now you know that 2015 dungey news

zippy895
Posts
5495
Joined
7/15/2008
Location
Daytona Beach, FL US
5/8/2014 5:51am Edited Date/Time 5/9/2014 6:23pm
see homepage!
|
newmann
Posts
24444
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
US
5/8/2014 6:25am
The '16 bike.....the works bike exemption rule that keeps on giving and giving and giving. I'm sure that one will be released to the public near the end of the SX season next year, just in time for no one else to have one for SX. One more shining example at the level of incompetence at the AMA. Brilliant move by KTM, working the rule book.
jonesaustin
Posts
2479
Joined
7/6/2009
Location
Austin, TX US
5/8/2014 7:00am Edited Date/Time 5/8/2014 7:06am
KTM is just amazing, the coolest maker of dirt bike machines in the sport's history. YAWN to all the others (except maybe Yamaha) and their big frames that look like a 1997 Honda CR. KTM sees clearly the lack of innovation in Japan, and is running with it. How can you not be a fan of this brand. They even make cool road cycling bikes! Can't wait to see what Dungey is talking about, and that was a pretty good interview overall.
pete24
Posts
2733
Joined
10/20/2011
Location
Marlborough, MA US
5/8/2014 7:14am
he roger my bike suks, if you figure out how i can race a new one off, i wont pull a chad reed and tell the media what i really think

The Shop

Moto75
Posts
344
Joined
3/19/2014
Location
Somewhere in, AZ US
5/8/2014 8:00am
Assuming that interview was at Las Vegas... It's next week, where's the spy photos? Smile
usp4u
Posts
587
Joined
3/25/2011
Location
Karns City, PA US
5/8/2014 8:29am
KTM is just amazing, the coolest maker of dirt bike machines in the sport's history. YAWN to all the others (except maybe Yamaha) and their big...
KTM is just amazing, the coolest maker of dirt bike machines in the sport's history. YAWN to all the others (except maybe Yamaha) and their big frames that look like a 1997 Honda CR. KTM sees clearly the lack of innovation in Japan, and is running with it. How can you not be a fan of this brand. They even make cool road cycling bikes! Can't wait to see what Dungey is talking about, and that was a pretty good interview overall.
But they don't make a robot, a piano, heavy equipment engines or terrible cars. Its like ALL they care about is producing good motorcyclesWhistling



(admitted recent orange convert who isn't going back)
GuyB
Posts
35693
Joined
7/10/2006
Location
Aliso Viejo, CA US
Fantasy
1274th
5/8/2014 8:43am
Who else thinks Husky will follow the same program?
Katoomey
Posts
1714
Joined
1/18/2013
Location
WY US
5/8/2014 8:55am Edited Date/Time 5/8/2014 9:07am
newmann wrote:
The '16 bike.....the works bike exemption rule that keeps on giving and giving and giving. I'm sure that one will be released to the public near...
The '16 bike.....the works bike exemption rule that keeps on giving and giving and giving. I'm sure that one will be released to the public near the end of the SX season next year, just in time for no one else to have one for SX. One more shining example at the level of incompetence at the AMA. Brilliant move by KTM, working the rule book.
the Dungey bikes are "homologation specials" I.e. -special edition bikes that are fully homologated. There is no special "works" exemption being used by KTM.

did you think they just pulled the number "400" out of a hat for the first run of Dungey replicas?

and as far as them being available before supercross for other people...there are other special requirements for bikes that are homologated earlier than the model year it is marketed and manufactured as.

this is right from the rule book...

"Early Model Homologation Requirements

When a manufacture intends to homologate an early model release (I.E. a 2013 model
released towards the end of 2012 and competing in the 2012 season), the following
applies:


The homologation application, supporting documents and conformation of all
control parts must be received by AMA no later than 15 days prior to the first
event that the model will compete in.

Minimum quantities which must be available through US dealers:

All Manufacturers – 400 units per model.

The model must be available through US dealers at the time of the homologation
application. Importation quantity requirements must be completed within 90 days
of the homologation application date."
jonesaustin
Posts
2479
Joined
7/6/2009
Location
Austin, TX US
5/8/2014 10:11am
usp4u wrote:
But they don't make a robot, a piano, heavy equipment engines or terrible cars. Its like ALL they care about is producing good motorcycles:whistle: (admitted recent...
But they don't make a robot, a piano, heavy equipment engines or terrible cars. Its like ALL they care about is producing good motorcyclesWhistling



(admitted recent orange convert who isn't going back)
lol, yes exactly. each of the Japanese R&D teams could do the same, but the spirit is lacking more than the $ i'm guessing. sounds like a company culture issue. before the production rule, Honda engineers were like the guys working for Steve Jobs in the 90's - they could try something radical. right now, KTM owns them all.
sc961
Posts
2242
Joined
12/11/2006
Location
Hutchinson, MN US
5/8/2014 10:27am
GuyB wrote:
Who else thinks Husky will follow the same program?
Good possibility.

Nice job on the interview Steve.
wreckitrandy
Posts
3839
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Granite Falls, NC US
5/8/2014 10:50am
Didn't RV get a 'new' bike in the middle of the outdoors several years ago?
newmann
Posts
24444
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
US
5/8/2014 10:52am
newmann wrote:
The '16 bike.....the works bike exemption rule that keeps on giving and giving and giving. I'm sure that one will be released to the public near...
The '16 bike.....the works bike exemption rule that keeps on giving and giving and giving. I'm sure that one will be released to the public near the end of the SX season next year, just in time for no one else to have one for SX. One more shining example at the level of incompetence at the AMA. Brilliant move by KTM, working the rule book.
Katoomey wrote:
the Dungey bikes are "homologation specials" I.e. -special edition bikes that are fully homologated. There is no special "works" exemption being used by KTM. did you...
the Dungey bikes are "homologation specials" I.e. -special edition bikes that are fully homologated. There is no special "works" exemption being used by KTM.

did you think they just pulled the number "400" out of a hat for the first run of Dungey replicas?

and as far as them being available before supercross for other people...there are other special requirements for bikes that are homologated earlier than the model year it is marketed and manufactured as.

this is right from the rule book...

"Early Model Homologation Requirements

When a manufacture intends to homologate an early model release (I.E. a 2013 model
released towards the end of 2012 and competing in the 2012 season), the following
applies:


The homologation application, supporting documents and conformation of all
control parts must be received by AMA no later than 15 days prior to the first
event that the model will compete in.

Minimum quantities which must be available through US dealers:

All Manufacturers – 400 units per model.

The model must be available through US dealers at the time of the homologation
application. Importation quantity requirements must be completed within 90 days
of the homologation application date."
No shit Sherlock, 400 is the homo number. If you go back and read what you posted, you'll see that Dungey will be on the gate on a bike that won't be available to anyone else until late in the SX season. Thereby giving the factory team an advantage year after year. The one year "works exemption" was given for development purposes and KTM is keeping the ball rolling through a loosely written rulebook.

How many homo specials have been available at the start of the season the past two or three years?

When have the Dungey replicas actually been on the dealer floors ready for delivery, May? Sitting in a shipping container at the Port of Los Angeles doesn't do Joe Privateer much good.
newmann
Posts
24444
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
US
5/8/2014 10:53am
Didn't RV get a 'new' bike in the middle of the outdoors several years ago?
Yep, 2012 wasn't it? Langston wrapped up the championship back in what, 2008 on a bike unavailable to anyone else.
wreckitrandy
Posts
3839
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Granite Falls, NC US
5/8/2014 11:30am
The measures these teams will go to trying to stay ahead of James, it's just unreal. Fuel gate, works bikes, mad scientist trainers,,,, where will it stop?
5/8/2014 11:39am
newmann wrote:
No shit Sherlock, 400 is the homo number. If you go back and read what you posted, you'll see that Dungey will be on the gate...
No shit Sherlock, 400 is the homo number. If you go back and read what you posted, you'll see that Dungey will be on the gate on a bike that won't be available to anyone else until late in the SX season. Thereby giving the factory team an advantage year after year. The one year "works exemption" was given for development purposes and KTM is keeping the ball rolling through a loosely written rulebook.

How many homo specials have been available at the start of the season the past two or three years?

When have the Dungey replicas actually been on the dealer floors ready for delivery, May? Sitting in a shipping container at the Port of Los Angeles doesn't do Joe Privateer much good.
Was Doug Henry's YZM 400 available to the public? All the manufacturers got one shot to do it and it sounds like KTM hasn't used theirs yet. The factory bikes they come out with each year don't count towards the exemption rule because they released the required 400.
IceMan446
Posts
4671
Joined
1/10/2010
Location
Sacramento, CA US
5/8/2014 11:41am
Was Doug Henry's YZM 400 available to the public? All the manufacturers got one shot to do it and it sounds like KTM hasn't used theirs...
Was Doug Henry's YZM 400 available to the public? All the manufacturers got one shot to do it and it sounds like KTM hasn't used theirs yet. The factory bikes they come out with each year don't count towards the exemption rule because they released the required 400.
His point is, you CAN NOT get one when Dungey has one.

Which from the homo rules, you should be able to.
peelout
Posts
17859
Joined
1/6/2011
Location
Ogden, UT US
5/8/2014 11:43am
The measures these teams will go to trying to stay ahead of James, it's just unreal. Fuel gate, works bikes, mad scientist trainers,,,, where will it...
The measures these teams will go to trying to stay ahead of James, it's just unreal. Fuel gate, works bikes, mad scientist trainers,,,, where will it stop?
*red hair


missed one Wink
5/8/2014 11:44am
IceMan446 wrote:
His point is, you CAN NOT get one when Dungey has one.

Which from the homo rules, you should be able to.
Oh ok, I didn't pay attention to when they actually released them. I just assumed that they were available as soon as Dungey started racing them. Darn homo rules.
Katoomey
Posts
1714
Joined
1/18/2013
Location
WY US
5/8/2014 11:48am
newmann wrote:
No shit Sherlock, 400 is the homo number. If you go back and read what you posted, you'll see that Dungey will be on the gate...
No shit Sherlock, 400 is the homo number. If you go back and read what you posted, you'll see that Dungey will be on the gate on a bike that won't be available to anyone else until late in the SX season. Thereby giving the factory team an advantage year after year. The one year "works exemption" was given for development purposes and KTM is keeping the ball rolling through a loosely written rulebook.

How many homo specials have been available at the start of the season the past two or three years?

When have the Dungey replicas actually been on the dealer floors ready for delivery, May? Sitting in a shipping container at the Port of Los Angeles doesn't do Joe Privateer much good.
no shit sherlock? ..and yet you still don't understand the difference between homologation and "works" exemption.

no matter when people actually get their hands on them, you are still wrong. they are fully homologated. no rules being bent or abused, just the good old fashioned homologation rule that was implemented in 1986. every brand could do what KTM is doing every single year.
IceMan446
Posts
4671
Joined
1/10/2010
Location
Sacramento, CA US
5/8/2014 11:52am
IceMan446 wrote:
His point is, you CAN NOT get one when Dungey has one.

Which from the homo rules, you should be able to.
Oh ok, I didn't pay attention to when they actually released them. I just assumed that they were available as soon as Dungey started racing them...
Oh ok, I didn't pay attention to when they actually released them. I just assumed that they were available as soon as Dungey started racing them. Darn homo rules.
Yeah, they just require them to be available. But that's up to interpretation.

But good luck finding one when Dungey debuts his. I have never seen one even remotely close to when he has his.

They sure do push the limits.
Matt Fisher
Posts
3947
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Visalia, CA US
Fantasy
1084th
5/8/2014 12:01pm
newmann wrote:
No shit Sherlock, 400 is the homo number. If you go back and read what you posted, you'll see that Dungey will be on the gate...
No shit Sherlock, 400 is the homo number. If you go back and read what you posted, you'll see that Dungey will be on the gate on a bike that won't be available to anyone else until late in the SX season. Thereby giving the factory team an advantage year after year. The one year "works exemption" was given for development purposes and KTM is keeping the ball rolling through a loosely written rulebook.

How many homo specials have been available at the start of the season the past two or three years?

When have the Dungey replicas actually been on the dealer floors ready for delivery, May? Sitting in a shipping container at the Port of Los Angeles doesn't do Joe Privateer much good.
Was Doug Henry's YZM 400 available to the public? All the manufacturers got one shot to do it and it sounds like KTM hasn't used theirs...
Was Doug Henry's YZM 400 available to the public? All the manufacturers got one shot to do it and it sounds like KTM hasn't used theirs yet. The factory bikes they come out with each year don't count towards the exemption rule because they released the required 400.
I believe KTM used their works exemption on the 250F several years ago. Hmmm, I would think that Husky has an exemption available, that could be interesting in a year or so.

Personally, I think that each mfg should be able to run a works bike every 5 years or so.
ATKpilot99
Posts
9750
Joined
4/13/2010
Location
Lake Geneva, WI US
5/8/2014 12:07pm
Why have a homologation or any kind of production rule when factory riders can use one off suspension etc anyway ?
FCTRY
Posts
337
Joined
12/28/2010
Location
Roanoke, VA US
5/8/2014 12:19pm
ATKpilot99 wrote:
Why have a homologation or any kind of production rule when factory riders can use one off suspension etc anyway ?
Like in pretty much all classes of motosport, the goal is to make it at least a little less of an arms race when it comes to spending on equipment. In a class where you can build anything, the team with the most money has a massive advantage. In a class where you are restricted to things that are at least generally available, the underdogs have a (slightly) better shot. They still have way less money to dump into development, but development is about maximizing the potential of the "same" bike, not building a unique bike that outclasses everything. It's like the salary cap for team sports, the goal is to make it so you can't just go out and buy domination. You still pretty much can though.

Can-am, Group B rally, and unlimited hillclimb are the classic examples of "anything goes" motorsport. In Can-am and Group B, it just got too dangerous. Still, some of the coolest and most innovative machines ever.
hartebreak
Posts
2512
Joined
9/16/2009
Location
Portland, OR US
Fantasy
246th
5/8/2014 12:26pm
Actually they used it way back with Shayne Kings 620 or whatever that was.
activeMX
Posts
325
Joined
7/19/2011
Location
Long Beach, CA US
5/8/2014 12:32pm
newmann wrote:
The '16 bike.....the works bike exemption rule that keeps on giving and giving and giving. I'm sure that one will be released to the public near...
The '16 bike.....the works bike exemption rule that keeps on giving and giving and giving. I'm sure that one will be released to the public near the end of the SX season next year, just in time for no one else to have one for SX. One more shining example at the level of incompetence at the AMA. Brilliant move by KTM, working the rule book.
This is hardly anything like using the works bike exemption rule. Those bikes were truly handmade and significant changes were happening to them each week. The Factory Edition Dungey races next year starting in Anaheim will have a frame and engine cases identical (or at least starting that way) to the 400 or 500 Factory Editions that will be sold to the public.

KTM is simply leveraging their ability to produce much smaller qty. of bikes to the benefit of their race teams AND the consumers.

What would you have the AMA raise the homolagation # to if 400 is too little? 1000, 3000??? Some Japanese mfg. are having a hard time meeting those numbers now days.
IWreckALot
Posts
8676
Joined
3/12/2011
Location
Fort Worth, TX US
5/8/2014 12:37pm
GuyB wrote:
Who else thinks Husky will follow the same program?
I guess I don't get the Husky push. Why brand the KTM as a Husqvarna? And why would KTM want to invest heavily in a Husky when they're really in a growing curve under the KTM brand. I really like the direction KTM is going and I don't want to see any of their attention spun off on to Husqvarna.
newmann
Posts
24444
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
US
5/8/2014 1:21pm
newmann wrote:
No shit Sherlock, 400 is the homo number. If you go back and read what you posted, you'll see that Dungey will be on the gate...
No shit Sherlock, 400 is the homo number. If you go back and read what you posted, you'll see that Dungey will be on the gate on a bike that won't be available to anyone else until late in the SX season. Thereby giving the factory team an advantage year after year. The one year "works exemption" was given for development purposes and KTM is keeping the ball rolling through a loosely written rulebook.

How many homo specials have been available at the start of the season the past two or three years?

When have the Dungey replicas actually been on the dealer floors ready for delivery, May? Sitting in a shipping container at the Port of Los Angeles doesn't do Joe Privateer much good.
Katoomey wrote:
no shit sherlock? ..and yet you still don't understand the difference between homologation and "works" exemption. no matter when people actually get their hands on them...
no shit sherlock? ..and yet you still don't understand the difference between homologation and "works" exemption.

no matter when people actually get their hands on them, you are still wrong. they are fully homologated. no rules being bent or abused, just the good old fashioned homologation rule that was implemented in 1986. every brand could do what KTM is doing every single year.
I fully understand the works exemption and homologation. The production rule was effected to somewhat level the playing field between the haves and the have nots. Yet here we are with a team showing up every year with something no one else can get until the season is pretty much over. I applaud KTM and their efforts to build a better bike while the Japanese OEM's have their thumbs up their asses. The AMA rule book should state that the 400 bikes should be on the dealers floors for a minimum of 30 days to let other racers and teams have them as well in time to get them tested and ready for the season.

And for the record, I never stated that that any rules were being bent or abused. The numbnuts at the AMA wrote the rules and KTM is just following them.
5/8/2014 1:40pm
I wonder if gibbys feet got injured by dungey backpeddling over them after the '16 slip? Cant very well brag about the results of your '15 model when the rider says its a '16.
JBecker 72
Posts
1738
Joined
3/25/2014
Location
VA US
5/8/2014 2:14pm
Very interested to see what the new bike will be stats wise. I had one of the 2005.5 250SXF bikes that I got June 05. It was a fantastic machine.
scott_nz
Posts
5304
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
NZ
Fantasy
597th
5/8/2014 2:21pm
hartebreak wrote:
Actually they used it way back with Shayne Kings 620 or whatever that was.
it was before Shayne King, I believe it was Lance Smail's bike they used the exemption on,

Post a reply to: now you know that 2015 dungey news

The Latest