Webb’s pass on Tomac = Penalised

cpyz300
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3/16/2019 9:38pm
agn5009 wrote:
I wouldn’t have an issue no matter who the rider is. An accident is an accident. I don’t want to see the AMA set the precedent...
I wouldn’t have an issue no matter who the rider is. An accident is an accident. I don’t want to see the AMA set the precedent that they’re going to penalize guys over clear cut accidents.
If it's an accident, which it was. He shouldn't have completed the pass, which he did. That pass was not going to happen unless he cut the corner, which is what happened. He should have let Tomac get back in front of him because that block pass was not legitimate.

It's about as straight forward as the rules state it.
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logan_140
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3/16/2019 9:44pm
Downunder wrote:
Those who think you can’t be penalised for cutting the track by accident may want to speak with Savatgy about East Rutherford 2017. Docked 5 places.
No way it would even come close to 5 positions lol. Time penalty if anything. 5-10 seconds. Not Webb’s fault tomac dropped like an anchor
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3/16/2019 9:50pm
Downunder wrote:
Those who think you can’t be penalised for cutting the track by accident may want to speak with Savatgy about East Rutherford 2017. Docked 5 places.
logan_140 wrote:
No way it would even come close to 5 positions lol. Time penalty if anything. 5-10 seconds. Not Webb’s fault tomac dropped like an anchor
Just pointing out it’s not unheard of. And I think the rule book states any positions gained +1. So if they decided to penalise (which is doubtful) it would be 1 position at a minimum.
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logan_140
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3/16/2019 9:53pm Edited Date/Time 3/16/2019 9:54pm
Downunder wrote:
Those who think you can’t be penalised for cutting the track by accident may want to speak with Savatgy about East Rutherford 2017. Docked 5 places.
logan_140 wrote:
No way it would even come close to 5 positions lol. Time penalty if anything. 5-10 seconds. Not Webb’s fault tomac dropped like an anchor
Downunder wrote:
Just pointing out it’s not unheard of. And I think the rule book states any positions gained +1. So if they decided to penalise (which is...
Just pointing out it’s not unheard of. And I think the rule book states any positions gained +1. So if they decided to penalise (which is doubtful) it would be 1 position at a minimum.
But did he truly gain a position from the move? He gained time yes.. but he didn’t make the pass til the exit of the corner. He should have let tomac go and just got it done a couple corners later, but in the heat of moment that’s a lot to process and remember to do.
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The Shop

early
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3/16/2019 10:01pm
logan_140 wrote:
But did he truly gain a position from the move? He gained time yes.. but he didn’t make the pass til the exit of the corner...
But did he truly gain a position from the move? He gained time yes.. but he didn’t make the pass til the exit of the corner. He should have let tomac go and just got it done a couple corners later, but in the heat of moment that’s a lot to process and remember to do.

shortcourse
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3/16/2019 10:10pm

If this was the other way around...everyone would be saying what a great pass by Tomac.
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3/16/2019 10:15pm
Cringing hard af at the "he didn't mean it" posts

If he tboned Tomac but "didn't mean it" no penalty right? Silly
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logan_140
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3/16/2019 10:21pm
Cringing hard af at the "he didn't mean it" posts

If he tboned Tomac but "didn't mean it" no penalty right? Silly
You literally can’t help it if you cross rut tho.. the bike is gonna go where it goes. We should all just be thankful nobody was hurt and somehow Webb got that bike stopped...
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agn5009
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3/16/2019 10:24pm
Cringing hard af at the "he didn't mean it" posts

If he tboned Tomac but "didn't mean it" no penalty right? Silly
If he got squirrelly and hit Tomac? No. No penalty. If he did it intentionally? Yes penalty.
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logan_140
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3/16/2019 10:32pm
Ok so let’s say a nascar driver had a tire going down and they couldn’t do anything about it, and they end up taking someone else out accidentally. Would they be penalized? It’s racing shit happens. Nobody was taken out move on.
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3/16/2019 10:32pm Edited Date/Time 3/17/2019 12:08am
Cringing hard af at the "he didn't mean it" posts

If he tboned Tomac but "didn't mean it" no penalty right? Silly
logan_140 wrote:
You literally can’t help it if you cross rut tho.. the bike is gonna go where it goes. We should all just be thankful nobody was...
You literally can’t help it if you cross rut tho.. the bike is gonna go where it goes. We should all just be thankful nobody was hurt and somehow Webb got that bike stopped...
He crossed ruts trying to jump to the furthest inside position.

He was going for the kill in that corner. More power to him if he succeeds, but he failed and still took the advantage, despite leaving the track. That's almost exactly the scenario the rules are written to penalize.

Ultimately the rules are there both for competition and for safety. I know it feels fucked up that safety is even a factor in this suicidal sport, but the rule is clearly written that a move involving leaving the track won't get rewarded and riders have to exercise a lot of caution re-entering, regardless of the competitive situation. That's why many times, 'SAFE' is written into the rule: It is specifically to address the case of a guy being out of control.
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Texas Built
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3/16/2019 11:11pm
foreman52 wrote:
Can’t see it. Wasn’t intentional by Webb at all. Smart move on Tomac’s part to be aware of his surroundings.
I don't know anyone who goes off the track intentionally.
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milliebays
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3/16/2019 11:15pm
RandyS wrote:
He didn't come back on to the track in a better position. No foul.
Indont thinknthey should penaloze however, but for the cut he would not have been able to make the pass.
crowe176
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3/16/2019 11:17pm
SLOWTIME wrote:
I was impressed he was able to make the turn, ..and I’m not a webb fan.

I’m impressed he didn’t tighten up and need to gather himself lol. I wouldn’t have made it to the next turn without all my blood running straight to my forearms. Kids a stud and I’m not even a fan lol
3/16/2019 11:25pm Edited Date/Time 3/16/2019 11:30pm
SLOWTIME wrote:
I was impressed he was able to make the turn, ..and I’m not a webb fan.

crowe176 wrote:
I’m impressed he didn’t tighten up and need to gather himself lol. I wouldn’t have made it to the next turn without all my blood running...
I’m impressed he didn’t tighten up and need to gather himself lol. I wouldn’t have made it to the next turn without all my blood running straight to my forearms. Kids a stud and I’m not even a fan lol
It was amazingly responsive riding for both riders to avoid an incident.

It does appear it tightened up one of the two. Tomac and Webb were both turning 49s prior to the pass. Webb had the ability to maintain that, while Tomac dropped to 51s and 52s.
3/16/2019 11:43pm
Downunder wrote:
Those who think you can’t be penalised for cutting the track by accident may want to speak with Savatgy about East Rutherford 2017. Docked 5 places.
logan_140 wrote:
No way it would even come close to 5 positions lol. Time penalty if anything. 5-10 seconds. Not Webb’s fault tomac dropped like an anchor
Someone posted the rules! Why are you talking about a time penalty. Read before you post,
wfo4ever
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3/17/2019 12:09am
I think it would be considered cutting the track. Just watch the video, it is very easy to see that there should be a penalty or DQ against Webb. The AMA will F&%# it up as usual.
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BobbyM
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3/17/2019 12:16am
unless you are in the "air" that kinda move is clearly a violation of some rule somewhere in someones rulebook....sometimes.
wfo4ever
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3/17/2019 12:27am
BobbyM wrote:
unless you are in the "air" that kinda move is clearly a violation of some rule somewhere in someones rulebook....sometimes.
BobbyM gets it. This is a AMA grey area kinda thing. It happens whenever something happens in this sport to do with the rules.
TDeath21
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3/17/2019 12:49am
In my opinion he should be penalized 5-10 seconds. As it turns out though, that penalty would not alter the result. They should still administer the penalty though and have the final times show it.
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3/17/2019 1:17am
RandyS wrote:
He didn't come back on to the track in a better position. No foul.
milliebays wrote:
Indont thinknthey should penaloze however, but for the cut he would not have been able to make the pass.
GOOD POINT TYLER
Motofinne
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3/17/2019 1:32am Edited Date/Time 3/17/2019 1:47am
The thing is that what happened to Webb is so much more different to incidents like Savatgy a couple of years ago when he completely cut a lane.

Webb cut "50%" of the corner. He didn't actually cut the whole corner. Anything else than a 5 second penalty would've been way too much (and a 5 sec penalty would not change the results since Tomac dropped an anchor). Lets say that Webb crossruts one jump earlier and ends up on the other lane and continues, then we have a bigger problem and in a case like that docking positions is the only option.

What if Tomac is more aggressive in the corner and keeps the spot, do you still think that Webb should get a penatly? Because Webb was going to pass Tomac, the question was when he was going to make the pass.

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KYFHO699
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3/17/2019 1:34am
Pretty sure if the shoe was on the other foot you would be crying like a little bitch. Gotta love the double standards with the morans on Vital...
Crush
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3/17/2019 1:52am
Motofinne wrote:
The thing is that what happened to Webb is so much more different to incidents like Savatgy a couple of years ago when he completely cut...
The thing is that what happened to Webb is so much more different to incidents like Savatgy a couple of years ago when he completely cut a lane.

Webb cut "50%" of the corner. He didn't actually cut the whole corner. Anything else than a 5 second penalty would've been way too much (and a 5 sec penalty would not change the results since Tomac dropped an anchor). Lets say that Webb crossruts one jump earlier and ends up on the other lane and continues, then we have a bigger problem and in a case like that docking positions is the only option.

What if Tomac is more aggressive in the corner and keeps the spot, do you still think that Webb should get a penatly? Because Webb was going to pass Tomac, the question was when he was going to make the pass.

I don’t think he makes that pass in that corner without what happened happening though. That’s all that matters, IF Kawi protests but it sounds like they didn’t so it doesn’t.
Motofinne
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3/17/2019 2:01am
Motofinne wrote:
The thing is that what happened to Webb is so much more different to incidents like Savatgy a couple of years ago when he completely cut...
The thing is that what happened to Webb is so much more different to incidents like Savatgy a couple of years ago when he completely cut a lane.

Webb cut "50%" of the corner. He didn't actually cut the whole corner. Anything else than a 5 second penalty would've been way too much (and a 5 sec penalty would not change the results since Tomac dropped an anchor). Lets say that Webb crossruts one jump earlier and ends up on the other lane and continues, then we have a bigger problem and in a case like that docking positions is the only option.

What if Tomac is more aggressive in the corner and keeps the spot, do you still think that Webb should get a penatly? Because Webb was going to pass Tomac, the question was when he was going to make the pass.

Crush wrote:
I don’t think he makes that pass in that corner without what happened happening though. That’s all that matters, IF Kawi protests but it sounds like...
I don’t think he makes that pass in that corner without what happened happening though. That’s all that matters, IF Kawi protests but it sounds like they didn’t so it doesn’t.
Probably not, altough we can't rule it out. He was pretty close to Tomac already before he crossrutted.

I agree that there should be some kind of penalty when you exceed the track limits and happen to make a pass. But my point is that he barely cut 1 meter of the corner and that is why docking positions or anything over a 5 second penalty would've been way too much.
Motofinne
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3/17/2019 2:05am
This is how close Webb is to Tomac when he gets crossrutted. I would say that Tomac was in trouble either way.


KYFHO699
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3/17/2019 2:30am
Doesn’t matter either way...Intentional or not, he cut the track and ended up gaining position as a result.
mac3-d
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3/17/2019 3:10am

If this was the other way around...everyone would be saying what a great pass by Tomac.
If it was Musquin that gains a place like that this place would blow up
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KYFHO699
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3/17/2019 3:43am Edited Date/Time 3/17/2019 3:45am
Nice way to bury it asshole...someone’s on the “Webb Wagon.”

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