Lt500r quadzilla engine conversion into mx frame

Polishhammer
Edited Date/Time 10/7/2019 7:15am
I picked up this engine fairly cheap due to the cracked case. I really want to put it into a 04-06 rmz250 frame but I'm concerned about the engines drastic counter shaft sprocket to swing arm offset. My 13 crf is approx 40mm, rm250 2t is 35mm, kx450f appears to be 35mm. Lt500 engine is approx 50mm. Does anyone know what the 04-06 rmz/kxf 250 is? What about ktms or Yamahas?



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lcgordon711
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lcgordon711 2/17/2018 7:08am
2/17/2018 7:08am
I feel like you gotta put it in some kind of Suzuki or you might as well use a Honda or kawi motor.
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harescrambled
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harescrambled 2/17/2018 11:43am
2/17/2018 11:43am Edited Date/Time 2/17/2018 12:14pm
Polishhammer wrote:
I picked up this engine fairly cheap due to the cracked case. I really want to put it into a 04-06 rmz250 frame but I'm concerned...
I picked up this engine fairly cheap due to the cracked case. I really want to put it into a 04-06 rmz250 frame but I'm concerned about the engines drastic counter shaft sprocket to swing arm offset. My 13 crf is approx 40mm, rm250 2t is 35mm, kx450f appears to be 35mm. Lt500 engine is approx 50mm. Does anyone know what the 04-06 rmz/kxf 250 is? What about ktms or Yamahas?



I have a 2004 RMZ250...I'll go measure it for you.
OK so it's about 35mm on the 2004 RMZ 250 also. What's the width across your swingarm bolt boss? It may be narrower than the RMZ cases, and if so you might be able to shim it
Turbojez
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Turbojez 2/18/2018 7:17am
2/18/2018 7:17am
Why would you put that motor into the 04-06 RMZ chassis? It wasn't the best chassis by any stretch, decent suspension would be pretty hard to come by. Only + is working on a steel frame instead of aluminum ones like 07+ RMZ's have.

The Shop

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Polishhammer 2/18/2018 11:16am
2/18/2018 11:16am
Polishhammer wrote:
I picked up this engine fairly cheap due to the cracked case. I really want to put it into a 04-06 rmz250 frame but I'm concerned...
I picked up this engine fairly cheap due to the cracked case. I really want to put it into a 04-06 rmz250 frame but I'm concerned about the engines drastic counter shaft sprocket to swing arm offset. My 13 crf is approx 40mm, rm250 2t is 35mm, kx450f appears to be 35mm. Lt500 engine is approx 50mm. Does anyone know what the 04-06 rmz/kxf 250 is? What about ktms or Yamahas?



harescrambled wrote:
I have a 2004 RMZ250...I'll go measure it for you. OK so it's about 35mm on the 2004 RMZ 250 also. What's the width across your...
I have a 2004 RMZ250...I'll go measure it for you.
OK so it's about 35mm on the 2004 RMZ 250 also. What's the width across your swingarm bolt boss? It may be narrower than the RMZ cases, and if so you might be able to shim it
The swing arm mount at the back of the lt500 engine is 95mm
The rm250 2t swing arm is 85mm . I could always cut the collars to use the rm one.
Polishhammer 2/18/2018 11:18am
2/18/2018 11:18am
Turbojez wrote:
Why would you put that motor into the 04-06 RMZ chassis? It wasn't the best chassis by any stretch, decent suspension would be pretty hard to...
Why would you put that motor into the 04-06 RMZ chassis? It wasn't the best chassis by any stretch, decent suspension would be pretty hard to come by. Only + is working on a steel frame instead of aluminum ones like 07+ RMZ's have.
I know it's not the best frame. It's steel so I could do most of the work myself. I guess I could just go with an aluminum rmz frame as they handle excellent.
harescrambled
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harescrambled 2/18/2018 3:43pm
2/18/2018 3:43pm
Polishhammer wrote:
The swing arm mount at the back of the lt500 engine is 95mm The rm250 2t swing arm is 85mm . I could always cut the...
The swing arm mount at the back of the lt500 engine is 95mm
The rm250 2t swing arm is 85mm . I could always cut the collars to use the rm one.
the 2004 RMZ250 cases are 92mm wide at the swingarm mount. you'll never make that work in that frame, and possibly any other frame without a jackshaft. Even if you get the engine into the RMZ swingarm, or use the RM swingarm, you're still going to have the countershaft sprocket 45mm outboard of the rear sprocket. Won't work...sorry
Polishhammer 2/19/2018 4:34am
2/19/2018 4:34am
The only way it would work is if the engine is moved slightly to the right. A Yamaha rear wheel has the sprocket around 10mm or so to the left. Its very close to swingarm but would work with the suzuki. Idk what the offset of sprocket to swing arm is on those. I'm not in a big rush.
These engines are counter balanced so the vibration is much less than a cr or kx. The transfer ports need work to make them run to their potential. It is around 17 or so pounds heavier than an rm250 engine though. About the same as a kx500.
pete24
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pete24 2/19/2018 6:21am
2/19/2018 6:21am
that motor is a turd dont watse your time by mx 500 standards it makes no power
metal_miracle 2/19/2018 5:30pm
2/19/2018 5:30pm
Hope you take lots of pics of the project. i allways wanted to see if someone would stuff that engine i a mx chassie
Polishhammer 2/22/2018 2:40pm
2/22/2018 2:40pm
metal_miracle wrote:
Hope you take lots of pics of the project. i allways wanted to see if someone would stuff that engine i a mx chassie
I met with a guy who specializes in aluminum welding. His welding looked really good! I'm going to need to buy a frame and swingarm to show him so we can figure out the alignment of the countershaft sprocket. Def have to run a Yamaha rear hub as it moves it left about 8mm or so. Id really like to get a 08 and up rmz450 frame as I really liked the handling of that bike. One of my favorite bikes.
Polishhammer 2/22/2018 2:44pm
2/22/2018 2:44pm
pete24 wrote:
that motor is a turd dont watse your time by mx 500 standards it makes no power
The transfer ports aren't set up right which held it back. Once I get the ports fixed up power won't be an issue. I remember my 90 quadzilla being very heavy compared to my old tecate 250.
harescrambled
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harescrambled 2/22/2018 6:21pm
2/22/2018 6:21pm
Polishhammer wrote:
The transfer ports aren't set up right which held it back. Once I get the ports fixed up power won't be an issue. I remember my...
The transfer ports aren't set up right which held it back. Once I get the ports fixed up power won't be an issue. I remember my 90 quadzilla being very heavy compared to my old tecate 250.
Hey don't let people get you down...do what you want. Don't worry about what they think...if you want to do it, then do it. I've not seen a LT500R motor in a bike chassis ever...be a cool project. The only thing I wonder is doesn't the kicker rotate forward? That's weird to me
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Polishhammer 2/23/2018 4:40pm
2/23/2018 4:40pm
Polishhammer wrote:
The transfer ports aren't set up right which held it back. Once I get the ports fixed up power won't be an issue. I remember my...
The transfer ports aren't set up right which held it back. Once I get the ports fixed up power won't be an issue. I remember my 90 quadzilla being very heavy compared to my old tecate 250.
harescrambled wrote:
Hey don't let people get you down...do what you want. Don't worry about what they think...if you want to do it, then do it. I've not...
Hey don't let people get you down...do what you want. Don't worry about what they think...if you want to do it, then do it. I've not seen a LT500R motor in a bike chassis ever...be a cool project. The only thing I wonder is doesn't the kicker rotate forward? That's weird to me
Kicker moves just like a dirt bike. The forward kickers were on the Honda atc 250r and the trx250r 2t quads. Yeah they were weird!
Moto Mofo
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Moto Mofo 2/23/2018 6:09pm
2/23/2018 6:09pm Edited Date/Time 2/23/2018 6:10pm
Do it, do it!!!!

And please keep the updates coming.
8686
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8686 2/25/2018 12:49pm
2/25/2018 12:49pm
Polishhammer wrote:
Kicker moves just like a dirt bike. The forward kickers were on the Honda atc 250r and the trx250r 2t quads. Yeah they were weird!
They’re not too bad. Now Suzuki had a sport quad that kicked straight out sideways from the machine. Talk about weird.

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Christopher_Sanchez 5/13/2018 12:23pm
5/13/2018 12:23pm
Any updates on this thread? I am VERY interested in seeing this happen as I want to stay brand appropriate and do it as well

Pit Row

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Polishhammer 5/14/2018 2:28am
5/14/2018 2:28am
The welder said in July he will have time to get the frame fabricated and welded. He's super busy right now. I'm in no rush so it works. Been busy trying to get this 09 crf450r project bike to start. I think k it's ecu or condenser.
queen of spodes 5/15/2018 10:11am
5/15/2018 10:11am
Polishhammer wrote:
The welder said in July he will have time to get the frame fabricated and welded. He's super busy right now. I'm in no rush so...
The welder said in July he will have time to get the frame fabricated and welded. He's super busy right now. I'm in no rush so it works. Been busy trying to get this 09 crf450r project bike to start. I think k it's ecu or condenser.
Did you wind up going with the steel RM frame or are you using AL? Don't forget the blue frame paint to match the engine.
Polishhammer 5/15/2018 1:09pm
5/15/2018 1:09pm
Aluminum rmz frame. Yes the blue is very important! Later in the summer I'm going to have to get a pipe for it. Thinking cr500 pipe with the lt500 flange welded onto it. The pipes made in Holland look really good!“
rob162
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rob162 5/15/2018 4:35pm
5/15/2018 4:35pm
Turbojez wrote:
Why would you put that motor into the 04-06 RMZ chassis? It wasn't the best chassis by any stretch, decent suspension would be pretty hard to...
Why would you put that motor into the 04-06 RMZ chassis? It wasn't the best chassis by any stretch, decent suspension would be pretty hard to come by. Only + is working on a steel frame instead of aluminum ones like 07+ RMZ's have.
Hey hey hey yhat chassis was GREAT!!! Still my favorite bikes. I sold my buddy my old 06 and im still faster and more comfortable on that then on any bike ive owned since. I actually have a 08 kxf collecting dust that might be getting a frame swap to steel if i can find a new or in good shape frame.
queen of spodes 5/16/2018 9:05pm
5/16/2018 9:05pm
Polishhammer wrote:
Aluminum rmz frame. Yes the blue is very important! Later in the summer I'm going to have to get a pipe for it. Thinking cr500 pipe...
Aluminum rmz frame. Yes the blue is very important! Later in the summer I'm going to have to get a pipe for it. Thinking cr500 pipe with the lt500 flange welded onto it. The pipes made in Holland look really good!“
Please make a build thread in Bike Builds
mikec265
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mikec265 5/19/2018 5:02pm
5/19/2018 5:02pm
Polishhammer wrote:
The only way it would work is if the engine is moved slightly to the right. A Yamaha rear wheel has the sprocket around 10mm or...
The only way it would work is if the engine is moved slightly to the right. A Yamaha rear wheel has the sprocket around 10mm or so to the left. Its very close to swingarm but would work with the suzuki. Idk what the offset of sprocket to swing arm is on those. I'm not in a big rush.
These engines are counter balanced so the vibration is much less than a cr or kx. The transfer ports need work to make them run to their potential. It is around 17 or so pounds heavier than an rm250 engine though. About the same as a kx500.
I put a KX500 into a 2001 RM250 chassis.
Weight difference on my scale was 7 pounds.
BlackMan
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BlackMan 3/4/2019 8:18am
3/4/2019 8:18am
lcgordon711 wrote:
I feel like you gotta put it in some kind of Suzuki or you might as well use a Honda or kawi motor.
Hello Polishhammer! I love your thinking. I am already well on my way with the same project only MUCH MORE radical! (details later) LT500 engine in a RM-Z450 frame, 2007.
Folks are asking why put it in a 2007 frame but I have never been anywhere near expert level so I could never tell the difference. As much as I love riding the RMZ I have never learned to race a 4-stroke. Used to ride an RM370, RM250, TM400. I've been racing 55+ in Texas for the last few years and will be doing 60+ now. Not even close to the best riders but you can't keep me off the track.
For one, a Suzuki engine must be in a Suzuki frame. Two, radical changes to the swing arm, engine moved way to the right but still close to center. Lower cradle intact but down tube chopped and modified. Not the best Aluminum welder but it works. Will send pictures of both my RADICAL RMZ projects. Both with big 2-strokes.

Keep up the good work!
BlackMan
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Polishhammer 3/8/2019 4:45am
3/8/2019 4:45am
Glad to see someone else attempting to use a lt500 engine!
The engine has potential to make a lot of hp but, the stock transfer ports need work. I would send the cylinder to Varner as he set some up for racing years ago that ran well.
The engine offset was drastic so I sold mine and used the money to buy a 88 cr500 engine to use. The cp500 conversions make it easy to put into the crf chassis. If I was into quads I would have kept the quadzilla to put in a blown ltr450
Good luck! I’ll be looking for your thread in he build section!
BlackMan
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BlackMan 10/5/2019 8:46pm
10/5/2019 8:46pm
I had to do it, I mostly completed my two Unicorn projects. The RMz500LT is about 98% complete, the TM400z is done.
I kick started the RM500LT yesterday. I still need to install the radiators, muffler...The frame is the 2007 RMz-450, the engine is the 1984 LT500R. I went ahead and fabricated a Full Floater out of aluminum so this is my three-eyed Unicorn. That's a swing-arm from a 1984 RM250, shock from the RM465 (I had an extra shock from the I raced the last couple of years). Honda CR500 pipe. I had to install the engine a bit far to the right so I built the lower frame to accommodate the placement.

NOTE: This is all aluminum welding practice for another project. I've gotten good at it!

The TM400z is a 2006 frame with the 1971 TM400 engine. I started this project a few years ago and rode it at Thunder Valley in Colorado(raced the 1989 RM250 in the 50+ class). Someone asked if I was going to make it more like the original so I removed the 1984 RM250 pipe and went with the original TM400 down pipe. No I will not take any close up pictures of the tank. It is the plastic RMz tank that I configured with fiberglass. It's ugly up close. I did some additional frame work to make it more solid. The down tube and under carriage is steel. The bike runs GREAT! I may get it to the track (Rio Bravo here in Houston) in the next month or so.

I race the 2012 RMz-450 in the over 55 class for the last few years. NEVER learned to ride 4-strokes. I grew up on big bore 2-strokes. That bottom picture is me at age 16 in 1975 with my first bike, the 1971 TM 400. The right side is me at 60 this year. Raced that RMz-450 at Cycle Ranch in San Antonio, Rio Bravo, Freedom, Murphy's, and Three Palms.

I can add more pictures if anyone is interested.

Note: Someone said the LT500 is a turd. I don't know. I have a 40 mm carb and will be testing it with the '71 TM400 CDI.





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Polishhammer 10/7/2019 7:15am
10/7/2019 7:15am
I can’t believe you found a way for that engine to fit! You’re very determined! The quadzilla English be came with very conservative porting. Terry Varner said he built some race quadzillas back in the day that ran very well.

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