Why does jgr not produce good results?

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8/15/2018 3:27 AM
Edited Date/Time: 8/15/2018 3:32 AM

It’s not money, they have all that nascar money for one... they have some of the best r&d in the game.. they have had good riders over the years, just none produced..

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8/15/2018 3:40 AM

They have only ever had one rider that was a true championship guy that was js7 . Imo barica never was or never will be in the hunt for titles .in fact put RD 5 and RV back racing and barica is finishing the exact same place as he was with jgr . Peick had a great SX year and is doing well outdoor s considering his hand . End of the day unless jgr sign Tomac ,MM25 or Roczen I don't think they will be in the hunt for a title . But I do think Hill will do races indoors and outdoor s next year .I don't think there s anything wrong with the team or bike now .I just think the first backward gem Yamaha was hard to get top riders to sign for them as no one liked the bike

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8/15/2018 3:51 AM

brimx153 wrote:

They have only ever had one rider that was a true championship guy that was js7 . Imo barica never was or never will be in the hunt for titles .in fact put RD 5 and RV back racing and barica is finishing the exact same place as he was with jgr . Peick had a great SX year and is doing well outdoor s considering his hand . End of the day unless jgr sign Tomac ,MM25 or Roczen I don't think they will be in the hunt for a title . But I do think Hill will do races indoors and outdoor s next year .I don't think there s anything wrong with the team or bike now .I just think the first backward gem Yamaha was hard to get top riders to sign for them as no one liked the bike

The bike is not good, per a person on the team. That’s why Ricky was just in Japan, testing the bike for suz to try and make it better.. how much longer are they contacted to ride Suzuki’s?

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8/15/2018 4:05 AM

The riders arent contenders. The bikes are behind the rest.

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8/15/2018 4:47 AM

kb228 wrote:

The riders arent contenders. The bikes are behind the rest.

I agree with this. Maybe the next team to ride huskys? Since there is already 2 Ktm teams and only 1 husky

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8/15/2018 4:50 AM

They aren’t switching brands for awhile

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8/15/2018 4:53 AM

Kyle_McNab wrote:

They aren’t switching brands for awhile

That sucks for them?

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8/15/2018 5:02 AM
Edited Date/Time: 8/15/2018 5:05 AM

Maybe just because you have a lot of money to support a team, JUST maybe it provides them much pleasure to support a deserving rider and helping their success to provide them the support they need to become a champion! So it is money, and they can they can do whatever they want. There are huge fans of racing themselves. It's much more rewarding to raise a champion and create that legacy.

If I had a lot of money, I would do the exact same thing. The factory riders are representing their brand so of course, they will offer a big salary to an existing champion for a higher chance winner.
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8/15/2018 5:03 AM

kb228 wrote:

The riders arent contenders. The bikes are behind the rest.

logan_140 wrote:

I agree with this. Maybe the next team to ride huskys? Since there is already 2 Ktm teams and only 1 husky

They don’t necessarily need to switch brands. Suzuki needs to get their head out of their asses and put out a bike thats competitive. They make stupid money from sales in india, theres no reason they cant do a good job. Especially when their gsxrs are doing well.

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8/15/2018 5:12 AM

kb228 wrote:

The riders arent contenders. The bikes are behind the rest.

logan_140 wrote:

I agree with this. Maybe the next team to ride huskys? Since there is already 2 Ktm teams and only 1 husky

kb228 wrote:

They don’t necessarily need to switch brands. Suzuki needs to get their head out of their asses and put out a bike thats competitive. They make stupid money from sales in india, theres no reason they cant do a good job. Especially when their gsxrs are doing well.

Maybe when you make stupid money with other products, it doesn't make sense to invest in products that don't make them very much money.

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8/15/2018 5:14 AM

kb228 wrote:

The riders arent contenders. The bikes are behind the rest.

logan_140 wrote:

I agree with this. Maybe the next team to ride huskys? Since there is already 2 Ktm teams and only 1 husky

kb228 wrote:

They don’t necessarily need to switch brands. Suzuki needs to get their head out of their asses and put out a bike thats competitive. They make stupid money from sales in india, theres no reason they cant do a good job. Especially when their gsxrs are doing well.

Whats wrong with the bike? Bogle got like 8 holeshots in a row, so its not slow.. Are you saying the suspension is shit? Are you saying it can't turn well?

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8/15/2018 5:19 AM

logan_140 wrote:

I agree with this. Maybe the next team to ride huskys? Since there is already 2 Ktm teams and only 1 husky

kb228 wrote:

They don’t necessarily need to switch brands. Suzuki needs to get their head out of their asses and put out a bike thats competitive. They make stupid money from sales in india, theres no reason they cant do a good job. Especially when their gsxrs are doing well.

Markee wrote:

Whats wrong with the bike? Bogle got like 8 holeshots in a row, so its not slow.. Are you saying the suspension is shit? Are you saying it can't turn well?

Its not as good as the rest. Its going to finish last in the shootout like it has for years. Pro level racing requires the best bikes. Anything less hinders rhe riders. The bike is a good bike dont get me wrong. Its just not as good as the rest

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8/15/2018 5:21 AM

brimx153 wrote:

They have only ever had one rider that was a true championship guy that was js7 . Imo barica never was or never will be in the hunt for titles .in fact put RD 5 and RV back racing and barica is finishing the exact same place as he was with jgr . Peick had a great SX year and is doing well outdoor s considering his hand . End of the day unless jgr sign Tomac ,MM25 or Roczen I don't think they will be in the hunt for a title . But I do think Hill will do races indoors and outdoor s next year .I don't think there s anything wrong with the team or bike now .I just think the first backward gem Yamaha was hard to get top riders to sign for them as no one liked the bike

logan_140 wrote:

The bike is not good, per a person on the team. That’s why Ricky was just in Japan, testing the bike for suz to try and make it better.. how much longer are they contacted to ride Suzuki’s?

Your an idiot if u think the jgr 450 is not good enough to win . You can say that with the 250 f but not the 450 . Do u think if they were factory ktm there result s would be better ??? . Only thing stopping jgr is rider line up .peick did well this year .especially in SX. where you expecting him to win the SX championship or something. How many holeshot s did bogle get .bikes power def is not a problem .

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8/15/2018 5:26 AM

kb228 wrote:

They don’t necessarily need to switch brands. Suzuki needs to get their head out of their asses and put out a bike thats competitive. They make stupid money from sales in india, theres no reason they cant do a good job. Especially when their gsxrs are doing well.

Markee wrote:

Whats wrong with the bike? Bogle got like 8 holeshots in a row, so its not slow.. Are you saying the suspension is shit? Are you saying it can't turn well?

kb228 wrote:

Its not as good as the rest. Its going to finish last in the shootout like it has for years. Pro level racing requires the best bikes. Anything less hinders rhe riders. The bike is a good bike dont get me wrong. Its just not as good as the rest

Yep cause jgr just race bone standard bikes .If it s last in the shootout must mean it's the worst factory bike too. It's amazing how many bag on the bike yet look at there results . What other brand has had so many rider s all do great on it . ???

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8/15/2018 5:48 AM

kb228 wrote:

They don’t necessarily need to switch brands. Suzuki needs to get their head out of their asses and put out a bike thats competitive. They make stupid money from sales in india, theres no reason they cant do a good job. Especially when their gsxrs are doing well.

Markee wrote:

Whats wrong with the bike? Bogle got like 8 holeshots in a row, so its not slow.. Are you saying the suspension is shit? Are you saying it can't turn well?

kb228 wrote:

Its not as good as the rest. Its going to finish last in the shootout like it has for years. Pro level racing requires the best bikes. Anything less hinders rhe riders. The bike is a good bike dont get me wrong. Its just not as good as the rest

Shootouts? Man you are in left field on this one. You didn't answer any of my questions.

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8/15/2018 6:07 AM
Edited Date/Time: 8/15/2018 6:09 AM

Markee wrote:

Whats wrong with the bike? Bogle got like 8 holeshots in a row, so its not slow.. Are you saying the suspension is shit? Are you saying it can't turn well?

kb228 wrote:

Its not as good as the rest. Its going to finish last in the shootout like it has for years. Pro level racing requires the best bikes. Anything less hinders rhe riders. The bike is a good bike dont get me wrong. Its just not as good as the rest

Markee wrote:

Shootouts? Man you are in left field on this one. You didn't answer any of my questions.

Im saying its not as good as the rest, in most categories. Power, weight, suspension, handling. I feel its pretty common knowledge. I mean what 2019 is the suzuki better than all around? Answer me that.

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8/15/2018 6:13 AM

As far as the 450 goes, I don't think it's the bike. Roczen ran one to a title. Peick is injured, and still running in the top 10, as is Hill. Look at Cunningham without factory backing, very competitive on that Zuke, There are 2 yellow bikes in the top 10, and a 3rd in 11th. I only see 1 green, 1 blue and 1 white in the top 10, and the white bike has a lot of points earned when it was yellow. wink And, like it was said earlier, Bogle ran out front a lot, until his injury slowed him down.

Time will tell with the new 250 making it's appearance next year and A-Mart supposedly running one for JGR??


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8/15/2018 6:15 AM

Roczen absolutely decimated the outdoors on the 10 year old Suzuki.

I really don't think its the bike. JGR has all the tools that the other factory teams have. There bike is more than capable of winning a championship.

They haven't hired a championship rider yet (other than JS7)

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Race Bike: 2018 KTM 350SXF

Other Bikes: 1985 CR80R, 1990 CR250R, 1998 PW80, Specialized Fuse Comp 29.

Sold: 2016 YZ250F, 2012 CRF250R

8/15/2018 6:16 AM

kb228 wrote:

Its not as good as the rest. Its going to finish last in the shootout like it has for years. Pro level racing requires the best bikes. Anything less hinders rhe riders. The bike is a good bike dont get me wrong. Its just not as good as the rest

Markee wrote:

Shootouts? Man you are in left field on this one. You didn't answer any of my questions.

kb228 wrote:

Im saying its not as good as the rest, in most categories. Power, weight, suspension, handling. I feel its pretty common knowledge. I mean what 2019 is the suzuki better than all around? Answer me that.

So what does a, off the showroom floor, Suzuki have in common with a JGR race bike? I would guess frame and swingarm and that's about it. Didn't Bogle win a couple races last year?

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8/15/2018 6:20 AM
Edited Date/Time: 8/15/2018 6:20 AM

Suzuki RM-Z450 has won FIVE outdoor Championships since it's creation in 2005 and THREE Supercross Championships.

Honda CRF450 has won TWO outdoor Championship and ZERO Supercross Championships.

That's 8-2 in favor of Suzuki over Honda. As a matter of fact, the RM-Z450 has the most 450 outdoor titles of any brand since 450s came out.

Suzuki - 5
Kawasaki - 4 (possibly 5 after 2018)
KTM - 3
Honda - 2
Yamaha - 1

It's not the bike. It's the riders. When top riders have been on Suzukis, they have won. The top riders win regardless of brand.

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8/15/2018 6:21 AM

kb228 wrote:

They don’t necessarily need to switch brands. Suzuki needs to get their head out of their asses and put out a bike thats competitive. They make stupid money from sales in india, theres no reason they cant do a good job. Especially when their gsxrs are doing well.

Markee wrote:

Whats wrong with the bike? Bogle got like 8 holeshots in a row, so its not slow.. Are you saying the suspension is shit? Are you saying it can't turn well?

kb228 wrote:

Its not as good as the rest. Its going to finish last in the shootout like it has for years. Pro level racing requires the best bikes. Anything less hinders rhe riders. The bike is a good bike dont get me wrong. Its just not as good as the rest

Explain Tomac on the Kawi that for the last 2 years has finished next to last in the shootouts.

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8/15/2018 6:25 AM

Markee wrote:

Shootouts? Man you are in left field on this one. You didn't answer any of my questions.

kb228 wrote:

Im saying its not as good as the rest, in most categories. Power, weight, suspension, handling. I feel its pretty common knowledge. I mean what 2019 is the suzuki better than all around? Answer me that.

Fourth_Floor wrote:

So what does a, off the showroom floor, Suzuki have in common with a JGR race bike? I would guess frame and swingarm and that's about it. Didn't Bogle win a couple races last year?

Doesnt mean its not as good as the rest. No shit its capable but because its a tier lower its more difficult.

Lets say factory teams improve the bike by 30%. If ktm and honda start at 70% stock and zook is 60% stock, they wont hit 100% like the other brands. The rider has to make up that 10% to win. Theres limits to how much bikes are improved from the base model. If that wasnt the case then theoretically you can make a 2008 more powerful than a 2019.

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8/15/2018 6:39 AM

Moto_Geek wrote:

Maybe just because you have a lot of money to support a team, JUST maybe it provides them much pleasure to support a deserving rider and helping their success to provide them the support they need to become a champion! So it is money, and they can they can do whatever they want. There are huge fans of racing themselves. It's much more rewarding to raise a champion and create that legacy.

If I had a lot of money, I would do the exact same thing. The factory riders are representing their brand so of course, they will offer a big salary to an existing champion for a higher chance winner.

Why is your writing so small or are you talking quietly

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8/15/2018 6:39 AM

The 450 is fine, Roczen won a title with it recently. JGR has the money to pay for a title contender but there isn't one on the market. Bogle will come around with time on the track and Pieck will be a 4-8 finisher and Hill needs to figure it out or get gone.

IMO, the only thing suzuki needs to figure out is to lose some weight. The motor is a very good smooth linear powerband that doesn't pull your arms out with an excellent handling and cornering chassis. So, I do feel it is a well rounded bike compared to the others.

Suzuki spends the majority of their R&D money on the GSXR and I don't blame them when that is their main source of revenue in the states followed by their marine motors.

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8/15/2018 6:41 AM

Anyways I predict big things from Hill come 19 sx.

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8/15/2018 6:43 AM

If they got a real contender instead also rans or merely capable riders, then they would be fine, the bike they are building is more than capable, the riders are the issue.

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vomiting equals disqualification.

8/15/2018 6:48 AM

Take any of the JGR riders and put them on whatever you think is the "best" bike and the results will still be the same. Period.

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8/15/2018 6:54 AM

How do they expect to win on a SUZUKI?!? grin

Photo

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8/15/2018 7:01 AM

Jbone is great but I think a change at that position is needed.

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8/15/2018 7:02 AM

They have won races on two different brand that were not necessarily favored by many pro riders.

They are very innovative, I think they are great at manufacturing and collecting data. Maybe they are missing out on the rider? If the rider says it feels one way and the team says..nope our data says this. Then it starts to make the rider second guess themselves.

I think they try to apply the same methods of success from nascar to supercross/motocross. The problem is the amount of variables in our sport. Nascar has a lot don't get me wrong, but as far as I know they don't currently have a way to replicate a race on the dirt bike like they do with the car.

Eventually they will figure it out. I think they will break new ground in some area which will give their riders a pretty significant advantage. At that point they will attract another big name rider who will be willing to work with them. Are they making a push towards a top rider again? Or is Weston their #1?

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