Why do eBikes have to compete?

Agree. Have a spec class and exhibition races. No need to combine them with IC engine bikes.

racingfortheson wrote:

So everyone is talking about eBikes and how they aren't on part with 250f or 450 or what ever, but why must they be? Here is a link of an eBike race and I thing it us the way to go. A big chunk of riders now a days think modern bikes are to fast. Looking at KTM'S eBike, it may be perfect. Slower speeds can make hitting the ground not as bad. The battery issue would be easier to overcome. Mark911 shared this and I'm in. This could and should be the future of eBikes.

Because it won't be long before "E" bikes outperform "ICE" bikes.
Why not let the best riders race against each other on what their sponsor
wants to promote? If it's not competitive it will not make it to the night show.
TM

racingfortheson wrote:

So everyone is talking about eBikes and how they aren't on part with 250f or 450 or what ever, but why must they be? Here is a link of an eBike race and I thing it us the way to go. A big chunk of riders now a days think modern bikes are to fast. Looking at KTM'S eBike, it may be perfect. Slower speeds can make hitting the ground not as bad. The battery issue would be easier to overcome. Mark911 shared this and I'm in. This could and should be the future of eBikes.

ToolMaker wrote:

Because it won't be long before "E" bikes outperform "ICE" bikes.
Why not let the best riders race against each other on what their sponsor
wants to promote? If it's not competitive it will not make it to the night show.
TM

Because then they might as well just let 2 strokes compete.

I'm talking about making races better and more competitive. 450's are to fast for SX. 250f is to much of a jump from 85. People always talk about it. Let's not start the eBikes up there. I my opinion, this would be so good for our sport. With the smaller bike, price for building could be lower, batteries could last longer, and riding areas could be anywhere. Here is the 125 class, without the smoke and noise. I do think $10k is to much but they get them under $6k I'm buying one.

racingfortheson wrote:

So everyone is talking about eBikes and how they aren't on part with 250f or 450 or what ever, but why must they be? Here is a link of an eBike race and I thing it us the way to go. A big chunk of riders now a days think modern bikes are to fast. Looking at KTM'S eBike, it may be perfect. Slower speeds can make hitting the ground not as bad. The battery issue would be easier to overcome. Mark911 shared this and I'm in. This could and should be the future of eBikes.

i dont think e bikes and gas bike should be racing against each other. even more so than 125's vs 250fs

I think ebike have a place in the industry and i think they will be good, but again

not in the same classes as 4 stroke or 2 strokes.

I've already read about a guy doing a off road race from a dead engine start.....he doesnt have to 'start' his engine.

racingfortheson wrote:

So everyone is talking about eBikes and how they aren't on part with 250f or 450 or what ever, but why must they be? Here is a link of an eBike race and I thing it us the way to go. A big chunk of riders now a days think modern bikes are to fast. Looking at KTM'S eBike, it may be perfect. Slower speeds can make hitting the ground not as bad. The battery issue would be easier to overcome. Mark911 shared this and I'm in. This could and should be the future of eBikes.

Phillip_Lamb wrote:

i dont think e bikes and gas bike should be racing against each other. even more so than 125's vs 250fs

I think ebike have a place in the industry and i think they will be good, but again

not in the same classes as 4 stroke or 2 strokes.

I've already read about a guy doing a off road race from a dead engine start.....he doesnt have to 'start' his engine.

I'm with you. The industry could start them off with less power. Think of how long the Alta battery would last on the KTM.

racingfortheson wrote:

So everyone is talking about eBikes and how they aren't on part with 250f or 450 or what ever, but why must they be? Here is a link of an eBike race and I thing it us the way to go. A big chunk of riders now a days think modern bikes are to fast. Looking at KTM'S eBike, it may be perfect. Slower speeds can make hitting the ground not as bad. The battery issue would be easier to overcome. Mark911 shared this and I'm in. This could and should be the future of eBikes.

Phillip_Lamb wrote:

i dont think e bikes and gas bike should be racing against each other. even more so than 125's vs 250fs

I think ebike have a place in the industry and i think they will be good, but again

not in the same classes as 4 stroke or 2 strokes.

I've already read about a guy doing a off road race from a dead engine start.....he doesnt have to 'start' his engine.

There is a starting sequence, from what I've read, that they could enforce mist be used.

There are already too many classes that don't mean doo-doo. For our sport to be recognized at the Pro level, they need to run whatever they think they can best compete with. Just because we have too many dumb rules already (like the 2-strokes) doesn't mean we need more. The 250's are already just as fast as the 450's, so please don't give me this liberal gonna save the tracks and riders from themselves slow the sport down stuff.

If you want to continue down the path of more classes so that the average Sunday racer gets 10 minutes of track time and has to wait for 30 classes to run go right ahead and make another class for the left handed red haired kids that live in a certain zip code.

When we practice, everyone runs together and the sky doesn't fall. Stop the madness, run more classes based on competitive lap times and it will be better racing, fuller gates, shorter days and more fun for all involved. Let technology move forward, don't dumb it down.

Slower is not faster.

Eventually there will be both, a gnarly E class and an intermediate E class, like how it is with 450 and 250 now. At least that's my theory.

It should be delineated along automatic vs. manuel transmissions.

If you want to argue about starting technique regarding dead engine starts, then there needs to be a dicsussion about moto/SX starts and the lack of clutch and needed gear changes on E bikes. Talk about an unfair apples to oranges situation. Just put a damn gearbox in them if you want to race heads up.

This for me is the biggest sticking point for putting E bikes in comp with ICE bikes. The ability to manage the gearbox and clutch technique are so integral to moto that atuomatics should never be allowed to race in the same class as manuel ICE bikes.

How many times have we seen passes made by blown shifts and bad gear selection? In my opinion E bikes will do two things. One, make racing more lame and boring by eliminating a very important part of race craft. Shifting. And two, make skeptics complaints about moto "all you do is twist the throttle" more legitimate.

All you guys that love them so much create your own series and prove just how much the public is begging for silent racing.

racingfortheson wrote:

So everyone is talking about eBikes and how they aren't on part with 250f or 450 or what ever, but why must they be? Here is a link of an eBike race and I thing it us the way to go. A big chunk of riders now a days think modern bikes are to fast. Looking at KTM'S eBike, it may be perfect. Slower speeds can make hitting the ground not as bad. The battery issue would be easier to overcome. Mark911 shared this and I'm in. This could and should be the future of eBikes.

I think tracks are to fast. I don't enjoy hitting jumps on a 450 in 4th wide open . Slower tracks are needed.

dimetime wrote:

It should be delineated along automatic vs. manuel transmissions.

If you want to argue about starting technique regarding dead engine starts, then there needs to be a dicsussion about moto/SX starts and the lack of clutch and needed gear changes on E bikes. Talk about an unfair apples to oranges situation. Just put a damn gearbox in them if you want to race heads up.

This for me is the biggest sticking point for putting E bikes in comp with ICE bikes. The ability to manage the gearbox and clutch technique are so integral to moto that atuomatics should never be allowed to race in the same class as manuel ICE bikes.

How many times have we seen passes made by blown shifts and bad gear selection? In my opinion E bikes will do two things. One, make racing more lame and boring by eliminating a very important part of race craft. Shifting. And two, make skeptics complaints about moto "all you do is twist the throttle" more legitimate.

All you guys that love them so much create your own series and prove just how much the public is begging for silent racing.

Yes, this sport is so large that cutting the pizza a little thinner is a great solution. (sarcasm alert)

There will always be people that resist change, and you could still ride a Maico like the guy at LL's did.

Maybe there should be a rule in the NBA and the NFL to have teams that allow different ethinicities to compete. It's just not fair I tell ya!

Every sport evolved as technology got better. We have lost 2 tracks in our area in the last years because of the noise. I'm ready for a change. I don't have to have noise to have fun. I just know the way they are going, trying to get as good as 4 strokes, I'll never afford a new eBike.

if people complained about two strokes being taken over im pretty sure mass riots would break out if electric bikes tried to take over. I see people complain about noise but if a truck got shut down because of noise then it was probably to close to something anyway. all my local tracks are nice and spread out from any residential spots.

racingfortheson wrote:

So everyone is talking about eBikes and how they aren't on part with 250f or 450 or what ever, but why must they be? Here is a link of an eBike race and I thing it us the way to go. A big chunk of riders now a days think modern bikes are to fast. Looking at KTM'S eBike, it may be perfect. Slower speeds can make hitting the ground not as bad. The battery issue would be easier to overcome. Mark911 shared this and I'm in. This could and should be the future of eBikes.

r.sal923 wrote:

I think tracks are to fast. I don't enjoy hitting jumps on a 450 in 4th wide open . Slower tracks are needed.

At some point, with tiny jumps and E-bikes going slower speeds, you are talking about a different sport. Which is fine. Hopefully it is another niche that keeps riding areas open and brings new people in. It is certainly less intimidating.
I have been interested in E-bikes, but after actually seeing a race, I'm not sure it's for me. But maybe I was influenced by the Euro production style and riding gear. I don't think seeing a berm shred on an E bike will ever be as cool to me as a normal bike.

Some people complain, others are more interested in riding the fastest bike available.
Given the characteristics of the electric motor, it's only a matter of time before IC can't compete

Having no where local to ride has stopped myself and many I know from riding. If quiet e-bikes allow more tracks to stay open I'm all for it.

Just give them their own class...

Ohhh so that's what the EMX class was supposed to be for lol

Andy_Greenney wrote:

Some people complain, others are more interested in riding the fastest bike available.
Given the characteristics of the electric motor, it's only a matter of time before IC can't compete

Having no where local to ride has stopped myself and many I know from riding. If quiet e-bikes allow more tracks to stay open I'm all for it.

I agree, I am not worried about how an e-bike will compete with an ICE. I am far more concerned with having more places to ride.

racingfortheson wrote:

I'm talking about making races better and more competitive. 450's are to fast for SX. 250f is to much of a jump from 85. People always talk about it. Let's not start the eBikes up there. I my opinion, this would be so good for our sport. With the smaller bike, price for building could be lower, batteries could last longer, and riding areas could be anywhere. Here is the 125 class, without the smoke and noise. I do think $10k is to much but they get them under $6k I'm buying one.

I do not mind paying 10k for a bike when there is less worry about the additional maintenance cost that will go into. The 4 strokes require top end work more often where as the ebikes do not need as much, so the long term costs will be better.

The E Bikes are targeted at your trail riders and weekend warriors right now. This probably accounts for like 80% of the total off road market. They are not targeting to take over the SX and MX series.

For many, the fact that this has very little maintenance would be a huge positive alone. This does have the ability to open up other riding areas and trails.

These E bikes are still in their infancy from a development perspective and look already what they can do. It's silly to think that with another 10 years of R&D they won't start to take over the market. Look at the bikes now. And then imagine what the battery life could be like 10 years from now as the technology matures.

People want more places to ride. Less maintenance on a bike. Hopefully cheaper bikes.

E bikes have all of that potential.

racingfortheson wrote:

I'm talking about making races better and more competitive. 450's are to fast for SX. 250f is to much of a jump from 85. People always talk about it. Let's not start the eBikes up there. I my opinion, this would be so good for our sport. With the smaller bike, price for building could be lower, batteries could last longer, and riding areas could be anywhere. Here is the 125 class, without the smoke and noise. I do think $10k is to much but they get them under $6k I'm buying one.

RangerLee wrote:

I do not mind paying 10k for a bike when there is less worry about the additional maintenance cost that will go into. The 4 strokes require top end work more often where as the ebikes do not need as much, so the long term costs will be better.

Yeah, but sooner or later you will have to replace the battery

RangerLee wrote:

I do not mind paying 10k for a bike when there is less worry about the additional maintenance cost that will go into. The 4 strokes require top end work more often where as the ebikes do not need as much, so the long term costs will be better.

If it doesn't have a rigorous enough maintenance schedule its not being used close enough to its limit. Thats the nature of any racing machine, the more you detune it the less maintenance it requires. It will get expensive fast when batteries and electrical components start being pushed to the limits, but being competitive isn't cheap.
A bone stock modern 450 can be competitive on any club level maybe with a little suspension work and set up changes and doesn't require much maintenance.

dimetime wrote:

It should be delineated along automatic vs. manuel transmissions.

If you want to argue about starting technique regarding dead engine starts, then there needs to be a dicsussion about moto/SX starts and the lack of clutch and needed gear changes on E bikes. Talk about an unfair apples to oranges situation. Just put a damn gearbox in them if you want to race heads up.

This for me is the biggest sticking point for putting E bikes in comp with ICE bikes. The ability to manage the gearbox and clutch technique are so integral to moto that atuomatics should never be allowed to race in the same class as manuel ICE bikes.

How many times have we seen passes made by blown shifts and bad gear selection? In my opinion E bikes will do two things. One, make racing more lame and boring by eliminating a very important part of race craft. Shifting. And two, make skeptics complaints about moto "all you do is twist the throttle" more legitimate.

All you guys that love them so much create your own series and prove just how much the public is begging for silent racing.

Man, I would like to try a little bit of whatever you are smoking.

Gear boxes on e bikes because missed shifts and bad gear selection are an important part of racing?

That makes about as much sense as an argument against disk brakes would have 30 years ago, or how about never having allowed safety seats because they discouraged riders from learning proper riding form.

dimetime wrote:

It should be delineated along automatic vs. manuel transmissions.

If you want to argue about starting technique regarding dead engine starts, then there needs to be a dicsussion about moto/SX starts and the lack of clutch and needed gear changes on E bikes. Talk about an unfair apples to oranges situation. Just put a damn gearbox in them if you want to race heads up.

This for me is the biggest sticking point for putting E bikes in comp with ICE bikes. The ability to manage the gearbox and clutch technique are so integral to moto that atuomatics should never be allowed to race in the same class as manuel ICE bikes.

How many times have we seen passes made by blown shifts and bad gear selection? In my opinion E bikes will do two things. One, make racing more lame and boring by eliminating a very important part of race craft. Shifting. And two, make skeptics complaints about moto "all you do is twist the throttle" more legitimate.

All you guys that love them so much create your own series and prove just how much the public is begging for silent racing.

Manuel who

dimetime wrote:

It should be delineated along automatic vs. manuel transmissions.

If you want to argue about starting technique regarding dead engine starts, then there needs to be a dicsussion about moto/SX starts and the lack of clutch and needed gear changes on E bikes. Talk about an unfair apples to oranges situation. Just put a damn gearbox in them if you want to race heads up.

This for me is the biggest sticking point for putting E bikes in comp with ICE bikes. The ability to manage the gearbox and clutch technique are so integral to moto that atuomatics should never be allowed to race in the same class as manuel ICE bikes.

How many times have we seen passes made by blown shifts and bad gear selection? In my opinion E bikes will do two things. One, make racing more lame and boring by eliminating a very important part of race craft. Shifting. And two, make skeptics complaints about moto "all you do is twist the throttle" more legitimate.

All you guys that love them so much create your own series and prove just how much the public is begging for silent racing.

Why in the world do I care about skeptics? When I get stuff like this I just tell them to come ride a 20 min moto and keep their lap times with in 5 secs of the fastest. Had one guy take me up. He road and practiced and learned for a few hours on my bike. Then got about 8 mins into his moto and pulled off, lol. He understands now.