YZF250 is an unfair advantage compared to the rest

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9/19/2020 4:55 PM

How many more HP do you think a STAR YZF250 makes than a GEICO CRF250? 5?

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Racing is life. Anything before or after is just waiting


9/19/2020 4:56 PM

4-5 hp easy. But the torque. Doesn’t matter the Star rider if they got a clear shot and crack the throttle and hook. They pull on whatever is next to them.

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9/19/2020 5:03 PM

Ban 5 valves 😃

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2015 Beta 500 RS, history: 99 KTM 300, 87 CR250, 84 KLR 600, 82 GPZ 550, 81 KX 250, 80 KX 250, 79 Montesa 414 VE, 78 250 VB, 77 360 VB, 76 360 VA, 75 YZ 125, 74 TM 125, 72 TS 125, 60's West Bend Go Boy Kart

9/19/2020 5:06 PM

Johnny Depp wrote:

Ban 5 valves 😃

They’re 4 now

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9/19/2020 5:39 PM

Peak HP is probably close Between most of the big Teams but like stated above it’s the Torque difference that probably gives them the edge.

Ghost

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9/19/2020 5:41 PM

Johnny Depp wrote:

Ban 5 valves 😃

Bigoldbeef wrote:

They’re 4 now

Ban 4 valves wink

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9/19/2020 5:42 PM

motokiwi wrote:

How many more HP do you think a STAR YZF250 makes than a GEICO CRF250? 5?

certain green bikes in the 250 class are known to be knocking on the door of ... 60HP

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9/19/2020 5:44 PM

The track was prepped so the advantage wasn’t there that much. JMart turned a faster lap time then the 450s and was good in and out of the tight turns

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9/19/2020 5:48 PM

JMarts body weight is an unfair advantage as well whistling

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9/19/2020 5:58 PM

It's not unfair. Unless they are cheating, may the best Team win.

My opinion is the 250 class should change to a "spec" class with rules similar to Limited at Lorettas. More riders could compete and would push more to the 450 class.

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9/19/2020 5:59 PM

toomanykaws wrote:

4-5 hp easy. But the torque. Doesn’t matter the Star rider if they got a clear shot and crack the throttle and hook. They pull on whatever is next to them.

4-5 easy? Surely you jest. With that much more it wouldn't even be a race. But as far as the rest of your post, you're spot on.

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9/19/2020 6:09 PM

Johnny Depp wrote:

Ban 5 valves 😃

Bigoldbeef wrote:

They’re 4 now

Brad460 wrote:

Ban 4 valves wink

Ban 4-strokes ?

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9/19/2020 6:28 PM

8tensolutions wrote:

It's not unfair. Unless they are cheating, may the best Team win.

My opinion is the 250 class should change to a "spec" class with rules similar to Limited at Lorettas. More riders could compete and would push more to the 450 class.

I really like this idea. What exactly could teams like Geico and Star not do that would make it more fair for privateers though? There’s really good product available for privateers to buy, I guess it just depends on your budget. It’s not like Star is running special fuel that privateers can’t buy or something (not making an inside joke here LOL). There’s already a price limit on 250 suspension right? Maybe they could have a price limit on engines possibly? I’m just spit balling..
It’s probably the long hours of dyno room, dirt dyno and R&D that Privateers don’t have access to that really makes the difference.

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9/19/2020 6:30 PM

What are the suspected power numbers from a factory 250f. Has there ever been a leaked dyno chart or a legitamate source on the suspected power output?

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9/19/2020 6:47 PM

Why can’t people realize the Yamaha 250 is so much better than all the other bikes

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9/19/2020 6:51 PM

waldpw18 wrote:

Why can’t people realize the Yamaha 250 is so much better than all the other bikes

Because your vital overlords swear its 6 feet wide and not orange.

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9/19/2020 6:59 PM

They said the yamaha 250f was around 56 for there outdoor bike and that was a few years ago...

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9/19/2020 7:04 PM

Johnny Depp wrote:

Ban 5 valves 😃

Bigoldbeef wrote:

They’re 4 now

Brad460 wrote:

Ban 4 valves wink

Ban valves!

....unless it’s a power valve of course.....

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9/19/2020 7:10 PM

8tensolutions wrote:

It's not unfair. Unless they are cheating, may the best Team win.

My opinion is the 250 class should change to a "spec" class with rules similar to Limited at Lorettas. More riders could compete and would push more to the 450 class.

this. it would never happen because of teams like pro circuit (their whole business is selling 4-stroke dope..over priced unreliable high HP motors ..) and yeah im not knocking the quality of their work but any built 4-stroke motor has a very limited shelf life.

they ought to make it a spec class to some extent with atleast limiting the revs or using a restrictor plate or somethin'

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9/19/2020 7:11 PM
Edited Date/Time: 9/19/2020 7:14 PM

ryanxmx31 wrote:

They said the yamaha 250f was around 56 for there outdoor bike and that was a few years ago...

this was a few years ago but the geico crf250s were putting down way over 50.

the average 125 before 4-strokes became popular made about 30 hp lol



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9/19/2020 7:15 PM
Edited Date/Time: 9/19/2020 8:05 PM

d394 wrote:

certain green bikes in the 250 class are known to be knocking on the door of ... 60HP

Huh ?

50HP is about all you’re going to get from any of the 250’s, without losing all the bottom end/ torque. Mitch’s bikes were blowing up trying to keep up with Geico and Star bikes. I doubt he’s able to pull as much from the Kawi

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9/19/2020 7:21 PM
Edited Date/Time: 9/19/2020 7:22 PM

Star bikes have way more power than they need...and should definitely share some of their HP with the less successful teams...and also give some to all the riders that are too lazy to put together a decent program.

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9/19/2020 7:24 PM

Down draft intake bro

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10' 200 XC-w
96' XR600r

9/19/2020 7:30 PM

The sad fact of the matter is that engine is in a relatively low state of tune, and can probably produce a lot more power. Reason why?, when is the last time you saw one DNF?

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9/19/2020 8:05 PM
Edited Date/Time: 9/19/2020 8:05 PM

Horsepower wins advertisements; torque wins races. I'd wager a guess that the Star Yami's are close to a full lb-ft more than the rest. They eat going up hills and pull hard. Very stout motors. I'd guess they're around 55hp and 24-25 lb-ft torque on a dynojet.

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9/19/2020 8:11 PM

waldpw18 wrote:

Why can’t people realize the Yamaha 250 is so much better than all the other bikes

mister2dt wrote:

Because your vital overlords swear its 6 feet wide and not orange.

And not built like a 110 lb super model.

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9/19/2020 8:13 PM

DynoDan22 wrote:

Horsepower wins advertisements; torque wins races. I'd wager a guess that the Star Yami's are close to a full lb-ft more than the rest. They eat going up hills and pull hard. Very stout motors. I'd guess they're around 55hp and 24-25 lb-ft torque on a dynojet.

Dan,
That’s a lot of HP. Have you seen a reliable 250f push over 50, without sacrificing the torque ?

The 450’s are only around 62-65

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9/19/2020 8:43 PM

Sounds pretty communist-y to me

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9/19/2020 8:55 PM

450's can be a fair amount more than 65hp. Dynos differ from brand to brand, so numbers can vary. The Star Yamahas are well into the 50's for sure. Reliable? Yes, for the 3-3.5hr service intervals. You'd be surprised how little torque you need to crack 55hp at 14k rpm. I know a certain 450 that won Daytona that was flirting with 70hp.

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9/19/2020 8:56 PM

DynoDan22 wrote:

Horsepower wins advertisements; torque wins races. I'd wager a guess that the Star Yami's are close to a full lb-ft more than the rest. They eat going up hills and pull hard. Very stout motors. I'd guess they're around 55hp and 24-25 lb-ft torque on a dynojet.

But torque is nothing without rpm (my legs putting 100ftlb into the crank of a bicycle won’t win any races).

If only there was a measurement that combined torque and rpm. Then we’d be seeing the full picture.

Oh yeah, that’s horsepower.

I think what you mean to say is peak hp doesn’t win races, but a broad spread of usable hp does.

This is why dyno graphs are useful. Not for their peak numbers, but for their shape and area under the curve.

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