Why did I get a 2 stroke it's like a handicap

xplane
Profile picture for user xplane
Posts
58
Joined
3/8/2017
Location
Houston, TX US
xplane 3/21/2017 2:24pm
3/21/2017 2:24pm
Tbteam wrote:
And who the hell didn't know that?
Well, funny you ask since my discovery of what "4 strokes are easy" really means and seeing how wide the gulf between 2 and 4 stroke ease of rideability actually is prompted this thread.
jeffro503
Profile picture for user jeffro503
Posts
27442
Joined
7/22/2007
Location
St Helens, OR US
jeffro503 3/21/2017 2:48pm
3/21/2017 2:48pm
Tbteam wrote:
And who the hell didn't know that?
xplane wrote:
Well, funny you ask since my discovery of what "4 strokes are easy" really means and seeing how wide the gulf between 2 and 4 stroke...
Well, funny you ask since my discovery of what "4 strokes are easy" really means and seeing how wide the gulf between 2 and 4 stroke ease of rideability actually is prompted this thread.
Weird where guys are easier on bikes is on the trails....and where guys hammer on them there are more 4 strokes. So that is the opposite of what you're trying to say.

You want a 4 stroke...great. But because " you " personally can't ride a 2 stroke worth a shit....don't think your 12 hours of riding Mx even remotely gives you an idea of what is better. 12 hours isn't enough time to learn much of anything in this sport. Let alone trying to say what's best.....

Fwiw...I hope you get what ever bike makes you more happy. No matter what stroke it is.
xplane
Profile picture for user xplane
Posts
58
Joined
3/8/2017
Location
Houston, TX US
xplane 3/21/2017 3:02pm
3/21/2017 3:02pm
The 4 stroke advantage is extremely obvious. It's not some subtle thing you need years of experience to understand. As long as you can open up the bike and not fall off the difference is clear. Aside from that, this is 2017 and it really shouldn't be controversial to say that 4 stroke power delivery is much more easily usable by a rider of any skill level.
1
1
bama205
Profile picture for user bama205
Posts
1490
Joined
10/7/2010
Location
Williamson County, TN US
bama205 3/21/2017 3:21pm
3/21/2017 3:21pm
Andy_Greenney wrote:
Sounds like a troll but I'll take the bait. People ride 2Ts because they want to, not because they are faster. The same rider will always...
Sounds like a troll but I'll take the bait. People ride 2Ts because they want to, not because they are faster. The same rider will always be able to haul a 4T around the track faster, why? Tractable Power.
That being said a 2T offers a great base for learning to ride as you have to be precise with gears, line choice etc and racing IS better in a 2T field.

Edit: the cr125 is a stinker of a 125, I know I had one. If you stay 125 ktm is the way to go
2 strokes are damn near twice as fast. FYI

The Shop

See All »
JWACK
Profile picture for user JWACK
Posts
2485
Joined
8/7/2009
Location
NM US
JWACK 3/21/2017 3:53pm
3/21/2017 3:53pm Edited Date/Time 3/21/2017 3:56pm
xplane wrote:
They changed the motor in 2005 to give the cr125 "almost" competitive power for a 125, mine has pro circuit platinum pipe, aftermarket reeds, and JD...
They changed the motor in 2005 to give the cr125 "almost" competitive power for a 125, mine has pro circuit platinum pipe, aftermarket reeds, and JD jet kit. Not saying the bike is slow, you just can't effortlessly get that power.

Lots of funny posts so far but one post I found particularly amusing was the idea that someone who scares themselves on a street bike and quits riding it would want to pick up moto and go on a track with ruts, sand, jumps, and other riders. lol.

Anyway the point in the OP is how crazy the subjective difference is between 2 stroke and 4 strokes of similar peak output.
peelout wrote:
no, actually the CR125 is slow. very slow. any year in the 2000's of the CR has been a turd. 125, 250, 80, 85. all slow...
no, actually the CR125 is slow. very slow. any year in the 2000's of the CR has been a turd. 125, 250, 80, 85. all slow turds. thank God they switched to 250f and 450f and revitalized their brand.

i honestly don't think a slower "race" machine has ever been built.

instead of aftermarket parts you'd be better off buying a book of matches and lighting that piece of shit on fire.
I hate to say it but your sprocket bolts are loose peely. My Honda 125s with a little work have always had great engines. I had a 01,02, and 03. Still have my 01. It's As good as any Yz I've had power wise. Peaky yes. Slow no. I'm sorry you had such bad experiences with the red goblins. Maybe you started this thread!!!! The conspiracy. Or maybe it's fake news. Idk
doghouse
Profile picture for user doghouse
Posts
548
Joined
1/7/2017
Location
Virginia Beach, VA US
doghouse 3/21/2017 4:02pm
3/21/2017 4:02pm
xplane wrote:
They changed the motor in 2005 to give the cr125 "almost" competitive power for a 125, mine has pro circuit platinum pipe, aftermarket reeds, and JD...
They changed the motor in 2005 to give the cr125 "almost" competitive power for a 125, mine has pro circuit platinum pipe, aftermarket reeds, and JD jet kit. Not saying the bike is slow, you just can't effortlessly get that power.

Lots of funny posts so far but one post I found particularly amusing was the idea that someone who scares themselves on a street bike and quits riding it would want to pick up moto and go on a track with ruts, sand, jumps, and other riders. lol.

Anyway the point in the OP is how crazy the subjective difference is between 2 stroke and 4 strokes of similar peak output.
peelout wrote:
no, actually the CR125 is slow. very slow. any year in the 2000's of the CR has been a turd. 125, 250, 80, 85. all slow...
no, actually the CR125 is slow. very slow. any year in the 2000's of the CR has been a turd. 125, 250, 80, 85. all slow turds. thank God they switched to 250f and 450f and revitalized their brand.

i honestly don't think a slower "race" machine has ever been built.

instead of aftermarket parts you'd be better off buying a book of matches and lighting that piece of shit on fire.
JWACK wrote:
I hate to say it but your sprocket bolts are loose peely. My Honda 125s with a little work have always had great engines. I had...
I hate to say it but your sprocket bolts are loose peely. My Honda 125s with a little work have always had great engines. I had a 01,02, and 03. Still have my 01. It's As good as any Yz I've had power wise. Peaky yes. Slow no. I'm sorry you had such bad experiences with the red goblins. Maybe you started this thread!!!! The conspiracy. Or maybe it's fake news. Idk
The 03 CR250 is legit my favorite bike ever.
wreckitrandy
Profile picture for user wreckitrandy
Posts
3858
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Granite Falls, NC US
wreckitrandy 3/21/2017 4:03pm
3/21/2017 4:03pm
xplane wrote:
The 4 stroke advantage is extremely obvious. It's not some subtle thing you need years of experience to understand. As long as you can open up...
The 4 stroke advantage is extremely obvious. It's not some subtle thing you need years of experience to understand. As long as you can open up the bike and not fall off the difference is clear. Aside from that, this is 2017 and it really shouldn't be controversial to say that 4 stroke power delivery is much more easily usable by a rider of any skill level.
There are a number of people that ride 300 KTMs off road that might disagree but, I'll defer to your enlightened observations.
peelout
Profile picture for user peelout
Posts
17873
Joined
1/6/2011
Location
Ogden, UT US
peelout 3/21/2017 4:11pm
3/21/2017 4:11pm
JWACK wrote:
I hate to say it but your sprocket bolts are loose peely. My Honda 125s with a little work have always had great engines. I had...
I hate to say it but your sprocket bolts are loose peely. My Honda 125s with a little work have always had great engines. I had a 01,02, and 03. Still have my 01. It's As good as any Yz I've had power wise. Peaky yes. Slow no. I'm sorry you had such bad experiences with the red goblins. Maybe you started this thread!!!! The conspiracy. Or maybe it's fake news. Idk
torqued them yesterday bro

toomanykaws
Profile picture for user toomanykaws
Posts
395
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Henderson, NV US
toomanykaws 3/21/2017 4:11pm
3/21/2017 4:11pm
One of the best analogies I heard was.... riding a four stroke is like using a MIG welder to weld with where as riding a two stroke is like using a TIG welder. And we all know how much harder it is to TIG. Right?
xplane
Profile picture for user xplane
Posts
58
Joined
3/8/2017
Location
Houston, TX US
xplane 3/21/2017 4:17pm
3/21/2017 4:17pm
Funny you say that because starting out I found TIG vastly easier than MIG.
JWACK
Profile picture for user JWACK
Posts
2485
Joined
8/7/2009
Location
NM US
JWACK 3/21/2017 4:20pm
3/21/2017 4:20pm
JWACK wrote:
I hate to say it but your sprocket bolts are loose peely. My Honda 125s with a little work have always had great engines. I had...
I hate to say it but your sprocket bolts are loose peely. My Honda 125s with a little work have always had great engines. I had a 01,02, and 03. Still have my 01. It's As good as any Yz I've had power wise. Peaky yes. Slow no. I'm sorry you had such bad experiences with the red goblins. Maybe you started this thread!!!! The conspiracy. Or maybe it's fake news. Idk
peelout wrote:
torqued them yesterday bro [img]https://media.giphy.com/media/4pMX5rJ4PYAEM/giphy.gif[/img]
torqued them yesterday bro

Grinning
Dan-The-Man 3/21/2017 4:27pm
3/21/2017 4:27pm
xplane wrote:
They changed the motor in 2005 to give the cr125 "almost" competitive power for a 125, mine has pro circuit platinum pipe, aftermarket reeds, and JD...
They changed the motor in 2005 to give the cr125 "almost" competitive power for a 125, mine has pro circuit platinum pipe, aftermarket reeds, and JD jet kit. Not saying the bike is slow, you just can't effortlessly get that power.

Lots of funny posts so far but one post I found particularly amusing was the idea that someone who scares themselves on a street bike and quits riding it would want to pick up moto and go on a track with ruts, sand, jumps, and other riders. lol.

Anyway the point in the OP is how crazy the subjective difference is between 2 stroke and 4 strokes of similar peak output.
peelout wrote:
no, actually the CR125 is slow. very slow. any year in the 2000's of the CR has been a turd. 125, 250, 80, 85. all slow...
no, actually the CR125 is slow. very slow. any year in the 2000's of the CR has been a turd. 125, 250, 80, 85. all slow turds. thank God they switched to 250f and 450f and revitalized their brand.

i honestly don't think a slower "race" machine has ever been built.

instead of aftermarket parts you'd be better off buying a book of matches and lighting that piece of shit on fire.
JWACK wrote:
I hate to say it but your sprocket bolts are loose peely. My Honda 125s with a little work have always had great engines. I had...
I hate to say it but your sprocket bolts are loose peely. My Honda 125s with a little work have always had great engines. I had a 01,02, and 03. Still have my 01. It's As good as any Yz I've had power wise. Peaky yes. Slow no. I'm sorry you had such bad experiences with the red goblins. Maybe you started this thread!!!! The conspiracy. Or maybe it's fake news. Idk
I'm going to echo this post. The 2002 to 2004 was slower but with work it was competitive with a great chassis. The 2005 motor will match the YZ. I wonder how many people just repeat the same misinformation without any time riding these bikes. Yes I've rode the CR and YZ back to back on many occasions.
kaptkaos
Profile picture for user kaptkaos
Posts
1087
Joined
11/17/2015
Location
Miami, FL US
kaptkaos 3/21/2017 4:31pm
3/21/2017 4:31pm
xplane wrote:
The 4 stroke advantage is extremely obvious. It's not some subtle thing you need years of experience to understand. As long as you can open up...
The 4 stroke advantage is extremely obvious. It's not some subtle thing you need years of experience to understand. As long as you can open up the bike and not fall off the difference is clear. Aside from that, this is 2017 and it really shouldn't be controversial to say that 4 stroke power delivery is much more easily usable by a rider of any skill level.
X100
BobPA
Profile picture for user BobPA
Posts
8029
Joined
10/31/2013
Location
PA US
BobPA 3/21/2017 5:25pm
3/21/2017 5:25pm
Dan-The-Man wrote:
I'm going to echo this post. The 2002 to 2004 was slower but with work it was competitive with a great chassis. The 2005 motor will...
I'm going to echo this post. The 2002 to 2004 was slower but with work it was competitive with a great chassis. The 2005 motor will match the YZ. I wonder how many people just repeat the same misinformation without any time riding these bikes. Yes I've rode the CR and YZ back to back on many occasions.
I've ridden a bunch of CR's and I 100% agree with Peely. Pipes, different year cylinders, Reeds, porting, head work, and they are all about as fast as a stock yz125. I love two strokes, and in fact only own two Kawi smokers as I am in between buying a new 450. But I have to agree 4 strokes are a better mx weapon. They are just easier to go faster consistently.
doghouse
Profile picture for user doghouse
Posts
548
Joined
1/7/2017
Location
Virginia Beach, VA US
doghouse 3/21/2017 5:27pm
3/21/2017 5:27pm Edited Date/Time 3/21/2017 5:28pm
Dan-The-Man wrote:
I'm going to echo this post. The 2002 to 2004 was slower but with work it was competitive with a great chassis. The 2005 motor will...
I'm going to echo this post. The 2002 to 2004 was slower but with work it was competitive with a great chassis. The 2005 motor will match the YZ. I wonder how many people just repeat the same misinformation without any time riding these bikes. Yes I've rode the CR and YZ back to back on many occasions.
BobPA wrote:
I've ridden a bunch of CR's and I 100% agree with Peely. Pipes, different year cylinders, Reeds, porting, head work, and they are all about as...
I've ridden a bunch of CR's and I 100% agree with Peely. Pipes, different year cylinders, Reeds, porting, head work, and they are all about as fast as a stock yz125. I love two strokes, and in fact only own two Kawi smokers as I am in between buying a new 450. But I have to agree 4 strokes are a better mx weapon. They are just easier to go faster consistently.
Eh, I've got a lightly modded YZ125 and it's like a Z50 compared to my CR250.
BobPA
Profile picture for user BobPA
Posts
8029
Joined
10/31/2013
Location
PA US
BobPA 3/21/2017 5:33pm
3/21/2017 5:33pm
doghouse wrote:
Eh, I've got a lightly modded YZ125 and it's like a Z50 compared to my CR250.
doghouse
Profile picture for user doghouse
Posts
548
Joined
1/7/2017
Location
Virginia Beach, VA US
doghouse 3/21/2017 5:36pm
3/21/2017 5:36pm
BobPA wrote:
[img]http://i1275.photobucket.com/albums/y447/drevans_satx/e735dba8_Cant-tell-if-serious-_zpsdf4b0771.jpg[/img]
Definitely serious. It's not even close. One bike puts out around 35 Hp and the other about 50.

Pit Row

See All »
BobPA
Profile picture for user BobPA
Posts
8029
Joined
10/31/2013
Location
PA US
BobPA 3/21/2017 5:43pm
3/21/2017 5:43pm
doghouse wrote:
Definitely serious. It's not even close. One bike puts out around 35 Hp and the other about 50.

You are comparing a 125 to a 250, no shit they are different. I am talking a CR125 vs any other 125
mnoble0902
Profile picture for user mnoble0902
Posts
93
Joined
3/12/2017
Location
Fairfax, VA US
mnoble0902 3/21/2017 5:46pm
3/21/2017 5:46pm
I'm in the process of finding a bike to get back into motocross. Reading this thread, I'm so glad I have decided to go with a 125! It sounds like they are difficult to ride, but once I figure it out and get good at it, it will be worth it! I'll ride it for a while and then move up to a 250; I don't know if it will be a four stroke or a two stroke though. Plenty of time to decide that.
1
JW381
Profile picture for user JW381
Posts
10642
Joined
7/21/2009
Location
Harrisburg, OR US
JW381 3/21/2017 5:47pm
3/21/2017 5:47pm
xplane wrote:
I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Of course CC per CC a 2 stroke can make more power but a 4 stroke with equivalent...
I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Of course CC per CC a 2 stroke can make more power but a 4 stroke with equivalent peak power (what you would get if you combined the 2t vs 4t in a class with any sort of well thought out rules) will have tons more torque everywhere and be way more easily rideable.

Also, they do have 4 strokes in the superminis, they are competitive in spite of not even having 2x the displacement of the 2 strokes and the only reason they don't race 4 strokes for smaller bikes is cost and manufacturer inertia.
Tenacious P wrote:
That's the answer: torque. Sometimes I don't want to be going balls to the wall, working the clutch like mad, trying to find and hold onto...
That's the answer: torque. Sometimes I don't want to be going balls to the wall, working the clutch like mad, trying to find and hold onto the tiny powerband on my CR250R...

...but usually I do.

Usually I do too haha
doghouse
Profile picture for user doghouse
Posts
548
Joined
1/7/2017
Location
Virginia Beach, VA US
doghouse 3/21/2017 5:49pm
3/21/2017 5:49pm
doghouse wrote:
Definitely serious. It's not even close. One bike puts out around 35 Hp and the other about 50.

BobPA wrote:
You are comparing a 125 to a 250, no shit they are different. I am talking a CR125 vs any other 125
Well I thought the guy you were responding to was talking about 250s, but apparently I totally made that up. Never mind me...
rutsmash
Profile picture for user rutsmash
Posts
526
Joined
3/1/2014
Location
Phoenix, AZ US
rutsmash 3/21/2017 6:30pm
3/21/2017 6:30pm
I bet you 2-stroke guys think the Abonimal Snowman is bigger than Bigfoot too..foolishness
potatoflake
Profile picture for user potatoflake
Posts
474
Joined
9/28/2015
Location
Kennewick, WA US
potatoflake 3/21/2017 6:32pm
3/21/2017 6:32pm
xplane wrote:
The 4 stroke advantage is extremely obvious. It's not some subtle thing you need years of experience to understand. As long as you can open up...
The 4 stroke advantage is extremely obvious. It's not some subtle thing you need years of experience to understand. As long as you can open up the bike and not fall off the difference is clear. Aside from that, this is 2017 and it really shouldn't be controversial to say that 4 stroke power delivery is much more easily usable by a rider of any skill level.
We get it bro you drive shifter karts and they use the same engines but this is motocross and it all comes down to how big your heart and balls are, not how much money mommy and daddy can pump into the engine and chasis

1
vetmxr
Profile picture for user vetmxr
Posts
1079
Joined
1/10/2009
Location
NE US
vetmxr 3/21/2017 6:58pm
3/21/2017 6:58pm
xplane wrote:
I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Of course CC per CC a 2 stroke can make more power but a 4 stroke with equivalent...
I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Of course CC per CC a 2 stroke can make more power but a 4 stroke with equivalent peak power (what you would get if you combined the 2t vs 4t in a class with any sort of well thought out rules) will have tons more torque everywhere and be way more easily rideable.

Also, they do have 4 strokes in the superminis, they are competitive in spite of not even having 2x the displacement of the 2 strokes and the only reason they don't race 4 strokes for smaller bikes is cost and manufacturer inertia.
Tenacious P wrote:
That's the answer: torque. Sometimes I don't want to be going balls to the wall, working the clutch like mad, trying to find and hold onto...
That's the answer: torque. Sometimes I don't want to be going balls to the wall, working the clutch like mad, trying to find and hold onto the tiny powerband on my CR250R...

...but usually I do.

JW381 wrote:
Usually I do too haha
me too........Smile
JWACK
Profile picture for user JWACK
Posts
2485
Joined
8/7/2009
Location
NM US
JWACK 3/21/2017 7:01pm
3/21/2017 7:01pm
rutsmash wrote:
I bet you 2-stroke guys think the Abonimal Snowman is bigger than Bigfoot too..foolishness
No. We think Bigfoot rides a 4stroke quad
And the snowman rips a twostroke sled.
slipdog
Profile picture for user slipdog
Posts
10044
Joined
7/25/2009
Location
Nor Cal, CA US
slipdog 3/21/2017 7:06pm
3/21/2017 7:06pm
I rode Frank at a sand track on Sunday... It was a good day!



darkbelow13 3/21/2017 7:23pm
3/21/2017 7:23pm
I've only ridden an '01 CR125, but compared to my RM125 of the same year that thing felt like a fucking turtle. Maybe it was just a particularly bad year or that particular bike sucked, but it was unbelievably slow.
byke
Profile picture for user byke
Posts
1423
Joined
8/12/2015
Location
Auburn, CA US
byke 3/21/2017 7:27pm
3/21/2017 7:27pm Edited Date/Time 3/21/2017 7:28pm
xplane wrote:
The 4 stroke advantage is extremely obvious. It's not some subtle thing you need years of experience to understand. As long as you can open up...
The 4 stroke advantage is extremely obvious. It's not some subtle thing you need years of experience to understand. As long as you can open up the bike and not fall off the difference is clear. Aside from that, this is 2017 and it really shouldn't be controversial to say that 4 stroke power delivery is much more easily usable by a rider of any skill level.
People are hypersensitive to engine technology, similar squabbling to ford/chevy and bud/coors. I like both 2t and 4t, so I'll shoot you as straight as I can. I come from the 2t generation and will always love them, but in my opinion you need to know what you're getting into and it doesn't sound like you did. If you said you were a new to dirt and thinking of riding mx and were mainly concerned with putting in fast lap times at low/moderate intensity over a long duration, I'd unquestionably steer you towards a 250 4t. If you said you wanted to ride strictly for high intensity fun and didn't care about anything else, the 125 2t is for you. Turns out the 125 2t wasn't what you were looking for right now and that's ok. I think you simply needed a different reference point in order to appreciate the 125 2t, so if you can afford to keep it, I'd keep it and buy a 250 4t, then experience the differences, which will lead to appreciating the differences.
1
YamahaJT1
Profile picture for user YamahaJT1
Posts
1232
Joined
3/17/2015
Location
VA US
YamahaJT1 3/21/2017 7:57pm
3/21/2017 7:57pm
05'-07' CR125's don't suck for OFB's (Old Fat Bastards) and beginners. 04's DO suck. That is my limited experience. My 05' CR125 can wax my bud's 2013 YZ125... Rider issue.

Post a reply to: Why did I get a 2 stroke it's like a handicap