Dylan Ferrandis is paid to win.

Nerd
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1/21/2020 10:56am
Jett Lawrence just now on Instagram:

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mx 219
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1/21/2020 11:07am Edited Date/Time 1/21/2020 11:08am
He was clearly faster, why make the pass there? Dumb move all around. I understand he is paid to win, so why did he make such a stupid move with about half of the race left? Probably could have passed Craig in about 3-4 turns and not lost a lot of time in the process.

If he doesn't make that move he catches Jett sooner, especially after Jett's tip over.
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Nerd
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1/21/2020 11:14am
mx 219 wrote:
He was clearly faster, why make the pass there? Dumb move all around. I understand he is paid to win, so why did he make such...
He was clearly faster, why make the pass there? Dumb move all around. I understand he is paid to win, so why did he make such a stupid move with about half of the race left? Probably could have passed Craig in about 3-4 turns and not lost a lot of time in the process.

If he doesn't make that move he catches Jett sooner, especially after Jett's tip over.
You can say it was rushed. You can say he should’ve waited. Those are opinions, but they have no bearing on this.

Apply that logic to Craig: “He was clearly slower. Why not check up in the corner and let Ferrandis by there? Dumb move all around. Ferrandis was going to pass him in 3-4 turns anyway, and then Craig would’ve had second place on the night instead of a DNF!”

See how this works?
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1/21/2020 11:14am
NateDawg wrote:
Lol, what the hell are you talking about? NFL players don't promote specific brands in the same way motocross riders do. No one believes that a...
Lol, what the hell are you talking about? NFL players don't promote specific brands in the same way motocross riders do. No one believes that a certain brand of helmet affects a football player's performance. The same cannot be said about motorcycle brands.
Nerd wrote:
The simple fact is that Christian Craig himself has done just as bad or worse. So have many other racers without being booed. If Craig did...
The simple fact is that Christian Craig himself has done just as bad or worse. So have many other racers without being booed.

If Craig did this to Ferrandis exactly the same, there would’ve been very few boos. The fans didn’t boo Ferrandis because he took Craig out. They booed him because he’s French, combined with the fact that the whole stadium—myself included—wanted Jett to win and was let down.

So what you’re really saying is “Factory teams shouldn’t hire French racers because fans don’t like the French”. And that’s asinine.
NateDawg wrote:
Bullshit. He wasn't booed for being French. If that were the case he'd be booed every time he got on the podium. He was only booed...
Bullshit. He wasn't booed for being French. If that were the case he'd be booed every time he got on the podium. He was only booed after he tried to justify his takeout on Craig. Seriously, go watch the interview. The crowd gave him a chance to own up to it and only booed him after he started making excuses. If he had gone up there like a man and admitted that he made an overly aggressive move then the backlash wouldn't have been nearly as severe.

It's the same thing as last year with Musquin. It wasn't just the fact that he took Tomac out, it was the fact that he didn't own up to it on the podium that pissed everybody off. If you're going to make a move like that you should be a man and own up to it.
YUP! Man up and own it and the fans will react differently.
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crusty_xx
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1/21/2020 11:15am
Nerd wrote:
Jett Lawrence just now on Instagram: [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/21/399492/s1200_17E95E00_144C_4650_AE76_53050648BF3B.jpg[/img]
Jett Lawrence just now on Instagram:

Yeah but what does he know?
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TXDirt
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1/21/2020 11:27am Edited Date/Time 1/21/2020 12:58pm
If you look at the pictures, DF is taking the line away after both riders already cleared the corner. they are no longer even turning at all. Especially that JL photo. He’s cleared the corner. DF chops the corner and cuts right into JL who’s already exited the corner and is now going in a straight line.

For that reason I would consider these both very aggressive passes. Which is 100% okay in my book. This is professional racing. But if I was one of the other riders you can bet I would put DF on his butt next chance I had.

The other pictures posted in this thread show riders taking the line away while both are still cornering. That’s not even really aggressive. It’s racing.

Taking the line away after rider has completely exited the corner and is basically upright going straight is a lot different.

DF is great at dishing it out. Which I love. I sure hope he can take it back when it’s his turn and he’s on the ground after the same pass.
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mx 219
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1/21/2020 11:29am Edited Date/Time 1/21/2020 11:32am
mx 219 wrote:
He was clearly faster, why make the pass there? Dumb move all around. I understand he is paid to win, so why did he make such...
He was clearly faster, why make the pass there? Dumb move all around. I understand he is paid to win, so why did he make such a stupid move with about half of the race left? Probably could have passed Craig in about 3-4 turns and not lost a lot of time in the process.

If he doesn't make that move he catches Jett sooner, especially after Jett's tip over.
Nerd wrote:
You can say it was rushed. You can say he should’ve waited. Those are opinions, but they have no bearing on this. Apply that logic to...
You can say it was rushed. You can say he should’ve waited. Those are opinions, but they have no bearing on this.

Apply that logic to Craig: “He was clearly slower. Why not check up in the corner and let Ferrandis by there? Dumb move all around. Ferrandis was going to pass him in 3-4 turns anyway, and then Craig would’ve had second place on the night instead of a DNF!”

See how this works?
There is one difference. When you are getting passed you typically don't pull over for someone to just pass you. I know some racers do that today. or it certainly looks like it at times.

I stand behind my opinion. Faster, than make the pass happen, but that wasn't the place to make that pass. If you don't win you still beat your championship competitors. Right now points and championships are more important than race wins. What happens if he breaks something on that crash? What if his bike has the bent bars?

Think long-term.

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1/21/2020 11:32am
TXDirt wrote:
If you look at the pictures, DF is taking the line away after both riders already cleared the corner. they are no longer even turning at...
If you look at the pictures, DF is taking the line away after both riders already cleared the corner. they are no longer even turning at all. Especially that JL photo. He’s cleared the corner. DF chops the corner and cuts right into JL who’s already exited the corner and is now going in a straight line.

For that reason I would consider these both very aggressive passes. Which is 100% okay in my book. This is professional racing. But if I was one of the other riders you can bet I would put DF on his butt next chance I had.

The other pictures posted in this thread show riders taking the line away while both are still cornering. That’s not even really aggressive. It’s racing.

Taking the line away after rider has completely exited the corner and is basically upright going straight is a lot different.

DF is great at dishing it out. Which I love. I sure hope he can take it back when it’s his turn and he’s on the ground after the same pass.
Cornering happens immediately before and after the corner, too.

The point is that Craig saw him coming and knew what he was risking by staying on the gas. He blew it. “Taking a line away” doesn’t mean you get to the spot *and then* the other rider has to shut off. Racers are expected to anticipate what is going to happen before it does. The line was in the process of being taken away when Craig was mid-corner, and he should’ve seen/known it (and probably did). He chose to try and race past the intersection to hold his spot instead of chop the throttle, and that’s why they hit, and why Craig DNF’d instead of finishing on the podium.
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Momus
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1/21/2020 11:34am
crusty_xx wrote:
Yeah but what does he know?
I'll tell you what he knows.

After beating DF in the heat race and gapping him convincingly in the final he knows that he is faster head to head.
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Nerd
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1/21/2020 11:36am
mx 219 wrote:
There is one difference. When you are getting passed you typically don't pull over for someone to just pass you. I know some racers do that...
There is one difference. When you are getting passed you typically don't pull over for someone to just pass you. I know some racers do that today. or it certainly looks like it at times.

I stand behind my opinion. Faster, than make the pass happen, but that wasn't the place to make that pass. If you don't win you still beat your championship competitors. Right now points and championships are more important than race wins. What happens if he breaks something on that crash? What if his bike has the bent bars?

Think long-term.

BS. When a faster racer catches you and then takes the inside from you in a line that converged with yours, 99% of the time, the racer on the outside checks up and tries to square it up under the racer trying to make the pass. That’s normal behavior.

Pinning it on the outside is also a choice some racers make on occasion, but that’s a big risk that *they* are taking. The crash, if there is one, is on the person taking that risk.
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devindavisphoto
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1/21/2020 11:36am
Momus wrote:
I'll tell you what he knows. After beating DF in the heat race and gapping him convincingly in the final he knows that he is faster...
I'll tell you what he knows.

After beating DF in the heat race and gapping him convincingly in the final he knows that he is faster head to head.
The "what does he know?" comment was sarcasm.
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borg
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1/21/2020 2:56pm
borg wrote:
I would say that if the inside rider hits the outsider between the wheels like Nerd said, it's a t-bone and should be penalized. If the...
I would say that if the inside rider hits the outsider between the wheels like Nerd said, it's a t-bone and should be penalized. If the insider's front wheel makes it past the ousider's before contact, good pass, outsider needs to brake. This was not a clear case. AMA thought it was closer to a t-bone.
My own opinion is that Ferrandis slightly misjudged the situation but I only saw it once.
kkawboy14 wrote:
The reason CC flipped was because CCs backwheel ran over DFs backwheel. By your logic DF had passed him!
Nerd wrote:
If Craig’s back wheel ran over Ferrandis’s back wheel, Ferrandis was in front of Craig...
I really only saw it once. By now there are some really good shots where it's easier to tell if it was a good pass. Ferrandis thinks he fucked up there or at least his GF says that he does. I'll check out some more views.
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1/21/2020 2:59pm Edited Date/Time 1/21/2020 3:05pm
NvHermit wrote:
This is exactly where Dylan popped out of the rut altering his line
Nerd wrote:
Ruts help racers corner faster. They are not considered any sort of boundary.
Where did I say they are ?
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1/21/2020 3:38pm
NvHermit wrote:
This is exactly where Dylan popped out of the rut altering his line
Nerd wrote:
Ruts help racers corner faster. They are not considered any sort of boundary.
NvHermit wrote:
Where did I say they are ?
He may have been here but when DF's rear wheel slid out into Craig he was not in front.
I'll go with what both riders said about it. I'm glad they're not as fucked in head as some SC fans. Not referring to anyone in this thread.
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1/21/2020 3:41pm Edited Date/Time 1/21/2020 3:44pm
I love Dylans desire to win, he didn't plan to take out Craig.
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RG1
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1/21/2020 3:53pm
Nerd wrote:
The simple fact is that Christian Craig himself has done just as bad or worse. So have many other racers without being booed. If Craig did...
The simple fact is that Christian Craig himself has done just as bad or worse. So have many other racers without being booed.

If Craig did this to Ferrandis exactly the same, there would’ve been very few boos. The fans didn’t boo Ferrandis because he took Craig out. They booed him because he’s French, combined with the fact that the whole stadium—myself included—wanted Jett to win and was let down.

So what you’re really saying is “Factory teams shouldn’t hire French racers because fans don’t like the French”. And that’s asinine.
NateDawg wrote:
Bullshit. He wasn't booed for being French. If that were the case he'd be booed every time he got on the podium. He was only booed...
Bullshit. He wasn't booed for being French. If that were the case he'd be booed every time he got on the podium. He was only booed after he tried to justify his takeout on Craig. Seriously, go watch the interview. The crowd gave him a chance to own up to it and only booed him after he started making excuses. If he had gone up there like a man and admitted that he made an overly aggressive move then the backlash wouldn't have been nearly as severe.

It's the same thing as last year with Musquin. It wasn't just the fact that he took Tomac out, it was the fact that he didn't own up to it on the podium that pissed everybody off. If you're going to make a move like that you should be a man and own up to it.
YUP! Man up and own it and the fans will react differently.
He didn’t even have time to own it. The boos were so loud I doubt anyone in the stadium even heard what he had to say
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bents
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1/21/2020 3:57pm
Big fan of Jett after that post. Good job young man. Lets go racing!
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oldblood
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1/21/2020 4:48pm
NvHermit wrote:
I love Dylans desire to win, he didn't plan to take out Craig.
What? If he says "he'll yes I was trying to take him out, but I screwed up and took myself out also ", and owns it like a man, then I'm okay with it. But if he says some weak ass shit like, "I didn't mean to take him out ", then he needs cleaned out in the next round.
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jemcee
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1/21/2020 4:52pm
RG1 wrote:
He didn’t even have time to own it. The boos were so loud I doubt anyone in the stadium even heard what he had to say
Haha "Hold up guys let's just hear what he says about it first" haha what complete bullshit
Also very ironic they're not owning up to why they were booing
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oldblood
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1/21/2020 5:00pm
Did Bradshaw or Mataisevich ever say I didn't mean to take him out? Own it.
1/21/2020 5:46pm
NateDawg wrote:
Bullshit. He wasn't booed for being French. If that were the case he'd be booed every time he got on the podium. He was only booed...
Bullshit. He wasn't booed for being French. If that were the case he'd be booed every time he got on the podium. He was only booed after he tried to justify his takeout on Craig. Seriously, go watch the interview. The crowd gave him a chance to own up to it and only booed him after he started making excuses. If he had gone up there like a man and admitted that he made an overly aggressive move then the backlash wouldn't have been nearly as severe.

It's the same thing as last year with Musquin. It wasn't just the fact that he took Tomac out, it was the fact that he didn't own up to it on the podium that pissed everybody off. If you're going to make a move like that you should be a man and own up to it.
YUP! Man up and own it and the fans will react differently.
RG1 wrote:
He didn’t even have time to own it. The boos were so loud I doubt anyone in the stadium even heard what he had to say
He didn't own it in the press conference either.
Nerd
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1/21/2020 5:51pm
He didn't own it in the press conference either.
How dare him refuse to own a thing where he did nothing wrong.
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GuyB
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1/21/2020 6:04pm
Nerd wrote:
How dare him refuse to own a thing where he did nothing wrong.
Steve, you're trying to win the Internet again...
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oldblood
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1/21/2020 6:09pm
Nerd wrote:
How dare him refuse to own a thing where he did nothing wrong.
GuyB wrote:
Steve, you're trying to win the Internet again...
I've appreciated his posts, as always. All good here.
Now if Matthes would post then it would be interesting.
Nerd
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1/21/2020 6:11pm
Nerd wrote:
How dare him refuse to own a thing where he did nothing wrong.
GuyB wrote:
Steve, you're trying to win the Internet again...
If we allow this sort of biased officiating and race-fan xenophobia to take hold, this sport is done. Officiating has to be objective, and snowflake fans need to be ignored.

If the AMA penalized others at least equally for worse things they've definitely done (Craig got last gate pick that night for practically murdering Alex Martin, for example) that would be one thing, but Ferrandis took an open door that Craig opened for him and Craig refused to let off. And then they penalized Ferrandis!

Craig: 2 bad choices. Ferrandis: 0 (or maybe 1, but I think 0) bad choices. But penalize Ferrandis?

C'mon. These guys have to be allowed to race. And we shouldn't encourage racers to pin it into people who are block-passing them like this. That's a very bad idea.
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magnetrax
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1/21/2020 8:53pm
I agree with the op and would add.

Incidents involving injury and cutting of the track should automatically trigger a review and possible sanctions. Beyond that..... death cross. This would keep the action on the track, without the chilling effect of ambiguous sanctions based on opinions of agressive riding.
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bvm111
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1/21/2020 9:14pm
Dude let it go

No one is arguing with you anymore and we are tired of you dragging this out 2 days longer than it needed to be. Christians wife and Jett have agreed with you... you won the internet this week, congratulations!

Even Jeffro has been trying to talk you off the ledge the past 24 hours and that is saying something!

Just let it go
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Nerd
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1/22/2020 7:59am
magnetrax wrote:
I agree with the op and would add. Incidents involving injury and cutting of the track should automatically trigger a review and possible sanctions. Beyond that...
I agree with the op and would add.

Incidents involving injury and cutting of the track should automatically trigger a review and possible sanctions. Beyond that..... death cross. This would keep the action on the track, without the chilling effect of ambiguous sanctions based on opinions of agressive riding.
Agreed.
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Nerd
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1/22/2020 8:00am
bvm111 wrote:
Dude let it go No one is arguing with you anymore and we are tired of you dragging this out 2 days longer than it needed...
Dude let it go

No one is arguing with you anymore and we are tired of you dragging this out 2 days longer than it needed to be. Christians wife and Jett have agreed with you... you won the internet this week, congratulations!

Even Jeffro has been trying to talk you off the ledge the past 24 hours and that is saying something!

Just let it go
No.

And fuck Jeffro.
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GuyB
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1/22/2020 8:27am
Nerd wrote:
No.

And fuck Jeffro.
Steve, knock it off. And no, we’re not debating this all the way to/from Glendale.

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