New Tesla Roadster

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11/20/2017 3:06 PM

XXVoid MainXX wrote:

Yep, that's the way it works. By the way, why is it that people like you seem to "want" them to fail? Just curious because I ...more

Void, I never said or even inferred that I want Tesla to fail. Truthfully, I don't really care either way. Where I find fault is with the billions of dollars in losses, and the constant failure of Tesla to meet stated targets. I also disagree with the valuation of Tesla versus the other automakers. Tesla is currently valued just below General Motors, and roughly even with Ford. I find this valuation ludicrous, as GM alone produces and sells more automobiles in two weeks than Tesla has produced and sold since the company began. What I see happening is the hype will continue until either the company becomes profitable, or folds. Even if Tesla doesn't fold up, their valuation must at some point reflect the true value of the business. When that day comes, there are going to be alot of unhappy investors in my opinion.

In the end, I hope they can make it work. I don't like seeing businesses fail. I'm a realist though, and not a fanboy, not blinded by the fantastic claims and the performance of the vehicles. In the end, if they cant make the numbers work, the show's over...and that would suck for all involved.

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11/20/2017 4:01 PM

All this "when will they become profitable talk" was beaten to death when discussing twitter, google, Amazon, Facebook, etc... How many wish they had that flux capacitor now to go back and invest? Obviously there were those that failed during this time but Tesla keeps moving forward and breaking through the status quo. They just keep speeding up (no pun intended). Don't seem to be slowing down at all.

And the post about Tesla paying back the loan entirely plus interest was dead on. Americans made money on the deal.

As of Oct 2017, the GM and Chrysler bailout cost Americans money. See below. Who's really relying on the taxpayers to stay afloat?

And the federal EV tax credit is available to all manufacturers. Tesla doesn't have the exclusive on that.

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11/20/2017 5:09 PM

jasonward73 wrote:

All this "when will they become profitable talk" was beaten to death when discussing twitter, google, Amazon, Facebook, etc... ...more

Problem is, Tesla isn't Facebook, Twitter, Etc....they are an automaker regardlless of how badly they want to be seen as a technology company. At the end of the day, they have to produce automobiles.

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Many thanks to everyone helping me out this GNCC season: SRT Offroad, Acerbis, FCR Suspension, O'Neal Racing, Evans Waterless Coolants, Rekluse, Twin Air, Braking Brakes, Carbsport

Profile image credit Ken Hill Photography

11/20/2017 5:55 PM

I like it.

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11/20/2017 7:23 PM

Ebs wrote:

It's nothing new, the amount of subsidies and tax breaks and favorable legislation given to some large corporations is ...more

Did you read those articles? The LA Times one is especially garbage and slanted. It includes SpaceX and their service contracts with NASA as a "subsidy". Funny, when that same money is handed to ULA or Orbital ATK that's called a launch contract. Tesla is majorly funded by stockholders, not the government.

We'll see if Tesla can make it or not but there's a lot of garbage out there about these companies. If people want to shit all over a company that truly has had a monopoly and billion dollars in free money through lobbying and the backing of their respective Senator's pull go dig into ULA. 400 million a launch, billion dollar yearly payment to maintain launch sites whether they launched or not, and allowed to launch precious national security payloads using cheap Russian made RD-180 engines bought from a man on the international sanctions list who clearly said the money goes straight to their military spending,

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11/20/2017 7:27 PM

I'd hate for the throttle to stick on one those.

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11/20/2017 7:47 PM

He has alot less to do with his companies than you think. They don't pay for shit either. I know a few who worked for his Solar company and left. Most there didn't even know who he was including the hiring people in HR.



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11/21/2017 6:37 AM

1st Amendment wrote:

I'd hate for the throttle to stick on one those.

I'd hate for a throttle to stick on any vehicle.

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11/21/2017 6:54 AM

harescrambled wrote:

Problem is, Tesla isn't Facebook, Twitter, Etc....they are an automaker regardlless of how badly they want to be seen as a ...more

They are producing cars and tech. They do both. Those tech companies mentioned above, which don't actually make anything tangible, take on average about 7yrs to turn profit.

Tesla delivered it's first car in 2008. The original Roadster. That was 9yrs ago. The Model S (which is really their first car designed from the ground up) was delivered in 2012. Just 5yrs ago.

In less than 10yrs they have completely disrupted an industry that has been sticking it to consumers (and american taxpayers) for almost 100yrs.

Keep in mind they are doing this while the big 3 have managed to lobby states to block Tesla from even being able to sell their cars. That alone should tell you how scared the status quo is. If they weren't, why would they care? I know it's shocking that Michigan is on that list. And ironic that Texas is on there too. Aren't they the land of "keep gov't out of our way and let the free market do what it does"?

The Model 3 will be a game changer. They'll prosper or die based on it's success. Based on pre-sales, it's a success so far.

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11/21/2017 8:29 AM

jasonward73 wrote:

They are producing cars and tech. They do both. Those tech companies mentioned above, which don't actually make anything ...more

Pretty much sums it up right there .

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11/21/2017 9:08 AM

And to get back on topic....

That Roadster is insane!!!!

But I'm even more excited for that 200kWh battery pack to make it's way to a Version 2.0 of the Model S or X. It should have at least a 500 mile range in those cars and the performance numbers shouldn't be too far off.

Probably a 2.1sec 0-60 in the Model S and a 2.5 in the Model X. Purely guesses on my side.

Meanwhile, I am enjoying this monster!! Slayed a Lambo Aventador SV and Ferrari 488 GTB already. I've lost count of how many Mustangs, Camaros, Corvettes, and Dodge SRT cars have been smoked. It's amazing how much people rush to line up next to me at stop lights.

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11/21/2017 9:14 AM

jasonward73 wrote:

And to get back on topic....

That Roadster is insane!!!!

But I'm even more excited for that 200kWh battery pack to make it's ...more

Sick! Just watched that video yesterday!!

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11/21/2017 9:48 AM

My old lady has a Tesla as her car when in Florida sitting in her works parking garage.
It's got like 4,000 mile or may 5K.
She hates it. "It's gay, I need Revs" Shes been torn between a Maserati, an Aston or a new NSX as a replacement.

Nobody really cares much about a silent car when a bad ass car starts up. Regardless of how fast they are. All her other cars are gassers.
It's pretty sexy watching a broad in a business suit, high ass heels and nails all done and shit, pop the hood and start checking fluids.

She does all her own maintainance too. Oil, plugs, wires, brakes. She has no trust in anyone working on her shit other than me because I'm anal about shit being perfect.

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11/21/2017 10:00 AM

jasonward73 wrote:

They are producing cars and tech. They do both. Those tech companies mentioned above, which don't actually make anything ...more

Tesla has not disrupted the industry just yet. Pump the breaks a bit. They are not even the top selling EV company currently.

Number of cars sold for Tesla in the month of October 2017 was 3,450 total vehicles.

Lets look at a few other manufactures for the month of October.

General Motors: 252,614

Ford: 199,698

Chrysler: 150,399

Toyota: 188,534

Honda: 127,353

Nissan: 123,012

Hyundai: 52,010

Kia: 44,397

Subaru: 54,045

Tesla: 3,450

Tesla cannot scale to even 10k a month yet. It will be a long long time to reach 100k vehicles built in a month. I don't think many of you understand the scale and complexity of operations to make that many vehicles.

Having said that, I would love a Tesla once the price comes down. As a company, they have a long long ways to go...and that journey will be very very expensive. It has burned a lot of cash already. They will need to produce tens of thousands of vehicles a month consistently to keep the lofty stock price up.

When you start having production glitches/delays while trying to produce a mere 5k vehicles a month, those problems only get tougher to solve when scaling to 50-100k vehicles a month.

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11/21/2017 10:25 AM

Rhino wrote:

My old lady has a Tesla as her car when in Florida sitting in her works parking garage.
It's got like 4,000 mile or may 5K.
...more

Premix!

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11/21/2017 4:55 PM
Edited Date/Time: 11/21/2017 4:56 PM

TXDirt wrote:

Tesla has not disrupted the industry just yet. Pump the breaks a bit. They are not even the top selling EV company currently.
...more

So it’s just a coincidence that every major car manufacturer is now manufacturing (or about to be) an EV? And every supercar/hypercar manufacturer is looking to electric power/hybrid as the future?

LaFerrari? 918 Spider? Lamborghini Terzo Milleni?

They don’t need to produce 100k cars to disrupt. Executives at GM literally laughed at Elon when asked if his vision of EVs has a chance. Guess who makes a great EV car now? Chevy! The bolt is a great car.

Before Tesla EVs were barely on the radar of the big theee. Now, several countries have passed legislation that will eventually outright ban the sale of new ICE vehicles.

Coincidence? I find that hard to believe.

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11/21/2017 5:42 PM

jasonward73 wrote:

They are producing cars and tech. They do both. Those tech companies mentioned above, which don't actually make anything ...more

TXDirt wrote:

Tesla has not disrupted the industry just yet. Pump the breaks a bit. They are not even the top selling EV company currently.
...more

jasonward73 wrote:

So it’s just a coincidence that every major car manufacturer is now manufacturing (or about to be) an EV? And every ...more

You mean after gas prices topped 5-4 dollars a gallons and people stopped buying big SUV's??

That had nothing to do with Tesla.

Manufactures are more concerned with gas prices then Tesla. I guarantee that. Even if Tesla somehow magically started being able to produce 200,000 cars a month ( which they are years, perhaps decades from doing) that collectively is probably a 10% drop in production for each major car company across the board. Not insignificant, but not exactly earth shattering either.

You know what causes a bigger drop in sales? High gas prices....

So it's fluctuating gas prices as to why things like the Prius and Bolt grew sales. Nothing to do with Tesla.

You should look at Tesla pragmatically and take off the rose colored glasses.

I like what Tesla is doing. But, they trade at 5x compared to their actual car production while every other car manufacturer trades at around 1x car production.

So no matter how big of a fan you are, or how great you think the cars are...... if they can't start producing at huge scale very very soon they will just be a footnote in the history books.

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11/22/2017 3:07 AM

TXDirt wrote:

You mean after gas prices topped 5-4 dollars a gallons and people stopped buying big SUV's??

That had nothing to do with ...more

No rose colored glasses here. I do love the car but I also realize they need to get their shit together to make the company viable. They’re talking the talk but we need to see them walk the walk. But their success or failure is a separate topic from being a disrupter. I disagree with your assertion it’s gas prices that fueled that.

Gas prices have been down for years now and the proliferation of EVs is more than ever. And escalating gas prices wouldn’t explain why several countries have legislation that is going to eventually ban the sale of all ICE vehicles. California even has this on their books for a vote this year. SUV and Trucks still outsell every car out there in the US and are the most profitable vehicles for car makers. Its reported they actually lose money on EVs (for now) but they still keep making them because they know it’s the future and don’t want to fall behind. For example, Volvo is going 100% battery/hybrid with their fleet. What Tesla did was prove you don’t have to compromise to go electric. In other words, you don’t have to drive something like a Prius. You can have a great looking full size car with unreal performance and plenty of range. The Roadster just put 10 more exclamation marks on what Tesla was already doing.

This was Elon’s mission all along. If Tesla fails because everyone else made a better all electric car then he would consider that a success. Of course, I’m sure he’d like to successful alongside everyone else with EVs. I think he will be.

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11/22/2017 6:57 AM

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/tesla-blows-through-dollar8000-a-minute-amid-model-3-woes/ar-BBFscZD?li=BBnb7Kz

I think I would be a little uncomfortable if I was an investor. Quite a debt spiral.
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11/22/2017 11:21 AM

Well, with a net worth of a reported 11-12 Billion and he sold the old Dassault Falcon for a new G650 ER so he probably doesn't care.






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11/22/2017 11:36 AM

Rhino wrote:

Well, with a net worth of a reported 11-12 Billion and he sold the old Dassault Falcon for a new G650 ER so he probably ...more

Maybe so, but does he care about Asian chicks and Gwen Stephani? That’s the important question...

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11/23/2017 12:50 AM

Sorta off topic but, anyone seen "Who Killed the Electric car"? Just remembered having seen it on tv years ago.

They're pretty nice looking cars, I like the look of yours JW.

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11/23/2017 6:57 AM

TXDirt wrote:

You mean after gas prices topped 5-4 dollars a gallons and people stopped buying big SUV's??

That had nothing to do with ...more

Agree 100% with all of this. Small cars and hybrids aren't selling because gas is cheap. Ford and GM both had hybrids for sale in the early 2000's, and Ford currently has the largest lineup of EV and hybrid vehicles for sale. They don't have the niche market of Tesla though. Tesla sells hype first and attempts to deliver the product later, similar to the Apple marketing model.

Also...regarding the sales of Teslas, every other auto manufacturer is not allowed to sell directly to the public, vehicles have to be sold through a dealer network. Why should Tesla be able to bypass those sales laws? It isn't a level playing field if they are operating under a different set of rules than other manufacturers. They aren't lobbying to have them not sell cars, they just want Tesla to have to sell cars in the same manner as everyone else.

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Nick
-2015 Grom grocery getter
-2011 Road King Classic
-2010 WR250X supermoto

11/23/2017 8:05 AM
Edited Date/Time: 11/23/2017 8:05 AM

I couldn’t care less if Tesla is making money or not, or changing the auto industry, or if investors will get a return on their investment, or if the VC will dry up, or if they are trying to save the planet or just build great cars...all I know is those cars look great, and perform great...

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11/23/2017 8:57 AM

I kinda like the Rimac better, but the roadster might grow on me.
Dont really care for the SUV things lines.

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11/23/2017 9:03 AM
Edited Date/Time: 11/23/2017 9:03 AM

blusmbl wrote:

Agree 100% with all of this. Small cars and hybrids aren't selling because gas is cheap. Ford and GM both had hybrids for sale ...more

Speaking for myself, I hope to never deal with the "amazing" customer service experience of a dealer again. Especially since selling you the car appears to just be a tool to get you in front of the finance guy who then pressures you into thousands of extra services. Don't even get me started on the service department.

With Tesla, I went online and within a few clicks bought my car. I paid the exact same price as everyone else and got the car exactly as I wanted with no compromise and nobody pressuring me for tire, paint, interior, drivetrain, warranty, extras..... And when I need service on my car someone pushes a software update and most of the time it's fixed. If not, some dude comes to my house and takes care of it in my driveway. All for free.

And regarding level playing field... In south FL nearly all the "dealers" are owned by one or two different groups. I see this in many large markets as well. So it's true, you are not dealing direct with the manufacturer for your Ford or Chevy but you are still dealing with a monopoly so there is in effect no competition since one or two groups owns all the dealerships. .

That model is outdated. Time to move on. If you think it's a level playing field you're living in fantasy land.

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11/23/2017 9:38 AM

I've never been pressured by anyone to buy shit at a dealer. I hear these stories but I never have bought a new vehicle off the floor or lot either. All my new vehicles were special order exactly how I want it and the price agreed on before even built.

It's actually a pretty smooth process. No stinky chain smoking losers in heavy shoes and cheap suits that can't even tell you what rear end gears are in what they are selling, and nobody trying to sell you shit.


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11/23/2017 9:53 AM

TXDirt wrote:

You mean after gas prices topped 5-4 dollars a gallons and people stopped buying big SUV's??

That had nothing to do with ...more

blusmbl wrote:

Agree 100% with all of this. Small cars and hybrids aren't selling because gas is cheap. Ford and GM both had hybrids for sale ...more

jasonward73 wrote:

Speaking for myself, I hope to never deal with the "amazing" customer service experience of a dealer again. Especially since ...more

Small cars and EVs dont sell because most look like shit. Bolts or Volts or whatever might be great cars, but they look like shit also.

A man can't be a man driving a Prius. Sorry, but some women still like a dude that isn't castrated and still has some self worth. If my oldest daughters Lexus IS 250 F Sport was all electric, it would still be a sick ass looking car.

I wouldnt even talk to a broad that drives a Prius. Get some self worth, not a PEACE sticker and CoExist sticker.

I've never bought a vehicle based on the mileage it gets. That's all bullshit numbers in the real world anyway. I buy a vehicle for the job it is going to do. No vehicle I have ever owned uses a LEAN AS FUCK Blow the motor tune on a dyno to meet CAFE requirements or even comes close to the BS numbers on the sticker.
Maybe some actually do. No one really knows.

If you are worried about mileage, the sidewalks are empty. That tells me no one really cares. They were empty when gas was 6 bucks too. All expensive gas did was make people take a few less trips per year. If that.

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11/23/2017 10:42 AM

Rhino wrote:

I've never been pressured by anyone to buy shit at a dealer. I hear these stories but I never have bought a new vehicle off ...more

Did you take a nap, or order a pizza-doesn’t matter-after you picked up your built to order Lambo?

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11/23/2017 11:23 AM

blusmbl wrote:

Agree 100% with all of this. Small cars and hybrids aren't selling because gas is cheap. Ford and GM both had hybrids for sale ...more

jasonward73 wrote:

Speaking for myself, I hope to never deal with the "amazing" customer service experience of a dealer again. Especially since ...more

Rhino wrote:

Small cars and EVs dont sell because most look like shit. Bolts or Volts or whatever might be great cars, but they look like ...more

I drive a corolla because it’s economical. I fill up twice in a month. Would love a Prius as well. The extra money I save goes to my kids activities. Karate, art class, etc. Extras for the wife and family.

I don’t feel emasculated driving one.

Wife giving me a blow job in a Corolla feels as good as when she would when I had my Mustang GT.

Sounds like you may be compensating for something....

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