The state of MX now

Related:
Create New Tag

10/10/2017 8:36 PM

Ricky is gone, Villo is gone, James is as good as gone, reed is on his way out, canard is gone, and now with Dungey out the obvious question remains. What’s next for ama racing? I know Eli is really quick as is Roczen. I haven’t followed the sport too closely lately but who do we have that’s really going to come up and be a superstar? Adam? At this point it seems unlikely. What do you guys think?

|

10/10/2017 10:07 PM

A couple of the young 250 guys will make the step. There's normally a quick transition from contender to star. A 250 guy will go from a podium/top 5 guy, to race winner, to title contender in a 3 year span.

Transition to 450s is normally a similar 3 year transition. With most 450 SX titles coming in years 2 or 3. So expect Webb to take the step this year to race winner and title threat, while Marvin moves to a title threat in his 3rd 450 year.

This year is a transition year with Dungey retiring. And with Reed being the only remaining 450 Supercross champ in the field expected to race. So there will be a rush to fill that void. Eli may be the favorite on paper, but he doesn't have the invincibility that Villopto or Dungey had for the past 8 seasons. Or Stew/Reed/RC/MC had from 93-09.

In 2019 when a couple of the current top 250 guys move up to the 450s we might see a rapid shift like we saw in 2010 when everyone would have bet that Stewart and Reed were the title favorites after dominating 07,08,09. But the title came down to the rookie Dungey and 2nd year 450 Villopoto and besides a resurgence in 2011 Reed and Stewart have not been title threats since.

One of the biggest shifts in popularity/star power was the 1990 season. The rookies of Bradshaw, Chicken, Larry Ward, Kiedrowski, Larocco, JMB all came in ready to win, the vets were in transistion with Rick Johnson coming off his wrist injury and never regaining the speed he had, Jeff Ward a couple years removed from his 87 title and still a race winner and title threat, Johnny O'Mara close to retirement and Jeff Stanton the reigning champ all were threats for the title and race wins. That shift only lasted 3 seasons before McGrath showed up and dominated the next 7 of 8 seasons.

If they didn't change the 250 point out rule this year there would have been a couple new 250 guys moving up. Now we will have to wait until 2019/2020 for guys like Cianciarulo, Forkner, Savatgy, Hill, Plessinger, Nichols, Smith, Hampshire, Martin plus more Loretta's graduates to move up.

|

10/10/2017 10:45 PM

Someone will be the alpha dog sooner or later and then Reed will say "We`re going faster than ever in history" and Randy will have new ammo for his bullshit posts.

|

10/11/2017 12:26 AM

With regard to the pointing out rule and the lack of depth in the 450s currently, are some of the 250 guys and their teams who ARE STILL eligible for the 250s missing a trick by NOT moving up?

Hill & Pless could take the leap early, get one year of experience on a 450 before the next batch are forced to advance.

|

10/11/2017 1:35 AM
Edited Date/Time: 10/11/2017 4:52 AM

Roczen is the guy in US.

Herlings in GPs.

|

10/11/2017 3:04 AM

The 250 guys move up and become the next greats.

|

10/11/2017 3:21 AM

I think last year was a fluke for CW2. I think we will see a different Coop this season, he could very well be the GUY....

|

2020 YZ450F
2018 KTM 450SXF FE
2016 YZ250F 2008 CRF450R
2015 YZ250F 2008 CRF250R
2001 CR250R
2010 YZ250 2012 CRF150R
2009 YZ125 2010 KX109.5
SSR Motorsports Dealer
TAGMX Suspension & Graphics! www.tagmxsuspension.com https://www.liquidskinzdesign.com/



10/11/2017 3:26 AM
Edited Date/Time: 10/11/2017 4:54 AM

sgrimmxdad wrote:

I think last year was a fluke for CW2. I think we will see a different Coop this season, he could very well be the GUY....

Maybe.

There is still a Ken Roczen on the line that is the closest to a RC, RV, Dungey that we have in US racing at the moment(if he is able to ride to his ability).

Webb could become the "guy" if he is able to step up this off season and make it happen. But there is a huge problem if he is mediocre again in 2018.

|

10/11/2017 6:23 AM

sgrimmxdad wrote:

I think last year was a fluke for CW2. I think we will see a different Coop this season, he could very well be the GUY....

I agree here to a point. I think that big blue Yamaturd pig is going to hold him back. I think if he finds his comfort spot though, he'd give ET3 and KR a run for their money.

|

10/11/2017 6:36 AM

Umm, what about the Moosecan 25???

|

10/11/2017 6:40 AM

sgrimmxdad wrote:

I think last year was a fluke for CW2. I think we will see a different Coop this season, he could very well be the GUY....

danman wrote:

I agree here to a point. I think that big blue Yamaturd pig is going to hold him back. I think if he finds his comfort spot though, he'd give ET3 and KR a run for their money.

Only if his work ethic catches up to his talent. Kid has talent for days but it's pretty well known that he doesn't work has hard as he needs too. It won't be the bike that holds him back.

|

10/11/2017 6:45 AM

The state of MX is very poor in the U.S. currently. If Davalos can't get a 450 ride after the spectacular year he had in 450 mx then there really is no hope for anyone else unless you are super connected like a Hill, Pless, AC, etc.

SX is dominating the sport and along with that all the decision making and that's very unfortunate.

|

10/11/2017 6:47 AM

It should be the ET3 show. But MM25 might be there also. KR94 is an unknown due to his very severe injury. I hope for him he can do it and if not be smart and just walk away. Of course a lot of the riders will be M.I.A. due to injuries which has already begun before the season has even started with Millsaps and Webb. There is probably more injured, it is hard to keep up with all the injuries these days. I just hope to maybe get to see some close racing for the lead even after the first few laps. I want to watch some riders racing for the win for the entire race. The rest of the riders will be way off the pace and we can not forget those professional lapped riders that should be black flagged for going too slow but will be allowed to stay out there.

|

10/11/2017 6:48 AM
Edited Date/Time: 10/11/2017 6:52 AM

vikingBoy wrote:

Umm, what about the Moosecan 25???

He`ll be 28 in a couple of month. Not much prime future left. RC, RV, Dungey were already retired by this age.
Nobody has been a champion at this age except MC at age of 29. Prime years are 22-27

|

10/11/2017 6:50 AM

Motofinne wrote:

Roczen is the guy in US.

Herlings in GPs.

We shall see. Pretty difficult to call Roczen "the guy" at this point.

|

10/11/2017 6:53 AM

Motofinne wrote:

Roczen is the guy in US.

Herlings in GPs.

Squirrelings wrote:

We shall see. Pretty difficult to call Roczen "the guy" at this point.

Sadly, I agree and hope he proves me wrong.

|

10/11/2017 6:54 AM

vikingBoy wrote:

Umm, what about the Moosecan 25???

I'm a huge fan of Marvin but he is in his prime at the moment. Like kongols mentioned, 28th year old soon.

He might get one 450 title if things goes his way but that doesn't make him the next multi-time champion like RV, RD etc.

|

10/11/2017 6:57 AM

Motofinne wrote:

Roczen is the guy in US.

Herlings in GPs.

Squirrelings wrote:

We shall see. Pretty difficult to call Roczen "the guy" at this point.

Yeah i know, it really depends on a lot of speculation of his arm situation.

But if he gets back to even 90%, he will be the next guy. He already has 2 450 titles and i can't see any other rider at the moment that can out race him for one season. I'm sorry but a relatively healthy Roczen has Tomac covered.

I'm hopeful that Roczen makes it happen and manages to get himself back to winning races and titles.

|

10/11/2017 7:13 AM

sgrimmxdad wrote:

I think last year was a fluke for CW2. I think we will see a different Coop this season, he could very well be the GUY....

danman wrote:

I agree here to a point. I think that big blue Yamaturd pig is going to hold him back. I think if he finds his comfort spot though, he'd give ET3 and KR a run for their money.

They keep hinting on the pulp show he is going to go KTM as soon as his contract is up with Yamaha. If it is the bike that will be the quickest way to find out... I personally think he has regained that hunger. Hard as that kid worked he earned a less than stellar year. He did all those extra races, I think it might have been a combo of being burned out and backing off the routine he had on the 250!

|

2020 YZ450F
2018 KTM 450SXF FE
2016 YZ250F 2008 CRF450R
2015 YZ250F 2008 CRF250R
2001 CR250R
2010 YZ250 2012 CRF150R
2009 YZ125 2010 KX109.5
SSR Motorsports Dealer
TAGMX Suspension & Graphics! www.tagmxsuspension.com https://www.liquidskinzdesign.com/



10/11/2017 7:17 AM

sgrimmxdad wrote:

I think last year was a fluke for CW2. I think we will see a different Coop this season, he could very well be the GUY....

danman wrote:

I agree here to a point. I think that big blue Yamaturd pig is going to hold him back. I think if he finds his comfort spot though, he'd give ET3 and KR a run for their money.

sgrimmxdad wrote:

They keep hinting on the pulp show he is going to go KTM as soon as his contract is up with Yamaha. If it is the bike that will be the quickest way to find out... I personally think he has regained that hunger. Hard as that kid worked he earned a less than stellar year. He did all those extra races, I think it might have been a combo of being burned out and backing off the routine he had on the 250!

I think that is what "everyone" assumes, Webb to KTM when the deal with Yamaha ends. Webb is the biggest name for next years deals and it makes sense.

Webb admitted on the Pulp show that he underestimated the challenge of the class and the bike didn't suit him. That should be fixed for this season so it really is time for him to step up. Maybe not contend for a title but at least have multiple podiums and have better bad days.

|

10/11/2017 7:19 AM

Motofinne wrote:

I think that is what "everyone" assumes, Webb to KTM when the deal with Yamaha ends. Webb is the biggest name for next years deals and it makes sense.

Webb admitted on the Pulp show that he underestimated the challenge of the class and the bike didn't suit him. That should be fixed for this season so it really is time for him to step up. Maybe not contend for a title but at least have multiple podiums and have better bad days.

Webb+ktm+Aldon=train back on the rails

|

10/11/2017 7:21 AM

Beware of The French.

|

I ripped a start from Egypt and I was happy about that.

10/11/2017 7:22 AM

sgrimmxdad wrote:

They keep hinting on the pulp show he is going to go KTM as soon as his contract is up with Yamaha. If it is the bike that will be the quickest way to find out... I personally think he has regained that hunger. Hard as that kid worked he earned a less than stellar year. He did all those extra races, I think it might have been a combo of being burned out and backing off the routine he had on the 250!

Motofinne wrote:

I think that is what "everyone" assumes, Webb to KTM when the deal with Yamaha ends. Webb is the biggest name for next years deals and it makes sense.

Webb admitted on the Pulp show that he underestimated the challenge of the class and the bike didn't suit him. That should be fixed for this season so it really is time for him to step up. Maybe not contend for a title but at least have multiple podiums and have better bad days.

early wrote:

Webb+ktm+Aldon=train back on the rails

If/when Webb goes to KTM, I doubt he will be tied to Aldon and would likely stay with Swanny.

|

10/11/2017 7:22 AM
Edited Date/Time: 10/11/2017 7:24 AM

sgrimmxdad wrote:

They keep hinting on the pulp show he is going to go KTM as soon as his contract is up with Yamaha. If it is the bike that will be the quickest way to find out... I personally think he has regained that hunger. Hard as that kid worked he earned a less than stellar year. He did all those extra races, I think it might have been a combo of being burned out and backing off the routine he had on the 250!

Motofinne wrote:

I think that is what "everyone" assumes, Webb to KTM when the deal with Yamaha ends. Webb is the biggest name for next years deals and it makes sense.

Webb admitted on the Pulp show that he underestimated the challenge of the class and the bike didn't suit him. That should be fixed for this season so it really is time for him to step up. Maybe not contend for a title but at least have multiple podiums and have better bad days.

early wrote:

Webb+ktm+Aldon=train back on the rails

Yeah i would think so, but it's not that straight forward to just show up at the Bakers factory and get on the program. It seems like everyone there has to be on board with taking in a new guy. I'm sure other people know more about that situation than me.

All i'm saying is that just because Webb goes to KTM doesn't mean he automatically goes with the Bakers factory.

|

10/11/2017 7:29 AM

Webb+KTM+his current program = unsure

|

10/11/2017 7:39 AM

I think we need to see Webb up-front, again, before we worry about Roger spending that kind of money on him.

|

I ripped a start from Egypt and I was happy about that.

10/11/2017 8:03 AM

How much longer does Roger even stay with it? His prodigy is gone now. Will the team still get the same effort he put in when Dungey was there? Roger and Dungey boosted the entire Motocross game way up. To become a multi-time champ now is nearly impossible. The bar is set so high, all the riders are at the best levels they can be. You won't see any single rider dominating like McGrath, RC, JS7, RV2. Those days are long gone. But if any rider was capable, it would definitely be Kenny.

|

Tony Alessi, "I think it's time to have more kids so I can have hopes of actually raising a champion."

10/11/2017 8:12 AM

I can see Anderson putting some solid races together in the near future.

I'll be able to better judge AC after this next season. Not many people come out and win their first ever supercross race.

Most likely Tomac willd dominate this year.

|

10/11/2017 8:25 AM

for a lot of reasons motocross grew more in the states then everywhere else, america became the power of mx and reign the world of motocross for an era....
in the last years, with a promotor in charge, the european side of mx has come back and has been growing faster and better then america, these days any race between both sides is an unknown affair, be it young guns or pros.....
i guess that a lot of the changes that youthstream has brought in, despite being much criticized, have done its job and now european riders have cut the gap to americans.....
so i think its time for ama and the other powers of american mx to really think about the reasons for americans to loose that advantage, for the field to loose its deepness, for the young kids that move in not be so hot and fast as they used to be, etc.....
the absence of a real series for young amatures, the absence of an age limit to move up, the production rule, the importance of super cross, the overworked track soils, etc......lots of things are done different in the states, are they better, are they worst ?????
i guess its time to put all on the table and rethink american mx racing......europe is beginning an era of success, lots of signs show that, so i think it time for americans to stop thinking only at the present moment and trying to find immediate solutions, and look for the main reasons for that change and what can be done to turn it around......
its not normal for an year of mx to start in usa and there is so little favorites for wins, and a few are european, so little young stars to hype the races......something has not been done right, something is missing.!!!!!!!

|

10/11/2017 8:31 AM
Edited Date/Time: 10/11/2017 8:32 AM

Sixeightone wrote:

How much longer does Roger even stay with it? His prodigy is gone now. Will the team still get the same effort he put in when Dungey was there? Roger and Dungey boosted the entire Motocross game way up. To become a multi-time champ now is nearly impossible. The bar is set so high, all the riders are at the best levels they can be. You won't see any single rider dominating like McGrath, RC, JS7, RV2. Those days are long gone. But if any rider was capable, it would definitely be Kenny.

I would say that becoming a multi-time champ easier than ever(in modern MX/SX history). There is no RC, RV, RD, MC. The level at the top is the worst that it has been for a long time. Kenny is the only one at the moment with the multi-time champion title(except CR22 but he wont win titles anymore) and he is still one of the youngest 450 riders(1 year older than Webb, keep that in mind).

I believe that Roczen will continue to win titles if he stays healthy. I don't think that anyone beats him straight up.

|