Posts
4084
Joined
1/10/2011
Location
Hollow Barrels, CA
US
Fantasy
89th
Edited Date/Time
7/4/2017 7:42pm
Mods/GuyB,
Someone notified me the thread about Cooper's Yamaha 450 from Saturday was deleted. I just looked for it, and it has vanished...so I gotta ask, why the heck aren't we allowed to talk about the design or handling of a particular motorcycle on a moto forum? There was obviously a bunch of jokes being made about the bike but it's nothing new. But there was also legitimate discussion about it's design, weight distribution, and past results in that thread. It's the only damn motorcycle with a backwards engine design and the numbers don't lie, so why would it not be okay to analyze the bike's handling and it's past results? Several pro riders have been vocal about and it sounds like Cooper might be in a hurry to get off it as well. I can't figure out why Vital would want to censor this type of discussion.
We were talking about a dirt bike, not a rider. Meanwhile, in other threads you have members throwing personal attacks at professional riders, calling them every vulgar name in the urban dictionary. So is it worse to call a bike a pig and talk about it's unconventional design than to call a rider a do*che, d*ck, f*cking moron, dip sh*t, etc? I would say the latter is much worse, but then again everyone is entitled to their own opinion so where do you draw the line?
Honest question, did the thread get the attention of one of your sponsors who asked you to delete it? That's the only thing I could imagine that would motivate Vital to completely delete the thread....I see a lot worse here so inquiring minds want to know, what happened there?
Someone notified me the thread about Cooper's Yamaha 450 from Saturday was deleted. I just looked for it, and it has vanished...so I gotta ask, why the heck aren't we allowed to talk about the design or handling of a particular motorcycle on a moto forum? There was obviously a bunch of jokes being made about the bike but it's nothing new. But there was also legitimate discussion about it's design, weight distribution, and past results in that thread. It's the only damn motorcycle with a backwards engine design and the numbers don't lie, so why would it not be okay to analyze the bike's handling and it's past results? Several pro riders have been vocal about and it sounds like Cooper might be in a hurry to get off it as well. I can't figure out why Vital would want to censor this type of discussion.
We were talking about a dirt bike, not a rider. Meanwhile, in other threads you have members throwing personal attacks at professional riders, calling them every vulgar name in the urban dictionary. So is it worse to call a bike a pig and talk about it's unconventional design than to call a rider a do*che, d*ck, f*cking moron, dip sh*t, etc? I would say the latter is much worse, but then again everyone is entitled to their own opinion so where do you draw the line?
Honest question, did the thread get the attention of one of your sponsors who asked you to delete it? That's the only thing I could imagine that would motivate Vital to completely delete the thread....I see a lot worse here so inquiring minds want to know, what happened there?
This thread?
http://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Moto-Related,20/WTH-is-with-Coop,1322296?…
This is what is America becoming to, no more free speech anywhere!
Rather then whole sale deleting a thread it should go to the dumbgeon. This would satisfy the agent who calls the forum mod to have a thread deleted, while still giving this site some journalistic impartiality. Both are important.
Edit: in general I think they do a decent job moderating. Most threads get to stay. Some get put in the dumbgeon. Only a select few get deleted outright. I think they are pretty fair here.
The Shop
"conspiracy alert, the blue farm animal thread and links to it have vanished.."
Anyway, does Yamaha sponsor this site? I can't say I remember seeing any YZF ads....right now I'm looking at a Maxxis ad and some Snow Summit micro brew ad on the site while I'm typing.
It's the same when any new bike comes out, unless it's lighter than a KTM or a two stroke everyone is convinced it handles like crap and is a POS.
How about a new rule, list the bikes you have personally ridden, and only then can you critique a bike you have experience with.
I ride a 2006 RMZ 450. Go ahead, call it an overweight yellow hog ancient slow 4-speed piece of shit....do I really care? Why are the panties all getting in a wad when someone critiques the bike of their choice?
I love the look of the Yamaha and it's design would not affect me at my level....I would be stoked on one. However, we are talking about the top level of the sport here on the forums, and if you are in denial go look at the numbers, they don't lie.
For the record, I didn't can the thread...
If someone came on here and asked "what's better, a 250sx or a yz250?", would it be right for me to go on and on about how much better the YZ is since that's my "opinion", even though I've never even ridden the KTM? No! An acceptable and reasonable response would be talking about my experience with my YZ, what I feel its strengths and weaknesses are, and give the poster relevant info that I have the qualifications to give. Blindly posting about something you know nothing about isn't an "opinion", it's complete bs and doesn't do anyone any good.
There was also some serious analysis from a variety of angles, and I respect the mods and in the thread commented that Yamaha would be hiring a hit man. There wasn't a bunch of inappropriate language or threats, just analysis.
So just like the Roczen partying photos, it is now a memory that adds to the lore of the Vital community.
Btw, is there something wrong with using your original account you've had since 2015?
Pit Row
Those are a few things for you to think about...
No, no one asked me to delete it. I toyed with the idea of tossing it in the Dumbgeon, but figured it wasn't of high enough quality to make the cut there.
That you "see a lot worse here" is subjective. JM465's analysis is probably pretty close. "Probably because they usually get filled with a bunch of morons who have never even ridden the bike, critiquing the design and telling us how they can tell it rides like crap from their couch. You bash that damn thing every chance you get, I'm no Yamaha fanboy but give it a damn rest already, it's seriously old and overplayed."
When you call it a blue pig in the headline to say that you're having a "legitimate discussion" is laughable. You've already made up your mind.
I also have to chuckle when people are trying to compare what Coop rides to the production bike. Sure, it shares the same frame and engine cases. It's also blue. But this ain't like the days when Hannah was riding a stock bike.
When BDB also asks, "So is it worse to call a bike a pig and talk about it's unconventional design than to call a rider a do*che, d*ck, f*cking moron, dip sh*t, etc?" No, it's not. I issued one vacation to a forum member yesterday for some rider-bashing. I also clip a bunch of non-essential stuff from threads when users here start bashing each other.
I read a lot. But I don't/can't read everything that gets posted. During the summer there's the usual work to do, plus the time I spend driving from race to race. My email (sgiberson@vitalmx.com) is always available for people to let me know if stuff is getting out of hand.
So while XR70 has taken two feeble attempts to paint us as Russians or KGB, I think trying to maintain some sort of order is not out of order.
Oh, and as far as any Ken Roczen Red Bud posts go, I think he self-deleted stuff from his IG account. We didn't delete anything. I think people are a little confused.
As far as the bike, yes I've made up my mind as have many others. Why wouldn't you consider it a legitimate discussion when Cooper gets bucked over the bars? We are talking about weight distribution and the geometry of a bike. The image below was posted in the thread that you deleted. Can anyone honestly say as a rider you don't think the amount of mass in front of the green line would affect the weight distribution and handling? Compare the YZF with the other bikes. Now go strap a weight on the fork of your mountain bike and tell me if it handles any different. Every little ounce and change in +/- degrees dramatically affects the handling, this is no secret. Go over to the VitalMB forum and look at all the discussions about bikes that have a 2-3 degree difference in geometry and how it affects the handling.
Also, take one of these spinner gadgets down below that all the kids are playing with and spin it in your hand. What do you feel when you change the angles? Now do you think spinning a big ass motor around in the chassis and drastically changing the angle of the head might affect handling somehow? It doesn't matter if it's a production bike or Cooper's bike, the design is totally different (and extreme) compared to all the bikes we've been riding for years. Some things work, some things don't. It works in the 250, but not in the 450 for some reason. If the yamaha was doing better all these years at the top we wouldn't be talking about it (Europe doesn't count, different bike)...this is all legitimate discussion, so I'll take it as you just didn't like the famous blue pig picassos. No worries, at least I know now that it was not a sponsor that asked you to delete it.
What happened to Coop wasn't the bikes fault. It was his body positioning and where he ended up. Same thing would have happened on any bike. Some of you talk so much crap about the "blue pig" but I absolutely love my 14 YZ450. So many guys talk about how great the new Honda is, but I rode it and hated it. At least I have the experience on both to give my opinion on them.
Maybe if you rode the newer yamaha you'd realize it's not as bad as some make it out to be.
So what do you and JM485 have to say about weight distribution comparison in the image above? If you don't think there's something wonky with that design that could affect this bike at the top of the sport then you are kidding yourselves. If you are in denial, go strap a weight to the front of your mountain bike like I mentioned and tell me what happens.
Post a reply to: Since when can't we critique a bike on a moto forum?