Time to end the 250 east and west in SX

Indy mxer
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10/22/2016 12:52pm
I hate that they still do this. And I get they want to give more privateers a shot.
But SX isn't big enough and there isn't enough talent to be able to split up a class of riders. This would be like Nascar splitting the Infinity series into east and west.
It would be so much more exciting if all the top 250 guys raced every weekend. Now, you have to wait to see some of the fastest guys until the series moves east.
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zehn
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10/22/2016 12:54pm Edited Date/Time 10/22/2016 12:55pm
"But SX isn't big enough and there isn't enough talent to be able to split up a class of riders"

And yet they do it every year with success... Pinch
Xeno
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10/22/2016 1:16pm
I totally disagree. It's a stepping-stone class to prepare racers for the big show.

Now, if they would tighten the production rules and establish a salary cap for the 250 class- that would be some good racing!
cameron96
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10/22/2016 2:18pm
Love the east west layout, Two different series to follow. One series is tight while the other is usually a run away

If they merged them and it was a run away it wouldn't be as good
ATKpilot99
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10/22/2016 2:22pm
I like it the way it is ..... but they need a chase format Wink

The Shop

10/22/2016 2:23pm
Xeno wrote:
I totally disagree. It's a stepping-stone class to prepare racers for the big show. Now, if they would tighten the production rules and establish a salary...
I totally disagree. It's a stepping-stone class to prepare racers for the big show.

Now, if they would tighten the production rules and establish a salary cap for the 250 class- that would be some good racing!
Spot on.

Add a 125 class at select rounds and you have perfection.
DL
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Menifee, CA US
10/22/2016 2:31pm
Xeno wrote:
I totally disagree. It's a stepping-stone class to prepare racers for the big show. Now, if they would tighten the production rules and establish a salary...
I totally disagree. It's a stepping-stone class to prepare racers for the big show.

Now, if they would tighten the production rules and establish a salary cap for the 250 class- that would be some good racing!
Spot on x2. The cost to build and maintain a competitive 250 is more than most of you could imagine. Add onto that a full race series........
ML512
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10/22/2016 2:41pm
Indy mxer wrote:
I hate that they still do this. And I get they want to give more privateers a shot. But SX isn't big enough and there isn't...
I hate that they still do this. And I get they want to give more privateers a shot.
But SX isn't big enough and there isn't enough talent to be able to split up a class of riders. This would be like Nascar splitting the Infinity series into east and west.
It would be so much more exciting if all the top 250 guys raced every weekend. Now, you have to wait to see some of the fastest guys until the series moves east.
I just had this conversation with someone this morning and I respectfully disagree. The costs of doing one series would be too much for a privateer on a 250 and secondly, you'd cost a bunch of riders their jobs. Without the need for a few riders on each coast, many top 250 riders would drop from the current 4-5 rider lineup, down to 3. Between Star, PC, Geico, TLD, etc... You'd chop around 5-7 factory level 250 rides, along with killing a few small "Coast only" 250 efforts such as Traders, BPRMX, Slaton, Stormlake Honda, etc.
10/22/2016 2:47pm
I would even go as far as to split it into 3 regions, tighten the rules, this would encourage smaller teams into the 250's,
or give a real privateer a chance.

Possible, give incentives to the now larger 250 teams to get into the main game.
RandyS
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10/22/2016 3:27pm Edited Date/Time 10/22/2016 3:28pm
One 250sx class, top 4 or 5 races count to get you to Vegas. Top 44 qualify, one night, winner take all. National points paid to all the main event riders in the final, 25 down to 1(20-22). Gives privateers more of a chance, teams can still run different riders each week, as long as they get their 4 or 5 races in.
zehn
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10/22/2016 3:35pm
RandyS wrote:
One 250sx class, top 4 or 5 races count to get you to Vegas. Top 44 qualify, one night, winner take all. National points paid to...
One 250sx class, top 4 or 5 races count to get you to Vegas. Top 44 qualify, one night, winner take all. National points paid to all the main event riders in the final, 25 down to 1(20-22). Gives privateers more of a chance, teams can still run different riders each week, as long as they get their 4 or 5 races in.
I... just.... ok
Indy mxer
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10/22/2016 3:35pm
Well, that's why this is called a forum. lol

I'm in the minority here. But I'm just a firm believer you put the best out there for every event. Or at a minimum, have a few east/west events during the season
But I do see your points on this.
RandyS
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10/22/2016 4:54pm Edited Date/Time 10/22/2016 5:02pm
RandyS wrote:
One 250sx class, top 4 or 5 races count to get you to Vegas. Top 44 qualify, one night, winner take all. National points paid to...
One 250sx class, top 4 or 5 races count to get you to Vegas. Top 44 qualify, one night, winner take all. National points paid to all the main event riders in the final, 25 down to 1(20-22). Gives privateers more of a chance, teams can still run different riders each week, as long as they get their 4 or 5 races in.
zehn wrote:
I... just.... ok
I didn't ask the question, or start anything about playoffs. I just threw out an idea. The main teams would run their guys at least half the rounds, maybe all but it would give small budget riders or teams a chance to pick a handful of rounds and still have a shot at contesting for the title however remote their odds may be. It might promote more regional teams knowing that you could run 4 or 5 races closest to your market and still have a shot at going to the big show. The national points would give the riders who are good at SX but don't do the nationals a chance at a number. Nascar playoffs are winner takes all, one race. What's the difference?
MotoX85
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Centralia, IL US
10/22/2016 5:03pm
Indy mxer wrote:
I hate that they still do this. And I get they want to give more privateers a shot. But SX isn't big enough and there isn't...
I hate that they still do this. And I get they want to give more privateers a shot.
But SX isn't big enough and there isn't enough talent to be able to split up a class of riders. This would be like Nascar splitting the Infinity series into east and west.
It would be so much more exciting if all the top 250 guys raced every weekend. Now, you have to wait to see some of the fastest guys until the series moves east.
ML512 wrote:
I just had this conversation with someone this morning and I respectfully disagree. The costs of doing one series would be too much for a privateer...
I just had this conversation with someone this morning and I respectfully disagree. The costs of doing one series would be too much for a privateer on a 250 and secondly, you'd cost a bunch of riders their jobs. Without the need for a few riders on each coast, many top 250 riders would drop from the current 4-5 rider lineup, down to 3. Between Star, PC, Geico, TLD, etc... You'd chop around 5-7 factory level 250 rides, along with killing a few small "Coast only" 250 efforts such as Traders, BPRMX, Slaton, Stormlake Honda, etc.
Totally agree, and why fix what isn't broken
Crush
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10/22/2016 5:06pm
It's not about the current privateers.

It's about the current pro 250 riders who would lose their rides and become privateers. Let alone their mechanics, team personnel, support staff, gear guys etc...

You're essentially saying lets make 22 less racing opportunities. That's crazy in a sport where there are already guys looking for rides.
kkawboy14
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10/22/2016 5:08pm
Xeno wrote:
I totally disagree. It's a stepping-stone class to prepare racers for the big show. Now, if they would tighten the production rules and establish a salary...
I totally disagree. It's a stepping-stone class to prepare racers for the big show.

Now, if they would tighten the production rules and establish a salary cap for the 250 class- that would be some good racing!
Stepping stone to where? Only 1 250 rider got a ride this year!
toomanykaws
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10/23/2016 6:17am Edited Date/Time 10/23/2016 6:18am
A 125cc east and west SX class. Two year max participation for a rider . A true entry level class. The 250f class. Keep east and west format. No point out or cap on years of participation allowed. What's wrong with allowing a career 250 rider? Doesn't seem fair to push them out of the sport and into non existent 450 spots.
TeamGreen
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10/23/2016 6:54am
Xeno wrote:
I totally disagree. It's a stepping-stone class to prepare racers for the big show. Now, if they would tighten the production rules and establish a salary...
I totally disagree. It's a stepping-stone class to prepare racers for the big show.

Now, if they would tighten the production rules and establish a salary cap for the 250 class- that would be some good racing!
I'm right there with Mr. Honda...uh, I mean Xeno.

I'll betcha that Mitch is of the same opinion, too.
downard254
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Bremen, OH US
10/23/2016 7:08am
What about a rule of no internal engine mods. Keep the price down that way. We have a local pro around here who tries to qualify for some of the area outdoor nationals and a few select tracks he will race a 450 as his normal 250 that has over $10,000 in the motor can't run with the factory bikes. Hmmmm.
kkawboy14
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10/23/2016 7:33am
30 rider main events would help everyone!
TXDirt
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10/23/2016 8:00am
It's a stepping stone of sorts. Definitely need to adjust the rules though so guys like Davalos can't stay in the class for 15 years.
MX Culture
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10/23/2016 8:29am
Time to end with the same post, over and over.
It's good as is and isn't changing.
Flip109
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10/23/2016 8:39am
TXDirt wrote:
It's a stepping stone of sorts. Definitely need to adjust the rules though so guys like Davalos can't stay in the class for 15 years.
This. If it's meant as a stepping stone class. Make it so.
10/23/2016 9:05am
Indy mxer wrote:
I hate that they still do this. And I get they want to give more privateers a shot. But SX isn't big enough and there isn't...
I hate that they still do this. And I get they want to give more privateers a shot.
But SX isn't big enough and there isn't enough talent to be able to split up a class of riders. This would be like Nascar splitting the Infinity series into east and west.
It would be so much more exciting if all the top 250 guys raced every weekend. Now, you have to wait to see some of the fastest guys until the series moves east.
ML512 wrote:
I just had this conversation with someone this morning and I respectfully disagree. The costs of doing one series would be too much for a privateer...
I just had this conversation with someone this morning and I respectfully disagree. The costs of doing one series would be too much for a privateer on a 250 and secondly, you'd cost a bunch of riders their jobs. Without the need for a few riders on each coast, many top 250 riders would drop from the current 4-5 rider lineup, down to 3. Between Star, PC, Geico, TLD, etc... You'd chop around 5-7 factory level 250 rides, along with killing a few small "Coast only" 250 efforts such as Traders, BPRMX, Slaton, Stormlake Honda, etc.
Agreed. Keep it how it is
lestat
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Piut RE
10/23/2016 11:30am
It depends on what the ultimate goal is . If it is to produce the best product possible (best racing) then eliminate the split . If the goal is industry job creation , then keep the split , or even , split it more .

When SX goes global , there will be some changes to the 250 class structure . East/West/local guys? That isnt going to work , so if it is global , it will have to be a single 250 series .

I think the days are numbered for privateers in SX anyway , so I am in favor of a single 450 series and a single 250 series .
ML512
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10/23/2016 11:33am
lestat wrote:
It depends on what the ultimate goal is . If it is to produce the best product possible (best racing) then eliminate the split . If...
It depends on what the ultimate goal is . If it is to produce the best product possible (best racing) then eliminate the split . If the goal is industry job creation , then keep the split , or even , split it more .

When SX goes global , there will be some changes to the 250 class structure . East/West/local guys? That isnt going to work , so if it is global , it will have to be a single 250 series .

I think the days are numbered for privateers in SX anyway , so I am in favor of a single 450 series and a single 250 series .
From what I've heard, not only will the 250 East/West series have no part in the global races, there may not be a 250 class at any of those rounds.
blusmbl
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10/23/2016 11:35am
downard254 wrote:
What about a rule of no internal engine mods. Keep the price down that way. We have a local pro around here who tries to qualify...
What about a rule of no internal engine mods. Keep the price down that way. We have a local pro around here who tries to qualify for some of the area outdoor nationals and a few select tracks he will race a 450 as his normal 250 that has over $10,000 in the motor can't run with the factory bikes. Hmmmm.
This is a pretty solid idea, actually. Nobody would ever agree to it, but it would certainly be a way to level the playing field with the 250's. It's done in several other motorsports disciplines.
SCR
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10/23/2016 11:59am
Having 16, 17 yr olds jumping in and doing 17 SX and 12 outdoors their fist year in pros seems a bit much. I like it split. Gives riders and sponsors with less resources a chance to compete in a full series.
lestat
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10/23/2016 12:04pm
lestat wrote:
It depends on what the ultimate goal is . If it is to produce the best product possible (best racing) then eliminate the split . If...
It depends on what the ultimate goal is . If it is to produce the best product possible (best racing) then eliminate the split . If the goal is industry job creation , then keep the split , or even , split it more .

When SX goes global , there will be some changes to the 250 class structure . East/West/local guys? That isnt going to work , so if it is global , it will have to be a single 250 series .

I think the days are numbered for privateers in SX anyway , so I am in favor of a single 450 series and a single 250 series .
ML512 wrote:
From what I've heard, not only will the 250 East/West series have no part in the global races, there may not be a 250 class at...
From what I've heard, not only will the 250 East/West series have no part in the global races, there may not be a 250 class at any of those rounds.
Well that makes sense from a logistics/expense perspective , but it comes with a cost to the quality of the product in the overseas races . Ticket sales may prove to be more difficult . Also leaves a big gap in the nightly program that will need to be filled somehow .

I still think a complete 250 series would be best .
TXDirt
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10/23/2016 12:08pm
I like the east/west format. I wish they would maybe have three rounds that were combined during the year. The championships are decided in Vegas so it makes that easy/west shootout very anticlimactic. Many of the top riders don't even race it or just give a half effort.
GangGreen
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10/23/2016 12:35pm
downard254 wrote:
What about a rule of no internal engine mods. Keep the price down that way. We have a local pro around here who tries to qualify...
What about a rule of no internal engine mods. Keep the price down that way. We have a local pro around here who tries to qualify for some of the area outdoor nationals and a few select tracks he will race a 450 as his normal 250 that has over $10,000 in the motor can't run with the factory bikes. Hmmmm.

Yet another unintended consequence of the ridiculous "Double Displacement Rule” kept in place in Pro Racing by MX Sports.
We’re making rules, and trying to fix things that were all brought on by the ill-thought “Double Displacement Rule”. Heck, isn’t there now an age rule for riding the 250F, which is the next step for 80cc riders. 125cc bikes NEED to be in this sport and the 250cc two-stroke platform is the best ever devised !!!!
Barry_Smith…………… They have a 125 Class, they just let 250cc four-strokes race in it.

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