Weird state of mx right now?

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Edited Date/Time 5/6/2018 12:48pm
I get bummed when so many top riders retire or any known rider for that matter. Kind of zaps the excitement out of the air and little depressing. Millsaps. Short. Dungey. Villopoto just to name a few.

I don’t know it’s a weird feeling to describe when you watch someone every week for years and years and you don’t see them anymore. Such a young mans sport compared to like nascar.
I guess you could say I just miss them.
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zehn
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zehn 5/3/2018 6:25pm
5/3/2018 6:25pm
much ty
TeamGreen
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TeamGreen 5/3/2018 6:29pm
5/3/2018 6:29pm
Short ain't "reitred"...he racing racing with real men.
cameron96
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cameron96 5/3/2018 6:55pm
5/3/2018 6:55pm
I miss the Dunge but damn this is entertaining without him there.
milliebays
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milliebays 5/3/2018 8:34pm
5/3/2018 8:34pm
TeamGreen wrote:
Short ain't "reitred"...he racing racing with real men.
don't talk about Moosecan like that.

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Tonynz
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Tonynz 5/3/2018 11:02pm
5/3/2018 11:02pm
Yea no more Ward, Hannah, McGrath, DeCoster, etc etc.
woody woodpecker 5/4/2018 1:15pm
5/4/2018 1:15pm Edited Date/Time 5/4/2018 1:16pm
You could say it's a young mans sport, but I don't see many GP riders or riders of the past retiring super young like Dungey, Villopoto and RC did. So maybe it's something to do with the intense schedule or industry in America that makes them want to retire as soon as possible.
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philG 5/4/2018 1:55pm
5/4/2018 1:55pm
woody woodpecker wrote:
You could say it's a young mans sport, but I don't see many GP riders or riders of the past retiring super young like Dungey, Villopoto...
You could say it's a young mans sport, but I don't see many GP riders or riders of the past retiring super young like Dungey, Villopoto and RC did. So maybe it's something to do with the intense schedule or industry in America that makes them want to retire as soon as possible.
There is one common factor with all 3...
woody woodpecker 5/4/2018 3:18pm
5/4/2018 3:18pm
woody woodpecker wrote:
You could say it's a young mans sport, but I don't see many GP riders or riders of the past retiring super young like Dungey, Villopoto...
You could say it's a young mans sport, but I don't see many GP riders or riders of the past retiring super young like Dungey, Villopoto and RC did. So maybe it's something to do with the intense schedule or industry in America that makes them want to retire as soon as possible.
philG wrote:
There is one common factor with all 3...
Well in RV's case it seemed like he was more mentally drained than physically, and maybe his team played a role in that. You're right though, but I'm not sure that it's Aldon's fault. If the schedule wasn't so tough that sort of training wouldn't be nessecary.
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jeffro503 5/4/2018 4:01pm
5/4/2018 4:01pm
woody woodpecker wrote:
You could say it's a young mans sport, but I don't see many GP riders or riders of the past retiring super young like Dungey, Villopoto...
You could say it's a young mans sport, but I don't see many GP riders or riders of the past retiring super young like Dungey, Villopoto and RC did. So maybe it's something to do with the intense schedule or industry in America that makes them want to retire as soon as possible.
philG wrote:
There is one common factor with all 3...
Yeah....they all won a lot.
2smokertillend 5/4/2018 4:29pm
5/4/2018 4:29pm
I try not to follow one or two guys anymore, and follow the racing. That way it doesn’t matter who ever wins, as long as there’s good racing.
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dirtnapper 5/4/2018 7:01pm
5/4/2018 7:01pm
I felt the same way after Windham retired! I still think of him all the time when I see the red #14 ( sorry Jarid.....Tongue )

But yeah I know what you are saying for sure.

And ( I'll probably get murdered for this....) I don't think the "up and comimg super stars" have provided much in the way of excitement - AC has certainly underwhelmed, Webb is still figuring it out, Fork has been fun to watch but nothing super spectacular, etc etc. Just my opinion of course....
Lightning78
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Lightning78 5/4/2018 7:27pm
5/4/2018 7:27pm
dirtnapper wrote:
I felt the same way after Windham retired! I still think of him all the time when I see the red #14 ( sorry Jarid.....:P )...
I felt the same way after Windham retired! I still think of him all the time when I see the red #14 ( sorry Jarid.....Tongue )

But yeah I know what you are saying for sure.

And ( I'll probably get murdered for this....) I don't think the "up and comimg super stars" have provided much in the way of excitement - AC has certainly underwhelmed, Webb is still figuring it out, Fork has been fun to watch but nothing super spectacular, etc etc. Just my opinion of course....
I agree dirtnapper.....these AM superstars that were supposed to come into the pros and be as competitive as they were touted to be....

I mean SO MANY people were calling AC the next RC and I gotta admit I NEVER saw that in him or his riding nor do I see any of that in Forkner. AC seems to finally be catching a stride but nowhere near what everyone thought he would be, hes exceptionally talented but just not "The Next RC" by any means and Forkner is fast but has just as many underwhelming races and good ones to name a few.

Whats strange is, we had a long list of AM's that came in and immediately took the F off like RC, Stewart, RV, and Windham but that doesnt seem to be as much of a trend as it did 10-20 years ago.
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BobPA 5/4/2018 7:32pm
5/4/2018 7:32pm
I do not think we will see any eras of dominance like in previous years. The training programs, and sheer dedication by all the current riders has leveled the playing field a bit. Plenty of guys now have the bike, training, and talent to run up front. It just comes down to consistency.

For which I think the Dunge should be teaching a class on.
philG
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philG 5/5/2018 4:55am
5/5/2018 4:55am
woody woodpecker wrote:
You could say it's a young mans sport, but I don't see many GP riders or riders of the past retiring super young like Dungey, Villopoto...
You could say it's a young mans sport, but I don't see many GP riders or riders of the past retiring super young like Dungey, Villopoto and RC did. So maybe it's something to do with the intense schedule or industry in America that makes them want to retire as soon as possible.
philG wrote:
There is one common factor with all 3...
jeffro503 wrote:
Yeah....they all won a lot.
They would rather quit than carry on winning...thats wrong IMO. I dont know another sport where athletes in their absolute prime just flat quit. I will rephrase that , i dont know another country in this sport where riders just quit . Hats off to Reed, he knows he is gonna have 40 years sat on the couch, you dont need to be starting doing that at 27.
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Shaned9326 5/5/2018 5:37am
5/5/2018 5:37am Edited Date/Time 5/5/2018 5:38am
The one dominant rider that has similar dna to those guys listed is racing in mxgp as Herlings is flat out crushing tracks at every race and hates to lose!! I no he doesn’t do supercross and all that but when it comes to just motocross, he’s clearly FMOP right now and will be for ye ars to come imo!!
Prejump
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Prejump 5/5/2018 5:40am
5/5/2018 5:40am
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders.

The GP boys have a much better train/life balance.

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drt410 5/5/2018 5:44am
5/5/2018 5:44am
BobPA wrote:
I do not think we will see any eras of dominance like in previous years. The training programs, and sheer dedication by all the current riders...
I do not think we will see any eras of dominance like in previous years. The training programs, and sheer dedication by all the current riders has leveled the playing field a bit. Plenty of guys now have the bike, training, and talent to run up front. It just comes down to consistency.

For which I think the Dunge should be teaching a class on.
Idk if you look at sx results it has pretty much always been dominated by one guy at a time. From 2017 to 2010 its been only Dungey and Villopoto, with Dungey winning 3 in a row and Villopoto winning 4 in a row. Then from 09 to 01 Stewart Reed Carmichael with Carmichael winning 5. Then before that McGrath pretty much won every year. Then Jeff Stanton before that then Bob Hannah. In its entire history you really just get 1-2 guys that win over a decade. It does seem like its changing, but who knows all it would take is for Tomac to stop making stupid mistakes for him to go on a run similar to these other guys. Hes about as dominant as the other guys its just that his bad days are really bad. Like starting this season with a dnf and a dns. It seems like its supposed to be Tomacs era but if he doesnt get it together then I guess we could finally start to see a different person winning each year.
Harry Backmon 5/5/2018 5:47am
5/5/2018 5:47am
Prejump wrote:
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders. The GP boys have a...
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders.

The GP boys have a much better train/life balance.

We have a winner! Not sure how anyone could watch the carnage of 2018 and come to any other conclusion.

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Shaned9326
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Shaned9326 5/5/2018 5:50am
5/5/2018 5:50am
Prejump wrote:
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders. The GP boys have a...
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders.

The GP boys have a much better train/life balance.

Harry Backmon wrote:
We have a winner! Not sure how anyone could watch the carnage of 2018 and come to any other conclusion.
Absolutely spot on and agree 100 percent!!
Harry Backmon 5/5/2018 5:58am
5/5/2018 5:58am
Prejump wrote:
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders. The GP boys have a...
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders.

The GP boys have a much better train/life balance.

Harry Backmon wrote:
We have a winner! Not sure how anyone could watch the carnage of 2018 and come to any other conclusion.
Shaned9326 wrote:
Absolutely spot on and agree 100 percent!!
I don't think any of us that have never done SX can understand. TV has a way of making people think, "I could do that." I thought golf would be easy after watching it on TV. Wrong.

With pro SX those guys really do go that fast. The whoops are gigantic. The jumps are crazy. I've walked an SX track and I couldn't get over how much more intimidating it was in person. Combine the above with tremendous pressure to win and it's no wonder they get the hell off the tracks after making some money.
Andy_Greenney 5/5/2018 6:43am
5/5/2018 6:43am
I guess it depends if you watch to see racing or watch to follow ‘your guy’. Makes no difference to me who comes and goes as long as there is some racing to watch.
philG
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philG 5/5/2018 7:20am
5/5/2018 7:20am
Prejump wrote:
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders. The GP boys have a...
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders.

The GP boys have a much better train/life balance.

No, overtraining is the problem. Roczen sussed it, Cianciarulo too.

GP boys have just as hectic a schedule. 20 GP's 2 days racing at each , plus at least 1 maybe 2 or even 3 National Championships, they raced in Russia on Tuesday, and now its French , Dutch , and British champs this weekend.

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Bearuno 5/5/2018 7:55am
5/5/2018 7:55am Edited Date/Time 5/5/2018 8:03am
philG wrote:
No, overtraining is the problem. Roczen sussed it, Cianciarulo too. GP boys have just as hectic a schedule. 20 GP's 2 days racing at each...
No, overtraining is the problem. Roczen sussed it, Cianciarulo too.

GP boys have just as hectic a schedule. 20 GP's 2 days racing at each , plus at least 1 maybe 2 or even 3 National Championships, they raced in Russia on Tuesday, and now its French , Dutch , and British champs this weekend.

I think the thing that the GP riders have - besides not being in the meat grinder that is SX - , as they progress to being 'higher level riders' within Motocross, they may then have the option to not do a whole lot of other races, if they choose that route. A Prime example being Cairoli. They get to that 'higher' level, they get paid well, and perhaps don't need to go chasing prize money and bonuses from other races. As I said, if they choose to pull back, just that bit.

If not, they have a Lot of options for other races, that might earn them a quid or two.

****One thing with these various 'rumors' about AX being canned, is that it might be the harbinger of the more SX rounds that have also been rumored for some time. And that, doesn't bode well for the health of riders, or the US Outdoor Nationals. ***

As you wrote - retiring at 27 (well hell, 37 even) still leads to a Lot of years to get through in your life - you better have shedloads of money, have great investments, and / or a bit of a plan to make money to live on for the rest of your life.


philG
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philG 5/5/2018 8:09am
5/5/2018 8:09am
Bearuno wrote:
I think the thing that the GP riders have - besides not being in the meat grinder that is SX - , as they progress to...
I think the thing that the GP riders have - besides not being in the meat grinder that is SX - , as they progress to being 'higher level riders' within Motocross, they may then have the option to not do a whole lot of other races, if they choose that route. A Prime example being Cairoli. They get to that 'higher' level, they get paid well, and perhaps don't need to go chasing prize money and bonuses from other races. As I said, if they choose to pull back, just that bit.

If not, they have a Lot of options for other races, that might earn them a quid or two.

****One thing with these various 'rumors' about AX being canned, is that it might be the harbinger of the more SX rounds that have also been rumored for some time. And that, doesn't bode well for the health of riders, or the US Outdoor Nationals. ***

As you wrote - retiring at 27 (well hell, 37 even) still leads to a Lot of years to get through in your life - you better have shedloads of money, have great investments, and / or a bit of a plan to make money to live on for the rest of your life.


Of all the riders , Cairoli is the only one who doesnt ride anything other than the Italian International series, with the GP's .. Herlings is in Holland this weekend along with a host of other MX1 & MX 2 guys.

Simpson had an off weekend and did Unadilla, that was his only break from early Feb till nations at end of september.
Bearuno
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Bearuno 5/5/2018 8:27am
5/5/2018 8:27am Edited Date/Time 5/5/2018 8:29am
Phil - note my 'mays ', the 'Perhaps' and the 'ifs'.

Heck, I've seen times when Desalle has chosen to do Enduros on 'off' weekends - some riders are Energizer Bunnies.

miketherider 5/5/2018 8:44am
5/5/2018 8:44am Edited Date/Time 5/5/2018 8:45am
Jeremy McGrath said it best...you get 10 "elite" years to burn yourself up physically and emotionally. After that, good luck.
woody woodpecker 5/5/2018 9:35am
5/5/2018 9:35am
miketherider wrote:
Jeremy McGrath said it best...you get 10 "elite" years to burn yourself up physically and emotionally. After that, good luck.
Well it's been 15 years now for Caroli and I think it was longer for Everts so clearly that's not true.
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level 5/5/2018 11:02am
5/5/2018 11:02am
I understand why they retire. I really do. I still hate I though. It’s risk of injury mostly and then just the hours of training everyday so you can ride a 20 minute main to your full potential. You have to be in top physical shape. It has to be exhausting.
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APLMAN99 5/5/2018 11:22am
5/5/2018 11:22am
Prejump wrote:
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders. The GP boys have a...
I think supercross is the problem, everything about it is just too extreme & it's shortening the careers of the riders.

The GP boys have a much better train/life balance.

philG wrote:
No, overtraining is the problem. Roczen sussed it, Cianciarulo too. GP boys have just as hectic a schedule. 20 GP's 2 days racing at each...
No, overtraining is the problem. Roczen sussed it, Cianciarulo too.

GP boys have just as hectic a schedule. 20 GP's 2 days racing at each , plus at least 1 maybe 2 or even 3 National Championships, they raced in Russia on Tuesday, and now its French , Dutch , and British champs this weekend.

I don't know if there is an easy way to see exactly how many races each rider actually does every season. Can you show us how many races the top 10 finishers in the 2017 MXGP class actually attended? I'd be surprised if it actually ended up being over 30......

You mentioned the British championships, and it definitely didn't seem to be much of a draw for the top GP guys in 2017.
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JohnnyT_983 5/5/2018 11:32am
5/5/2018 11:32am
I agree with a lot of the “sx is the problem” but at the same time it feels like the progression of the sport has stalled. Jut about everyone has perfected their own way and nobody has come back to revolutionize the riding technique (McGrath - stay low, Stewart - the scrub) everything has been a pretty consistent progression scale, but nobody is shocking the water with anything different that can push the riders to a new level.

Think back to Herlings over last summer came in with his euro setup and laid waste to everyone. Maybe that’s what it will take is an American setup to become more European and forgiving.

Or even as the mxgp tracks deteriorate and break down at far more extensive rate than the outdoor nationals.

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