17 CRF450 Springs

rg478
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12/28/2016 8:01am
Is anybody stocking springs yet for the 17 CRF450? Spoke to factory connection, they mentioned February and Race Tech doesn't have anything listed on their site either. Since these forks are supposedly the 49mm "A-kit"specs, would those springs work? Also need a shock spring, the shock looks completely different than previous models. Any help would be awesome!
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m21racing
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12/28/2016 8:34am Edited Date/Time 12/28/2016 8:37am
Call Cannon Racecraft in Oklahoma. They are making shock springs on custom order basis. The shock spring is like 240mm free length. My homie just did one. He's testing this week.

You can ask Cannon if you can mail in a fork/shock spring so they can spec them if it's not on market yet. As of earlier this week , they had not gotten one yet.
slipdog
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12/28/2016 11:51am
Like my homie above said, you're out of luck for now on the shock spring.

That said, the fork springs are 44mm X 473mm and you can use the 2010-2013 YZ 450/2007-20012 KX 450 fork spring which is 44mm X 470mm. The spring seat is held on the cartridge by a circlip and they have a second circlip grove 3.5mm below the stock one, move the circlip to the lower groove and you effectively have 473.5mm
rg478
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12/28/2016 12:08pm
slipdog wrote:
Like my homie above said, you're out of luck for now on the shock spring. That said, the fork springs are 44mm X 473mm and you...
Like my homie above said, you're out of luck for now on the shock spring.

That said, the fork springs are 44mm X 473mm and you can use the 2010-2013 YZ 450/2007-20012 KX 450 fork spring which is 44mm X 470mm. The spring seat is held on the cartridge by a circlip and they have a second circlip grove 3.5mm below the stock one, move the circlip to the lower groove and you effectively have 473.5mm
Thanks for the input guys. By talking to local tuners and even the big shops it looks like they are just getting their hands on the components and still need to do some testing before they can even have the stuff made. Oh well, I guess it could be worse!
aedwards07
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12/28/2016 4:30pm
slipdog wrote:
Like my homie above said, you're out of luck for now on the shock spring. That said, the fork springs are 44mm X 473mm and you...
Like my homie above said, you're out of luck for now on the shock spring.

That said, the fork springs are 44mm X 473mm and you can use the 2010-2013 YZ 450/2007-20012 KX 450 fork spring which is 44mm X 470mm. The spring seat is held on the cartridge by a circlip and they have a second circlip grove 3.5mm below the stock one, move the circlip to the lower groove and you effectively have 473.5mm
Slip you rock! Thats what info I needed. Any possible downside of moving the spring seat to the next groove?

The Shop

slipdog
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12/28/2016 5:15pm
slipdog wrote:
Like my homie above said, you're out of luck for now on the shock spring. That said, the fork springs are 44mm X 473mm and you...
Like my homie above said, you're out of luck for now on the shock spring.

That said, the fork springs are 44mm X 473mm and you can use the 2010-2013 YZ 450/2007-20012 KX 450 fork spring which is 44mm X 470mm. The spring seat is held on the cartridge by a circlip and they have a second circlip grove 3.5mm below the stock one, move the circlip to the lower groove and you effectively have 473.5mm
aedwards07 wrote:
Slip you rock! Thats what info I needed. Any possible downside of moving the spring seat to the next groove?
No issue at all. The spring seats aren't very restrictive compared to a SX style designed to add extra damping and even if they were, nobody could notice the difference of them entering the oil 3.5mm sooner. I use small machined aluminum spacers all the time to relocate the spring seat to add preload to certain springs and even cut down the spring seat to remove some.
rg478
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12/29/2016 7:10am
slipdog wrote:
Like my homie above said, you're out of luck for now on the shock spring. That said, the fork springs are 44mm X 473mm and you...
Like my homie above said, you're out of luck for now on the shock spring.

That said, the fork springs are 44mm X 473mm and you can use the 2010-2013 YZ 450/2007-20012 KX 450 fork spring which is 44mm X 470mm. The spring seat is held on the cartridge by a circlip and they have a second circlip grove 3.5mm below the stock one, move the circlip to the lower groove and you effectively have 473.5mm
aedwards07 wrote:
Slip you rock! Thats what info I needed. Any possible downside of moving the spring seat to the next groove?
slipdog wrote:
No issue at all. The spring seats aren't very restrictive compared to a SX style designed to add extra damping and even if they were, nobody...
No issue at all. The spring seats aren't very restrictive compared to a SX style designed to add extra damping and even if they were, nobody could notice the difference of them entering the oil 3.5mm sooner. I use small machined aluminum spacers all the time to relocate the spring seat to add preload to certain springs and even cut down the spring seat to remove some.
Quick question, are the fork caps 50mm or 49mm ?
slipdog
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12/29/2016 7:46am
It takes the same cap wrench as all the Showa forks so I assume that's 50mm?, The KYB wrench is slightly smaller so maybe that's 49mm, I can't say I've ever measured them I've just always had the wrenches in my tool box, lol.

The compression base valve uses a 40mm wrench/socket now instead of the 32mm they always use to use.
m21racing
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12/29/2016 8:21am
You testing today slip? I can always use an excuse to leave shop and drink beer. Lol
I'll probably roll out there lunchtime for an hour or so.
slipdog
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12/29/2016 9:44am
m21racing wrote:
You testing today slip? I can always use an excuse to leave shop and drink beer. Lol I'll probably roll out there lunchtime for an hour...
You testing today slip? I can always use an excuse to leave shop and drink beer. Lol
I'll probably roll out there lunchtime for an hour or so.
I'll be at Hangtown by 1pm
aedwards07
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12/29/2016 10:43am
Slip have you ran the yzf springs in the 17 crf? I ran it by someone else and they said the ID is smaller on the yzf springs.
slipdog
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12/29/2016 11:58am Edited Date/Time 12/29/2016 11:59am
I''m loading up to go riding with them right now. Springs can vary depending on how they're wound, but the CRF springs I took out have an OD of 44.20mm and ID of 34.10mm. Another set of stock '12 YZ 450 springs I have here have OD 44.05mm and ID 34.15mm. They are basically the same minus the 3mm in length.

The top two are the '17 CRF and the bottom one is the '12YZ



Kartwheel
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12/30/2016 12:00pm
2015/16 CRF250R shock springs should work, both shocks are 50mm SHOWA and the spring length is the same
aedwards07
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1/1/2017 5:04pm
Slip how did the fork springs turn out? If all is good I'll order some up in the morning.
slipdog
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1/1/2017 8:15pm
aedwards07 wrote:
Slip how did the fork springs turn out? If all is good I'll order some up in the morning.
It worked out fine on Thursday, we put about an hour on the bike and he took it for a ride day Saturday. He's bringing it back tomorrow for some more testing and I'll check actual installed preload because I was in a hurry to get ready for Thursday and just made sure the total length was the same.
aedwards07
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1/2/2017 4:22am
Sounds good. I'll order some up once I hear they are good to go. Thanks!
slipdog
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1/2/2017 7:00am
If you are not wanting to wait another 6+ weeks for springs to go into production this is a good option right now. No different when RaceTech was selling 470mm springs for the 497mm '14 YZ when they first came out. They added a 25mm spacer in the box and that was their option until they had the 497's in stock.

If you can't make them, you can buy several different sized preload spacers here to get installed preload where you want it. http://www.suspensiondirect.com/shop/elite-parts/1-elite-fork-parts/d-s…
aedwards07
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1/2/2017 7:12am
Sounds good. I will order up a set today. Thanks for all the help!
rg478
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1/2/2017 10:28am
slipdog wrote:
If you are not wanting to wait another 6+ weeks for springs to go into production this is a good option right now. No different when...
If you are not wanting to wait another 6+ weeks for springs to go into production this is a good option right now. No different when RaceTech was selling 470mm springs for the 497mm '14 YZ when they first came out. They added a 25mm spacer in the box and that was their option until they had the 497's in stock.

If you can't make them, you can buy several different sized preload spacers here to get installed preload where you want it. http://www.suspensiondirect.com/shop/elite-parts/1-elite-fork-parts/d-s…
Is that true about the 15-16 crf250r shock spring being the same ? I hadn't heard that yet and honestly a little doubtful as this shock is completely different and mounted so much lower to the frame.
m21racing
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1/2/2017 10:32am
No, from what i saw on the 17, 240mm is new . Cannon told me a 245mm spring is pushing it as far as fitment.
slipdog
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1/2/2017 10:42am
m21racing wrote:
No, from what i saw on the 17, 240mm is new . Cannon told me a 245mm spring is pushing it as far as fitment.
^^Like Marc said, the '17 CRF is 240 and it barley uncovers the retaining collar circlip when you unscrew the preload collars all the way down. The CRF 250 is 250, to my knowledge, so you'd need a spring compressor to put it on and you'd be somewhere at 7-8mm preload minimum with no adjustability left
rg478
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1/3/2017 8:43am
slipdog wrote:
If you are not wanting to wait another 6+ weeks for springs to go into production this is a good option right now. No different when...
If you are not wanting to wait another 6+ weeks for springs to go into production this is a good option right now. No different when RaceTech was selling 470mm springs for the 497mm '14 YZ when they first came out. They added a 25mm spacer in the box and that was their option until they had the 497's in stock.

If you can't make them, you can buy several different sized preload spacers here to get installed preload where you want it. http://www.suspensiondirect.com/shop/elite-parts/1-elite-fork-parts/d-s…
Slip, thanks for all this information. Sorry for the multiple questions but you definitely seem to know your stuff. I have been told in the past that crf's stock installed preload is between 5-8mm on the forks, don't know how correct this is. If I installed the KX springs which are 3mm shorter and didn't move the retainer ring, wouldn't that allow me to run a stiffer spring with a mellower initial stroke by reducing the installed preload? I've heard of guys needing to have their cartridges machined for the higher retainer slot, but this seems like it would essentially work the same way. Your thoughts?
slipdog
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1/3/2017 9:33am
In theory, yes, a little less preload will ease the initial engagement of the spring. My concern with these forks(Showa) is that you must know actual preload because the Showa fork use a loose recessed collar to retain the circlip on the cartridge.

Several years back I had someone bring in CRF 250 forks sitting part way through the stroke. They had the local dealership install softer springs and they misread the catalog and installed 454mm yz springs instead of 460mm crf springs. Stock preload was 6mm so the YZ springs made it 0 and after a few weeks of riding the "looseness" at the top of the stroke eventually deformed the retaining collars and pushed them up over the circlips. Couldn't get the collars from Honda or Suspension Direct so eventually had to machine my own on my lathe to fix it, PITA!

The '17 CRF seems to have a good amount of static sag in the front and that's why I I'm curious to measure it this week. You would need to be sure you kept enough preload on the springs to securely hold the spring seat and retaining collar in place. Not as big of a deal with KYB because theirs are crimped in place over the circlip from the factory
slipdog
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1/4/2017 6:13pm
rg478 wrote:
Slip, thanks for all this information. Sorry for the multiple questions but you definitely seem to know your stuff. I have been told in the past...
Slip, thanks for all this information. Sorry for the multiple questions but you definitely seem to know your stuff. I have been told in the past that crf's stock installed preload is between 5-8mm on the forks, don't know how correct this is. If I installed the KX springs which are 3mm shorter and didn't move the retainer ring, wouldn't that allow me to run a stiffer spring with a mellower initial stroke by reducing the installed preload? I've heard of guys needing to have their cartridges machined for the higher retainer slot, but this seems like it would essentially work the same way. Your thoughts?
Hey you definitely don't want to install the 470mm KX/YZ springs without moving the circlip. I just measured the preload and it's only 3mm so you'd be at 0. You also can't use the preload spacers from SDI that I linked because they're 28mm ID and the CRF is 29mm ID. I just used 3mm of KTM preload spacers between the seat and spring to get it to 6mm.
rg478
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1/6/2017 2:51pm
rg478 wrote:
Slip, thanks for all this information. Sorry for the multiple questions but you definitely seem to know your stuff. I have been told in the past...
Slip, thanks for all this information. Sorry for the multiple questions but you definitely seem to know your stuff. I have been told in the past that crf's stock installed preload is between 5-8mm on the forks, don't know how correct this is. If I installed the KX springs which are 3mm shorter and didn't move the retainer ring, wouldn't that allow me to run a stiffer spring with a mellower initial stroke by reducing the installed preload? I've heard of guys needing to have their cartridges machined for the higher retainer slot, but this seems like it would essentially work the same way. Your thoughts?
slipdog wrote:
Hey you definitely don't want to install the 470mm KX/YZ springs without moving the circlip. I just measured the preload and it's only 3mm so you'd...
Hey you definitely don't want to install the 470mm KX/YZ springs without moving the circlip. I just measured the preload and it's only 3mm so you'd be at 0. You also can't use the preload spacers from SDI that I linked because they're 28mm ID and the CRF is 29mm ID. I just used 3mm of KTM preload spacers between the seat and spring to get it to 6mm.


Just got the springs in, these specs look a little different, you think it's still OK to use?
slipdog
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1/6/2017 3:38pm
rg478 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/01/06/167593/s1200_1483743003794844021663.jpg[/img] Just got the springs in, these specs look a little different, you think it's still OK to use?


Just got the springs in, these specs look a little different, you think it's still OK to use?
You're going to have to measure the OD of the top coil to verify dimensions and then dry fit them(I assume you're installing them yourself) to check clearances. Check to see there is clearance over the cartridge and they rest on the spring seat without being undersized. You will also need to make sure they drop down into the fork tube and over the bottoming cone without rubbing.

I don't use Race Tech springs so I don't have any to measure, but I have many sets of OEM KYB springs in different rates and they all are right on 470mm length and 44mm OD just like the KYB catalog states.
aedwards07
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1/7/2017 4:30am
Cannon racecraft has springs available now.
1HRCrider
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1/8/2017 3:34pm
Really like the Red Chrome rear springs on the Factory bikes. Anything available to the public?
rg478
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1/10/2017 5:37pm
rg478 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/01/06/167593/s1200_1483743003794844021663.jpg[/img] Just got the springs in, these specs look a little different, you think it's still OK to use?


Just got the springs in, these specs look a little different, you think it's still OK to use?
slipdog wrote:
You're going to have to measure the OD of the top coil to verify dimensions and then dry fit them(I assume you're installing them yourself) to...
You're going to have to measure the OD of the top coil to verify dimensions and then dry fit them(I assume you're installing them yourself) to check clearances. Check to see there is clearance over the cartridge and they rest on the spring seat without being undersized. You will also need to make sure they drop down into the fork tube and over the bottoming cone without rubbing.

I don't use Race Tech springs so I don't have any to measure, but I have many sets of OEM KYB springs in different rates and they all are right on 470mm length and 44mm OD just like the KYB catalog states.
Everything went in fine, pretty straightforward . These springs looked to be almost exactly the same length as stock, but I moved the circlip down to be safe. Diameter didn't seem to be an issue as well, they cleared the cartridges and bottoming cone fine. Word of advice to anyone who works on these in the future, your standard cartridge holder tool won't work, the dampening rods are 15mm. Ended up needing to fab something really quick to make it work. I'll be riding with them tomorrow and probably put a few hours on them before pulling them apart, changing the oil and inspecting for any abnormal wear to make sure all is good.
zlowery
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3/25/2017 6:05pm
Anyone know of springs that are available now? Thanks!
rg478
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3/25/2017 8:29pm
Give Cannon Racecraft a call, awesome people to work with. I ultimately ended up calling them and ordered the correct springs as it was constantly bugging me knowing I didn't have the right springs in my forks. They told me the shock spring was backordered and could be a 3 week wait. Both fork and shock springs showed up at my door a week after placing my order, couldn't be happier with their service and product.

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