Tomac and that Kawasaki

gregyou
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8/22/2020 6:33pm
Don’t forget get the bike has shit it’s self in non mud races as well. Was it last season that it cost him a moto win
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Broseph
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8/22/2020 6:44pm
Last year’s National Hare and Hound champ, Jacob Argubright, had a DNF from engine trouble last week at Vegas to Reno on a KX450. He also blew an engine at ISDE last fall on a KX450.

Are there real documented durability issues with the new KX? Or just a few random high profile engine failures?
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8/22/2020 6:44pm
and yet one of the largest threads on this form is for how people love the 19+ kx450
gregyou wrote:
You think any one on here push’s the bike as hard as any of top pros?
Absolutely. Pro’s ride in the correct gear/rpm for the track, proper maintenance, technique, etc. if you listen how low in the RPM some of them ride it’s crazy.

Not everyone is barcia and a ray.

When Eli’s radiators get plugged up that is no way a sign the bike is junk.
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The Shop

Elbows
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8/22/2020 6:58pm
I am surprised Barcia’s bike made it. Literally every lap when he came by you could smell the clutch being roasted. Those guys push the bikes to the absolute limit. I’m surprised there wasn’t more Dnf’s. It was unreal at the bikes losing coolant and smoking today.
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8/22/2020 7:01pm
Absolutely. Pro’s ride in the correct gear/rpm for the track, proper maintenance, technique, etc. if you listen how low in the RPM some of them ride...
Absolutely. Pro’s ride in the correct gear/rpm for the track, proper maintenance, technique, etc. if you listen how low in the RPM some of them ride it’s crazy.

Not everyone is barcia and a ray.

When Eli’s radiators get plugged up that is no way a sign the bike is junk.
I really don't see a huge distinction between Barcia, Aray and Eli in terms of bike abuse. Eli is a high rpm guy, he is a smash through rough lines guy, and he is a ride-the-clutch guy.
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Howlan
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Wilson, NC US
8/22/2020 7:03pm
Tomac to GasGas when contact is up?
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gregyou
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8/22/2020 7:03pm
Yep, Tomac and that Kawasaki, only 4 titles, what a POS!
He could’ve had more if not for a few bike issues and he nearly last one of the outdoor titles due to the bike blowing up one year
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ktm300xcw2018
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8/22/2020 7:03pm
and yet one of the largest threads on this form is for how people love the 19+ kx450
gregyou wrote:
You think any one on here push’s the bike as hard as any of top pros?
Absolutely. Pro’s ride in the correct gear/rpm for the track, proper maintenance, technique, etc. if you listen how low in the RPM some of them ride...
Absolutely. Pro’s ride in the correct gear/rpm for the track, proper maintenance, technique, etc. if you listen how low in the RPM some of them ride it’s crazy.

Not everyone is barcia and a ray.

When Eli’s radiators get plugged up that is no way a sign the bike is junk.
According to timing/scoring he came from dead last in the first turn crash up to 6th. Passing that many people in the wet and muddy conditions is more than enough to fill the radiators with mud. Hard charger award for sure.
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Fonzarelli
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Saginaw, MI US
8/22/2020 7:15pm
When is the last time people said a mechanical DNF was a rider's fault? I think the answer might be never. Amazing what crap you guys will come up with to make today into Tomac's personal failure because the bike broke.
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8/22/2020 7:20pm
Fonzarelli wrote:
When is the last time people said a mechanical DNF was a rider's fault? I think the answer might be never. Amazing what crap you guys...
When is the last time people said a mechanical DNF was a rider's fault? I think the answer might be never. Amazing what crap you guys will come up with to make today into Tomac's personal failure because the bike broke.
"Fault" is a weird way to put it. Everyone who has ever maintained a bike realizes that some riders are harder on stuff than others.
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Ozy
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2017
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US
8/22/2020 7:32pm
Remember when RC used to say "Never count out the Champion"

next 7 races are going to be very fun to watch
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Natester551v
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St. George, UT US
8/22/2020 7:40pm
the series of KX450F failures are concerning, but the comments about Eli being super hard on clutches are true as well.
Williamson said that his engine oil would be pitch black after a 6 lap heat race.

Interesting that Reed recently commented about how durable the KTM clutch was, and he is also notoriously hard on clutches. I can't imagine how many they went through each week when he was Factory Yamaha...
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kpiper
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8/22/2020 8:24pm Edited Date/Time 8/22/2020 8:33pm
Kawasaki needs to make a bike that can handle how Tomac rides.

Maybe they do and it was just a combination of things today but I can't remember anytime someone's 450 blows up in back to back motos can you? Especially the defending three time champ?

Maybe the radiators got plugged when he fell in the first turn. Now, that was ALL on Eli. I didn't like at all how he handled that same area of the track in the first moto either with the pulling a tearoff deal. Seemed like asking for what ended up happening.

Yes, I realize his goggles got mud on them.
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Mavetism
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8/22/2020 8:27pm
Dirtydeeds wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/08/22/445150/s1200_EB94728E_6C4D_4010_BF33_F52D32F49D75.jpg[/img]

Thanks for that. 😂
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GuyB
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8/22/2020 8:31pm
During tonight's teleconference with the riders, I think Zach said that Husky swapped three powerplants today. I saw a number of DNFs for the GEICO Honda gang. I know Ben LaMay got towed out (KTM?)

There was a lot of unhappy equipment by the end of the second moto.
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FGR01
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8/22/2020 8:35pm
I'd like to point out that in my original post I didn't attempt to point fingers at Eli or the Bike. That wasn't my point.

My point is that when the reigning 3x running champ has a massive mechanical DNF in both motos, that is not a good day for the team. There's got to be some major soul searching going on and trying to root this problem out. Not saying where the blame lies or that the blame has to lie anywhere, but it is completely unacceptable for this to happen in a Pro race operation. Eli is a very professional rider so when he dropped the bike in disgust after the Moto-1 DNF you know things were not good. Can you imagine if he was mic'ed up when the moto-2 DNF happened what we would have heard?
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kpiper
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8/22/2020 8:51pm
FGR01 wrote:
I'd like to point out that in my original post I didn't attempt to point fingers at Eli or the Bike. That wasn't my point. My...
I'd like to point out that in my original post I didn't attempt to point fingers at Eli or the Bike. That wasn't my point.

My point is that when the reigning 3x running champ has a massive mechanical DNF in both motos, that is not a good day for the team. There's got to be some major soul searching going on and trying to root this problem out. Not saying where the blame lies or that the blame has to lie anywhere, but it is completely unacceptable for this to happen in a Pro race operation. Eli is a very professional rider so when he dropped the bike in disgust after the Moto-1 DNF you know things were not good. Can you imagine if he was mic'ed up when the moto-2 DNF happened what we would have heard?
A lot of you guys may laugh at this...but when I saw Eli 'toss' his bike to the ground at the end of the first moto I cringed a little.

I never liked the idea of doing something like that to my bike...I get being mad but 'she' has to take care of you again in the next race. Treat your equipment well no matter what.
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TSCHAM101
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Norco, CA US
8/22/2020 9:16pm
FGR01 wrote:
I'd like to point out that in my original post I didn't attempt to point fingers at Eli or the Bike. That wasn't my point. My...
I'd like to point out that in my original post I didn't attempt to point fingers at Eli or the Bike. That wasn't my point.

My point is that when the reigning 3x running champ has a massive mechanical DNF in both motos, that is not a good day for the team. There's got to be some major soul searching going on and trying to root this problem out. Not saying where the blame lies or that the blame has to lie anywhere, but it is completely unacceptable for this to happen in a Pro race operation. Eli is a very professional rider so when he dropped the bike in disgust after the Moto-1 DNF you know things were not good. Can you imagine if he was mic'ed up when the moto-2 DNF happened what we would have heard?
kpiper wrote:
A lot of you guys may laugh at this...but when I saw Eli 'toss' his bike to the ground at the end of the first moto...
A lot of you guys may laugh at this...but when I saw Eli 'toss' his bike to the ground at the end of the first moto I cringed a little.

I never liked the idea of doing something like that to my bike...I get being mad but 'she' has to take care of you again in the next race. Treat your equipment well no matter what.
Has your equipment ever cost you 20-30 grand? in 1 day?

Id be pissed too if im on one of the best teams in the world and the bike blows up back to back motos. Thats unacceptable by any operation of professional racing... DNF'ing cause of a crash or DNF 1 moto because of a mechanical is acceptable.. but it cant happen back to back like that, makes the whole operation look bad.

i guarantee that Kawasaki Tops, will be calling the race team this week saying "WTF, we cant have that happen, it will kill the publics perception of reliability, resulting in poor sales.... FIX IT"..
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8/22/2020 9:23pm
I hope that's the end of the mud races for the rest of the year. Not a fan of that kind of racing
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kpiper
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8/22/2020 9:32pm Edited Date/Time 8/22/2020 9:38pm
FGR01 wrote:
I'd like to point out that in my original post I didn't attempt to point fingers at Eli or the Bike. That wasn't my point. My...
I'd like to point out that in my original post I didn't attempt to point fingers at Eli or the Bike. That wasn't my point.

My point is that when the reigning 3x running champ has a massive mechanical DNF in both motos, that is not a good day for the team. There's got to be some major soul searching going on and trying to root this problem out. Not saying where the blame lies or that the blame has to lie anywhere, but it is completely unacceptable for this to happen in a Pro race operation. Eli is a very professional rider so when he dropped the bike in disgust after the Moto-1 DNF you know things were not good. Can you imagine if he was mic'ed up when the moto-2 DNF happened what we would have heard?
kpiper wrote:
A lot of you guys may laugh at this...but when I saw Eli 'toss' his bike to the ground at the end of the first moto...
A lot of you guys may laugh at this...but when I saw Eli 'toss' his bike to the ground at the end of the first moto I cringed a little.

I never liked the idea of doing something like that to my bike...I get being mad but 'she' has to take care of you again in the next race. Treat your equipment well no matter what.
TSCHAM101 wrote:
Has your equipment ever cost you 20-30 grand? in 1 day? Id be pissed too if im on one of the best teams in the world...
Has your equipment ever cost you 20-30 grand? in 1 day?

Id be pissed too if im on one of the best teams in the world and the bike blows up back to back motos. Thats unacceptable by any operation of professional racing... DNF'ing cause of a crash or DNF 1 moto because of a mechanical is acceptable.. but it cant happen back to back like that, makes the whole operation look bad.

i guarantee that Kawasaki Tops, will be calling the race team this week saying "WTF, we cant have that happen, it will kill the publics perception of reliability, resulting in poor sales.... FIX IT"..
It is a Karma thing. My equipment could kill me if it failed badly...so I prefer to treat it with respect. My bike the same.

But yes, Kawasaki should be embarrassed to say the least.
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kpiper
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8/22/2020 9:35pm
mxwells216 wrote:
I hope that's the end of the mud races for the rest of the year. Not a fan of that kind of racing
I don't mind mud races per se but I do hate it that mechanical failures like this can totally change the outcome of the series.
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scott_nz
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8/22/2020 9:56pm
kpiper wrote:
Kawasaki needs to make a bike that can handle how Tomac rides. Maybe they do and it was just a combination of things today but I...
Kawasaki needs to make a bike that can handle how Tomac rides.

Maybe they do and it was just a combination of things today but I can't remember anytime someone's 450 blows up in back to back motos can you? Especially the defending three time champ?

Maybe the radiators got plugged when he fell in the first turn. Now, that was ALL on Eli. I didn't like at all how he handled that same area of the track in the first moto either with the pulling a tearoff deal. Seemed like asking for what ended up happening.

Yes, I realize his goggles got mud on them.
Reed blew both his factory hondas up at southwick 11, barcia also lost a motor in one moto that day,
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mb60
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8/22/2020 10:10pm
Was at the Des nations and watched every KX 450 blow steam that weekend. You would have though they would have done something in 2 years to correct the problem.
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gregyou
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8/22/2020 10:10pm
Is there any video of him dropping his bike in disgust ?
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jemcee
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AU
8/22/2020 10:14pm
kpiper wrote:
It is a Karma thing. My equipment could kill me if it failed badly...so I prefer to treat it with respect. My bike the same. But...
It is a Karma thing. My equipment could kill me if it failed badly...so I prefer to treat it with respect. My bike the same.

But yes, Kawasaki should be embarrassed to say the least.
It's not so much about the bike for me it's about the mechanic.. He works bloody hard for a lot less money and yes it sucks for you that it broke but to just dump it for someone else to pick up isn't a good look.. Especially when there were people there to hold it up.. It seems he wanted to dump it to make a point and that's lame if you ask me
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robotsfrom
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Lomita, CA US
8/22/2020 10:35pm
Tomac's bike may have DNF'd both motos, but AC was on the same bike and got his first 450 motocross podium going 3-5 for 2nd overall.

Just something to point out. The bikes are solid. Tomac just had two motos of worst case scenarios in a mud race. Coming from back in the pack both motos plugging the radiators and being tough on the bike making passes. Not many bikes could tolerate that, as we saw today with how many DNF's there were.
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Heavyrider
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Albuquerque, NM US
8/22/2020 10:54pm
kpiper wrote:
It is a Karma thing. My equipment could kill me if it failed badly...so I prefer to treat it with respect. My bike the same. But...
It is a Karma thing. My equipment could kill me if it failed badly...so I prefer to treat it with respect. My bike the same.

But yes, Kawasaki should be embarrassed to say the least.
jemcee wrote:
It's not so much about the bike for me it's about the mechanic.. He works bloody hard for a lot less money and yes it sucks...
It's not so much about the bike for me it's about the mechanic.. He works bloody hard for a lot less money and yes it sucks for you that it broke but to just dump it for someone else to pick up isn't a good look.. Especially when there were people there to hold it up.. It seems he wanted to dump it to make a point and that's lame if you ask me
I thought it looked like John Tomac who picked it up.
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