Posts
641
Joined
5/30/2017
Location
Tucson, AZ
US
Edited Date/Time
10/30/2021 5:51pm
I just listened to Ping's discussion about this issue on the Vital YouTube page. I share a lot of the same feelings that he mentioned on the issue. I am interested to hear the thoughts of you all on the seemingly inevitable move to all electric (or some sort of hybrid) dirt bikes in the future. For me, this is a deeper issue than the type of energy we use to go kinetic.
I am 32 years old. My fascination with the internal combustion engine (ICE), especially with regard to dirtbikes, has been a lifelong thing. My obsession with dirt bikes in general has been life long. I love everything about two strokes; how they sound, how they make power, how they "feel", and of course, the smell. I also feel the same about the four stroke, even though I was resistant to them during the four stroke revolution in my youth. I love the development, research, testing and tuning aspect of the ICE as well.
I feel that we will lose a huge piece of what is so fun about riding, if and when we go all electric. I'm sure there will be a handful of pros to it, like being able to ride in more areas without noise complants. But what will happen to off-road racing? Will the requirement to run the Baja 1000 be a trailer full of expensive batteries and double the pits? Can a single battery last at race pace for a full outdoors moto?
The day we can't buy a two or four stroke and the manufacturers no longer support ICE based bikes very well could be the day I hang up my boots, which is a depressing thought.
I am 32 years old. My fascination with the internal combustion engine (ICE), especially with regard to dirtbikes, has been a lifelong thing. My obsession with dirt bikes in general has been life long. I love everything about two strokes; how they sound, how they make power, how they "feel", and of course, the smell. I also feel the same about the four stroke, even though I was resistant to them during the four stroke revolution in my youth. I love the development, research, testing and tuning aspect of the ICE as well.
I feel that we will lose a huge piece of what is so fun about riding, if and when we go all electric. I'm sure there will be a handful of pros to it, like being able to ride in more areas without noise complants. But what will happen to off-road racing? Will the requirement to run the Baja 1000 be a trailer full of expensive batteries and double the pits? Can a single battery last at race pace for a full outdoors moto?
The day we can't buy a two or four stroke and the manufacturers no longer support ICE based bikes very well could be the day I hang up my boots, which is a depressing thought.
THEY are the target demographic, it’s not about you or I anymore.
I wouldn't really call it being a drama queen, just a point of view. Thanks for your input.
The Shop
Long live the Braaap.
I really question people who claim that the "fun" in riding is due to the engine in the bike. Really? Sure, power is delivered differently between a 125, 250f, 250, 450F, etc..... but why do people care so much how the power is produced? If it has ample power, who gives a shit? Fun to me is going fast around a track, consistently, improving my lap times and skill level. In the past 3 years, my riding skill level has increased dramatically just because of my Altas.
I'll be the first person to say Electric is not ready for every type of riding possible out there. Baja 1000? Cmon dude, would you bring a stock dirtbike with a 1.5gal tank to the Baja1000? Obviously you'd need a massive battery to be able to do that on electric, just like those baja 1000 bikes have super large fuel tanks.
For your weekend warrior motocrosser, the Alta MXR is absolutely sufficient for most riders. Most weekend warriors can only do 10 minute sessions anyway. Guys like me can go 20+ mins pushing hard but i wouldn't say that's common. The Alta already has the range to last that long.
For your trail rider, the Alta EXR is more than capable. I've done multiple 90+ minute rides in tight single track trail riding on a single full charge. Range is just one thing, though. How about performance? Its way easier to ride in tight, technical stuff than any other dirtbike, hands down, no questions. Want to wheelie over something? Easy. No clutch and no gears to deal with. Just whick the throttle. Need to crawl up a rocky hill? No problem, the power is super manageable with just your right wrist, and provides more traction than even a 4 stroke. Not to mention, you've got 4 different power maps stock (and lets just say more are possible). Dont forget the bike is ultra quiet and doesn't vibrate! If you were to close your eyes and imagine the best offroading experience, you'd imagine yourself on an Alta EXR in tight, technical terrain having a fricken blast.
That said, the current Alta MXR with 50% more range would be the absolute ideal motocross and offload bike IMO. Also one with the ability to quick swap batteries instead of having to wait an hour for the bike to recharge. It hasn't really been a big deal for me because i usually bring 2 bikes to the track all the time, but its worth mentioning.
There are so many advantages to electric: Wayyyyyyy less maintenance,, wayyyyy longer motor life, a power curve that no gas engine can match, a power curve that can easily be configured to mimic ANY current motocross engine, power that is ALWAYS consistent no matter the temperature/elevation/ "age of the engine", did i mention i never have to waste time making a mess cleaning air filters or changing oil? And i'm saying this as a person who enjoys wrenching on mechanical things. Its absolute LUXURY not having to worry about that stuff on a dirtbike.
My Altas are hands down my go-to bikes to chose when going motocross riding. Any other bike is just a chore at this point. Sure, i have to lug a generator + charger to the track, but i'd much rather have to do that than clean an air filter after every ride, or change transmission oil after 5 hours, or engine oil after 8-10 hours.
As riders, we are not liked! We are actually hated for the most part.
Did your riding skill actually increase all the way across the board and on all bikes because of riding the Alta, or did you get better/faster on the Alta because you don’t have to do anything other than twist the throttle and brake? I.e no shifting/clutch
I do think that it would create the ability to open up more tracks closer to the suburbs, without the issues surrounding it getting shut down by the community because of noise issues.
It’s just a compliance gimmick with zero foundation on longevity because emissions is the current recreational outrage.
People who are trying to shut down trails, tracks and land will continue that fight well after these come into play. It just won’t be carbon emissions.
Perhaps my mindset is from a different era as a whole, or maybe its just me. But like another poster said, change is indeed hard. All the fun doesn't come from simply what the engine is necessarily, but for me its a part of the whole experience, and I enjoy it. To each their own!
Pit Row
"I really question people who claim that the "fun" in riding is due to the engine in the bike. Really? Sure, power is delivered differently between a 125, 250f, 250, 450F, etc..... but why do people care so much how the power is produced?"
Why? Because people like different things.
McDonald's vs Wendy's
Coke vs Pepsi
MTN Bike vs E MTN Bikes
How hard is it to understand people like different things. Not everyone is on the electric bandwagon. BFD!
Some people actually like changing gears and working on their bikes.
Years ago on Tomorrow's world TV show in UK, they showed an engine running on finely powdered and dried algae. They routed the exhaust back to help grow more algae.
Ethanol also produces CO2, but its a renewable fuel... however, it takes a lot of energy to process, and also growing corn takes a lot of precious water.
So many things to consider....
The Alta has progressed my technique on all bikes across the board. Not having to clutch and shift is a huge advantage. Instead of having to spend a tiny bit of focus on shifting and clutch work, I spend more of my focus on line choice, technique, etc. Not only that, but I'm able to stand up more often on the Alta vs any gas bike because shifting under acceleration usually has to be done sitting down... dont have to do that on the Alta. Its quite an amazing experience, honestly. Any fun you may think is lost is easily overcome by being able to ride faster easier, and to me going fast is having fun. It's the smoothest power delivery you'll ever feel on a dirtbike and its power that isn't restricted to hitting a rev limiter in a particular gear. Because of that and because of the massive torque the electric motor makes, the gas gyro effect in the air that raises the front wheel is much more than a gas bike. This means its easy to get yourself out of hairy, endo-ish situations when you hit a knuckle on a jump face or something like that.
That all being said, i can easily jump between my Alta and my KX125 absolutely fine. Its not like you forget how to shift and use the clutch after riding an electric bike. The Alta makes having to shift and using the clutch feel like an extra chore while riding. The instant response of the electric motor spoils you real quick. Kinda like the introduction of 4 strokes spoiled riders because of the added torque down low. Its a similar jump in feeling moving over to the Alta from a 4-stroke.
You gotta try it.
Literally EVERY person i've let ride one of my Alta's has come back from that ride with a huge smile on their face, and cant help themselves but say how good the bike is.
Including guys like Jeff Walker (this was my EXR):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvqibD_d9NA
Having said that the argument that we must change because we will run out of oil isn’t a good argument. Lithium must be mined too. We will run out of lithium too.
When the guys with Altas show up at our tracks and have to plug in their bikes to charge it back up, they run their loud ass / gas burning generators, which are annoying AF. This is the biggest downside of riding an Alta at the track.
But… I will admit that when I rode my buddies, I was immediately comfortable on it and jumped every jump on the track on my first lap. I was very surprised at how easy it was to get comfortable on. The power it had in the race mode was much better than I could have imagined.
With that said, I will own an electric bike eventually, but I’ll never get rid of my other bikes. I ride a lot of off-road / single track and our rides consist of 60-80 mile loops. I’d sure hate to run out of battery power in some of the places we ride !
I suspect once electric dirtbikes become more mainstram, local tracks will have 240V RV hookups so no generators would be needed. Hell, i would gladly pay 5-10$ extra on top of the gate fee if i was able to just plug in to electricity on the property.
Both are still having fun fishing. Two different ways, same passion for the hobby.
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