Xtrig Rocs and Xtrig PHDS on SXF450 2019-21 = 10mm higher bar?

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8/8/2020 7:55 AM

Has anyone mounted this combo, and successfully gotten OEM height on the handlebar position?

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8/8/2020 7:58 AM

I have that setup on 19 350sxf, why do you think it’s 10mm up? I never measured but didn’t notice a big change.

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8/8/2020 7:59 AM

See picture. In the videos from Xtrig on Youtube, they mount the KTM with the fixed mount without spacer to get the right height i guess. But it also means, PHDS automatically raise the bar position?!

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Seem maybe they have done this (user lower bar mounts) to not change the triple clamp since it has more overall height then 2019+ OEM clamp?

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8/8/2020 8:01 AM

CarlinoJoeVideo wrote:

I have that setup on 19 350sxf, why do you think it’s 10mm up? I never measured but didn’t notice a big change.

See below. When i did run it with PHDS and Rocs, i instantly felt bars was way higher. Went back to my factory clamp and stock bar mounts, height came back to normal when riding.

Took the picture in the garage after the training today, so seem to get the same height you need to run the lower bar mounts (which also was Xtrig seem to be using in all their videos).

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8/8/2020 8:02 AM

CarlinoJoeVideo wrote:

I have that setup on 19 350sxf, why do you think it’s 10mm up? I never measured but didn’t notice a big change.

Is your part numbers Xtrig Rocs (40505003) and Xtrig PHDS (50200001)?

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8/9/2020 2:34 PM

Fuck that sucks. Really hate the stock bar mounts/clamps, just twist when you lay bike over.

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8/10/2020 7:22 AM
Edited Date/Time: 8/10/2020 7:26 AM

I have found one bar that has 69mm height, 10mm lower than OEM KTM bend. That is Protaper EVO bar called "steering stabilizer low". 51mm sweep.

I also got this info from Xtrig today, which i think is not giving the full picture of handlebar height after mounting Xtrig
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Rocs on 2019 chassi:
KTM OEM 38mm
PHDS 41mm
Fix 29mm

Fix + 10mm is also 1mm higher then STD.
PHDS 3mm higher then STD.
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I will need to remove and mount the clamps during week and measure the exact height from ground to see exact impact, but you say you measured 10mm?

My own calc shows the same, but that is not what Xtrig says. I have replied them and asked why/if not they take the metal spacer and the 5mm lower mount point (2019 chassi) of bars into consideration when they say the above. No reply yet on that.

If im sure it is 10mm difference, i will just order the Pro tape bar that is 69mm. But i want to be sure, so i dont end up with 3-5mm to low bar with the 69mm. Super picky about bar height. I could of course order 3-5mm spacers from Xtrig

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8/10/2020 8:30 AM

Yes that im aware of. PHDS they say is 3mm higher. Then you need to add the washer of 2.5mm (Stock clamp uses oring that adds 0 mm to height). That is 5.5mm difference

I will measure my stuff tonight or tomorrow, but the handlebar is another 5mm lower mounted from 2018.5 chassi and onward (i remember reading when they released the bike) and it does not come from different bar bend. Either it i frame angle, or triple clamp.

When i rode it, if felt way more than 5mm difference but could be wrong.

I also see now that the new Xtrig FlexFix is 5mm lower than the PHDS system. So maybe they came up with that since there is no way of lowering the PHDS?

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8/10/2020 3:10 PM

If you want mounts that don't twist up, but maintain the stock geometry, check ours out:

https://luxonmx.com/product-luxon-ktm-husqvarna-bar-mounts.html

More info:
https://luxonmx.com/blog-luxon-bar-mount-fix-ktm-husqvarna-twisting.html

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Billy Wight
Luxon MX
@LuxonMX
https://luxonmx.com
Motocross Components Engineered for Performance

8/10/2020 3:16 PM

Absolutely an option. But would like to get the handlebars moved slightly fwd which the xtrig allows me to do, OEM moves to much.

Have you done any vibration reduction testing between these and phds?

What I liked about the phds was that they took away slot of vibration. Always felt like other bikes vibrated more with OEM setup?

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8/10/2020 3:20 PM
Edited Date/Time: 8/10/2020 3:21 PM

Also since I know you are very knowledgeable within this area, a 2016 or 17 triple clamp for KTM, would they mean 5mm higher bar position automatically when mounted on a 2019+ chassi?

Just feel like there was no way just 2.5+3mm was all it was taller when I tested the xtrig and phds on my ktm. Felt more like 10 or 10+mm...?

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8/10/2020 3:26 PM

Yes, we tested back to back to back - KTM OEM style, Solid cones, and Xtrig a few years ago. There was no significant difference between the stock and Xtrig, certainly not enough to justify the 1 lb weight penalty. They sure look like they would dampen vibration better from the outside, but if you look at a cross section, there's really not much rubber isolation at all on the bottom cone (red) that you can't see. Solid cones were terrible, though!

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Billy Wight
Luxon MX
@LuxonMX
https://luxonmx.com
Motocross Components Engineered for Performance

8/10/2020 3:30 PM

We have a set of Xtrig Honda clamps here, but I'm assuming they're using the same PHDS parts across all brands. They are 2.5mm higher than the stock KTM stuff. But that also depends on how they made their KTM triple clamps and if the PHDS is indeed the same across all brands.

The KTM OEM clamps are the same geometry 2016 to current as far as where the bar mounts are placed.

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Billy Wight
Luxon MX
@LuxonMX
https://luxonmx.com
Motocross Components Engineered for Performance

8/10/2020 3:39 PM
Edited Date/Time: 8/10/2020 3:41 PM

Ok, KTM/Husky said they lowered the bar position 5mm for the 2018.5/2019 modells, so that need to come from frame adjustment/lowering then I assume.

The flexfix from xtrig is 5mm lower than phds. Wonder where that number comes from. If it is like you say, then if I would use the 2.5mm metal spacer and the xtrig rocs I would still be 2.5mm short. (Forget previous text, edit)

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8/10/2020 3:50 PM

Yeah, all the OEM bar mounts and triple clamps are the same geometry 2016+, so it's either a chassis change (that did change in 2019) or a bar bend change.

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Billy Wight
Luxon MX
@LuxonMX
https://luxonmx.com
Motocross Components Engineered for Performance

8/11/2020 3:20 AM

You happen to know if Xtrig include the 2.5mm spacer (that they say you should put under the top clamp instead of OEM oring), in getting the same Height/measurement as OEM clamp?

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8/11/2020 10:28 AM

I have no idea. All the measurements I posted above are from various stock KTM clamps and the set of Xtrig Honda clamps I have here, so I can't comment on the Xtrig KTM clamps specifically.

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Billy Wight
Luxon MX
@LuxonMX
https://luxonmx.com
Motocross Components Engineered for Performance

8/11/2020 11:56 AM

Yes, but I'm not sure they have even thought about the height it adds. It is used to seal toward frame but also to avoid top bolt to bottom towards axle. If I use a small oring instead and use the spacer under the main nut above the top triple clamp it of course adds no height but is against the instructions.

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8/11/2020 12:00 PM
Edited Date/Time: 8/11/2020 12:09 PM

Took some measurements today. Measured from the point that goes against frame on below clamp, to in line with under the bar. Used a thin knife blade of 1mm to get exact level measurement against the bar.

Overall height is 235mm (or 234 but blade is ~1mm) vs 240 for rocs, say 5mm. That does NOT include the 2.5mm spacer. So rocs + phds adds 7.5mm in height if installed nthe way xtrig wants with the spacer below top triple clamp. Bottom picture with full clamp is xtrig rocs. On bike is the factory triple clamp.

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8/11/2020 12:04 PM
Edited Date/Time: 8/11/2020 12:23 PM

So if I use the xtrig flexfix which is -5mm than phds I should get OEM height, if the PHDS adds 3mm (per info from xtrig), and the other 2mm comes from clamp itself, + 2.5mm washer added under clamp (basically 2+2.5 minus 5).

Freaking lot of work for running non OEM setup 😄

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8/18/2020 8:36 AM

I will place an order on these today.

Im interested in testing the triple clamp as well. Are they stiffer than the KTM factory clamps that i have now?


Feeling of Xtrig Rocs was, lets just say, not satisfactory.

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8/19/2020 6:04 PM

Thanks for the order, it went out yesterday!

Regarding the stiffness question, that's actually a rather complex topic. Stiffness is a directional quantity. The real question is "are they stiffer, and in which direction(s)?" An ideal clamp is nearly completely rigid in torsion (turning) and in vertical (fork compression direction) so you end up with precise steering and retain fork alignment in a bump. But it will be appropriately flexible laterally and (primarily) longitudinally for comfort. These goals are somewhat conflicting, but achievable to an extent.

A lot of people think the stock KTM clamps (the black ones) are rigid. That's actually backwards from reality. The stock KTM clamps are super flexible. So much that they allow fork misalignment which causes binding resulting in a harsher ride. They're also pretty sloppy in torsion and don't give a precise feel in corners.

The newer KTM factory clamps (same as the KTM Powerparts clamps) are stiffer than the regular stock KTM clamps in all directions except slightly less laterally (this is due to the split clamp feature). This is largely a good thing and the result is a good feeling clamp on the track. They're also split, which allows a smoother bend of the fork, which results in a smoother stroke of the fork and less binding. This all results in a more plush ride, despite the clamps actually being more rigid.

Relative the the KTM Factory (PowerParts) clamps, our new Gen2 clamps are very slightly less stiff longitudinally, which gives a bit more comfort, a good deal stiffer in torsion, bump, and laterally, which keeps the forks well aligned and creates a precise steering feel. They're also split, so you get that benefit too.

I don't have any numbers for the Xtrig clamps, so I can't comment specifically on those. I can comment on the split, though. They're only split on the outer section. You'll notice that the KTM Factory clamp and ours are actually split around the entire inside diameter. There's a reason for that!

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Billy Wight
Luxon MX
@LuxonMX
https://luxonmx.com
Motocross Components Engineered for Performance