Who/What is next for Electric

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2/28/2020 7:23 AM

We are anxiously awaiting the new Honda Electric bike, or at least I am, mostly curious as to the price point. But what is next, who will jump into electric next and where will they start (anyone heard any rumors)? I see both KTM and Cobra seem to be calling the minis E5. So assuming they reference e5, will there continue to be 60's, 85s, 100, 125/250F, 450. Or do you think manufacturer's will try to combine a 65/85 with adjustability like how KTM did the e5 with 4 inches of adjustability I believe.

I am hoping more people pursue a 50 size bike (Honda, Kawasaki, even Yamaha with a more competitive bike to KTM and Cobra).



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2/28/2020 8:33 AM

I think physics has somewhat derailed the electric initiative for MX and offroad.

The supreme energy density of gasoline is saving engines, for now.

Currently, a battery with enough power to be competitive is still too big and heavy, plus cost, range and charging issues that render it a dealbreaker for most people.

If battery development progresses and a model was actually introduced at a lower cost than a comparable gas bike, I could see them gaining ground.

I think you will see more OEMs pursue the E-MTB style market first, where electric is really beginning to carve out a good niche.

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2/28/2020 8:41 AM

^I don't know. Those Altas seemed like they did a pretty good job of being on the money for a 250F-style power level. It won't take too much more development to get to 350 and then 450. I feel like the electric vehicle revolution is just beginning and we'll see more and more innovation in just a few years.

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Braaapin' aint easy.

2/28/2020 8:45 AM
Edited Date/Time: 2/28/2020 8:46 AM

I’m still having a hard time accepting that Alta is gone. I was lucky enough to spend some time at the track with some the engineers and they were really figuring it out.

That last version, the MXR, was SO good.

I got to spend some time on Josh Hills with Cone Valve/Trax set up and I would trade any bike in the world for the experience I had on that bike.

It gives me hope it can be done, I pray someone else is able to get the technology out there. There’s nothing quite like the power delivery of electric.

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2/28/2020 8:47 AM

Obviously its not such an issue in the states but here in Europe noise is a big problem and its shut a lot of tracks down. The biggest thing I feel electric has going for it from a European/British point of view is low noise pollution. If there was a decent electric bike available here at a comparable price point I'd seriously consider investing in one. Even if I couldn't race it. It would open up so many more places that guys could ride without pissing off the neighbors so to speak!

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2/28/2020 8:48 AM
Edited Date/Time: 2/28/2020 8:49 AM

I do remember people saying 4 strokes will
Never catch back on in the late 90s and early early 2000s... due to cost/etc and look where are just 15-20 years later. theyre the dominant machine.

I think the future is bright for the electric bikes. And engineers won’t cease to amaze on their capabilities!

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GP740
Since 1987

2/28/2020 8:53 AM

Hopefully its dead. When we start riding electric motorcycles, I am done, and buying a boat.

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2/28/2020 9:27 AM

KTM had in one of there financial reports the mention of an E10 and E15 being released this year. I can only assume that would refer to a 65 and 85.

I wish I could find it back. It was a thread on here.

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2/28/2020 9:58 AM

The biggest problem is no one is buying dirt bikes, gas or electric.

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2/28/2020 10:00 AM

Kyle978 wrote:

I’m still having a hard time accepting that Alta is gone. I was lucky enough to spend some time at the track with some the engineers and they were really figuring it out.

That last version, the MXR, was SO good.

I got to spend some time on Josh Hills with Cone Valve/Trax set up and I would trade any bike in the world for the experience I had on that bike.

It gives me hope it can be done, I pray someone else is able to get the technology out there. There’s nothing quite like the power delivery of electric.

Right there with you! Every few weeks I'll have a moment of mourning for Alta.

If anyone is gonna get this right (like they did), it needs to be a whole new, electric-first platform - adapting existing ICE setups to electric sacrifices too much.

I'm sure Yamaha has some things happening behind the scenes, especially given their TYE. I had thought KTM, with the acquisition of Gas Gas / Torrot, was maybe planning to position Gas Gas (long-term) as electric, or at least leverage the learnings / R&D they've put in.

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2/28/2020 10:02 AM

mxracerjohn250 wrote:

Hopefully its dead. When we start riding electric motorcycles, I am done, and buying a boat.

Preach on

I hope a batteria shorts and burns the factory down

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2/28/2020 10:14 AM



I got one of these sur rons a few months ago. Say what you will, but it is a blast for what it is. I think they got the price right as well. The lightweight mtn bike components/aspect help it to achieve some decent range also.
Don't except to moto it, but in some good flowing single track (easy on the suspension) you would be hard pressed to go faster on anything else
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2/28/2020 10:21 AM

On the Topic of Noise, why in the world have the factories not worked on trying to make some quieter versions
Of Motocross bikes, now more than ever it's needed, and now more than ever we have power to spare,
Do you guys think they could make some quiet gas powered bikes?
How much less power would a 450 that's 50% quieter have?
And not at the pro level but could there be local racing with the quieter bikes?

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2/28/2020 10:36 AM

I love my 450 but after racing electric carts I think they can be pretty awesome. The technology will be here sooner than you realize.

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2/28/2020 10:39 AM

mxracerjohn250 wrote:

Hopefully its dead. When we start riding electric motorcycles, I am done, and buying a boat.

hillbilly wrote:

Preach on

I hope a batteria shorts and burns the factory down

I hear you guys, but just curiously: why?

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Braaapin' aint easy.

2/28/2020 10:46 AM

mxracerjohn250 wrote:

Hopefully its dead. When we start riding electric motorcycles, I am done, and buying a boat.

translation:

me, caveman, like bang-bang noise. change bad, fire-engine good.

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2/28/2020 11:13 AM

I was always against electric motorcycles until I rode my sons KTM E5. That little thing rips! The torque is incredible for that little engine. I will be buying a full size electric bike.

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2/28/2020 11:22 AM

The sound the smell, it all adds to the excitement of supercross or motocross. How many people do you think are going to run to the fence at a National to watch 40 electric bikes take off when that gate drops? Can you imagine going to a Nascar race with no sound? I was at Daytona a couple weeks ago. The sound of the cars as they roar by....if that does not get you on the edge of your seat nothing will.

There is a HUGE difference in racing electric bikes and gas powered bikes. It is part of the show, and the show would never be the same.

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2/28/2020 11:35 AM

mxracerjohn250 wrote:

The sound the smell, it all adds to the excitement of supercross or motocross. How many people do you think are going to run to the fence at a National to watch 40 electric bikes take off when that gate drops? Can you imagine going to a Nascar race with no sound? I was at Daytona a couple weeks ago. The sound of the cars as they roar by....if that does not get you on the edge of your seat nothing will.

There is a HUGE difference in racing electric bikes and gas powered bikes. It is part of the show, and the show would never be the same.

Plenty of sports do not have loud noises (other than the crowd) and are far more popular than moto. Not having loud obnoxious 4 strokes would allow you to be able to hear the announcers and pay closer attention to what is actually happening in the race. We all said 4 strokes sound terrible when they came out, but love them now. If they improve the sport or simply provide additional options, why not accept it?

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2/28/2020 11:40 AM

A couple weeks back we camped at Ocotillo for Presidents weekend. A family friend camped with us and brought out 2 Alta MXRs. Knowing he was bringing those I was very excited to try it for the first time. He put a full charge on it and told me to ride it for as long as I want so indeed I did. Started out in setting 2, bumped it to 3 and kept it there most of the time. I shit you not, that was the most fun I've had riding in years. Very quick to get used to and confidence inspiring, especially in slower, technical single track stuff back in the mud hills. Also, in wide open areas this thing rips! A ton of torque and is faster than you'll ever need to go on dirt.

Without a doubt, I will be getting one as my main bike when Honda/KTM/Husky releases them.

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2/28/2020 11:41 AM

Believe it or not, stadiums should take lessons from Daytona International Speedway when talking about sound systems. They PA is amazing. Cars racing around, and you hear the announcers announcing and calling the race clear as day. Not sure why stadiums dont do the same thing for baseball basketball or football.

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2/28/2020 11:49 AM

Sound and smell do not enhance riding. When you hear a bike or smell gas and oil, its does remind you of riding. That is why we love the sound and smell.

When I was with Alta, I assisted hundreds of riders demo an Alta. When a rider finished a demo, they always had a big smile on their face and not once did a rider complain about the absence of sound.

I raced mine 3 times and pulled 6 holeshots with 4 moto wins and two seconds against mostly 450's.

I loved the bike and wished I would have kept one of my demos! Even though they were more expensive than ICE bikes, riders saved by having close to zero maintenance.

I'm confident it won't be long before we see more electric models in the near future.

For the haters out there, do yourself a favor a take a test ride on one when available and let me know how you like it. Then and only then will your opinion be valid.

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2/28/2020 12:00 PM

Zoom wrote:

Sound and smell do not enhance riding. When you hear a bike or smell gas and oil, its does remind you of riding. That is why we love the sound and smell.

When I was with Alta, I assisted hundreds of riders demo an Alta. When a rider finished a demo, they always had a big smile on their face and not once did a rider complain about the absence of sound.

I raced mine 3 times and pulled 6 holeshots with 4 moto wins and two seconds against mostly 450's.

I loved the bike and wished I would have kept one of my demos! Even though they were more expensive than ICE bikes, riders saved by having close to zero maintenance.

I'm confident it won't be long before we see more electric models in the near future.

For the haters out there, do yourself a favor a take a test ride on one when available and let me know how you like it. Then and only then will your opinion be valid.

I disagree. Maybe it does not mater to the guy that is racing them, but it does to the casual race fans that do to races, that will never ride or race a motorcycle. Like I said, can you imagine going to a national with 40 bikes on the gate, and and you hear electric motors buzzing off the line?

I guarantee you the casual race fan attendance would decline.

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2/28/2020 12:05 PM

mxracerjohn250 wrote:

I disagree. Maybe it does not mater to the guy that is racing them, but it does to the casual race fans that do to races, that will never ride or race a motorcycle. Like I said, can you imagine going to a national with 40 bikes on the gate, and and you hear electric motors buzzing off the line?

I guarantee you the casual race fan attendance would decline.

You're right, the only reason casual fans go to the track is to hear bikes.

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2/28/2020 12:11 PM

Zoom wrote:

Sound and smell do not enhance riding. When you hear a bike or smell gas and oil, its does remind you of riding. That is why we love the sound and smell.

When I was with Alta, I assisted hundreds of riders demo an Alta. When a rider finished a demo, they always had a big smile on their face and not once did a rider complain about the absence of sound.

I raced mine 3 times and pulled 6 holeshots with 4 moto wins and two seconds against mostly 450's.

I loved the bike and wished I would have kept one of my demos! Even though they were more expensive than ICE bikes, riders saved by having close to zero maintenance.

I'm confident it won't be long before we see more electric models in the near future.

For the haters out there, do yourself a favor a take a test ride on one when available and let me know how you like it. Then and only then will your opinion be valid.

mxracerjohn250 wrote:

I disagree. Maybe it does not mater to the guy that is racing them, but it does to the casual race fans that do to races, that will never ride or race a motorcycle. Like I said, can you imagine going to a national with 40 bikes on the gate, and and you hear electric motors buzzing off the line?

I guarantee you the casual race fan attendance would decline.

I have heard our sense of smell is our greatest sense and is often the sense that we can remember the longest. I believe that as I still remember what my grandma's kitchen pantry smelled like and she sold that house about 10 years ago now.

Listen guys, I'm with you I enjoy the smell and the noise of bikes. Nothing gets me more excited for a race than hearing the gate drop and 40 bikes heading into turn 1 together. But times are changing. I said this in another electric post on here before, but I would rather have an electric bike than no bike at all. With how the EPA and agencies are going after pollution and with complaints of sound electric is a win as far as I can tell.

I will most likely be buying my son an electric e5 assuming Honda, Yamaha or Kawasaki have an e5 out, or possibly go with the Cobra. I don't want to conform to the KTM craze unless Im forced to.

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2/28/2020 12:22 PM

mxracerjohn250 wrote:

I disagree. Maybe it does not mater to the guy that is racing them, but it does to the casual race fans that do to races, that will never ride or race a motorcycle. Like I said, can you imagine going to a national with 40 bikes on the gate, and and you hear electric motors buzzing off the line?

I guarantee you the casual race fan attendance would decline.

I disagree with you.

Look at USAC crit races- fans line the fences, multiple people deep. No motors, no noises or smells.

YOU may leave the fence-line. Someone else will take your spot.

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2/28/2020 12:52 PM

Just gonna say it's very "cultish" the way most of y'all lash out a people who disagree.

I despise the E bike movement. It's fucking stupid, it's no better for the enviroment and it won't save riding areas. Just saying. And the fact that there is no clutch or gear box management makes these things a nothing more that a power wheel toy. Desl with it. That's why you guys ride better, because it removes an integral part of the moto experience. Shifting.

I think it's a waste and dumb and that's my opinion. No amount of ad hominum attacks changes anything, in fact it points out the weakness of the arguments being made. The bikes and the "movement" should stand alone in persuading people to move over. Not attempting to brow beat them into accepting your opinion. Jesus why is everybody a dickheaded advocate these days?

You guys pining for an fucking E bike then make one, sell it or ride it and shut the fuck up.

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2/28/2020 1:44 PM

mxracerjohn250 wrote:

Hopefully its dead. When we start riding electric motorcycles, I am done, and buying a boat.

Better plan to buy a boat even though I'm not sure where you're going to use it near Xenia.

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2/28/2020 2:41 PM

mxracerjohn250 wrote:

Hopefully its dead. When we start riding electric motorcycles, I am done, and buying a boat.

hillbilly wrote:

Preach on

I hope a batteria shorts and burns the factory down

Falcon wrote:

I hear you guys, but just curiously: why?

I wonder this as well. Every thread like this has dudes sayin this. If it keeps the industry alive then, who cares.

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2/28/2020 2:48 PM

mxracerjohn250 wrote:

The sound the smell, it all adds to the excitement of supercross or motocross. How many people do you think are going to run to the fence at a National to watch 40 electric bikes take off when that gate drops? Can you imagine going to a Nascar race with no sound? I was at Daytona a couple weeks ago. The sound of the cars as they roar by....if that does not get you on the edge of your seat nothing will.

There is a HUGE difference in racing electric bikes and gas powered bikes. It is part of the show, and the show would never be the same.

Of course the sound and smell were the best with the two strokes racing but it didn't seem to matter. The four strokes came on the scene and outperformed the two strokes (due to unfair rules that still exist). Racers and teams soon switched over. As with all racing, racers are gonna gravitate to the machine that lets them perform at their best. The four strokes were said to be easier to ride; the electrics will be easier yet. They said the four strokes had better torque; well the electrics will be better yet. If and when the electrics show up, I imagine they'll take over quickly. Plus much of the next generation isn't going to have any interest in watching what their dads raced just as most four stroke riders today don't care about watching the two strokes that their dads raced. That's just how it is.

The two stroke/four stroke situation has shown us that the desires of the paying fans spectating at proMX events counts for little to the "powers that be" running the sport. I'd say they alienated many motocross enthusiasts by unfairly killing racing with two strokes efforts. And they'll do the same when they abandon the four strokes. The decisions determining what machinery we'll be seeing racing is in the hands of the manufacturers. That's just how it is.

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