:20am
Thanks Matt. I will check my cover this weekend. I had one bad area but I do not see much pitting. I will know better when I get it off. I think I will be ok. Even if I do not need a cover at this time I plan to buy one in the near future to have as a back up while They are available from Russell. I am missing the water pump separator. I cannot find one anywhere for a 1986 CR125. Here is what I have seen so far.

mattbrown342
Profile picture for user mattbrown342
Posts
9
Joined
3/13/2019
Location
Weatherford, TX US
mattbrown342 4/12/2019 5:35pm
4/12/2019 5:35pm
Photos can be difficult to make out, but it appears to be in good condition.
1
mattbrown342
Profile picture for user mattbrown342
Posts
9
Joined
3/13/2019
Location
Weatherford, TX US
mattbrown342 4/12/2019 5:48pm
4/12/2019 5:48pm
I’ve finished prepping and taping. I’ll paint as soon as I get some nice weather. It’s too cool right now. I’ve decided to try rattle cans. I’ve got a lot of money in parts already and decided not to pay to have it powder coated. I’m using VHT on the engine and colorite on the frame. I’m hoping it’ll hold up, but I’ve got my doubts.




Post a reply to: cr125 water pump/clutch cover help 1985/1986