Weege-USA MXDN Disconnect

ando
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10/5/2017 8:04am
ML512 wrote:
They need their suspension techs, and electronic/engine guys...team managers are going to go too. Last thing you want is one mechanic if there is a serious...
They need their suspension techs, and electronic/engine guys...team managers are going to go too. Last thing you want is one mechanic if there is a serious problem that's beyond what he deals with (engine, electronics, suspension, etc).
Why all that? Even that support crew you mention would be far bigger than most nations (I’m guessing)? You’re talking at least 4-5 support crew per rider.

Still sounds to me like the riders/teams/factories have lost the humility to say “you know what we are going to send three riders, three mechanics and a team manager and do the best we can”.
loftyair
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10/5/2017 8:24am
I love nations, but, the 40th guy on the gate, even in the 'a' class, is really slow! Like the USA 250th fastest guy would smoke half the field. Hard to figure, like Gasjer, he has really slow teammates. All races should have a 107% lap time entry, or something.
dkg
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10/5/2017 8:28am Edited Date/Time 10/5/2017 8:30am
Jt$ wrote:
That may be your perspective on it from GB and probably many other countries but here in the USA, A1 dwarfs MXoN for most. I spend...
That may be your perspective on it from GB and probably many other countries but here in the USA, A1 dwarfs MXoN for most. I spend thousands of my own dollars every year to go to this MXoN so clearly I love it but, big picture, A1 is much, much more interesting for casual USA fans.

For better or worse, SX attendance and TV numbers are far larger than any other form of dirt bike racing on earth.
Jt$

It doesn’t surprise me at all that A1 is larger than MXDN here in the USA. Do you know where MXDN ranks in actual interest level here in the USA. I’d be really interested in both raw numbers for the SX, MX and MXDN in total interest level, (attendees and tv viewing) and then the numbers for likely consumers of bikes, gear, etc. It still amazes me at the lack of industry commitment to MXDN which I suspect is the number 2 event in the USA (probably number 1 in worldwide interest).
10/5/2017 8:46am
Grieby54 wrote:
I wonder how many Kawasakis stayed on dealer floors because of Eli’s refusal to the MXdN. I wonder how many Monster cans remained in the convenience...
I wonder how many Kawasakis stayed on dealer floors because of Eli’s refusal to the MXdN.

I wonder how many Monster cans remained in the convenience store fridge due to his lack of participation.

Fans being pumped on a rider doesn’t pay the bills. Fans being bummed on a rider doesn’t make the rider’s paycheck any smaller.
Probably none.. if anyone is that influenced by pro riders on what you should ride you’re a fool.

The Shop

Adam43
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10/5/2017 8:50am
The MXON the best event in the sport, but it's only purpose is bragging rights and lining Giuseppe's pockets.

The riders need more incentive to participate, rather than just avoiding getting flamed on social media.

Pay the riders more

OR

Pay the qualifying federations more of the take from the event, and put the money towards growing and revitalizing this dying sport in their respective countries.

10/5/2017 9:01am
No point in debating a topic on MXDN. It will never be mandatory and if a rider doesn’t feel like going then he won’t go. For example with Tomac monster wants him at the GP and MEC rather then MXDN. It’s simple. I also thinks A1 is a little more hype BUT if we send our best riders to MXDN I think it will be more exciting
10/5/2017 9:02am
Grieby54 wrote:
I wonder how many Kawasakis stayed on dealer floors because of Eli’s refusal to the MXdN. I wonder how many Monster cans remained in the convenience...
I wonder how many Kawasakis stayed on dealer floors because of Eli’s refusal to the MXdN.

I wonder how many Monster cans remained in the convenience store fridge due to his lack of participation.

Fans being pumped on a rider doesn’t pay the bills. Fans being bummed on a rider doesn’t make the rider’s paycheck any smaller.
Probably none.. if anyone is that influenced by pro riders on what you should ride you’re a fool.
Yeah I’ve never bought a bike on what a pro riders same with gear. I mean is tomacs bike REALLY a kawi with all those factory parts Laughing
Motofinne
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10/5/2017 9:04am Edited Date/Time 10/5/2017 9:11am
loftyair wrote:
I love nations, but, the 40th guy on the gate, even in the 'a' class, is really slow! Like the USA 250th fastest guy would smoke...
I love nations, but, the 40th guy on the gate, even in the 'a' class, is really slow! Like the USA 250th fastest guy would smoke half the field. Hard to figure, like Gasjer, he has really slow teammates. All races should have a 107% lap time entry, or something.
The slowest riders on the track were 15-20 seconds off the fastest guys.

Take a look at this results page from this years mudder in Unadilla. The difference was even bigger than in Matterly Basin between the fastest and slowest riders.
http://americanmotocrossresults.com/xml/MX/events/M1750/M1F2RES.pdf


mtnr
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10/5/2017 9:08am
Jt$ wrote:
That may be your perspective on it from GB and probably many other countries but here in the USA, A1 dwarfs MXoN for most. I spend...
That may be your perspective on it from GB and probably many other countries but here in the USA, A1 dwarfs MXoN for most. I spend thousands of my own dollars every year to go to this MXoN so clearly I love it but, big picture, A1 is much, much more interesting for casual USA fans.

For better or worse, SX attendance and TV numbers are far larger than any other form of dirt bike racing on earth.
dkg wrote:
Jt$ It doesn’t surprise me at all that A1 is larger than MXDN here in the USA. Do you know where MXDN ranks in actual interest...
Jt$

It doesn’t surprise me at all that A1 is larger than MXDN here in the USA. Do you know where MXDN ranks in actual interest level here in the USA. I’d be really interested in both raw numbers for the SX, MX and MXDN in total interest level, (attendees and tv viewing) and then the numbers for likely consumers of bikes, gear, etc. It still amazes me at the lack of industry commitment to MXDN which I suspect is the number 2 event in the USA (probably number 1 in worldwide interest).
But again, as weege said the clicks in the racer x site are highest the week before the mxdn, over a1. So core interest is highest for the mxdn. Not leveraging off those numbers is kinda weird. Core demographics spend more on race product over swag as compared the casual a1 fan would go more for swag over race products. Imho . If your selling gear the mxdn is a great we way to hit core - riding users.
Crush
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10/5/2017 9:10am
loftyair wrote:
I love nations, but, the 40th guy on the gate, even in the 'a' class, is really slow! Like the USA 250th fastest guy would smoke...
I love nations, but, the 40th guy on the gate, even in the 'a' class, is really slow! Like the USA 250th fastest guy would smoke half the field. Hard to figure, like Gasjer, he has really slow teammates. All races should have a 107% lap time entry, or something.
Motofinne wrote:
The slowest riders on the track were 15-20 seconds off the fastest guys. Take a look at this results page from this years mudder in Unadilla...
The slowest riders on the track were 15-20 seconds off the fastest guys.

Take a look at this results page from this years mudder in Unadilla. The difference was even bigger than in Matterly Basin between the fastest and slowest riders.
http://americanmotocrossresults.com/xml/MX/events/M1750/M1F2RES.pdf


That's in the mains. Check out the qualifier range. Fucked up.
Motofinne
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10/5/2017 9:14am
loftyair wrote:
I love nations, but, the 40th guy on the gate, even in the 'a' class, is really slow! Like the USA 250th fastest guy would smoke...
I love nations, but, the 40th guy on the gate, even in the 'a' class, is really slow! Like the USA 250th fastest guy would smoke half the field. Hard to figure, like Gasjer, he has really slow teammates. All races should have a 107% lap time entry, or something.
Motofinne wrote:
The slowest riders on the track were 15-20 seconds off the fastest guys. Take a look at this results page from this years mudder in Unadilla...
The slowest riders on the track were 15-20 seconds off the fastest guys.

Take a look at this results page from this years mudder in Unadilla. The difference was even bigger than in Matterly Basin between the fastest and slowest riders.
http://americanmotocrossresults.com/xml/MX/events/M1750/M1F2RES.pdf


Crush wrote:
That's in the mains. Check out the qualifier range. Fucked up.
Yes i know, the difference in speed is HUGE in the time practice and qualifiers.

But i responded on this comment: "I love nations, but, the 40th guy on the gate, even in the 'a' class, is really slow!"

I assume he meant the motos.
RG1
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10/5/2017 9:40am
Juice_Mann wrote:
I may be way off base, but I would argue that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year. There's a reason why...
I may be way off base, but I would argue that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year. There's a reason why the MXDN doesn't broadcast live on television.
RG1 wrote:
You nailed it with the first 6 words of your post. There's a lot of hype and excitement around A1, mainly because there hasn't been any...
You nailed it with the first 6 words of your post.

There's a lot of hype and excitement around A1, mainly because there hasn't been any racing for 3 months prior, and it's the first race of the new year. If you look at A1 as a single event and the MXdN as a single event, then MXdN is the one that means the most to most fans and is the more prestigious event to win
Jt$ wrote:
That may be your perspective on it from GB and probably many other countries but here in the USA, A1 dwarfs MXoN for most. I spend...
That may be your perspective on it from GB and probably many other countries but here in the USA, A1 dwarfs MXoN for most. I spend thousands of my own dollars every year to go to this MXoN so clearly I love it but, big picture, A1 is much, much more interesting for casual USA fans.

For better or worse, SX attendance and TV numbers are far larger than any other form of dirt bike racing on earth.
Of course, I wouldn't try to argue that MXoN has better attendance or TV figures than SX, that's obviously not the case. It's more engaging and far more accessible to the casual fan. I just think that to most hardcore, genuine, fans of the sport, worldwide, not just in the US, the MXoN is the biggest single event of the year. A1 is part of a bigger picture, the SX championship, which is extremely prestigious and important
early
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10/5/2017 9:51am
Heres an idea to any gear company out there.

Why not make a red white and blue colorway in your top product line every year and call it the MX Des Nations line. I think that colorway sells pretty decent anyway so its not too much of a gamble, it could be a limited edition. Then you already have it ready to go come september/october.
Shaned9326
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10/5/2017 11:36am
Tbteam wrote:
The fact that a motocross fan can state that A1 is bigger than the MXdN pretty much sums up the losing attitude that is pervasive amongst...
The fact that a motocross fan can state that A1 is bigger than the MXdN pretty much sums up the losing attitude that is pervasive amongst our "culture".

Patriotism, national pride and respect for your own country seem to be on a severe downward slide with the up and coming generation. So many signs point to an unnerving sense of "meh, who cares" syndrome.
Nailed it brother!!!
10/5/2017 11:50am Edited Date/Time 10/5/2017 11:51am
just shows SX is getting bigger and bigger in USA and MX is loosing ground , if A1 is bigger as the MXON races
Pretty sure , worldwide MXON is much bigger as any SX event ...
Motoxdoc
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10/5/2017 12:08pm
Juice_Mann wrote:
I may be way off base, but I would argue that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year. There's a reason why...
I may be way off base, but I would argue that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year. There's a reason why the MXDN doesn't broadcast live on television.
^^^This^^^ to the 1st 6 words in your post. At least you recognized it.
Juice_Mann
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10/5/2017 12:23pm
Juice_Mann wrote:
I may be way off base, but I would argue that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year. There's a reason why...
I may be way off base, but I would argue that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year. There's a reason why the MXDN doesn't broadcast live on television.
Motoxdoc wrote:
^^^This^^^ to the 1st 6 words in your post. At least you recognized it.
There seems to be some pretty useful info in this thread that would back my argument, but whatever man go ahead and make me sound like an idiot if it makes you happy.
Robgvx
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10/5/2017 12:56pm
RG1 wrote:
You nailed it with the first 6 words of your post. There's a lot of hype and excitement around A1, mainly because there hasn't been any...
You nailed it with the first 6 words of your post.

There's a lot of hype and excitement around A1, mainly because there hasn't been any racing for 3 months prior, and it's the first race of the new year. If you look at A1 as a single event and the MXdN as a single event, then MXdN is the one that means the most to most fans and is the more prestigious event to win
Jt$ wrote:
That may be your perspective on it from GB and probably many other countries but here in the USA, A1 dwarfs MXoN for most. I spend...
That may be your perspective on it from GB and probably many other countries but here in the USA, A1 dwarfs MXoN for most. I spend thousands of my own dollars every year to go to this MXoN so clearly I love it but, big picture, A1 is much, much more interesting for casual USA fans.

For better or worse, SX attendance and TV numbers are far larger than any other form of dirt bike racing on earth.
RG1 wrote:
Of course, I wouldn't try to argue that MXoN has better attendance or TV figures than SX, that's obviously not the case. It's more engaging and...
Of course, I wouldn't try to argue that MXoN has better attendance or TV figures than SX, that's obviously not the case. It's more engaging and far more accessible to the casual fan. I just think that to most hardcore, genuine, fans of the sport, worldwide, not just in the US, the MXoN is the biggest single event of the year. A1 is part of a bigger picture, the SX championship, which is extremely prestigious and important
Why do we/they place so much emphasis on 'the casual fan'?

Why should we change the core values of the sport to pander to people who only go to one or two supercross races a year, don't ride, spend no money in the industry apart from an SX ticket, beer and hot dog, have no appreciation of the effort, skill and endurance of the riders and no understanding of the history or values of the sport? How do those people benefit anyone except Feld/YS etc?

It makes no sense to undermine the very foundations of the sport to attract people who aren't particularly interested in it anyway.

Motoxdoc
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10/5/2017 4:14pm
Juice_Mann wrote:
I may be way off base, but I would argue that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year. There's a reason why...
I may be way off base, but I would argue that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year. There's a reason why the MXDN doesn't broadcast live on television.
Motoxdoc wrote:
^^^This^^^ to the 1st 6 words in your post. At least you recognized it.
Juice_Mann wrote:
There seems to be some pretty useful info in this thread that would back my argument, but whatever man go ahead and make me sound like...
There seems to be some pretty useful info in this thread that would back my argument, but whatever man go ahead and make me sound like an idiot if it makes you happy.
Some useful info in this thread that supports your theory that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year? I didn't see that. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. If what I said makes you think you sound like an idiot.....well that's on you. Don't blame me for that.....and why would I be happy if I DID make you sound like an idiot? What kind of people do you associate with that are HAPPY to make you sound like an idiot? That's anti-social.
Juice_Mann
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10/5/2017 5:26pm
Motoxdoc wrote:
^^^This^^^ to the 1st 6 words in your post. At least you recognized it.
Juice_Mann wrote:
There seems to be some pretty useful info in this thread that would back my argument, but whatever man go ahead and make me sound like...
There seems to be some pretty useful info in this thread that would back my argument, but whatever man go ahead and make me sound like an idiot if it makes you happy.
Motoxdoc wrote:
Some useful info in this thread that supports your theory that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year? I didn't see that...
Some useful info in this thread that supports your theory that A1 is the biggest and most celebrated event of the year? I didn't see that. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. If what I said makes you think you sound like an idiot.....well that's on you. Don't blame me for that.....and why would I be happy if I DID make you sound like an idiot? What kind of people do you associate with that are HAPPY to make you sound like an idiot? That's anti-social.
ML512 said on page 2 "eight to ten of the SX rounds match or beat an MXdN for in-person attendance". And since most SX rounds are broadcasted live on Fox Sports is it safe to assume more people watch these events from home too? Do these things not support my argument that A1 is a bigger event than the MXdN? Sure it might not mean as much as the MXdN in itself, but it's a bigger event nonetheless in terms of attendance, viewing, and probably money.

As for the other stuff, your initial comment came off a bit douchey IMO so I apologize if I took it the wrong way.
ML512
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10/5/2017 7:08pm
Jt$ wrote:
That may be your perspective on it from GB and probably many other countries but here in the USA, A1 dwarfs MXoN for most. I spend...
That may be your perspective on it from GB and probably many other countries but here in the USA, A1 dwarfs MXoN for most. I spend thousands of my own dollars every year to go to this MXoN so clearly I love it but, big picture, A1 is much, much more interesting for casual USA fans.

For better or worse, SX attendance and TV numbers are far larger than any other form of dirt bike racing on earth.
dkg wrote:
Jt$ It doesn’t surprise me at all that A1 is larger than MXDN here in the USA. Do you know where MXDN ranks in actual interest...
Jt$

It doesn’t surprise me at all that A1 is larger than MXDN here in the USA. Do you know where MXDN ranks in actual interest level here in the USA. I’d be really interested in both raw numbers for the SX, MX and MXDN in total interest level, (attendees and tv viewing) and then the numbers for likely consumers of bikes, gear, etc. It still amazes me at the lack of industry commitment to MXDN which I suspect is the number 2 event in the USA (probably number 1 in worldwide interest).
mtnr wrote:
But again, as weege said the clicks in the racer x site are highest the week before the mxdn, over a1. So core interest is highest...
But again, as weege said the clicks in the racer x site are highest the week before the mxdn, over a1. So core interest is highest for the mxdn. Not leveraging off those numbers is kinda weird. Core demographics spend more on race product over swag as compared the casual a1 fan would go more for swag over race products. Imho . If your selling gear the mxdn is a great we way to hit core - riding users.
On this website, traffic is roughly 30-40% higher the weekend of A1 then it is for MXoN.
dkg
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10/5/2017 7:20pm
ML512 wrote:
On this website, traffic is roughly 30-40% higher the weekend of A1 then it is for MXoN.
Hmmm ...; what’s the ratio of USA participants to non-USA participants?
lestat
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10/5/2017 7:43pm
Robgvx wrote:
Why do we/they place so much emphasis on 'the casual fan'? Why should we change the core values of the sport to pander to people who...
Why do we/they place so much emphasis on 'the casual fan'?

Why should we change the core values of the sport to pander to people who only go to one or two supercross races a year, don't ride, spend no money in the industry apart from an SX ticket, beer and hot dog, have no appreciation of the effort, skill and endurance of the riders and no understanding of the history or values of the sport? How do those people benefit anyone except Feld/YS etc?

It makes no sense to undermine the very foundations of the sport to attract people who aren't particularly interested in it anyway.

Nailed it !
Forty
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10/5/2017 7:55pm
Robgvx wrote:
Why do we/they place so much emphasis on 'the casual fan'? Why should we change the core values of the sport to pander to people who...
Why do we/they place so much emphasis on 'the casual fan'?

Why should we change the core values of the sport to pander to people who only go to one or two supercross races a year, don't ride, spend no money in the industry apart from an SX ticket, beer and hot dog, have no appreciation of the effort, skill and endurance of the riders and no understanding of the history or values of the sport? How do those people benefit anyone except Feld/YS etc?

It makes no sense to undermine the very foundations of the sport to attract people who aren't particularly interested in it anyway.

Money. The casual fan has it.
ML512
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10/5/2017 8:22pm
ML512 wrote:
On this website, traffic is roughly 30-40% higher the weekend of A1 then it is for MXoN.
dkg wrote:
Hmmm ...; what’s the ratio of USA participants to non-USA participants?
73% North America (USA, Canada, Mexico) with the remainder being mixed world wide. UK, Australia and France are our next three largest markets...we have viewers from 227 of the 247 independent regions of the world each month.

If I'm doing my math correctly, we have around 1.3 million viewers from outside North America in a year period...

I actually went and checked the logs. I was a little high, there was 25% more traffic for A1 this year than MXoN, with last year's A1 traffic being about 28% higher than MXoN.

But, the spread of US vs world wide traffic between those two events is only a 2% difference. At A1 it's around 71% NA to 29% world wide and MXoN is around 69% NA to 31% world wide. In sense of viewers, A1 garnishes more traffic from every country basically than MXoN does for us.
Jrewing
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10/5/2017 9:02pm
Seriously, if you can't understand the passion with the core fan at Mxon, verse the hype of a new season attracting both core fan plus the added outside fan, then little wonder the sport is regressing.
If Mxon was free to air at a better timeslot it would be boosted a fair bit more.
Imagine if Mxon was first up with the best riders fit, great time slot on free to air it would kill it.
Mxon does really well attendance wise considering the lack of creature comforts stadium sports have going for them.
10/6/2017 12:24am
Grieby54 wrote:
I wonder how many Kawasakis stayed on dealer floors because of Eli’s refusal to the MXdN. I wonder how many Monster cans remained in the convenience...
I wonder how many Kawasakis stayed on dealer floors because of Eli’s refusal to the MXdN.

I wonder how many Monster cans remained in the convenience store fridge due to his lack of participation.

Fans being pumped on a rider doesn’t pay the bills. Fans being bummed on a rider doesn’t make the rider’s paycheck any smaller.
Probably none.. if anyone is that influenced by pro riders on what you should ride you’re a fool.
Then no one should pay to sponsor a team....

Stupid idea:
What if the des nations went to a production bike rule. Through and through... can only change spring rates and clickers.
ayearinmx
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10/6/2017 1:44am
A1 Night Show Thread - 699 replies, 23784 views
A1 Practice Thread - 493 replies, 35701 views

MXoN Sunday Race Thread - 914 replies, 52462 views
MXoN Saturday Thread - 417 replies, 28984 views
Crush
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10/6/2017 3:45am
Jrewing wrote:
Seriously, if you can't understand the passion with the core fan at Mxon, verse the hype of a new season attracting both core fan plus the...
Seriously, if you can't understand the passion with the core fan at Mxon, verse the hype of a new season attracting both core fan plus the added outside fan, then little wonder the sport is regressing.
If Mxon was free to air at a better timeslot it would be boosted a fair bit more.
Imagine if Mxon was first up with the best riders fit, great time slot on free to air it would kill it.
Mxon does really well attendance wise considering the lack of creature comforts stadium sports have going for them.
Bingo.

TV broadcast contracts have fuck all to do with what the core fans want to see... as David's post about illustrates... double the views. Double.
ns503
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10/6/2017 4:26am
A poll would be interesting.

I.e., for those who have been at a MXoN, and a SX - would you rather spectate (in person) at MXoN or A1?

Nations, no question.

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