the systematic destruction of the sport of motocross.

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5/29/2019 9:51 PM

soggy wrote:

what the fuck are you talking about when you say grow the sport. I don't get it. you want to grow the sport take a group of young kids and teach them how to ride. Growing the sport is not the responsibility of pro racing.

even the most popular sports in the US aren't all available on public TV. Monday night football is on ESPN for fucks sake. I don't know a single person who uses rabbit ears for TV today. Literally everyone has a streaming service. People don't even know what an antenna is anymore.

oldblood wrote:

If you were a political party, you would lose.

soggy wrote:

what in the world are you even talking about.

A fair question.
I see a lot of old vets, and that's nice but we need to build the sport.
Why are you so freaking pissy?

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If you are going through HELL, keep going.

5/29/2019 9:52 PM

The biggest things that made MX explode back then was that it was cool, it didn't cost a crap ton (comparatively), and you could probably go ride somewhere close to your house. Now we have so much urban sprawl and so many NIMBY organizations, good luck having a riding area within a 1 hour drive from home. When I was racing from 1977-1988 I had 4 legit places to ride within 40 minutes of my house and some places that were 15 min away if I just wanted to do turns or screw around and play ride. Totally different times.

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Old MXer turned Superfan.

5/29/2019 9:54 PM

oldblood wrote:

Actually you bring up a good point. I think there should be a round table of key people (including some old guys), annually to discuss the current and future health of our sport.

Let capitalism determine the winners and losers! This is just more regulations that will cost more money! Let the parents volunteer their time to get approval for a community track, prep it for races, flag the races, etc. what benefit is it to the motorcycle manufacturers to invest in local mx or National promoters for that matter. It just doesn’t make sense to make small investments in multiple communities to help leverage the free labour and local support for activities that would help you sell your product. Where is the ROI in that? (Sarcasm off)

I learnt all the above from the CARB thread on vital mx

Seriously though, I am so old i am Jesus’ older brother, living in Canada. I thank my younger brother everyday for NBC gold, MXGPTV, DC (he’s involved in all levels of the sport - grass roots to professional) and people on vital.on Vital that bring interesting information for me to consume (I am talking about you Maverick)

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5/29/2019 9:56 PM

oldblood wrote:

A fair question.
I see a lot of old vets, and that's nice but we need to build the sport.
Why are you so freaking pissy?

i know your just trolling at this point. I see a lot of vets too, and none of them are teaching young kids how to ride, or helping them get a bike to ride. there are no learn to ride days that are free if you just show up. you want to get people hooked get them riding not watching on tv. this thread should be called 'the systematic destruction of oldblood"

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5/29/2019 9:57 PM

rob162 wrote:

I'm not a old man by any means but yeah haven't watched any nationals since its been on the app. I find it absolutely ridiculous that we cant get air time to watch the nationals on tv for both motos. Ill tell you what i do watch alot of SX and MXGP. I also don't agree with the nationals on Saturday. Its hard for me to get time of to go to red bud on Saturday running my own company. Work over pleasure. But I can tell you if they were on Sunday still myself as well as probably 10-15 other people I know would hit 3-4 rounds a year like we use to. Plus at least 10-12 of us would have a +1 or 2.
Honestly there is no good reason we can't get air time.

I’ve watched every single moto live on TV. You’re doing it wrong.

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5/29/2019 9:57 PM

Oh shit! Time for bed! See you tomorrow!

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If you are going through HELL, keep going.

5/29/2019 10:08 PM

Flip109 wrote:

Some of you have never checked TV guides in Walmart, then went home and set a vcr to record at 2am the Tuesday after the race, only to rewind it the next day and there be some rerun of a fucking dog show instead. Or waited till a month later to read about it in the next magazine. Live app, live tv, either way is cool with me!! Bitch all you want I actually prefer the app.

OH, I remember those days! Man I would get pissed if I set the timer wrong or a Golden Girls show got pushed back and I missed the last moto! Do you remember the phone number that you could call to get the race results?

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5/29/2019 11:19 PM

The millennials have no interest in dirt bikes. They grew up with electronic devices attached to their hands and it's a new world we live in now. Outdoor youth activities have been replaced by youtube, video games, pornub, and social media. Combine that shift in lifestyle with the fact that dirt bike racing is not exciting to watch unless you are actually into riding, and the sport will continue to decline. I've had many parties with SX or MX on and we all know most races become boat races with no action, and people get bored real quick if they aren't into dirt bikes.

Other factors we are faced with:

1. Jurisdictions/Government/Tree hugger agencies trying to shut us down due to noise, environment, and emissions. I own land for riding in the desert and it's a constant battle to keep our trails open
2. A potential recession that seems to be inevitable in the next year or two. If/when this happens, the spending for toys dries up real quick
3. Baby Boomers will die off and take a ton of knowledge/experience/history with them. This mass die off could also affect housing and the economy
4. Advancements in technology will blow your mind and will change the way we live. People will soon be living in virtual worlds. It's already here, but it's advancing at an exponential pace right now. Once 5G is deployed in a few years, you will start to see disturbing changes that this new technology will bring to our lifestyle.

With that said, there will always be a core market of people who love moto, but this market will shrink in the next 10 years as our culture changes like it did with the introduction of the internet and electronic devices.


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5/29/2019 11:31 PM

If you assume that only the top 1% of mx fans a.k.a the "true enthusiasts" intentionally watch the mx live..


Then OP's argument is invalid.




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"Are you kidding me guy? You know how hard I grease it"

5/30/2019 12:10 AM

I blame Honda.

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5/30/2019 1:32 AM

oldblood wrote:

Okay fine, but there should be three races (minimum) on public access tv.
Look at it this way, if you were going to grow the sport like politicians run for office, you'd be loosing right now.

You mean like High Point, Red Bud and Unadilla this year being shown live on NBC (450 Moto 2 only)

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5/30/2019 2:13 AM

What I got from reading the more serious posts in this thread is that guys like DC are doing everything they can to grow or maintain the sport....but to no avail. They are swimming against a much stronger current of an ageing mx population, not enough new blood due to the growing virtual reality tech that kids are drawn to, government regulation, and the economic pressures of doing a rather expensive sport. These are things that even bringing 2 strokes back, more tv time, cheaper entry fees for pros in the GPs, smaller displacements in the pros, etc wouldn’t change the outlook.

Maybe the MXGP guys are right, and the survival of the sport lies in bringing it to countries like Indonesia, Thailand, China, India? But surely the prices of bikes would have to be more than halved for that to work?

Anyhow these are some big issues not limited to motocross. I wonder if I will actually retire before I die...given how the ageing population in Europe is going and the growing pressure on our social systems...and im in Switzerland...probably the most capitalistic country in Europe. As my monthly insurance bills are increased each year, the declining value of my state pension contributions, im put under more pressure to save for the down payment on a house, future kids hopefully, and the reality that i need to bring more personal savings to the table if i want to retire before 70. Even though im in my 30s, these things force me already to push mx off my priority list. but maybe that’s everyone...unless ure making more than 150k a year or both spouses are working...i don’t see how luxuries like mx, skiing or horse riding are sustainable long term. My wife loves horses...talk about an expensive sport...wow....some stables charge more monthly rent than renting a small apartment!

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5/30/2019 2:37 AM

Flip109 wrote:

Some of you have never checked TV guides in Walmart, then went home and set a vcr to record at 2am the Tuesday after the race, only to rewind it the next day and there be some rerun of a fucking dog show instead. Or waited till a month later to read about it in the next magazine. Live app, live tv, either way is cool with me!! Bitch all you want I actually prefer the app.

uneasy_rider wrote:

OH, I remember those days! Man I would get pissed if I set the timer wrong or a Golden Girls show got pushed back and I missed the last moto! Do you remember the phone number that you could call to get the race results?

Omg I did not know there was a phone number. Okay my past 14 year old self feels robbed lol

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5/30/2019 3:09 AM

The New generations doesn't watch TV anyways so an app (or at least YouTube) might actually be a better way to reach a young audience.

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5/30/2019 3:18 AM

I have been trying to find a rerun of last weeks national at pala for. 3 days ! Fuck it...No problem recording Mxgp & watching...better anyways... I”m not watching tv on my IPad.....I”m old....

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5/30/2019 3:32 AM

It's too clean.
Everybody is so worried about the kids.
Like its some kind of daycare or something.

Throw in a dose of Burning Man at every National,
and 4 years down the line you'll need a lottery to manage how many 16 to 40 somethings want to come.

That's what I think anyway.......

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5/30/2019 4:32 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/30/2019 4:32 AM

sandman768 wrote:

I have been trying to find a rerun of last weeks national at pala for. 3 days ! Fuck it...No problem recording Mxgp & watching...better anyways... I”m not watching tv on my IPad.....I”m old....

So you can record MXGP but not the National's? I dvr the races every week. I don't understand all the bitching here.

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5/30/2019 4:39 AM

We are in a world with more ways to spend disposable income. Cell phones, cable bills, iPads, satellite radio... Bikes are more expensive to buy and more expensive, and complex, to repair. Tracks/riding areas are further away. It’s dangerous. Local racing scene is weak (chicken or egg, not sure). A higher percentage of kids in the 70s and 80s grew up doing outside activities and riding bikes making transition to MX easier, and more appealing. Each chips away at some aspect of MX and results in fewer participants. It’s a fallacy, in my opinion, to think that more capable, complex and expensive bikes are actually more fun than the much simpler bikes of the past.

But as a fan of the sport, I love the app! Definitely beats waiting for Cycle News to arrive on Thursday, and for the Carlsbad USGP to show up on Wide World of Sports or the Super Bowl of MX at the LA Coliseum to be shown. Months later IIRC. Professional racing, especially from the fan perspective, is the best it’s ever been. The local grass roots of the sport is probably at a low.

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5/30/2019 4:51 AM

Step 3: create 60 classes, go sit at the track for an entire Saturday for three practice sessions. Get up even earlier on Sunday to sit at the track for another entire day for two motos.

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5/30/2019 4:58 AM

Does everyone get free internet when they sign up for the app?

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5/30/2019 5:20 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/30/2019 5:25 AM

Need a mid level of cycle. Does this 59 year old need 2019 technology to have fun....a no.
A C class, Vet or even Intermediate, no.
I like simple bikes, a carb and kick start are ok with me. If u head to the woods, do an east coast “bike swim” somewhere, you can almost always get the thing going to get home.

6 years old tech. would be great, no retooling, just pump them out. Intermediate bikes. $4999. 2 stroke and four stroke.

Then if a person turns into Joe Squid they can have at it, and move up to an “expert bike” if they wish.

The only “intermediate” bike that exists now is used. Not as alluring to buyers as new at a good price.

Need sort of a DT1 revolution. A new 2012 technology bike would be awesome at the right price.

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JS7 is the most entertaining rider since Hannah, my first hero,. even living in the frozen north.
Dirt biking from 11 to late 50’s, loves wood riding on the old 525.

5/30/2019 5:23 AM

zippytech wrote:

Does everyone get free internet when they sign up for the app?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost

Does everyone get free internet when they sign up for vital?

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5/30/2019 5:59 AM

oldblood wrote:

Okay fine, but there should be three races (minimum) on public access tv.
Look at it this way, if you were going to grow the sport like politicians run for office, you'd be loosing right now.

What is "public access TV". I doubt many people just have antennas and only have CBS/NBC/ABC/PBS. If they have cable or direct tv they can watch most of the races now. The sport has never been on local channels. Everything is going on demand and the Gold App is no different than paid packages offered by Major League Baseball, the NFL, NHL etc. It allows you better access and no commercials and additional coverage. If you don't want it, don't buy it, just like four strokes.

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5/30/2019 6:03 AM

Black Diesel Bomber wrote:

The millennials have no interest in dirt bikes. They grew up with electronic devices attached to their hands and it's a new world we live in now. Outdoor youth activities have been replaced by youtube, video games, pornub, and social media. Combine that shift in lifestyle with the fact that dirt bike racing is not exciting to watch unless you are actually into riding, and the sport will continue to decline. I've had many parties with SX or MX on and we all know most races become boat races with no action, and people get bored real quick if they aren't into dirt bikes.

Other factors we are faced with:

1. Jurisdictions/Government/Tree hugger agencies trying to shut us down due to noise, environment, and emissions. I own land for riding in the desert and it's a constant battle to keep our trails open
2. A potential recession that seems to be inevitable in the next year or two. If/when this happens, the spending for toys dries up real quick
3. Baby Boomers will die off and take a ton of knowledge/experience/history with them. This mass die off could also affect housing and the economy
4. Advancements in technology will blow your mind and will change the way we live. People will soon be living in virtual worlds. It's already here, but it's advancing at an exponential pace right now. Once 5G is deployed in a few years, you will start to see disturbing changes that this new technology will bring to our lifestyle.

With that said, there will always be a core market of people who love moto, but this market will shrink in the next 10 years as our culture changes like it did with the introduction of the internet and electronic devices.


I disagree with the millennial comments. I am 44 by the way, so not me, but look at mountain biking. It is the sport with the largest growth for junior high and high school sports. In Utah, we have 3000+ kids in the league alone with 3 divisions. Just like 30 years ago or whenever, kids will do what their parents do and then what their friends do. It's not all phones and You Tube.

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Facebook.com/8tensolutions
Twitter and Instagram @8tensolutions

5/30/2019 6:22 AM

Black Diesel Bomber wrote:

The millennials have no interest in dirt bikes. They grew up with electronic devices attached to their hands and it's a new world we live in now. Outdoor youth activities have been replaced by youtube, video games, pornub, and social media. Combine that shift in lifestyle with the fact that dirt bike racing is not exciting to watch unless you are actually into riding, and the sport will continue to decline. I've had many parties with SX or MX on and we all know most races become boat races with no action, and people get bored real quick if they aren't into dirt bikes.

Other factors we are faced with:

1. Jurisdictions/Government/Tree hugger agencies trying to shut us down due to noise, environment, and emissions. I own land for riding in the desert and it's a constant battle to keep our trails open
2. A potential recession that seems to be inevitable in the next year or two. If/when this happens, the spending for toys dries up real quick
3. Baby Boomers will die off and take a ton of knowledge/experience/history with them. This mass die off could also affect housing and the economy
4. Advancements in technology will blow your mind and will change the way we live. People will soon be living in virtual worlds. It's already here, but it's advancing at an exponential pace right now. Once 5G is deployed in a few years, you will start to see disturbing changes that this new technology will bring to our lifestyle.

With that said, there will always be a core market of people who love moto, but this market will shrink in the next 10 years as our culture changes like it did with the introduction of the internet and electronic devices.


Number 4 is real. If you are not paying attention you are going to be shocked. The robotics and AI development is something of more concern to me than anything. Once Starlink (which launched last week) and Neuralink get going, watch out!

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5/30/2019 6:23 AM

I'm going to take a wild guess assume they wouldn't be on the app if they were losing their asses. Meaning, people are watching it. It's still on cable TV as well, so I'm not sure what the point is here. The app is 1000 times more convenient. No guessing what channel it's going to be on and we get to watch practice. Best thing ever.

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5/30/2019 6:28 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/30/2019 6:29 AM

I haven't had cable in over 10 years. The apps are amazing. I watch more more moto than I ever have in my entire life.

Also, as far as attracting new people to the sport. I've never regularly watched MotoAmerica until I bought the app this year. Haven't missed a race since.

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5/30/2019 6:31 AM

soggy wrote:

what in the world are you even talking about.

oldblood wrote:

A fair question.
I see a lot of old vets, and that's nice but we need to build the sport.
Why are you so freaking pissy?

soggy wrote:

i know your just trolling at this point. I see a lot of vets too, and none of them are teaching young kids how to ride, or helping them get a bike to ride. there are no learn to ride days that are free if you just show up. you want to get people hooked get them riding not watching on tv. this thread should be called 'the systematic destruction of oldblood"

I'm a "vet", and all four of my kids ride - just not at MX tracks. Most guys I ride with have kids that ride (and their dad taught them).

It's been mentioned already, but it's simply a combination of access (to convenient places to ride) and interest (prioritizing riding above a gazillion other sports and activities - including the distraction of phones, etc.).

Anyone else see the irony in bitching about technology whilst posting a comment on an internet message board from a smart phone? Just sayin'...🙄

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5/30/2019 6:34 AM
Edited Date/Time: 5/30/2019 6:34 AM

haydos25 wrote:

No good reason we cant get airtime? Why dont you tell the TV execs that, and they'll counter with facts and figures.

Its the same old story, people refuse to get up off their ass and do something when its not 100% convenient for them, then they complain. People refuse to buy the app but then complain every race isn't on live TV. Switch it around, if 10 million people bought the app and tuned in every week do you think theTV execs might say, hey this sport is pulling in pretty good numbers considering, why dont we throw it on the regular channel and see how it goes?

I can half understand the complaints about a saturday program instead of a sunday, but i think that was just a scheduling decision to try and keep the stakeholders involved and limit the pressure that a travelling 2 day event each week brings.

Bingo. This guy gets it

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5/30/2019 6:42 AM

zippytech wrote:

Does everyone get free internet when they sign up for the app?

early wrote:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost

Does everyone get free internet when they sign up for vital?

No, but the internet needed to access vital is nothing compared to the access needed for tv.. and not everyone lives where they can even get the access for tv

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