Tom Moen @ KTM killed shootouts (kudos to Ping for telling it straight) & Merica's declining competitive spirit

jeffro503
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jeffro503 7/20/2018 10:24pm
7/20/2018 10:24pm
DC wrote:
Adam43 wrote, Racer X quit because Davey didn't like the heat, as Ping alludes. I think they also realized they weren't bringing anything to the table...
Adam43 wrote, Racer X quit because Davey didn't like the heat, as Ping alludes. I think they also realized they weren't bringing anything to the table that other outlets weren't doing better.

I am not sure what Ping said or was joking about but I'm definitely not afraid of the heat, I just have never been into doing bike tests because the other magazines were doing them and there was no need for us to go that route -- we wanted to be a lifestyle magazine, not hard parts. When Ping retired he knew how to actually test (which I will admit I am not very good at) and he started doing them online for films, and people seem to love his swagger and wisdom.

DC
Racer X
And David does a great job Davey. I enjoy his watching / reading his tests on bikes and equipment , and the overall health of the sport. For some reason I can't remember the exact article , but I think it was on the " Tornado bike , and his impression of how that bike worked out for him haha! OMG , I was in tears reading that one!
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aaryn #234
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aaryn #234 7/21/2018 2:19am
7/21/2018 2:19am
jorgechavez wrote:
People win and lose in society everyday? I also disagree with what that guy on Main Event Moto was saying, he acted as if 10 -...
People win and lose in society everyday?

I also disagree with what that guy on Main Event Moto was saying, he acted as if 10 - 15 years ago people rode to be the very best rider they can be but apparently now people just want to have fun and enjoy their hobby?

Riding has always been about the fun for me, I just think people who grew up chasing the dream of being a pro have a skewed idea of why people ride.
Agree with that,

There are many reasons why people ride and or race.

I do it mainly for the fun, I am never winning a top class trophy in this life time, sure I have won a couple of C grade and Vet local club titles, but that was more to do with rocking up to every round, certainly not from winning the most or being the best in class.

I have spoken to a number of ex-pro level riders in Aus and ask why they don't just go out and ride for fun or race local events, most are the same. If they are going to race they know they will just go push 100% and it will be all about going out there to be the best. Its a different mind set to us average riders / racers.

Sure when I line up, i want to win, and no matter what I want to beat whoever it is in front of me on track, or keep the rider behind, behind, but normally that is for 10th place and back Smile

I find the excitement in the battle I am in on track no matter what position it is, others need that battle to be for first or a top three position to get that same excitement. Which to me explains B and C grade classes lol.

Seriously B and C grade classes in series or events where there are well under a full gate of riders in the top class are normally won by riders who could easily top ten in the grade above, but won't race unless the can win or have a chance of winning so they race a grade lower.
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brimx153
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brimx153 7/21/2018 11:45am
7/21/2018 11:45am
Shootouts are crap imo . I 've often found I 'll jump on a couple of bikes ride them and I like one more than the other . But when I get the chance to play with map s and suspension I 've often found the bike I liked least from full stock .suits me way better than the bike I picked top the first day .GET OUT TRY THE BIKES FOR YOURSELF. Ie. for my style a Yamaha turns way better than a Suzuki or Honda, ktm but every shoot out will tell me different. Also I find the Suzuki as a ton of power for me prob because of where I ride in the power band. All this stuff is different for each style rider.
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OW38B
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OW38B 7/21/2018 12:47pm
7/21/2018 12:47pm
kiwifan wrote:
some think shootouts are a waste of space (likely those whose brand always loses), some flip flop on them (again likely to do with their brand...
some think shootouts are a waste of space (likely those whose brand always loses), some flip flop on them (again likely to do with their brand winning or not), some use them religiously to decide which one to buy, some never read them...its a choice that I am glad we all have.

At the end of the day, shootouts are a group of peoples opinions that have more relevance than your average joe rider's opinion.

For what its worth the Vital ones are the ones I pay closest attention to, the MXA ones the least ...imho.
I like to read ALL shootouts and rank them ALL equally.......true story.

The Shop

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Bry145
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Bry145 7/21/2018 4:18pm
7/21/2018 4:18pm
We have winners and losers in our society. The winners pay into the system and the losers drain resources out of the system.

Just wait until all the Boomers are retired and are sucking Social Security and Medicaid dry. And if you think Generations X, Y, and Z will have the incomes to keep the government and consumer spending afloat you are insane.

Endgame 2025.





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Underground 7/21/2018 5:52pm
7/21/2018 5:52pm
Bry145 wrote:
We have winners and losers in our society. The winners pay into the system and the losers drain resources out of the system. Just wait until...
We have winners and losers in our society. The winners pay into the system and the losers drain resources out of the system.

Just wait until all the Boomers are retired and are sucking Social Security and Medicaid dry. And if you think Generations X, Y, and Z will have the incomes to keep the government and consumer spending afloat you are insane.

Endgame 2025.





And winners can't do or be anything without losers. Fucking wanker
Travis_Hudson
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Travis_Hudson 7/22/2018 9:46am
7/22/2018 9:46am
slipdog wrote:
What am I missing about Tom? He was always an awesome guy, not sure how he got dragged into this...
Tom did complain to the magazines......but rightfully so. there would be times they would just ride the other bikes and let the KTM sit. I witnessed this first hand. They would be like "its gonna get last anyways". No bullshit.
Motofinne
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Motofinne 7/22/2018 9:59am
7/22/2018 9:59am
Well to be fair, the last few years of Racer X "shootouts" were painful to witness.

I like what they're doing now. Making individual videos of all the bikes with tips for people who bought them.
es337
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es337 7/22/2018 10:10am
7/22/2018 10:10am
809 wrote:
I am continually amazed at the number of douchebags on Vital!
milliebays wrote:
#metoo
Poundmetoo
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milliebays
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milliebays 7/22/2018 3:43pm
7/22/2018 3:43pm
slipdog wrote:
What am I missing about Tom? He was always an awesome guy, not sure how he got dragged into this...
Travis_Hudson wrote:
Tom did complain to the magazines......but rightfully so. there would be times they would just ride the other bikes and let the KTM sit. I witnessed...
Tom did complain to the magazines......but rightfully so. there would be times they would just ride the other bikes and let the KTM sit. I witnessed this first hand. They would be like "its gonna get last anyways". No bullshit.
BNG will do that.
milliebays
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milliebays 7/22/2018 3:46pm
7/22/2018 3:46pm Edited Date/Time 7/22/2018 3:47pm
jorgechavez wrote:
People win and lose in society everyday? I also disagree with what that guy on Main Event Moto was saying, he acted as if 10 -...
People win and lose in society everyday?

I also disagree with what that guy on Main Event Moto was saying, he acted as if 10 - 15 years ago people rode to be the very best rider they can be but apparently now people just want to have fun and enjoy their hobby?

Riding has always been about the fun for me, I just think people who grew up chasing the dream of being a pro have a skewed idea of why people ride.
aaryn #234 wrote:
Agree with that, There are many reasons why people ride and or race. I do it mainly for the fun, I am never winning a top...
Agree with that,

There are many reasons why people ride and or race.

I do it mainly for the fun, I am never winning a top class trophy in this life time, sure I have won a couple of C grade and Vet local club titles, but that was more to do with rocking up to every round, certainly not from winning the most or being the best in class.

I have spoken to a number of ex-pro level riders in Aus and ask why they don't just go out and ride for fun or race local events, most are the same. If they are going to race they know they will just go push 100% and it will be all about going out there to be the best. Its a different mind set to us average riders / racers.

Sure when I line up, i want to win, and no matter what I want to beat whoever it is in front of me on track, or keep the rider behind, behind, but normally that is for 10th place and back Smile

I find the excitement in the battle I am in on track no matter what position it is, others need that battle to be for first or a top three position to get that same excitement. Which to me explains B and C grade classes lol.

Seriously B and C grade classes in series or events where there are well under a full gate of riders in the top class are normally won by riders who could easily top ten in the grade above, but won't race unless the can win or have a chance of winning so they race a grade lower.
his point was that people don't race as much anymore. there are various valid reasons for this, like track time and cost. but you can't beat the skills and lessons that racing teaches.

it's happened in cycling too. noone wants to race anymore on the road. it's all gran fondos and gravel rides. XC MTB racing outside of the marathon stuff has declined since the 90s. enduro is the only thing that's strong, but that's basically a time trial, you're not racing head-to-head.

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