mMinimum wage bill will cost jobs, CBO says

borg
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borg
Edited Date/Time 2/20/2014 9:45am
Here

The spin will be interesting on this one.
When you remove the lowest rung on the ladder, fewer people will be able to get on. It's that simple. Also when you force the minimum wage higher, people will stay at that wage longer. Right now, a very small percentage of people on minimum wage stay at that rate. I don't have the numbers but they're available.
The bottom line is that forcing MW's higher results in higher unemployment for young people and other low skilled people. Those that have a MW job will see a higher income for a time but will stay there longer. Some of you maybe OK with that tradeoff. It's a no win situation for those that are against the Federal minimum wage. The winners see the results right away, more money. The losers, with the exception of those let go because of the increase, don't really know why they cant find a job. They don't know who to blame.
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SEE ARE125
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SEE ARE125 2/18/2014 1:24pm
2/18/2014 1:24pm
I have to laugh at those that support this. They're effin clueless. The same people for the minimum wage increase are the same people for wealth redistribution. How contradictory is that?
mx757
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mx757 2/18/2014 1:32pm
2/18/2014 1:32pm
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more inflation? I know it sounds nice for them to be making $15 an hour, but when that's your base then that means the companies are going to have to make up for it somewhere, usually by charging more for their products and services, meaning the cost of living increases everywhere, and that $15 an hour gets people just as far as the $8 an hour did before.
JW381
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JW381 2/18/2014 1:37pm
2/18/2014 1:37pm
mx757 wrote:
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more...
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more inflation? I know it sounds nice for them to be making $15 an hour, but when that's your base then that means the companies are going to have to make up for it somewhere, usually by charging more for their products and services, meaning the cost of living increases everywhere, and that $15 an hour gets people just as far as the $8 an hour did before.
No shit, it's such a short term solution to a vastly long term problem

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Mr. G
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Mr. G 2/18/2014 1:53pm
2/18/2014 1:53pm
mx757 wrote:
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more...
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more inflation? I know it sounds nice for them to be making $15 an hour, but when that's your base then that means the companies are going to have to make up for it somewhere, usually by charging more for their products and services, meaning the cost of living increases everywhere, and that $15 an hour gets people just as far as the $8 an hour did before.
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see more and more. It is a shame.
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J.F.S 2/18/2014 2:27pm
2/18/2014 2:27pm
mx757 wrote:
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more...
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more inflation? I know it sounds nice for them to be making $15 an hour, but when that's your base then that means the companies are going to have to make up for it somewhere, usually by charging more for their products and services, meaning the cost of living increases everywhere, and that $15 an hour gets people just as far as the $8 an hour did before.
Mr. G wrote:
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see...
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see more and more. It is a shame.
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher salary? Are you willing to make less in order to cool down the inflation? Tax cuts also create inflation, so you people, with your juvenile and simplified "logic" want lower salaries and higher taxes? Or are just being dumb enough to simplify things, so that you can make stupid arguments that in reality only reinforces how extremely ignorant and uninterested you really are. It is so obvious how you try to create a persona of a well read, rightwing, good ole christian, white, rich guy, when in reality we all know, due to your posts, that you are a poor, working class, un educated, atheist. Not that there is anything wrong with the later, I actually prefer the later, it is only sad that you do not seem to want to be yourself. And it is sad, that when you try to be something you are not, you come out as really dumb and unsympathetic.
borg
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borg 2/18/2014 3:27pm
2/18/2014 3:27pm Edited Date/Time 2/18/2014 3:28pm
J.F.S wrote:
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher...
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher salary? Are you willing to make less in order to cool down the inflation? Tax cuts also create inflation, so you people, with your juvenile and simplified "logic" want lower salaries and higher taxes? Or are just being dumb enough to simplify things, so that you can make stupid arguments that in reality only reinforces how extremely ignorant and uninterested you really are. It is so obvious how you try to create a persona of a well read, rightwing, good ole christian, white, rich guy, when in reality we all know, due to your posts, that you are a poor, working class, un educated, atheist. Not that there is anything wrong with the later, I actually prefer the later, it is only sad that you do not seem to want to be yourself. And it is sad, that when you try to be something you are not, you come out as really dumb and unsympathetic.
I have made no claims about inflation. Would you care to comment on my assertion that increasing minimum wages increases youth unemployment? And please don't ask me to provide a list of links to articles. They are easily obtainable by anyone that really wants the information.
Brad460
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Brad460 2/18/2014 4:06pm
2/18/2014 4:06pm
mx757 wrote:
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more...
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more inflation? I know it sounds nice for them to be making $15 an hour, but when that's your base then that means the companies are going to have to make up for it somewhere, usually by charging more for their products and services, meaning the cost of living increases everywhere, and that $15 an hour gets people just as far as the $8 an hour did before.
Mr. G wrote:
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see...
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see more and more. It is a shame.
J.F.S wrote:
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher...
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher salary? Are you willing to make less in order to cool down the inflation? Tax cuts also create inflation, so you people, with your juvenile and simplified "logic" want lower salaries and higher taxes? Or are just being dumb enough to simplify things, so that you can make stupid arguments that in reality only reinforces how extremely ignorant and uninterested you really are. It is so obvious how you try to create a persona of a well read, rightwing, good ole christian, white, rich guy, when in reality we all know, due to your posts, that you are a poor, working class, un educated, atheist. Not that there is anything wrong with the later, I actually prefer the later, it is only sad that you do not seem to want to be yourself. And it is sad, that when you try to be something you are not, you come out as really dumb and unsympathetic.
I think OF stole your screen name and password...

Being able to control your emotions when attacked is a sign of intelligence....you might want to work on that...I can just see you sitting there seething banging the keys..Laughing

Unfortunately I don't think simply raising the minimum wage will bring anyone out of poverty...We really need to focus on education and teaching people how to "raise assets to a higher level". Teach skills which generate revenue...increase value.. Increase efficiency...

If you as an employee are stuck at minimum wage you need to take a long look in the mirror....more than likely the problem lies with you, not your boss, not your company, and not the government...
Mr. G
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Mr. G 2/18/2014 6:19pm
2/18/2014 6:19pm
mx757 wrote:
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more...
Why do people not realize that raising the minimum wage, especially to the ridiculous amounts that people are screaming for, will create nothing more than more inflation? I know it sounds nice for them to be making $15 an hour, but when that's your base then that means the companies are going to have to make up for it somewhere, usually by charging more for their products and services, meaning the cost of living increases everywhere, and that $15 an hour gets people just as far as the $8 an hour did before.
Mr. G wrote:
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see...
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see more and more. It is a shame.
J.F.S wrote:
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher...
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher salary? Are you willing to make less in order to cool down the inflation? Tax cuts also create inflation, so you people, with your juvenile and simplified "logic" want lower salaries and higher taxes? Or are just being dumb enough to simplify things, so that you can make stupid arguments that in reality only reinforces how extremely ignorant and uninterested you really are. It is so obvious how you try to create a persona of a well read, rightwing, good ole christian, white, rich guy, when in reality we all know, due to your posts, that you are a poor, working class, un educated, atheist. Not that there is anything wrong with the later, I actually prefer the later, it is only sad that you do not seem to want to be yourself. And it is sad, that when you try to be something you are not, you come out as really dumb and unsympathetic.
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees and those that are parasitic in nature.
JW381
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JW381 2/18/2014 6:34pm
2/18/2014 6:34pm
Mr. G wrote:
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see...
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see more and more. It is a shame.
J.F.S wrote:
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher...
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher salary? Are you willing to make less in order to cool down the inflation? Tax cuts also create inflation, so you people, with your juvenile and simplified "logic" want lower salaries and higher taxes? Or are just being dumb enough to simplify things, so that you can make stupid arguments that in reality only reinforces how extremely ignorant and uninterested you really are. It is so obvious how you try to create a persona of a well read, rightwing, good ole christian, white, rich guy, when in reality we all know, due to your posts, that you are a poor, working class, un educated, atheist. Not that there is anything wrong with the later, I actually prefer the later, it is only sad that you do not seem to want to be yourself. And it is sad, that when you try to be something you are not, you come out as really dumb and unsympathetic.
Mr. G wrote:
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees...
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees and those that are parasitic in nature.
Are you implying that everyone should take entrepreneurial risks, and anyone who doesn't is a parasitic employee? Good for you on your choice to be self employed. Glad it worked out for you, also. But check your arrogance at the door, that's not some sole righteous path reserved only for capitalistic warriors. You have your place in the economy, as do others. Not to say increasing minimum wage will be beneficial, but that argument is tired and narrow, at best.
tunedlength
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tunedlength 2/18/2014 8:47pm
2/18/2014 8:47pm
JW381
You made his point all inclusive.
He did say many,not all.

As far as the topic we need to ask ourselves what is a livable wage?
Should every job pay a livable wage?
I asked this in a previous thread and Nerd was the only one willing to take a stab at it.
His reply something to the effect of "What ever it takes to get people off of welfare"
This link shows equivalent welfare hourly wage.
So in California this equals $11.59 for an individual.
How many would leave the welfare system (assuming there are jobs available) if we increased the MW to $15?
JW381
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JW381 2/18/2014 9:20pm
2/18/2014 9:20pm Edited Date/Time 2/18/2014 9:22pm
tunedlength wrote:
JW381 You made his point all inclusive. He did say many,not all. As far as the topic we need to ask ourselves what is a livable...
JW381
You made his point all inclusive.
He did say many,not all.

As far as the topic we need to ask ourselves what is a livable wage?
Should every job pay a livable wage?
I asked this in a previous thread and Nerd was the only one willing to take a stab at it.
His reply something to the effect of "What ever it takes to get people off of welfare"
This link shows equivalent welfare hourly wage.
So in California this equals $11.59 for an individual.
How many would leave the welfare system (assuming there are jobs available) if we increased the MW to $15?
You are correct, but I didn't technically make his point all-inclusive, I asked him if he was implying something that was all-inclusive. But you're right, I should have chose to word that more appropriately. But why even make a comparison to employees and "those that are parasitic in nature"? Employees are the backbone of the entire system, after all. I still think what I said holds ground.

I agree with your point on a livable wage providing a way off of welfare, but that doesn't solve the problem of employers raising costs to account for the increases in wages paid. I'm not a business owner, but I find it frustrating that employers will do whatever to hold their advantage in the wage gap. I know that sounds like "socialist wealth re-distribution" to some of you, but if the richest capitalists actually support the economy then they'd support more disposable income in circulation, yes?

Again, I'm really not for increasing minimum wage under present circumstances, but I don't think an increased min. wage with decreased welfare (as you mentioned and as Nerd proposed in another thread) would have the disastrous effects on inflation and self-determinated workers the way some seem to be prospecting. Make working the only way to get by, increase the wages to get more money circulating, and decrease welfare. Simple, yes, but bad idea? I don't think so.
Mr. G
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Mr. G 2/18/2014 9:56pm
2/18/2014 9:56pm
You sure assume a lot. The parasitic comment was aimed at welfare recipients that are able bodied. Not everybody should be self employed as not all are cut out for it. Besides it is not a degraded thing to be an employee but I do think the world would be a better place if more people were self employed. Most people don't think highly enough of themselves in comparison to what they are really capable of. It is far higher usually. There are exceptions of course.
JW381
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JW381 2/18/2014 10:05pm
2/18/2014 10:05pm
Mr. G wrote:
You sure assume a lot. The parasitic comment was aimed at welfare recipients that are able bodied. Not everybody should be self employed as not all...
You sure assume a lot. The parasitic comment was aimed at welfare recipients that are able bodied. Not everybody should be self employed as not all are cut out for it. Besides it is not a degraded thing to be an employee but I do think the world would be a better place if more people were self employed. Most people don't think highly enough of themselves in comparison to what they are really capable of. It is far higher usually. There are exceptions of course.
I think the biggest problem with self-employment is a result of two things: a) corporations cornering markets and forcing self-employed business to go under and b) the education system forcing degrees and certificates on the workforce. I understand you don't need a degree to be self-employed, but you do in many instances, and a certificate of some kind is required in even more situations (plumbers, electricians, pharmacy technicians, hell even kindergarten teachers). I'm all for a workforce that is as educated and specialized as it possibly can be, but with the astronomical cost of education post-high school, it's not even remotely viable for a graduate to undertake a startup self-employment journey.

Excuse the emotion in my first comment, I'm only interested in civil debate amongst good, American beer-drinking men Cool
Sully
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Sully 2/18/2014 10:34pm
2/18/2014 10:34pm
Legit question, because I honestly don't know: How does raising the minimum wage not just push the poverty level up to the next step? Wouldn't companies have to compensate the people currently making $10/hr to account for previous raises? And people making $12/hr would then need to make more, and so on up the chain. I'm no economist, but the way I see it, no matter what the brain trust in DC thinks, raising minimum wage will raise the cost of goods.
Mr. G
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Mr. G 2/18/2014 10:46pm
2/18/2014 10:46pm
We will probably never all agree on the way to go about it as people are people and have different ideas but from my viewpoint I want to country as a whole up it's production. If the production of the entire country is increased it lowers prices and offers more jobs to do the production. In my little neck of the woods I have never produced more yet I make way less than ever. Why? Because the entire fire protection industry is in a slump along with many other industries. You must be competitive or die and I wouldn't have it any other way. The one point about being self employed that never gets talked about is the fact that I can never be fired. Sure a general contractor can stop calling but there are others. It is at the end of the day a much more secure position to be in since my future is more or less governed by the good or bad actions I do. And so we work in hopes that this country get it's act together.
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tunedlength 2/18/2014 11:15pm
2/18/2014 11:15pm
Mr. G wrote:
You sure assume a lot. The parasitic comment was aimed at welfare recipients that are able bodied. Not everybody should be self employed as not all...
You sure assume a lot. The parasitic comment was aimed at welfare recipients that are able bodied. Not everybody should be self employed as not all are cut out for it. Besides it is not a degraded thing to be an employee but I do think the world would be a better place if more people were self employed. Most people don't think highly enough of themselves in comparison to what they are really capable of. It is far higher usually. There are exceptions of course.
JW381 wrote:
I think the biggest problem with self-employment is a result of two things: a) corporations cornering markets and forcing self-employed business to go under and b)...
I think the biggest problem with self-employment is a result of two things: a) corporations cornering markets and forcing self-employed business to go under and b) the education system forcing degrees and certificates on the workforce. I understand you don't need a degree to be self-employed, but you do in many instances, and a certificate of some kind is required in even more situations (plumbers, electricians, pharmacy technicians, hell even kindergarten teachers). I'm all for a workforce that is as educated and specialized as it possibly can be, but with the astronomical cost of education post-high school, it's not even remotely viable for a graduate to undertake a startup self-employment journey.

Excuse the emotion in my first comment, I'm only interested in civil debate amongst good, American beer-drinking men Cool
I find this MW topic fascinating.
For the record I do not think a significant number of folks would leave welfare for a $3 an hour raise.
Keep in mind the link shows hourly equivalent for an individual.
I imagine a family of three on welfare would be hard pressed to replace total welfare benefits at $15.
minimum wage manipulation (up or down) wont fix our economy.

While some may disagree, I think we may have reached a point were we need trade policy's that bring manufacturing jobs back to our country.
Motocross83 2/19/2014 1:03am
2/19/2014 1:03am Edited Date/Time 2/19/2014 1:07am
When ordinary people get hold of money or feel they have more money in their pockets, then tend to spend it on things, which in turn helps drive the economy forward. Very shortly the money returns to the government via taxation. The internal flow of money within an economy doesn't hurt a countries finance.

The deadly danger to any country is when more money flows abroad than is earned through productivity.

The non tax paying super rich have at their disposal essentially FREE money supplied by the FED. They use this money to buy assets and create speculation bubbles throughout the economy. They also send their money abroad and hide it in foreign tax havens. You (all of us in the western world) have to return to real capitalism where we employ the labour and talents of our people to create real wealth. Raising the minimum wage is long overdue and will do no harm.

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Mr. G
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Mr. G 2/19/2014 1:26am
2/19/2014 1:26am
They only send it elsewhere when the climate here becomes hostile since they are also trying to survive. If I was in charge I would appeal to them via production which is their biggest urge. It is a win win. Raising minimum wage is way too late in the chain and as such will cause a negative affect hitherto-known of the people in this area and larger such spheres.
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J.F.S 2/19/2014 4:04am
2/19/2014 4:04am Edited Date/Time 2/19/2014 4:05am
Mr. G wrote:
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see...
They know all of that. They don't care. Luckily idiots like JFS are a minority in this country but as the populace degrades you will see more and more. It is a shame.
J.F.S wrote:
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher...
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher salary? Are you willing to make less in order to cool down the inflation? Tax cuts also create inflation, so you people, with your juvenile and simplified "logic" want lower salaries and higher taxes? Or are just being dumb enough to simplify things, so that you can make stupid arguments that in reality only reinforces how extremely ignorant and uninterested you really are. It is so obvious how you try to create a persona of a well read, rightwing, good ole christian, white, rich guy, when in reality we all know, due to your posts, that you are a poor, working class, un educated, atheist. Not that there is anything wrong with the later, I actually prefer the later, it is only sad that you do not seem to want to be yourself. And it is sad, that when you try to be something you are not, you come out as really dumb and unsympathetic.
Mr. G wrote:
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees...
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees and those that are parasitic in nature.
I am a majority owner of two companies, and part owner of a third. Well, self employed if you will. I too know something about employees, their salaries and running companies. I think I already "won", but not because of paying low salaries, everybody that we have employed make more money than minimum wage. Surround yourself with competence, kings of their areas and it will pay off in the long run, instead of surrounding yourself with the cheapest labour. You pay peanuts, you get monkeys. And to think that the whole society will fall apart and that companies fall apart, because the lowest payed get a raise, is just not the case. The people on top of the ladder, with power and money are the ones who have the power to make a society better or a company better, or make a company fall apart or make a society fall apart. To blame the minimum wage workers for inflation or other things is just dumb.
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Titan1 2/19/2014 1:19pm
2/19/2014 1:19pm
J.F.S wrote:
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher...
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher salary? Are you willing to make less in order to cool down the inflation? Tax cuts also create inflation, so you people, with your juvenile and simplified "logic" want lower salaries and higher taxes? Or are just being dumb enough to simplify things, so that you can make stupid arguments that in reality only reinforces how extremely ignorant and uninterested you really are. It is so obvious how you try to create a persona of a well read, rightwing, good ole christian, white, rich guy, when in reality we all know, due to your posts, that you are a poor, working class, un educated, atheist. Not that there is anything wrong with the later, I actually prefer the later, it is only sad that you do not seem to want to be yourself. And it is sad, that when you try to be something you are not, you come out as really dumb and unsympathetic.
Mr. G wrote:
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees...
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees and those that are parasitic in nature.
J.F.S wrote:
I am a majority owner of two companies, and part owner of a third. Well, self employed if you will. I too know something about employees...
I am a majority owner of two companies, and part owner of a third. Well, self employed if you will. I too know something about employees, their salaries and running companies. I think I already "won", but not because of paying low salaries, everybody that we have employed make more money than minimum wage. Surround yourself with competence, kings of their areas and it will pay off in the long run, instead of surrounding yourself with the cheapest labour. You pay peanuts, you get monkeys. And to think that the whole society will fall apart and that companies fall apart, because the lowest payed get a raise, is just not the case. The people on top of the ladder, with power and money are the ones who have the power to make a society better or a company better, or make a company fall apart or make a society fall apart. To blame the minimum wage workers for inflation or other things is just dumb.
You are going to have to explain why monkeys deserve to be paid anything more than peanuts?

I don't pay any of my employees minimum wage either...because they are all worth more than that. But if I had a job that even a monkey can do, and I hire a monkey to do it, they are only getting paid peanuts.

And its not just the lowest paid that get a raise...if you raise the pay for the lowest earners...then all the sudden they are making the same as assistant managers...so you can't pay the workers the same as the managers and now you've got to give the assistant managers a raise...now assistant managers are making the same as the managers...and that can't happen, so you've got to give the managers a raise...now the managers are making the same as the VP's...and that can't happen...give the VP's a raise too...now the VP's make the same as the President/CEO...and that can't work, so you have to give him a raise as well...but wait...all those raises eliminated the companies profit margins (or reduced them significantly)...now what? Oh, better raise prices! Now, the lowest paid workers are making a few bucks more per hour, but have to spend more money on all the things they buy, so it's a wash.

Companies won't take a hit to their profit margins...they will pass the cost on to their customers (just like they do with tax hikes).

In high school I was working for my uncle at his oil and lube shop...the minimum wage went from 4.25/hour to like 4.75/hour (or something like that)...and that morning when I came into work, my uncle was on a latter raising all of his prices to cover his increased employee wages. (And the other three oil and lube shops in town did the EXACT same thing).

Not every business owner is a multi millionaire with money and power...in fact MOST of them aren't. Most of them are small business owners (like my uncle) who have no choice but to pass the increased overhead to their customers.

If all you limp wristed, bleeding heart liberals want to save the world...put your money where your mouth is...but don't try do it with my money (or anyone else's) by forcing your beliefs down our throats with big government (don't you complain about the religious doing the same?).

There shouldn't be a minimum wage anyway...it's ridiculous.
vet323
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vet323 2/19/2014 3:15pm
2/19/2014 3:15pm
Manny union jobs have wage scales tied to the MW (wages have to be a certain % above MW, for instance). If the MW goes up, union pay goes up, too.
Spartacus
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Spartacus 2/19/2014 7:19pm
2/19/2014 7:19pm
Damm shame slavery was ever outlawed in this country, just think of the increase in profit margins!
vanillaice782 2/19/2014 8:04pm
2/19/2014 8:04pm
He already gave the poor people a raise when he gave them Obamacare but they were just too dumb to actually sign up for it.
Titan1
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Titan1 2/19/2014 8:09pm
2/19/2014 8:09pm
Spartacus wrote:
Damm shame slavery was ever outlawed in this country, just think of the increase in profit margins!
Right...because forcing someone against their will, with zero rights or freedom and for no pay...is exactly the same thing as someone, of their own free will, agreeing to work for the wage an employer is willing to pay (no matter how large or small that wage is).
leakypipe23 2/19/2014 8:43pm
2/19/2014 8:43pm
Simple question. If you are only able to get a minimum wage job, why are you starting a family?
Mr. G
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Mr. G 2/19/2014 11:15pm
2/19/2014 11:15pm
J.F.S wrote:
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher...
Actually, luckily enough, ignorant idiots like you are a minority in USA, you are a very bad example for America. Why don't you want a higher salary? Are you willing to make less in order to cool down the inflation? Tax cuts also create inflation, so you people, with your juvenile and simplified "logic" want lower salaries and higher taxes? Or are just being dumb enough to simplify things, so that you can make stupid arguments that in reality only reinforces how extremely ignorant and uninterested you really are. It is so obvious how you try to create a persona of a well read, rightwing, good ole christian, white, rich guy, when in reality we all know, due to your posts, that you are a poor, working class, un educated, atheist. Not that there is anything wrong with the later, I actually prefer the later, it is only sad that you do not seem to want to be yourself. And it is sad, that when you try to be something you are not, you come out as really dumb and unsympathetic.
Mr. G wrote:
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees...
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees and those that are parasitic in nature.
J.F.S wrote:
I am a majority owner of two companies, and part owner of a third. Well, self employed if you will. I too know something about employees...
I am a majority owner of two companies, and part owner of a third. Well, self employed if you will. I too know something about employees, their salaries and running companies. I think I already "won", but not because of paying low salaries, everybody that we have employed make more money than minimum wage. Surround yourself with competence, kings of their areas and it will pay off in the long run, instead of surrounding yourself with the cheapest labour. You pay peanuts, you get monkeys. And to think that the whole society will fall apart and that companies fall apart, because the lowest payed get a raise, is just not the case. The people on top of the ladder, with power and money are the ones who have the power to make a society better or a company better, or make a company fall apart or make a society fall apart. To blame the minimum wage workers for inflation or other things is just dumb.
Minimum wage jobs are entry level. You get an entry level job when you are starting out. You get more skilled and become more valuable. My company is not entry level and pays MUCH more. You have to separate entry level and otherwise. It is very very simple. People that start at an entry level job and never move up don't deserve to be coddled until they eventually die from old age. My guess is your companies are also not entry level and thus the employees make more money. Problem solved.
J.F.S
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J.F.S 2/20/2014 1:26am
2/20/2014 1:26am
Mr. G wrote:
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees...
I chose to be self employed and to win or die in the attempt. It is a viewpoint shared by entrepreneurs and lost on many employees and those that are parasitic in nature.
J.F.S wrote:
I am a majority owner of two companies, and part owner of a third. Well, self employed if you will. I too know something about employees...
I am a majority owner of two companies, and part owner of a third. Well, self employed if you will. I too know something about employees, their salaries and running companies. I think I already "won", but not because of paying low salaries, everybody that we have employed make more money than minimum wage. Surround yourself with competence, kings of their areas and it will pay off in the long run, instead of surrounding yourself with the cheapest labour. You pay peanuts, you get monkeys. And to think that the whole society will fall apart and that companies fall apart, because the lowest payed get a raise, is just not the case. The people on top of the ladder, with power and money are the ones who have the power to make a society better or a company better, or make a company fall apart or make a society fall apart. To blame the minimum wage workers for inflation or other things is just dumb.
Mr. G wrote:
Minimum wage jobs are entry level. You get an entry level job when you are starting out. You get more skilled and become more valuable. My...
Minimum wage jobs are entry level. You get an entry level job when you are starting out. You get more skilled and become more valuable. My company is not entry level and pays MUCH more. You have to separate entry level and otherwise. It is very very simple. People that start at an entry level job and never move up don't deserve to be coddled until they eventually die from old age. My guess is your companies are also not entry level and thus the employees make more money. Problem solved.
No one argues about the entry level wage thing, the issue is how much people should get paid at entry level.
J.F.S
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J.F.S 2/20/2014 1:28am
2/20/2014 1:28am
leakypipe23 wrote:
Simple question. If you are only able to get a minimum wage job, why are you starting a family?
Actually, that is what this is about. Should there be full-time jobs from which you can not even support yourself and your family? I think not.
Mr. G
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Mr. G 2/20/2014 2:00am
2/20/2014 2:00am
This is where the definition gets blurred. Minimum wage jobs are for those jobs that are of a low level skill, responsibility and risk. A person that ascends to one that has those three qualities is therefor more valuable and is paid more to keep around since the have a bargaining chip. If we just arbitrarily raise the wage it kills the incentive and brings the entire group down as we don't have an ever increasing population that becomes more valuable. Hmmm maybe that is what these proponents want?

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