Dylan Ferrandis is paid to win.

Nerd
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1/20/2020 10:32pm
SCR wrote:
He was way short of tacking the line away or controlling the track. He rode his bike right underneath the side of Craigs bike. How the...
He was way short of tacking the line away or controlling the track. He rode his bike right underneath the side of Craigs bike. How the hell could he of been in front of him
Bad move. 100% Dylans fault. And 100% he should
Expect the same back as part of the checks and balances of racing. That's how it goes no need for penalties really.
Another person who thinks Ferrandis put his bike under Craig’s bike. WTF?

You guys should actually ride a motorcycle sometime. I think it helps a lot in understanding motorcycle racing.
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bvm111
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1/20/2020 10:49pm
You must really be celebrating MLK day, good on ya... but I've learned a long time ago posting under the influence never turns out well!
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Nerd
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1/20/2020 11:19pm
bvm111 wrote:
You must really be celebrating MLK day, good on ya... but I've learned a long time ago posting under the influence never turns out well!
Nobody’s altered on my end.
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Nerd
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1/20/2020 11:29pm
For the uninitiated, who seem to be confused, maybe I can help:

It seems like we’ve lost track of basic motocross etiquette. People seem to think you can leave a door wide open and it’s “not fair” for the (faster) guy behind you to try and go through that door.

Bullshit. It’s their *job* to go through that open door! It’s *your* job not to open it! Don’t leave the door open! And if you do, don’t act surprised when someone goes through that open door!

That’s how moto works! It’s simple, consistent, and historically accurate as well! This is how everybody has always judged cases of motocross etiquette, and that’s what this Ferrandis/Craig incident really is. It’s about etiquette. Who has the right of way? The rider in front! For how long? There’s no minimum time. Whoever is ahead at the precise moment that a bad thing happens has the right to be wherever they are on the track *because* they’re ahead of the other person (as long as they are on the track).

Be aware of who’s in front and behind you, and act accordingly! If you do not act accordingly, it’s not up to anybody *else* to change racing etiquette so that the person who left the door open is absolved of all responsibility for their own actions! If you leave the door open when you know a faster rider is right on your ass, you fucked up! It’s that simple!

So, whoever’s wheel is behind when the two bikes hit, they’re the one who is at fault for whatever negative consequences result from the collision. Because either they tried to go through a door that wasn’t open enough, or they let someone through their open door and then tried to close the door on them after it was too late.

This is how it works and has always worked.
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The Shop

Nerd
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1/20/2020 11:44pm
Nerd wrote:
The guy in front controls the track. Who’s in front? [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/20/399368/s1200_2957F7F2_2452_47FE_B111_125FC8F16D77.jpg[/img]
The guy in front controls the track.

Who’s in front?
jeffro503 wrote:
Jesus Nerd...........that pic is literally like a 100th of a second type pic , that if you rewound it about 1/2 sec......Christian would of been ahead...
Jesus Nerd...........that pic is literally like a 100th of a second type pic , that if you rewound it about 1/2 sec......Christian would of been ahead a full bike length. How fast do you think these guys can react to something like that? Again , for like the 3rd time......Dylan even said he fucked up and came in way to hot. For Christ's sake , have fun arguing with yourself man. I'm out.
Crush wrote:
Using photos for evidence when they're going different speeds and accelerating at a different rate is problematic for sure... and perspective also plays a part there...
Using photos for evidence when they're going different speeds and accelerating at a different rate is problematic for sure... and perspective also plays a part there.... if the photographer is 10 metres to the right, a different story is being told.
The photographer is definitely not standing on the track. He’s at least perpendicular to that spot where they hit, or he’s already a little farther to the right. Dylan Ferrandis is ahead before they hit.
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Robgvx
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1/21/2020 12:58am
Nerd wrote:
For the uninitiated, who seem to be confused, maybe I can help: It seems like we’ve lost track of basic motocross etiquette. People seem to think...
For the uninitiated, who seem to be confused, maybe I can help:

It seems like we’ve lost track of basic motocross etiquette. People seem to think you can leave a door wide open and it’s “not fair” for the (faster) guy behind you to try and go through that door.

Bullshit. It’s their *job* to go through that open door! It’s *your* job not to open it! Don’t leave the door open! And if you do, don’t act surprised when someone goes through that open door!

That’s how moto works! It’s simple, consistent, and historically accurate as well! This is how everybody has always judged cases of motocross etiquette, and that’s what this Ferrandis/Craig incident really is. It’s about etiquette. Who has the right of way? The rider in front! For how long? There’s no minimum time. Whoever is ahead at the precise moment that a bad thing happens has the right to be wherever they are on the track *because* they’re ahead of the other person (as long as they are on the track).

Be aware of who’s in front and behind you, and act accordingly! If you do not act accordingly, it’s not up to anybody *else* to change racing etiquette so that the person who left the door open is absolved of all responsibility for their own actions! If you leave the door open when you know a faster rider is right on your ass, you fucked up! It’s that simple!

So, whoever’s wheel is behind when the two bikes hit, they’re the one who is at fault for whatever negative consequences result from the collision. Because either they tried to go through a door that wasn’t open enough, or they let someone through their open door and then tried to close the door on them after it was too late.

This is how it works and has always worked.
Welcome back Steve.

Totally agree with you.

If this scenario could be re-run I wonder whether Craig would back off this time?
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Robgvx
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1/21/2020 1:04am
Nerd wrote:
For the uninitiated, who seem to be confused, maybe I can help: It seems like we’ve lost track of basic motocross etiquette. People seem to think...
For the uninitiated, who seem to be confused, maybe I can help:

It seems like we’ve lost track of basic motocross etiquette. People seem to think you can leave a door wide open and it’s “not fair” for the (faster) guy behind you to try and go through that door.

Bullshit. It’s their *job* to go through that open door! It’s *your* job not to open it! Don’t leave the door open! And if you do, don’t act surprised when someone goes through that open door!

That’s how moto works! It’s simple, consistent, and historically accurate as well! This is how everybody has always judged cases of motocross etiquette, and that’s what this Ferrandis/Craig incident really is. It’s about etiquette. Who has the right of way? The rider in front! For how long? There’s no minimum time. Whoever is ahead at the precise moment that a bad thing happens has the right to be wherever they are on the track *because* they’re ahead of the other person (as long as they are on the track).

Be aware of who’s in front and behind you, and act accordingly! If you do not act accordingly, it’s not up to anybody *else* to change racing etiquette so that the person who left the door open is absolved of all responsibility for their own actions! If you leave the door open when you know a faster rider is right on your ass, you fucked up! It’s that simple!

So, whoever’s wheel is behind when the two bikes hit, they’re the one who is at fault for whatever negative consequences result from the collision. Because either they tried to go through a door that wasn’t open enough, or they let someone through their open door and then tried to close the door on them after it was too late.

This is how it works and has always worked.
Robgvx wrote:
Welcome back Steve.

Totally agree with you.

If this scenario could be re-run I wonder whether Craig would back off this time?

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ledger
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1/21/2020 1:07am
jeffro503 wrote:
Jesus Nerd...........that pic is literally like a 100th of a second type pic , that if you rewound it about 1/2 sec......Christian would of been ahead...
Jesus Nerd...........that pic is literally like a 100th of a second type pic , that if you rewound it about 1/2 sec......Christian would of been ahead a full bike length. How fast do you think these guys can react to something like that? Again , for like the 3rd time......Dylan even said he fucked up and came in way to hot. For Christ's sake , have fun arguing with yourself man. I'm out.
Crush wrote:
Using photos for evidence when they're going different speeds and accelerating at a different rate is problematic for sure... and perspective also plays a part there...
Using photos for evidence when they're going different speeds and accelerating at a different rate is problematic for sure... and perspective also plays a part there.... if the photographer is 10 metres to the right, a different story is being told.
Nerd wrote:
The photographer is definitely not standing on the track. He’s at least perpendicular to that spot where they hit, or he’s already a little farther to...
The photographer is definitely not standing on the track. He’s at least perpendicular to that spot where they hit, or he’s already a little farther to the right. Dylan Ferrandis is ahead before they hit.
Now it's the photographer's fault, the fan's fault, everyone that doesn't see things your way is at fault. You gotta be the life of your own party. You're funny though. Don't forget...you are a Winner. Goodnight...
CPR
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1/21/2020 1:33am Edited Date/Time 1/21/2020 1:36am
No question that coming through the apex of the corner, DF was far enough in front of CC for Craig to see him. He chose to not back off.
Was DF's dive reckless? Yes.
Did CC also make a poor choice? Yes.
Did the two lines, no make that three, in that corner come together all night? Yes.
So two professional riders decide to go for it in a corner with only one exit line and they both go down. Shock, horror, racing incident. Get over it, it was an awesome race, bring on the next round!

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CPR
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1/21/2020 1:35am
Fucken very entertaining thread though, thanks Nerd.
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FIREfish148
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1/21/2020 4:58am
How about an angle on jett’s run in on the face of the triple with Dylan? That was greasy
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brocster
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1/21/2020 5:53am
borg wrote:
I would say that if the inside rider hits the outsider between the wheels like Nerd said, it's a t-bone and should be penalized. If the...
I would say that if the inside rider hits the outsider between the wheels like Nerd said, it's a t-bone and should be penalized. If the insider's front wheel makes it past the ousider's before contact, good pass, outsider needs to brake. This was not a clear case. AMA thought it was closer to a t-bone.
My own opinion is that Ferrandis slightly misjudged the situation but I only saw it once.
kkawboy14 wrote:
The reason CC flipped was because CCs backwheel ran over DFs backwheel. By your logic DF had passed him!
Nerd wrote:
If Craig’s back wheel ran over Ferrandis’s back wheel, Ferrandis was in front of Craig...
If Craig was not there to use as a backstop. Ferrandis takes the line he took, Never!
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racin mason
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1/21/2020 7:14am
If you take last weeks "Friese is dangerous " thread into account, Craig is at fault.Last weeks sentiment was" If a faster rider comes up behind you ,you must just let them by,and not put up any fight".
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NvHermit
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1/21/2020 7:43am
jeffro503 wrote:
The mistake is here " and I wanted to pass on the inside, and he just didn’t hear me or see me... From what I’ve seen...
The mistake is here " and I wanted to pass on the inside, and he just didn’t hear me or see me... From what I’ve seen on the pictures, I slid and I think I crashed before we touched... And I made him crash "

You are behind someone , you gauge their speed and where it's safe to pass. He didn't.....which was a mistake. The guy in front , has no idea what the guy behind is thinking.....how would he? This is what I'm trying to say. Dylan made a mistake on his plan of attack and how he was going to make a pass. He obviously had more pace then Christian did , and he should have planned the pass a little better then he did. BUT.....Christian should have also not let the door wide open like that. In the race night thread , I was actually in there defending Dylan's move , and also all the stupid hatred coming his way. I think it was a mistake by both rider's , more of it falling on Dylan though. If you are following , it's up to you how to get by clean , not the guy in front.
Nerd wrote:
The guy in front controls the track. Who’s in front? [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/20/399368/s1200_2957F7F2_2452_47FE_B111_125FC8F16D77.jpg[/img]
The guy in front controls the track.

Who’s in front?
This is exactly where Dylan popped out of the rut altering his line
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1/21/2020 7:52am
That move was made by lots of different riders at many different times through the night. The difference with this one is the rider getting passed didn't want to admit he was slower and decided to giver rather than back down. Architect of his own demise.
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1/21/2020 8:28am
Crush wrote:
How many times have you seen riders dive up the inside to a roller exiting a corner, and back out?? It's a pretty regular occurrence, because...
How many times have you seen riders dive up the inside to a roller exiting a corner, and back out?? It's a pretty regular occurrence, because most understand if it's not 100% there, an impact could be devastating... AND in general, if it's not there, it's better to take stock and go again. They both went down after all.

And taking the line away – should be just that. Not just causing contact in a 50/50.

Again, not against rough riding, but carelessness towards other competitors shouldn't be dismissed as fine just because 'this is sx you pussies'...
Nerd wrote:
When someone takes your line away and you stay on the gas anyway, the contact is your fault, not theirs. The right of way goes to...
When someone takes your line away and you stay on the gas anyway, the contact is your fault, not theirs. The right of way goes to the guy in front!

WTF?! Have any of you guys ever actually raced motocross?
I'm 43 years old and have raced for 33 of those years and that's the first time I've ever heard the term "right of way" in relation to racing motorcycles. I had a mental image of red and white triangle signs on MX/SX tracks and had a good laugh.
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seth505
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1/21/2020 8:50am
Hey, anyone have a personal opinion on Ferrandis this week? Please make a new post and let us know what you think, thanks in advance! We can't have enough of these, really, no, for sure, it's great content...
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Nerd
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1/21/2020 9:03am
CPR wrote:
No question that coming through the apex of the corner, DF was far enough in front of CC for Craig to see him. He chose to...
No question that coming through the apex of the corner, DF was far enough in front of CC for Craig to see him. He chose to not back off.
Was DF's dive reckless? Yes.
Did CC also make a poor choice? Yes.
Did the two lines, no make that three, in that corner come together all night? Yes.
So two professional riders decide to go for it in a corner with only one exit line and they both go down. Shock, horror, racing incident. Get over it, it was an awesome race, bring on the next round!

Yes. 100%
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Nerd
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1/21/2020 9:05am
NvHermit wrote:
This is exactly where Dylan popped out of the rut altering his line
Ruts help racers corner faster. They are not considered any sort of boundary.
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Ingjr1
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1/21/2020 9:06am
Karma is a bitch. I'm saying this is probably going to cost Ferrandis the championship from a retaliation move. I'm for anyone but Ferrandis.
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NateDawg
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1/21/2020 9:41am
Actually, Ferrandis is paid to promote motorcycle brands. The best way to do this is to win. A bad way to do this is to piss off the entire stadium of fans to the point where they are rooting against you for the rest of your career. That's not the kind of publicity his employers are looking for.
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Nerd
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1/21/2020 9:47am
NateDawg wrote:
Actually, Ferrandis is paid to promote motorcycle brands. The best way to do this is to win. A bad way to do this is to piss...
Actually, Ferrandis is paid to promote motorcycle brands. The best way to do this is to win. A bad way to do this is to piss off the entire stadium of fans to the point where they are rooting against you for the rest of your career. That's not the kind of publicity his employers are looking for.
If 35,000 snowflakes get in your way, you get a shovel and clear them out. These are not Yamaha customers any more than NFL fans are customers for Riddell.
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SigPig
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1/21/2020 9:50am
Block passes have been a part of racing for a while. There might be a T-Bone tossed in below for those that can spot the difference.







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Nerd
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1/21/2020 9:54am Edited Date/Time 1/21/2020 9:55am
SigPig wrote:
Block passes have been a part of racing for a while. There might be a T-Bone tossed in below for those that can spot the difference...
Block passes have been a part of racing for a while. There might be a T-Bone tossed in below for those that can spot the difference.







Alessi/Stewart = T-bone
Osborne/Savatgy is close to a T-bone, too, since he’s moving Savatgy when Savatgy is still ahead of him.

The rest are fair game.
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Momus
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1/21/2020 9:57am Edited Date/Time 1/21/2020 10:01am
Ingjr1 wrote:
Karma is a bitch. I'm saying this is probably going to cost Ferrandis the championship from a retaliation move. I'm for anyone but Ferrandis.
I'm sure the retribution aspect would have been discussed in the AMA trailer and CC will have it uppermost in his mind.

He, and the team, seems unconcerned anyway.
NateDawg
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1/21/2020 9:58am
NateDawg wrote:
Actually, Ferrandis is paid to promote motorcycle brands. The best way to do this is to win. A bad way to do this is to piss...
Actually, Ferrandis is paid to promote motorcycle brands. The best way to do this is to win. A bad way to do this is to piss off the entire stadium of fans to the point where they are rooting against you for the rest of your career. That's not the kind of publicity his employers are looking for.
Nerd wrote:
If 35,000 snowflakes get in your way, you get a shovel and clear them out. These are not Yamaha customers any more than NFL fans are...
If 35,000 snowflakes get in your way, you get a shovel and clear them out. These are not Yamaha customers any more than NFL fans are customers for Riddell.
Lol, what the hell are you talking about? NFL players don't promote specific brands in the same way motocross riders do. No one believes that a certain brand of helmet affects a football player's performance. The same cannot be said about motorcycle brands.
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Nerd
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1/21/2020 10:04am
NateDawg wrote:
Lol, what the hell are you talking about? NFL players don't promote specific brands in the same way motocross riders do. No one believes that a...
Lol, what the hell are you talking about? NFL players don't promote specific brands in the same way motocross riders do. No one believes that a certain brand of helmet affects a football player's performance. The same cannot be said about motorcycle brands.
The simple fact is that Christian Craig himself has done just as bad or worse. So have many other racers without being booed.

If Craig did this to Ferrandis exactly the same, there would’ve been very few boos. The fans didn’t boo Ferrandis because he took Craig out. They booed him because he’s French, combined with the fact that the whole stadium—myself included—wanted Jett to win and was let down.

So what you’re really saying is “Factory teams shouldn’t hire French racers because fans don’t like the French”. And that’s asinine.
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NateDawg
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1/21/2020 10:37am
NateDawg wrote:
Lol, what the hell are you talking about? NFL players don't promote specific brands in the same way motocross riders do. No one believes that a...
Lol, what the hell are you talking about? NFL players don't promote specific brands in the same way motocross riders do. No one believes that a certain brand of helmet affects a football player's performance. The same cannot be said about motorcycle brands.
Nerd wrote:
The simple fact is that Christian Craig himself has done just as bad or worse. So have many other racers without being booed. If Craig did...
The simple fact is that Christian Craig himself has done just as bad or worse. So have many other racers without being booed.

If Craig did this to Ferrandis exactly the same, there would’ve been very few boos. The fans didn’t boo Ferrandis because he took Craig out. They booed him because he’s French, combined with the fact that the whole stadium—myself included—wanted Jett to win and was let down.

So what you’re really saying is “Factory teams shouldn’t hire French racers because fans don’t like the French”. And that’s asinine.
Bullshit. He wasn't booed for being French. If that were the case he'd be booed every time he got on the podium. He was only booed after he tried to justify his takeout on Craig. Seriously, go watch the interview. The crowd gave him a chance to own up to it and only booed him after he started making excuses. If he had gone up there like a man and admitted that he made an overly aggressive move then the backlash wouldn't have been nearly as severe.

It's the same thing as last year with Musquin. It wasn't just the fact that he took Tomac out, it was the fact that he didn't own up to it on the podium that pissed everybody off. If you're going to make a move like that you should be a man and own up to it.
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Nerd
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1/21/2020 10:50am
NateDawg wrote:
Bullshit. He wasn't booed for being French. If that were the case he'd be booed every time he got on the podium. He was only booed...
Bullshit. He wasn't booed for being French. If that were the case he'd be booed every time he got on the podium. He was only booed after he tried to justify his takeout on Craig. Seriously, go watch the interview. The crowd gave him a chance to own up to it and only booed him after he started making excuses. If he had gone up there like a man and admitted that he made an overly aggressive move then the backlash wouldn't have been nearly as severe.

It's the same thing as last year with Musquin. It wasn't just the fact that he took Tomac out, it was the fact that he didn't own up to it on the podium that pissed everybody off. If you're going to make a move like that you should be a man and own up to it.
You’ve been around long enough to know what you just said is nonsense. If you won’t admit it, there’s no point in further discussing this with you.

If Jett still won, there would’ve been far fewer boos. If Craig did the same thing to Ferrandis instead, far fewer boos.

The boos were due to a combination of his being a French and Jett losing.
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