safety lights - consequences?

lumpy790
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Edited Date/Time 2/28/2012 8:33pm
Plain and simple ignoring the lights is a safety issue.....A Privateer would never dare ignore the yellow/red lights. The powers that be need to shoot a shot across the top riders ship ..... just to remind them that they are subject to the same rules & consequences. Clip RV with a $ fine a few points and they will get the idea and abide by the rules.

NASCAR would never let something like this slide..... same rules for all ..... break them & you visit the principals office to explain why.
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Grieby54
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2/28/2012 7:41am
Thank God someone said something about this. I was wondering if I was the only one who was thinking about it, but I was scared to start a thread because nobody else had.
wardy
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2/28/2012 7:56am
wonder is a "fake" test during practice would be in order. throw the red lights and red cross during practice ......... every practice to "test" the riders ability to pay attention. if they don't follow the rules during practice they won't during a race. Bad part is if someone would crash trying to "stop" in the air kinda thing that would be even more of an issue......
lumpy790
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2/28/2012 8:19am
wardy I like your test them idea.......do it in the non timed practice..... or .... add 1 lap with lights on making them roll all of the jumps.

Or..... during the track walk have the lights on so they 100% know where they are so there is no excuses.
MiSledder
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2/28/2012 8:20am
Malcom Stewart was fined for being slapped in the back of the head, RV jumps on red and he was "committed" LOL nice!

The Shop

jbomx363
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2/28/2012 8:27am Edited Date/Time 2/28/2012 8:28am
Whitlock gone...... and we get Blanchard. Oh boy. Wink
Gbizzle
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2/28/2012 8:28am
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of the race it happens, if you break a rule you are penalized for it. Everyone knows going in to follow the rules or it is going to hurt your finishing position. However, the AMA picks and chooses where they want to penalize people which makes for a confusing and non-consistent set of rules.
SteveS
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2/28/2012 8:33am
They do enforce the lights rule the same way every time.

If a racer is already committed to the jump at the moment they turn the red light on, they don't penalize the racer. After that they do.

The issue with the particular jump in question was that they had a yellow light at the base of the jump, which was also at the exit of the turn since it was so close. The yellow light is rigged to come on if they turn on the red. Yellow in AMA Pro means you still jump and go for it.

They have recognized the problem that creates, and so the light at the base of the triple will be red from this point going forward.

I am not sure why the AMA-haters cannot see that they DO care about the safety of the riders and they DO work to make things better as time goes on. They just want to hate the AMA and get rid of it.

As if that will somehow make everything better to just have Feld running the show for rule making and officiating.
SteveS
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2/28/2012 8:34am
Gbizzle wrote:
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of...
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of the race it happens, if you break a rule you are penalized for it. Everyone knows going in to follow the rules or it is going to hurt your finishing position. However, the AMA picks and chooses where they want to penalize people which makes for a confusing and non-consistent set of rules.
Show me the example of when an "unfavored" person was penalized for a red light infraction while a "favored" racer was not.
Sherwood
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2/28/2012 8:35am
wardy wrote:
wonder is a "fake" test during practice would be in order. throw the red lights and red cross during practice ......... every practice to "test" the...
wonder is a "fake" test during practice would be in order. throw the red lights and red cross during practice ......... every practice to "test" the riders ability to pay attention. if they don't follow the rules during practice they won't during a race. Bad part is if someone would crash trying to "stop" in the air kinda thing that would be even more of an issue......
It's a good idea but it would need to be thrown in the first free practice because if not the OEM's/team managers would be pissed.
Sherwood
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2/28/2012 8:37am
Gbizzle wrote:
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of...
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of the race it happens, if you break a rule you are penalized for it. Everyone knows going in to follow the rules or it is going to hurt your finishing position. However, the AMA picks and chooses where they want to penalize people which makes for a confusing and non-consistent set of rules.
SteveS wrote:
Show me the example of when an "unfavored" person was penalized for a red light infraction while a "favored" racer was not.
Chad Reed even said on the Pulpmx show last night if it was a privateer that did that it wouldn't have ended the same.
SteveS
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2/28/2012 8:42am
Gbizzle wrote:
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of...
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of the race it happens, if you break a rule you are penalized for it. Everyone knows going in to follow the rules or it is going to hurt your finishing position. However, the AMA picks and chooses where they want to penalize people which makes for a confusing and non-consistent set of rules.
SteveS wrote:
Show me the example of when an "unfavored" person was penalized for a red light infraction while a "favored" racer was not.
Sherwood wrote:
Chad Reed even said on the Pulpmx show last night if it was a privateer that did that it wouldn't have ended the same.
And that proves it?

Has it ever actually happened?
SteveS
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2/28/2012 8:43am
wardy wrote:
wonder is a "fake" test during practice would be in order. throw the red lights and red cross during practice ......... every practice to "test" the...
wonder is a "fake" test during practice would be in order. throw the red lights and red cross during practice ......... every practice to "test" the riders ability to pay attention. if they don't follow the rules during practice they won't during a race. Bad part is if someone would crash trying to "stop" in the air kinda thing that would be even more of an issue......
Sherwood wrote:
It's a good idea but it would need to be thrown in the first free practice because if not the OEM's/team managers would be pissed.
What is this "free" practice I see written of so often? There isn't any "free" practice. It all counts. Except the first lap after they are let onto the track.
steveada
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2/28/2012 8:49am
Sounds to me the whole "warning lights" system that is in place is something that has come together by adding lights here and lights there without much thought to the point they are not very helpful. They started with yellow lights before blind jumps warning that the red light on jump face is on. Sounds good. Then they decided to add yellow lights down the lanes to take the place of yellow flags. Now you have yellow lights all over, some meaning the same as a yellow flag, and others warning that the flashing red lights are on. It is probably a bit confusing, but to someone like RV who has probably sat through 100 pre-supercross riders meetings and walked 100 supercross tracks, It's really not that difficult to understand what light means what. Now maybe some privateer running his first supercross race could be confused by the system, but not someone whose been in the sport for a while. I still think the AMA made a bad call. When it comes to a safety issue, make the error on the side of safety, not luck. Even if it's just a monetary fine that doesn't effect the points, you at least have to do something that says safety is important and stuff like this won't be tolerated.
Sherwood
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2/28/2012 8:49am Edited Date/Time 2/28/2012 8:51am
wardy wrote:
wonder is a "fake" test during practice would be in order. throw the red lights and red cross during practice ......... every practice to "test" the...
wonder is a "fake" test during practice would be in order. throw the red lights and red cross during practice ......... every practice to "test" the riders ability to pay attention. if they don't follow the rules during practice they won't during a race. Bad part is if someone would crash trying to "stop" in the air kinda thing that would be even more of an issue......
Sherwood wrote:
It's a good idea but it would need to be thrown in the first free practice because if not the OEM's/team managers would be pissed.
SteveS wrote:
What is this "free" practice I see written of so often? There isn't any "free" practice. It all counts. Except the first lap after they are...
What is this "free" practice I see written of so often? There isn't any "free" practice. It all counts. Except the first lap after they are let onto the track.
They give the riders a first practice that I believe is 8 minutes long before the qualifying practices. It's not counted towards qualifying for the night show thus the tag free practice.
lumpy790
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2/28/2012 8:53am
Sherwood wrote:
It's a good idea but it would need to be thrown in the first free practice because if not the OEM's/team managers would be pissed.
SteveS wrote:
What is this "free" practice I see written of so often? There isn't any "free" practice. It all counts. Except the first lap after they are...
What is this "free" practice I see written of so often? There isn't any "free" practice. It all counts. Except the first lap after they are let onto the track.
Sherwood wrote:
They give the riders a first practice that I believe is 8 minutes long before the qualifying practices. It's not counted towards qualifying for the night...
They give the riders a first practice that I believe is 8 minutes long before the qualifying practices. It's not counted towards qualifying for the night show thus the tag free practice.
1st practice is "free" or not timed........ only time I have seen this NOT happen was in a open air stadium when it has rained.....to preserve the track.
Sherwood
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2/28/2012 8:56am
SteveS wrote:
What is this "free" practice I see written of so often? There isn't any "free" practice. It all counts. Except the first lap after they are...
What is this "free" practice I see written of so often? There isn't any "free" practice. It all counts. Except the first lap after they are let onto the track.
Sherwood wrote:
They give the riders a first practice that I believe is 8 minutes long before the qualifying practices. It's not counted towards qualifying for the night...
They give the riders a first practice that I believe is 8 minutes long before the qualifying practices. It's not counted towards qualifying for the night show thus the tag free practice.
lumpy790 wrote:
1st practice is "free" or not timed........ only time I have seen this NOT happen was in a open air stadium when it has rained.....to preserve...
1st practice is "free" or not timed........ only time I have seen this NOT happen was in a open air stadium when it has rained.....to preserve the track.
And is all of 8 minutes long.
karnivool
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2/28/2012 8:58am
Gbizzle wrote:
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of...
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of the race it happens, if you break a rule you are penalized for it. Everyone knows going in to follow the rules or it is going to hurt your finishing position. However, the AMA picks and chooses where they want to penalize people which makes for a confusing and non-consistent set of rules.
one of the differences is how the rules apply to points and positions...

in Nascar, you can get penalized/docked positions/points and still have a chance at the title...if RC had been docked for his FUELGATE it would have ruined any shot at the title...therefore the infraction is too great...no way should one fuel mishap be grounds for destroying a season.

our points system gives no reward for the guy leading all the laps and winning...(1 extra pt...really?) meaning 8 race wins can be lost in one mechanical or mistake...(ask dungey)

i think the points system is bogus, and the rules would need to be adjusted accordingly so points are taken away for infractions that matter.

then riders would pay attention, and race harder, if leading laps was worth something...and they would follow rules if they knew they were risking something...safety isn't their greatest concern

my $.02
wardy
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2/28/2012 9:00am
old fart did you understand what i suggested? it wasn't to add anything but rather "test" the riders during practice so they understand. I actually like steve's opinion better. take a lap in practice and have all the lights and flaggers waving flags to let the rider know exactly where they are positioned.

One thing about these tracks is riders ride them once. Things change week to week. Riding amatuer tracks normally flagging and positions on the track are the same most for a whole year or longer. Riders know where they are at. The whole idea is to give the riders the best information to work with, and the track officials and flaggers the best use of thier ability to keep the riders safe.

Now i don't know if at riders meeting or track walk this isn't done, I know if i was racing a race like this i would look for these things but i am old and look at things different then a guy who jumps 75ft every lap a few times.
txmxer
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2/28/2012 9:10am
Why aren't lights placed at the entrance to the turn before a big jump?
If Bauer is correct, they are going to do exactly that.
Moto_Geek
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2/28/2012 9:17am
I'm pretty sure the amber goggles RV was wearing changed the lights to yellow..
steveada
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2/28/2012 9:32am
To me it seems pretty simple, and you would think that they would have it figured out at the highest level of this sport in the world. Anyway, if the yellow warning light was on when RV went by, and the AMA is saying he was already committed to jump, then the light was not in the right place. You have to put the warning light in a place that gives the rider time to safely react and roll the jump. Then there is no judgement call about "did he have time to react or not?".
moto282
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2/28/2012 9:51am
Another thread on this? Really?
Grieby54
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2/28/2012 10:09am
moto282 wrote:
Another thread on this? Really?
Everybody skipped over my post saying the same thing...
wawazat
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2/28/2012 11:11am
AMA needs a good public relations person right about now. Two weeks in a row they are the story of the race. AMA isn't really doing anything to improve their image.
SteveS
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2/28/2012 11:16am
Moto_Geek wrote:
I'm pretty sure the amber goggles RV was wearing changed the lights to yellow..
They turned into amber lamps?
Old Mate
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2/28/2012 11:31am
Human era can have bad results even with the best intention of these safety lights. Matt Moss was about 13yrs and riding brisbane sx. He was the last bike out on the track for practice and they have a no jump rule on lap 1 with the red no jump lites on. He just rolled over the first jump of the triple as his good mate Cody Mackie just completed lap 1. So the officials turned off the red lights and Cody jumped the triple as Matt was rolling back up out of the bottom. The reult was a quite a few hours unconsious.
Mstock
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2/28/2012 11:35am
Who was the down rider that caused the RED LIGHT and what position was he in at the time of the crash?
bobby397
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2/28/2012 11:42am
Gbizzle wrote:
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of...
One of the main differences between the AMA and other motorsport sanctioning bodies. For example NASCAR does not care who you are or what time of the race it happens, if you break a rule you are penalized for it. Everyone knows going in to follow the rules or it is going to hurt your finishing position. However, the AMA picks and chooses where they want to penalize people which makes for a confusing and non-consistent set of rules.
SteveS wrote:
Show me the example of when an "unfavored" person was penalized for a red light infraction while a "favored" racer was not.
I think it was two rounds ago, but a couple of riders in the lites c or b timed qualifier lost their fastest lap time due to jumping on the red light I believe

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