impressed by the Ktm engines in RBSR

JMX82
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JMX82 10/23/2018 9:33pm
10/23/2018 9:33pm
mister2dt wrote:
My point was, almost everyone on here bags on the YZ as old and outdated, not worth buying compared to the KTM’s. We just watched an...
My point was, almost everyone on here bags on the YZ as old and outdated, not worth buying compared to the KTM’s. We just watched an old outdated YZ giving up 50cc’s and holding its own, winning some and losing some. It very easily could have been in the final and possibly won if RV had RD’s smoothness. RV missed his marks several times giving up real estate to RD who hit his. It wasnt the bikes that won. Thats for sure. SM hit more marks than RD, and that was insane to watch
How do you know that RV was riding a 250? That YZ he was riding was heavily modified and there was nothing in the rules preventing them to run bigbore engine
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seth505
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seth505 10/23/2018 9:41pm
10/23/2018 9:41pm Edited Date/Time 10/23/2018 9:42pm
mister2dt wrote:
They were 300’s not 250’s. So..... apples to oranges. But, RV made that “ancient technology” look pretty good snagging a podium against 50 more cc’s. Winning...
They were 300’s not 250’s. So..... apples to oranges.

But, RV made that “ancient technology” look pretty good snagging a podium against 50 more cc’s. Winning a few along the way against them.

Not bad for a bike that people on here keep saying ignore and go for the newer/better/ blah blah blah. Looked pretty damn good to me
seth505 wrote:
The YZ is a really good bike, the KTM/Husky are just better. Can't people deal with the fact that every model year one bike will be...
The YZ is a really good bike, the KTM/Husky are just better. Can't people deal with the fact that every model year one bike will be better than another? It just so happens that it is repeating year after year lately.
mister2dt wrote:
My point was, almost everyone on here bags on the YZ as old and outdated, not worth buying compared to the KTM’s. We just watched an...
My point was, almost everyone on here bags on the YZ as old and outdated, not worth buying compared to the KTM’s. We just watched an old outdated YZ giving up 50cc’s and holding its own, winning some and losing some. It very easily could have been in the final and possibly won if RV had RD’s smoothness. RV missed his marks several times giving up real estate to RD who hit his. It wasnt the bikes that won. Thats for sure. SM hit more marks than RD, and that was insane to watch
Of course it's the rider who won, I agree. That said, the YZ by definition is old and outdated. Also, all the bikes were modified so who knows, I don't know what each was puttin down for hp/torque.
jbrown15
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jbrown15 10/23/2018 10:19pm
10/23/2018 10:19pm
mister2dt wrote:
My point was, almost everyone on here bags on the YZ as old and outdated, not worth buying compared to the KTM’s. We just watched an...
My point was, almost everyone on here bags on the YZ as old and outdated, not worth buying compared to the KTM’s. We just watched an old outdated YZ giving up 50cc’s and holding its own, winning some and losing some. It very easily could have been in the final and possibly won if RV had RD’s smoothness. RV missed his marks several times giving up real estate to RD who hit his. It wasnt the bikes that won. Thats for sure. SM hit more marks than RD, and that was insane to watch
JMX82 wrote:
How do you know that RV was riding a 250? That YZ he was riding was heavily modified and there was nothing in the rules preventing...
How do you know that RV was riding a 250? That YZ he was riding was heavily modified and there was nothing in the rules preventing them to run bigbore engine
Well I believe RV said he was only riding a 250? why would he lie when there's no rule that says you can't run a big bore?
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Underground 10/23/2018 11:52pm
10/23/2018 11:52pm
More lols than facts in here. Question I want to know is whether they were running an actual Moto Tassinari reed block with the decal taken off or the genuine KTM cheapo knock off?

The Shop

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Underground 10/24/2018 12:00am
10/24/2018 12:00am
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Wonder what premix ratio they were running... The manual still call for 60:1 on these things? Tongue
Moto96 wrote:
No where close. They were far too smokey and loaded up each time in the box to be running that lean on oil. I run 40:1...
No where close. They were far too smokey and loaded up each time in the box to be running that lean on oil.
I run 40:1 for the woods and mine doesnt smoke that much.

SoCalMX70 wrote:
Yeah that was kind of my point. Tongue in cheek comment. I'm looking hard at going KTM after I'm done with my YZ, but I can't...
Yeah that was kind of my point. Tongue in cheek comment. I'm looking hard at going KTM after I'm done with my YZ, but I can't wrap my head around running 60:1 when racing (even as slow as I am).
We used to run 125's at 66:1 with Motul 800 2 stroke and not one blow up. It's not that big of a stretch as you imagine. The oil manufacturer recommends it and they are a better judge of what their oil can handle than an OEM who doesn't know what kind of out board boat motor or chainsaw 2 stroke oil you are going to put into your high performance racing motorcycle.
Underground 10/24/2018 12:06am
10/24/2018 12:06am
Moto96 wrote:
its not that critical.
clem wrote:
For any two stroke, jetting is critical unless you are referring to your weed wacker. Get the pilot and needle wrong and see how well those...
For any two stroke, jetting is critical unless you are referring to your weed wacker. Get the pilot and needle wrong and see how well those bikes pull through the rhythm sections.
Moto96 wrote:
I can guarantee you nobody there had perfect jetting. Not unless they were swapping brass from the day to the night which maybe a few with...
I can guarantee you nobody there had perfect jetting. Not unless they were swapping brass from the day to the night which maybe a few with factory techs there with old 2 stroke knowledge have, but most had a setting and ran it.






Ah yeah, remember the days before EFI, when factory mechanics would wrestle with jetting on their bikes? It was back in full force last weekend at the Red Bull Straight Rhythm. Just about everyone we talked with was wrestling with some form of jetting issue. Aside from that, the four KTMs for Ryan Dungey, Ryan Morais, Shane McElrath, and Jordon Smith were stout indeed. They did not bring knives to a gunfight.
Lifted from Pit Bits. You should have known.
Jrewing
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Jrewing 10/24/2018 3:07am
10/24/2018 3:07am
JMX82 wrote:
Here is pic of Dungeys engine. You can clearly see the serial numbers on the side of the cylinder. Does anyone know is it possible to...
Here is pic of Dungeys engine. You can clearly see the serial numbers on the side of the cylinder. Does anyone know is it possible to tell cylinder size from those numbers?





Yeah sure looks a couple mm in that spacer at the base of the cylinder. 300’s don’t rev far enough in whoop sections. They’d be hunting over rev.
That pipe looks long too verse JG33’s pipe.
Man I’d love to see that bike race the 450 nationals. No disadvantage off the gate there
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JMX82
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JMX82 10/24/2018 3:25am
10/24/2018 3:25am
I would love to see an magazine article about how KTM build these bikes bikes for the RBSR. Those factory two strokes are so cool that they are making me want to go and buy new 2019 250SX although I'm completely happy with my current 2016 250SX
Moto96
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Moto96 10/24/2018 5:10am
10/24/2018 5:10am Edited Date/Time 10/24/2018 5:24am
Moto96 wrote:
No where close. They were far too smokey and loaded up each time in the box to be running that lean on oil. I run 40:1...
No where close. They were far too smokey and loaded up each time in the box to be running that lean on oil.
I run 40:1 for the woods and mine doesnt smoke that much.

SoCalMX70 wrote:
Yeah that was kind of my point. Tongue in cheek comment. I'm looking hard at going KTM after I'm done with my YZ, but I can't...
Yeah that was kind of my point. Tongue in cheek comment. I'm looking hard at going KTM after I'm done with my YZ, but I can't wrap my head around running 60:1 when racing (even as slow as I am).
Underground wrote:
We used to run 125's at 66:1 with Motul 800 2 stroke and not one blow up. It's not that big of a stretch as you...
We used to run 125's at 66:1 with Motul 800 2 stroke and not one blow up. It's not that big of a stretch as you imagine. The oil manufacturer recommends it and they are a better judge of what their oil can handle than an OEM who doesn't know what kind of out board boat motor or chainsaw 2 stroke oil you are going to put into your high performance racing motorcycle.
Its not about what the oil will handle. Its about how long you want it to last.
Chain saws run at 50:1, and Echo and Stihl, Husky oil (The good versions) are top notch. They have to be and here is why.
Most smaller saws run at 12-17K RPM. And crank bearings don't last. They last much longer at 32:1 but the emissions folks dont care, and neither do the saw people because they will outlast the warranty.

So when it seizes, you buy another saw. Did you know newer saws have a catalytic converter? Yah. That thing in the exhaust pipe..
Its supposed to last 50 hours for the consumer.. To get to that point, better be running lean on oil. Plus, there is little to no smoke that lean.

Those bikes were pretty smokey in the box, more than it would be running 50 or 60:1. But who knows. Some oils are just smokier than others at the same ratio too. So there is that.

https://youtu.be/UEH7WWg8y8Q?start=51


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make1go
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make1go 10/24/2018 5:10am
10/24/2018 5:10am
Jeff_Crutcher wrote:
Silencer. Leaded $50 a gal fuel. Prime jetting. Vforce. Bike will BARK. But you can’t be any geek off the street to ride one. Gotta be...
Silencer. Leaded $50 a gal fuel. Prime jetting. Vforce.

Bike will BARK. But you can’t be any geek off the street to ride one. Gotta be handy with the steel.
Moto96 wrote:
Young Guns. Classic 2 movies.
jeeeeze dude its a fricken song not a movie....

warren g & nate dogg: regulate

the g funk..

8
RCF
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RCF 10/24/2018 5:13am
10/24/2018 5:13am
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Wonder what premix ratio they were running... The manual still call for 60:1 on these things? Tongue
Moto96 wrote:
No where close. They were far too smokey and loaded up each time in the box to be running that lean on oil. I run 40:1...
No where close. They were far too smokey and loaded up each time in the box to be running that lean on oil.
I run 40:1 for the woods and mine doesnt smoke that much.

SoCalMX70 wrote:
Yeah that was kind of my point. Tongue in cheek comment. I'm looking hard at going KTM after I'm done with my YZ, but I can't...
Yeah that was kind of my point. Tongue in cheek comment. I'm looking hard at going KTM after I'm done with my YZ, but I can't wrap my head around running 60:1 when racing (even as slow as I am).
My kids bike has 240 hours on the original crank running 60:1, he's a AA rider.
GrapeApe
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GrapeApe 10/24/2018 5:13am
10/24/2018 5:13am
Jeff_Crutcher wrote:
Silencer. Leaded $50 a gal fuel. Prime jetting. Vforce. Bike will BARK. But you can’t be any geek off the street to ride one. Gotta be...
Silencer. Leaded $50 a gal fuel. Prime jetting. Vforce.

Bike will BARK. But you can’t be any geek off the street to ride one. Gotta be handy with the steel.
Moto96 wrote:
Young Guns. Classic 2 movies.
make1go wrote:
jeeeeze dude its a fricken song not a movie....

warren g & nate dogg: regulate

the g funk..

2
SKIDLID
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SKIDLID 10/24/2018 5:25am
10/24/2018 5:25am Edited Date/Time 10/24/2018 5:26am
When I raced snocross in the late 90's and 2000's Bombardier (Ski Doo) told us the sleds made the most power at 25-1 mixture of oil. I never ran the ratio though.
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Moto96
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Moto96 10/24/2018 5:29am
10/24/2018 5:29am
Jeff_Crutcher wrote:
Silencer. Leaded $50 a gal fuel. Prime jetting. Vforce. Bike will BARK. But you can’t be any geek off the street to ride one. Gotta be...
Silencer. Leaded $50 a gal fuel. Prime jetting. Vforce.

Bike will BARK. But you can’t be any geek off the street to ride one. Gotta be handy with the steel.
Moto96 wrote:
Young Guns. Classic 2 movies.
make1go wrote:
jeeeeze dude its a fricken song not a movie....

warren g & nate dogg: regulate

the g funk..

make1go wrote: jeeeeze dude its a fricken song not a movie.... warren g & nate dogg: regulate the g funk..

NOPE. Warren G ripped it off from the movie. Which was 6 years Prior.

https://youtu.be/5afnr_lZP-Y
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AJ565
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AJ565 10/24/2018 6:00am
10/24/2018 6:00am
Jrewing wrote:
Yeah sure looks a couple mm in that spacer at the base of the cylinder. 300’s don’t rev far enough in whoop sections. They’d be hunting...
Yeah sure looks a couple mm in that spacer at the base of the cylinder. 300’s don’t rev far enough in whoop sections. They’d be hunting over rev.
That pipe looks long too verse JG33’s pipe.
Man I’d love to see that bike race the 450 nationals. No disadvantage off the gate there
Thats a stock KTM pipe vs. a PC pipe. Mine was the same way on my 250 when I switched it out.
Bramlett321
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Bramlett321 10/24/2018 6:26am
10/24/2018 6:26am
Dexter wrote:
It seems like Dungey and Morais pipes were stock.
GODZILLA wrote:
That ain't no stock exhaust. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2018/10/22/297791/s1200_KTM_Pipe.jpg[/img]
That ain't no stock exhaust.

I wasn't aware that Akropovic did 2 stroke silencers?? Guessing these are probably one off systems for the factory guys!!!
BobPA
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BobPA 10/24/2018 8:02am
10/24/2018 8:02am
Bramlett321 wrote:
I wasn't aware that Akropovic did 2 stroke silencers?? Guessing these are probably one off systems for the factory guys!!!
Nope, they make it for the two strokes....$524.99. Kind of comical in the price department.

Pit Row

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ns503
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ns503 10/24/2018 8:52am
10/24/2018 8:52am
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Yeah that was kind of my point. Tongue in cheek comment. I'm looking hard at going KTM after I'm done with my YZ, but I can't...
Yeah that was kind of my point. Tongue in cheek comment. I'm looking hard at going KTM after I'm done with my YZ, but I can't wrap my head around running 60:1 when racing (even as slow as I am).
Underground wrote:
We used to run 125's at 66:1 with Motul 800 2 stroke and not one blow up. It's not that big of a stretch as you...
We used to run 125's at 66:1 with Motul 800 2 stroke and not one blow up. It's not that big of a stretch as you imagine. The oil manufacturer recommends it and they are a better judge of what their oil can handle than an OEM who doesn't know what kind of out board boat motor or chainsaw 2 stroke oil you are going to put into your high performance racing motorcycle.
Moto96 wrote:
Its not about what the oil will handle. Its about how long you want it to last. Chain saws run at 50:1, and Echo and Stihl...
Its not about what the oil will handle. Its about how long you want it to last.
Chain saws run at 50:1, and Echo and Stihl, Husky oil (The good versions) are top notch. They have to be and here is why.
Most smaller saws run at 12-17K RPM. And crank bearings don't last. They last much longer at 32:1 but the emissions folks dont care, and neither do the saw people because they will outlast the warranty.

So when it seizes, you buy another saw. Did you know newer saws have a catalytic converter? Yah. That thing in the exhaust pipe..
Its supposed to last 50 hours for the consumer.. To get to that point, better be running lean on oil. Plus, there is little to no smoke that lean.

Those bikes were pretty smokey in the box, more than it would be running 50 or 60:1. But who knows. Some oils are just smokier than others at the same ratio too. So there is that.

https://youtu.be/UEH7WWg8y8Q?start=51


50 hours?

Are you sure?
Moto96
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Moto96 10/24/2018 10:00am
10/24/2018 10:00am
ns503 wrote:
50 hours?

Are you sure?
The catalytic deal is supposed to be good for 50 minimum to satisfy emissions requirements, thats what the Stihl and Husky dealer told me where I get my saw stuff.
They say it is maintainence free, but who knows. Most take that part out.

They run freer without it. Looks to me to be pretty restrictive.

Underground 10/24/2018 2:47pm
10/24/2018 2:47pm
SoCalMX70 wrote:
Yeah that was kind of my point. Tongue in cheek comment. I'm looking hard at going KTM after I'm done with my YZ, but I can't...
Yeah that was kind of my point. Tongue in cheek comment. I'm looking hard at going KTM after I'm done with my YZ, but I can't wrap my head around running 60:1 when racing (even as slow as I am).
Underground wrote:
We used to run 125's at 66:1 with Motul 800 2 stroke and not one blow up. It's not that big of a stretch as you...
We used to run 125's at 66:1 with Motul 800 2 stroke and not one blow up. It's not that big of a stretch as you imagine. The oil manufacturer recommends it and they are a better judge of what their oil can handle than an OEM who doesn't know what kind of out board boat motor or chainsaw 2 stroke oil you are going to put into your high performance racing motorcycle.
Moto96 wrote:
Its not about what the oil will handle. Its about how long you want it to last. Chain saws run at 50:1, and Echo and Stihl...
Its not about what the oil will handle. Its about how long you want it to last.
Chain saws run at 50:1, and Echo and Stihl, Husky oil (The good versions) are top notch. They have to be and here is why.
Most smaller saws run at 12-17K RPM. And crank bearings don't last. They last much longer at 32:1 but the emissions folks dont care, and neither do the saw people because they will outlast the warranty.

So when it seizes, you buy another saw. Did you know newer saws have a catalytic converter? Yah. That thing in the exhaust pipe..
Its supposed to last 50 hours for the consumer.. To get to that point, better be running lean on oil. Plus, there is little to no smoke that lean.

Those bikes were pretty smokey in the box, more than it would be running 50 or 60:1. But who knows. Some oils are just smokier than others at the same ratio too. So there is that.

https://youtu.be/UEH7WWg8y8Q?start=51


But how do the bearings know it's 32:1? Do they have some sort of sensor on them? What would happen if I made it like, 34:1 by accident going forward with your recommendation?
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Alex.434
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Alex.434 10/24/2018 4:33pm
10/24/2018 4:33pm
I like how Shane, a total goof of a dude, hand writes, in marker, "310cc RV Killer" on the side of his cylinder, a displacement size no one uses, and posts it on Instagram while joining in the shit talkin' fun around RBSR and some folks here are taking it as gospel. I saw that and laughed because it's like when you write 'TURBO' on the air filter cover of your Civic before the Autocross.

I also like feels beating out reals around YZ's and KTM's. YZ's are really nice bikes, but their engines are behind the curve of the KTMs and they weigh more, that's not speculation, that's the facts Jack. Give both stock bikes to competent tuners, have them throw the works at them, and one is still going to weigh more and make less power (hint: the YZ).
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extremeadversary 10/24/2018 10:51pm
10/24/2018 10:51pm
I'm more impressed that both Grant and Villo with 50 less CCs were that close. Props to both Mitch @ PC and Twisted Devolpment for building impressive engines.
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tek14
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tek14 10/24/2018 11:01pm
10/24/2018 11:01pm
Today thay made add about Lectron - carb and said it was used both Carson and Catanzaro taking win and second place. Anyone have pics on those bikes?
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-MAVERICK-
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-MAVERICK- 10/24/2018 11:51pm
10/24/2018 11:51pm
tek14 wrote:
Today thay made add about Lectron - carb and said it was used both Carson and Catanzaro taking win and second place. Anyone have pics on...
Today thay made add about Lectron - carb and said it was used both Carson and Catanzaro taking win and second place. Anyone have pics on those bikes?
Not the best pics but you can see the Lectron carb.




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RCF
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RCF 10/25/2018 3:21am
10/25/2018 3:21am
extremeadversary wrote:
I'm more impressed that both Grant and Villo with 50 less CCs were that close. Props to both Mitch @ PC and Twisted Devolpment for building...
I'm more impressed that both Grant and Villo with 50 less CCs were that close. Props to both Mitch @ PC and Twisted Devolpment for building impressive engines.
How do you know their bikes were 50 CC's less ? you can buy a big Bore Kit for any brand bike.
Dougy1
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Dougy1 10/25/2018 5:13am
10/25/2018 5:13am
extremeadversary wrote:
I'm more impressed that both Grant and Villo with 50 less CCs were that close. Props to both Mitch @ PC and Twisted Devolpment for building...
I'm more impressed that both Grant and Villo with 50 less CCs were that close. Props to both Mitch @ PC and Twisted Devolpment for building impressive engines.
RCF wrote:
How do you know their bikes were 50 CC's less ? you can buy a big Bore Kit for any brand bike.
FFSAKE listen to Pulp pod casts as if Mathes is going to put it out there with out solid knowledge . I thought Villo was very gracious actually considering he was that much underpowered. If he was on those Ktm's he would of been extremely difficult to beat. And I dare say Grant would of not been far behind him ...
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mister2dt
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mister2dt 10/25/2018 6:44am
10/25/2018 6:44am
extremeadversary wrote:
I'm more impressed that both Grant and Villo with 50 less CCs were that close. Props to both Mitch @ PC and Twisted Devolpment for building...
I'm more impressed that both Grant and Villo with 50 less CCs were that close. Props to both Mitch @ PC and Twisted Devolpment for building impressive engines.
RCF wrote:
How do you know their bikes were 50 CC's less ? you can buy a big Bore Kit for any brand bike.
When asked, RV stated it was still a 250. So yeah, way more impressive to be 50cc handicapped and put in the runs he did. Says a lot more about the YZ than it does the KTM.
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H4L
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H4L 10/25/2018 7:07am
10/25/2018 7:07am
mister2dt wrote:
When asked, RV stated it was still a 250. So yeah, way more impressive to be 50cc handicapped and put in the runs he did. Says...
When asked, RV stated it was still a 250. So yeah, way more impressive to be 50cc handicapped and put in the runs he did. Says a lot more about the YZ than it does the KTM.
Agree. Well said...
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